Nature of Reality

kojikun · Post by **kojikun** » 2002-12-12 01:29am

I've been watching/thinking about the Matrix univers, and an interesting philosophical point hit me. Given that the universe is at best a subjective phenomena (i think therefore _i_ am [but not necessarilly all of you]), how would you logical rational folks define "the real world", in the non-subjective "ultimate reality" sense?

I came up with a short but sweet definition: Reality is the annoying stuff that doesn't go away when you do.

Assuming that reality is your imagination, when you cease to be, whatever remains is the ultimate real that transcends subjectivity.

whats your thoughts on this?

Shinova · Post by **Shinova** » 2002-12-12 01:35am

Your definition is good, except that we won't know if reality has gone away when we die, cause, we're dead. We won't be able to check if reality has gone or not.

I think the only way the true nature of reality can be seen is if one person or many people can somehow see through the perspectives of every thing in the universe at the same time--in other words, see the universe through the eyes or viewpoints of everything.

Provided you don't go insane from the stimuli first.

kojikun · Post by **kojikun** » 2002-12-12 01:38am

ah but i never said SEE reality, just define it

if the universe is merely a dream, so is everything you would see if you saw the world from everythings perspective (kind of like that device Zafrod gets into in Diner at the End of the Universe that showed him all of existance all at once and it was him)

Post by **haas mark** » 2002-12-12 01:42am

Question: Do you know thaty reality exists? If it does, then you have a viable defiinition. If it doesn't, then that discounts the definition of reality, because then reality is non-existant.

Shinova · Post by **Shinova** » 2002-12-12 01:43am

kojikun wrote:ah but i never said SEE reality, just define it

if the universe is merely a dream, so is everything you would see if you saw the world from everythings perspective (kind of like that device Zafrod gets into in Diner at the End of the Universe that showed him all of existance all at once and it was him)

Okay then, reality in simple terms is our subjective point of view.

But if you want the true definition of reality, then you'd have to do what I suggested. Then you can take everything's point of view into account.

SWPIGWANG · Post by **SWPIGWANG** » 2002-12-12 05:55am

Reality = INFORMATION (what we don't understand)

Zoink · Post by **Zoink** » 2002-12-12 09:22am

If you could create a model of your known universe using loop quantum gravity (or whatever working theory you have), you'd probably see that the universe is a series of information exchanges.

You'd probably find that the existence of this information isn't dependant on a particular structure that creates consciousness. ie. The relationships between the bits that constitute you and their relationship to the universe aren’t dependant on the structure that gives you the trait (or illusion) of consciousness.

Essentially the information available to you follows a certain pattern that suggests it is independent of your consciousness, that denying this would be to deny the validity of this information and deny your own existence.

How 'bout that? I just thought it up so please critique as you see fit

EmperorChrostas the Cruel · Post by **EmperorChrostas the Cruel** » 2002-12-14 12:02am

Excuse me but is the question philosophical, or mechanical?

First off, reality is that which is real, IE exsists as the spacetime continuum, and it's entire contents.
Perhaps you are confusing consciousness, which is the perseption of a self, and it's relationship with all that is not itself, IE the outside world,and reality. Your consciousness does mimic reality to an astonishing degree, but halucinations prove that the two are not one and the same. Talk to a loony, they don't perceive realty like you.

Awareness, is the model, or simulation of reality you run in your wetware, to better predict the universe, to stay alive and propagate.

The simulation IS you. We all are the synergistic result of a reality simulation program, currently running in the most advanced neural network, wetware information processing unit type on the planet.

The simulation's sensor input can be fooled, but usualy the data input is valid, only the reasoning and thus the conclusions are wrong. This can result in tripping over a rug, biting your tounge, or saying the wrong thing and getting no sex from the old lady that night!

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2002-12-14 12:05am

Reality is whatever you objectively percieve it to be.

ArmorPierce · Post by **ArmorPierce** » 2002-12-15 03:34pm

Reality is everything that happens apart from yourself.

Andrew J. · Post by **Andrew J.** » 2002-12-15 04:42pm

You have too much time on your hands.