MGS4 Trailer

Post by **Vympel** » 2006-05-11 12:57am

DPDarkPrimus wrote: Did you play MGS3? It was explained.

Short of "and Ocelot woke up and it was all a dream, he then preceded to give Liquid a call to let him know he thinks the lines he's been given are a bit too campy" I really don't see how any explanation could work.

Haven't played MGS3, yet. I just haven't gotten round to it, even though I bought it.

Adrian Laguna · Post by **Adrian Laguna** » 2006-05-11 01:58am

DPDarkPrimus wrote:
Vympel wrote:I keep hoping (some of) MGS2 was a bad dream. Really, the whole thing about Liquid Snake's arm and Revolver Ocelot really rubbed me the wrong way.
Did you play MGS3? It was explained.

No it isn't, at least not directly. One can speculate based on what is learned in MGS3, but they never actually explain it.

Vympel, you really don't want to read this.

Ocelot is the son of The Sorrow, who has well known psychic abilities, namely communicating with the dead and carrying on after death in spirit form. Presumably Ocelot has latent psychic abilities, and channels Liquid through the arm.

BTW - I really like Raiden. Probably my favorite MGS moment was in Sons of Liberty, the part where Raiden and Snake fight toguether. That was incredible, you and Snake in a massive gunfight against the Arsenal Tengus. The round area at the end is just perfect for drawing the sword and cutting-up the bastards. It owns.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-05-11 02:01am

Don't read it, Vympel. At least, not while thinking about 'tactical espionage action'.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2006-05-11 02:02am

Bah, it's not that bad, at least it isn't when recalling that stuff like that's been in the series since MGS...

If most can accept walking nuclear tanks, they should be able to handle that.

Adrian Laguna · Post by **Adrian Laguna** » 2006-05-11 02:04am

Spanky The Dolphin wrote:Bah, it's not that bad, at least it isn't when recalling that stuff like that's been in the series since MGS...

If most can accept walking nuclear tanks, they should be able to handle that.

It's not so much "handling it" as ZOMG GIANT SPOILER! Particularly the very first pharse.

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2006-05-11 06:49am

Yes, don't read that unless you want a big chunk of the story ruined. It does pretty much explain without directly saying how Ocelot is controlling Liquid now and then. You have to remember, there are weird things going on in the MGS universe that aren't just related to cutting edge tech. The way you blend this with a realistic world is what makes it interesting.

Edward Yee · Post by **Edward Yee** » 2006-05-11 08:24am

Actually, re: the theme of MGS -- if you mean in a "gene, meme and scene" kind of way, MGS4 has been stated to be about "sense," with more emphasis than before placed on the non-visual elements. For example, a nearby explosion may be enough to send a severely damaged building crumbling.

Also, notice how one of the Gekkous sounded like a cow?

Post by **Vympel** » 2006-05-11 09:48am

Fuck me. That's a good trailer. I loved the Raiden-wank at the end.

I wonder, is Snake going all old and apparently suicidal a way to get the Raiden-haters to "deal" with playing as Raiden? I need no such therapy, I'd much rather play as him in that awesome Gray Fox style suit that Snake, but who knows- knowing Kojima, you won't be able to play as Raiden at all *shrug*

Tommorow, i start playing MGS3, and nothing but.

Darth Raptor · Post by **Darth Raptor** » 2006-05-11 11:13am

It was pretty clear since MGS2 that they were grooming Raiden to be Snake's successor; especially considering how Solid Snake was effectively doomed at the end of MGS.

Raiden was actually well-recieved in Japan, like Spanky said. While in America he became something of a joke. See Major Raikov.

Post by **Vympel** » 2006-05-11 11:22am

Darth Raptor wrote:It was pretty clear since MGS2 that they were grooming Raiden to be Snake's successor; especially considering how Solid Snake was effectively doomed at the end of MGS.

Raiden was actually well-recieved in Japan, like Spanky said. While in America he became something of a joke. See Major Raikov.

Cool. I liked the visual design of Raiden immensely, and that's where it's at for me. I think the entire MGS script is B-grade garbage anyway (but in a good way), so the voice doesn't bother me. I still love Solid of course, but change is good. Change is reliable. If it doesn't work you can always hit him with it.

Things I didn't like about the trailer- the silly Metal Gears that were being used with the organic style legs and the torsos that were clearly just scaled down versions of Rex- as well as the uber-wank helicopters the PMC troops seemed to have at their disposal. Not happy. I did like Snake using an AK-74 though, that was big fun

Shogoki · Post by **Shogoki** » 2006-05-11 11:53am

Two games announced in this E3 featuring Snake:

This is the trailer for the second one.

Snake in Smash Brothers was totally unexpected, and awesome, lol.

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2006-05-11 05:15pm

Vympel wrote:
Cool. I liked the visual design of Raiden immensely, and that's where it's at for me. I think the entire MGS script is B-grade garbage anyway (but in a good way), so the voice doesn't bother me. I still love Solid of course, but change is good. Change is reliable. If it doesn't work you can always hit him with it.

Since this will be the last MGS pretty much, I doubt you'll see much more of Raiden, unless he gets his own spin-off.

Things I didn't like about the trailer- the silly Metal Gears that were being used with the organic style legs and the torsos that were clearly just scaled down versions of Rex- as well as the uber-wank helicopters the PMC troops seemed to have at their disposal. Not happy. I did like Snake using an AK-74 though, that was big fun

They were organic legs, infact, the Gekkou (Moonlight) units seem to be semi-mechanical and organic. This could help in a field where their AI operates long term alone and without maintenance, so they use biological components for the less complex stuff. Besides, they pissed all over those Taliban like soldiers. Imagine a battalion of these in Iraq. Fuck Stryker.

I don't too care for the helo, but then it's a design the US Navy among others has wanted for a while (possibly with transformational abilities like in The Sixth Day). They still use Blackhawks though and the PMC is still using modern tech, albeit, with nanotech integrated soldiers and the other tech advances of MGS.

I'm wondering if you can play Raiden again. If he has that exoskeleton from the get-go, then you're pretty invincible unless someone pins you with an RPG-29 or thermobaric RPG-7 or something.

Edward Yee · Post by **Edward Yee** » 2006-05-11 09:53pm

Vympel, the (at least public) reason for Metal Gear RAY was to beat up the REX derivatives that came about after Revolver Ocelot leaked REX's plans onto the black market; hence there's been assumption that Gekkou was one of the latest of the derivatives.

(It is possible that due to the hijacking of the RAY prototype and the turning of its design to become mass-produced guards for Arsenal Gear, the derivative R&D/production was able to continue without that hurdle. Then again, the organic legs drrm to allow the possibility that RAY technology was actually incorporated into Gekkou, if not implemented from R&D independent of RAY.)

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2006-05-12 06:26am

RAY never had organic legs, though. They look similar, along with the REX head section, but RAY's legs were metal and only "bled" a special sealant paste which makes sense for an amphibious unit when damaged.

They're also obviously urban warfare craft as opposed to anything really anti-REX. Going to be a bitch to fight in a place where it's harder to hide, yet also easier to miss bad guys, depending on where you are in the city.

Ford Prefect · Post by **Ford Prefect** » 2006-05-12 08:40am

I haven't managed to see the fifteen minute trailer yet, but I have seen a much shorter one, and frankly, this game looks like it will kick ass. Certainly I need to get my friend's PS2 and his copy of MGS3.

Nephtys · Post by **Nephtys** » 2006-05-12 12:24pm

Ford Prefect wrote:I haven't managed to see the fifteen minute trailer yet, but I have seen a much shorter one, and frankly, this game looks like it will kick ass. Certainly I need to get my friend's PS2 and his copy of MGS3.

MGS3 I say is the best one of the set. It's well done, and easilly surpasses the previosu games. Good gameplay, even if the bosses are cheesier than MGS1's set... but not 2's thankfully.

Edward Yee · Post by **Edward Yee** » 2006-05-12 12:38pm

Admiral Valdemar wrote:RAY never had organic legs, though. They look similar, along with the REX head section, but RAY's legs were metal and only "bled" a special sealant paste which makes sense for an amphibious unit when damaged.

Is such technology (sealant "bleeding") any where even testing phase in real life? Nonetheless, all good points, and thanks for the correction.

They're also obviously urban warfare craft as opposed to anything really anti-REX.

I was talking about RAY, hence the "at least public," but these new Gekkou definitely showed the urban warfare asskickery.

BlkbrryTheGreat · Post by **BlkbrryTheGreat** » 2006-05-12 02:12pm

Shogoki wrote:Two games announced in this E3 featuring Snake:

This is the trailer for the second one.

Snake in Smash Brothers was totally unexpected, and awesome, lol.

Snake- in Smash Brothers??! That just sealed the deal for Wii!

Hamel · Post by **Hamel** » 2006-05-12 02:14pm

MGS4 has some god-damn ugly-ass post-processing.

Post by **Vympel** » 2006-05-12 02:49pm

It's not so much the concept of the unit that bothers me (I mean, I can accept Mecha in MG, for god's sake) but even knowing that the REX plans proliferated- having these units torsos being scaled down, virtual *exact* copies of the REX is really uninspired design. I'm really dissapointed with the art guys in that department.

Covenant · Post by **Covenant** » 2006-05-12 03:47pm

Beh, Raiden. I've long ago had my life's maximum tolerance for light-blonde or white-haired girly-looking japanese male characters. That whole thing just doesn't work for me at all, and I hope in the future at least they'll offer me a choice between Raiden and Snake rather than just Raiden.

I really had a strong aversion to his character, and even a totally badass voice actor wouldn't have made him any less ridiculous to me. His character design made me cringe (please let him actually look male this time) and he seemed so totally out of place compared to Snake and the legacy of Big Boss within the series. I don't think they should re-do the entire dude to cater to a more Western audience, but I really want to be a gritty, ultra-badass commando dude in Metal Gear Solid. Let them make Metal Gear Gaiden games for Raiden, where you can spent your time being a cyberninja, but Raiden just doesn't have the depth of character to replace Snake, especially after his role in 2.

It was so incredibly painful in parts, especially knowing it COULD have been Snake I was being, that I really never want to repeat the experience without a chance to be Snake as well. I'm not saying the character is necessarily bad, but he's just sooo Japanese that he's really just foreign to what I want to identify with. I'd rather be an actual female like Samus than some sort of male-model in a jumpsuit.

Nephtys · Post by **Nephtys** » 2006-05-12 03:52pm

Vympel wrote:It's not so much the concept of the unit that bothers me (I mean, I can accept Mecha in MG, for god's sake) but even knowing that the REX plans proliferated- having these units torsos being scaled down, virtual *exact* copies of the REX is really uninspired design. I'm really dissapointed with the art guys in that department.

Well, the REX Torso did resemble a modern battletank. Admittedly, they don't go well at all with the RAY-styled legs, nor are they appropriate to be styled like something armored given how fragile those legs are. Doesn't really make sense why the guns are on top instead of on bottom, given how tall they are but..meh!

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2006-05-12 05:04pm

Hamel wrote:MGS4 has some god-damn ugly-ass post-processing.

And this matters when the game is coming out in over a year's time, because?

Vympel wrote:It's not so much the concept of the unit that bothers me (I mean, I can accept Mecha in MG, for god's sake) but even knowing that the REX plans proliferated- having these units torsos being scaled down, virtual *exact* copies of the REX is really uninspired design. I'm really dissapointed with the art guys in that department.

The REX like head design is a good design though, since the top half is essentially a turret that connects to the drive chassis. Why change a good design just to be original? There are no "art guys" anyway, there is just the art guy, him being Yoji Shinkawa, and his work is always brilliant. I see nothing wrong with the Gekkou units, and the resemblance to the two previous MGS Metal Gear designs is nice, especially with the juxtaposition of an obviously standard tank like upper body, with the organic bottom (consider REX was going to be like RAY until they found the PSX couldn't deal with the poly count). You can't compare his stuff to the original MG machines, which were more at home to a version of Metal Slug if anything, but you retcon the hell out of that stuff to fit the new games.

I love the mooing. Seriously, that bull/cow like attitude is great, and like the Combine machines in HL2, probably instills just as much fear when they can land infront of you like that. I bet the AI is even based on a pred-pray model, given the somewhat animalistic nature, though gets the job done.

Nephtys wrote:
Well, the REX Torso did resemble a modern battletank. Admittedly, they don't go well at all with the RAY-styled legs, nor are they appropriate to be styled like something armored given how fragile those legs are. Doesn't really make sense why the guns are on top instead of on bottom, given how tall they are but..meh!

There's only so much armour you can put on anything. Even an Abrams or Challenger can be done in with enough firepower, so it's obvious that there is light weapons durability, but reliance on stealth and speed/agility for avoiding getting done in by an ATGM. There's no way a guy is going to sit there and prime a Javelin or Milan when one comes charging towards you using those .50 cals or standard MG in the "snout".

Post by **Vympel** » 2006-05-13 12:15am

Penny Arcade: Link

Hamel · Post by **Hamel** » 2006-05-13 12:23am

Admiral Valdemar wrote:
Hamel wrote:MGS4 has some god-damn ugly-ass post-processing.
And this matters when the game is coming out in over a year's time, because?

Don't tease me like that. The whole visual style is based around that ugly ass tint. Why would they change it?