The meaning of life, biologically and mentally

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The Grim Squeaker
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The meaning of life, biologically and mentally

Post by The Grim Squeaker »

How would you define the meaning of life and of human life?
Would you see any differentiation between the two or with your own personal ethos?

My opinion is that physically/biologically the meaning of life is to breed, that's how all life is hard-wired and made and how life profligates [or a specific species].

Yet, if our only reason to live and thrive is to breed why do we spend our energy on other tasks such as music, literature and speeches about how sex is Evil ;)? Why not spend our lives doing nothing but fucking and scavenging for food in a manner similar to ants or termites?
Meaning, what is the spiritual/mental reason for life, is there one apart from attempting to survive and spread?

I realize that My own opinion may be rather hard to understand [the second part at least] so feel free to ask me with even more impunity than is the norm :? .
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Post by Resinence »

Biologically I would agree that the meaning of life is to breed. Mentally, to develop an army of robotic minions and take over the world of course.

I guess we make music and art and learn etc to further the advances of our race, as we slowly march through time generation by generation becoming more advanced. I mean, you have to have SOMETHING to do when not fucking right? :lol:
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Post by mr friendly guy »

Biologically is to survive to pass on our genes.

For a mental point of view, I suppose its to do things which you find fruitful and important and which you enjoy. For me I enjoy talking on messageboards, reading and watching sci fi. Although I do question whether there needs to be a "mental / spiritual point of life". I mean you do things which you enjoy, why does the reason you do it have to possess a spiritual connatation?
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Re: The meaning of life, biologically and mentally

Post by Knife »

DEATH wrote:
Yet, if our only reason to live and thrive is to breed why do we spend our energy on other tasks such as music, literature and speeches about how sex is Evil ;)? Why not spend our lives doing nothing but fucking and scavenging for food in a manner similar to ants or termites?
Meaning, what is the spiritual/mental reason for life, is there one apart from attempting to survive and spread?
You can rationalized a lot of that as making the original said, imperative to breed, easier. Boiling down music and dance down, you have or could have males and/or females parading themselves around to attract a mate. Communication just made our civilization easier, for both food gathering and attracting mates.

Sure they have spillover into other neat things but primarily they improved the ability of humans to eat and reproduce.
They say, "the tree of liberty must be watered with the blood of tyrants and patriots." I suppose it never occurred to them that they are the tyrants, not the patriots. Those weapons are not being used to fight some kind of tyranny; they are bringing them to an event where people are getting together to talk. -Mike Wong

But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red
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Re: The meaning of life, biologically and mentally

Post by Darth Wong »

DEATH wrote:How would you define the meaning of life and of human life?
How do you justify your assumption that life and human life must have some kind of meaning?
My opinion is that physically/biologically the meaning of life is to breed, that's how all life is hard-wired and made and how life profligates [or a specific species].

Yet, if our only reason to live and thrive is to breed why do we spend our energy on other tasks such as music, literature and speeches about how sex is Evil ;)?
The existence of a biological reason for our existence does not mean that other activities must be suspended. Our enjoyment of those other activities is a side-effect of our mental capacity. Animals enjoy plenty of things that stimulate them properly and serve no reproductive purpose; a dog loves it when you scratch his back or behind his ears, for example.
Why not spend our lives doing nothing but fucking and scavenging for food in a manner similar to ants or termites?
Because we're smart enough to do more: an ability which has allowed us to dominate the other creatures of this world.
Meaning, what is the spiritual/mental reason for life, is there one apart from attempting to survive and spread?

There is no spiritual/mental reason for life. Life exists because it was an inevitable outcome of certain properties of organic chemistry, not because of some higher purpose.
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Post by The Grim Squeaker »

How do you justify your assumption that life and human life must have some kind of meaning?
I don't think that we were created by a divine man with a beard :P , I mean what would you say is the evolutionary/natural purpose for a living being, that is what are it's imperatives and what are our imperatives.
(That is, what should be our goal and should it be different from other creatures).
Life exists because it was an inevitable outcome of certain properties of organic chemistry, not because of some higher purpose.
That is true, though physical constants also have something to do with it.
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Post by Admiral Valdemar »

I would have to agree with what's already been stated. Whatever you find Humans can do for fun or to further the species, it is all based on the same old selfish gene idea. We are, for all our ingenuity and intelligence, still trapped in the circle of a von Neumann mission; to breed and continue breeding until resources or something else acts as the limiting factor. Bacteria just don't experience the fun along the way that we do.

I'm sure you'll find every religious or philosophically inclined individual will attach some higher meaning to life and balk at the idea that sex is all we're good for on this Earth. But given they exist and likely will procreate, they just need to reflect upon their own lives to see that they, as everyone else, are stuck running the same basic program beneath all that pseudo-philosophical mumbo jumbo.
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Post by Darth Wong »

Technically, even if you aren't a breeder, you still fulfill a biological niche if you protect, feed, or otherwise support the breeders.
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Post by Admiral Valdemar »

That is true, and certainly something that can apply to the homosexual populace whenever they get criticised for not furthering the species (which is bullshit anyway, but a whole 'nother can-o-worms).
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Post by Zero »

Biology has no purpose or point for us. We've evolved towards the ability to pass on our genes, and towards having a greater desire to do so, but that doesn't mean there's any point or purpose in it. The external universe isn't a personal being.. it has no wills, intentions, or desires. We decide our own purpose, because purpose is something that can only be ascribed by sentient beings.

As for the meaning of my life... I'll figure it out when I'm done being a dumbshit teenager.
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Post by The Grim Squeaker »

Admiral Valdemar wrote:That is true, and certainly something that can apply to the homosexual populace whenever they get criticised for not furthering the species (which is bullshit anyway, but a whole 'nother can-o-worms).
That does raise another question which I fear may be taken badly:
What is the (Biologically speaking) point of homosexuals if they can't breed on their own? (Barring a high state of technology (with lesbians) or the society needed for adoption).
I realize that this question might sound harsh/Bigoted/Fundamentalist's and I certainly would never claim that Homosexuals have no right to live (They have every bit a right as a heterosexual etc'), but I would like to ask it.
Animals enjoy plenty of things that stimulate them properly and serve no reproductive purpose; a dog loves it when you scratch his back or behind his ears, for example.
True, but is that what our other goals should be? Simply maximizing pleasure and avoiding pain? (Sex is pleasing due to the way we're hard-wired so that is a very feasible goal).
Our enjoyment of those other activities is a side-effect of our mental capacity.
Yet how de we know if those are our "natural" responses or those bought about due to a mutation (A paedophile no doubt feels pleasure when committing an act, yet the chances of them breeding are relatively lower and it is against the breeding/spreading "function").
Because we're smart enough to do more: an ability which has allowed us to dominate the other creatures of this world.
[Hypothetical question] They why do we not dominate mentally weak humans and why is it that we're built to admire physical strength rather than mental abilities. ( Yes I know that originally humans could only survive with strength primarily backed up by teamwork and a hunter-gatherer society during our early stages of evolution).
There is no spiritual/mental reason for life
Then what is the goal that drives you on?
Why keep living and striving if say you suddenly couldn't father any more children? [(For example) following the "Breeding" as the basic physical imperative]
I know that I wouldn't kill myself even if that were somehow the case, so is our "natural" (I.E the way we evolved) Goal to breed and enjoy ourselves?
Why do we enjoy reading or other cerebral sports so much then?

I apologize if I may be very unclear.
I'm not really trying to argue with anyone's personal philosophies just voicing some of the thought that's I've had on this subject while debating it with a friend or a point that he raised (For example what should be our goal if not breeding or alternately [on a "higher" level] simple pleasure/pain
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Post by Admiral Valdemar »

DEATH wrote: That does raise another question which I fear may be taken badly:
What is the (Biologically speaking) point of homosexuals if they can't breed on their own? (Barring a high state of technology (with lesbians) or the society needed for adoption).
I realize that this question might sound harsh/Bigoted/Fundamentalist's and I certainly would never claim that Homosexuals have no right to live (They have every bit a right as a heterosexual etc'), but I would like to ask it.
The homosexuals in a species often lend their paternal or maternal skills to other offspring, so as to help those who have siblings succeed more in the wild. It has been shown in one study that special "homosexual genes" exist that are passed on through the very act of helping in this way. Though not always directly (there is nothing saying gays cannot have children, that's just stupid), those that give rise to such altruistic organisms that don't readily procreate often survive to produce more of the same later on. Think of them as benefactors to give a hand to those that give rise to children.
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Post by Rye »

DEATH wrote:That does raise another question which I fear may be taken badly:
What is the (Biologically speaking) point of homosexuals if they can't breed on their own?
If a group of men ended up without women, or vice versa, their sexuality wouldn't really matter. As it stands, homosexuals aren't automatically infertile, and currently many have families before they come out.

They do contribute to the breeders, though. Imagine there'd just been a catastrophe in caveman land, a volcano erupted or something. If you had a group of survivors, 5 of whom were gay, even with the scarcity of food or whatever, you would have 5 hunters/fighters/foragers that aren't going to make the situation worse by producing more children. If they have a straight brother, their shared genes will get passed on anyway.

There are situations in which not breeding is a good thing, lots of old civilisations also appear to have benefited from same sex contributors, as do some social structures in our nearest evolutionary cousins. I seem to recall the Spartans used to encourage homosexuality, because the men, in love with each other, would fight harder against their enemies. I might be wrong on that, though.
I realize that this question might sound harsh/Bigoted/Fundamentalist's and I certainly would never claim that Homosexuals have no right to live (They have every bit a right as a heterosexual etc'), but I would like to ask it.
Biology isn't purposeful, so when it throws out different sexualities, perhaps even detrimental ones, (bestiality and paedophilia, for instance) that don't pass on their genes, there's nothing to prevent it happening again since sexuality is not reducible to genes alone, and if it were, we couldn't prevent those mutations.
Yet how de we know if those are our "natural" responses or those bought about due to a mutation (A paedophile no doubt feels pleasure when committing an act, yet the chances of them breeding are relatively lower and it is against the breeding/spreading "function").
Mutations are natural, nature is irrelevent to morality; remember, how something is is not necessarily how it ought to be. Judging what impulses to follow is where morality and society comes in. People choose not to have children if they carry the cystic fibrosis gene, for instance, we have ultimate responsibility, not unthinking natural processes.
Then what is the goal that drives you on?
There's not really anything better to do. ;)
Why keep living and striving if say you suddenly couldn't father any more children? [(For example) following the "Breeding" as the basic physical imperative]
Because I am not a robot that slavishly does what my genes tell me, humans evolved brains that can override genetic commands. Our genes would be horrified if they were aware.
I know that I wouldn't kill myself even if that were somehow the case, so is our "natural" (I.E the way we evolved) Goal to breed and enjoy ourselves?
Enjoyment evolved to make us seek, pain evolved to make us avoid.
Why do we enjoy reading or other cerebral sports so much then?
Human brains enjoy taking in information, that lust for information is probably what set our ancestors apart from the monkeys. They'd be curious, they'd spot buzzards circling, for instance and wonder why, track them down and get extra meat in the diet, which would lead to a means of supporting bigger brains that were more curious, and so on down the generations.
I apologize if I may be very unclear.
I'm not really trying to argue with anyone's personal philosophies just voicing some of the thought that's I've had on this subject while debating it with a friend or a point that he raised (For example what should be our goal if not breeding or alternately [on a "higher" level] simple pleasure/pain
People are only really responsible for their own personal goals, you make them yourself and hope you're right. Nobody really knows because such purpose is not inherent in existence any more than we get a choice whether we're born or not.
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Post by Knife »

Then what is the goal that drives you on?
Why keep living and striving if say you suddenly couldn't father any more children? [(For example) following the "Breeding" as the basic physical imperative]
I know that I wouldn't kill myself even if that were somehow the case, so is our "natural" (I.E the way we evolved) Goal to breed and enjoy ourselves?
Why do we enjoy reading or other cerebral sports so much then?
Humans are a social species too. Another trait that helps with gathering food and producing kids (well protecting and nurturing them anyways). As stated above, if you belong to a group of humans *a pack :P * you personally don't need to have a child to fit in or be usefull to the others with kids, and vice versa.
They say, "the tree of liberty must be watered with the blood of tyrants and patriots." I suppose it never occurred to them that they are the tyrants, not the patriots. Those weapons are not being used to fight some kind of tyranny; they are bringing them to an event where people are getting together to talk. -Mike Wong

But as far as board culture in general, I do think that young male overaggression is a contributing factor to the general atmosphere of hostility. It's not SOS and the Mess throwing hand grenades all over the forum- Red
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