A future with no bananas?

Post by **Beowulf** » 2006-05-16 01:41am

The global economy has actually transitioned away from one banana species as the primary crop once already. The Cavendish is actually the second variety to make it into the big time. The first was the Gros Michel.

Admiral Johnason · Post by **Admiral Johnason** » 2006-05-16 02:50am

If worse come to worse, they can always modify the banana geneticly and create something new, but close enough to actually be a banana. Imagine it if you will, a totally lab designed banana, perfect in every way, or totally crapy, but you get the picture. they won't let it really go the way of the Dodo.

PainRack · Post by **PainRack** » 2006-05-16 05:45am

Admiral Johnason wrote:If worse come to worse, they can always modify the banana geneticly and create something new, but close enough to actually be a banana. Imagine it if you will, a totally lab designed banana, perfect in every way, or totally crapy, but you get the picture. they won't let it really go the way of the Dodo.

And that will be highly expensive.

Post by **Broomstick** » 2006-05-16 06:09am

As Beowulf already said, all this has happened before. The first really popular banana in what is know as "The West" was the Gros Michel, which the Cavendish replaced.

There are actually many species of "banana" in the world, many of which still have seeds and thus still maintain genetic variation to a greater degree than the Cavendish. They do not, however, taste like the Gros Michel or Cavendish which more banana-savy parts of the world consider "desert" bananas.

We are not talking about the extinction of all bananas, we are speaking of a population crash of a particular variety of banana. The fact that North America and Europe regard that one variety as THE banana is more a problem of their culture than of bananas at large.

Smithsonian magazine did a story about bananas a couple months ago, but I don't have time to dig out the issue this morning for more details.

Bounty · Post by **Bounty** » 2006-05-16 07:42am

I'm probably showing my lack of understanding of genetics here, but should the variant we call "banana" crash and burn, wouldn't it be possible to recreate it from crossbreeding the other varieties ? I mean, if that's how the moden commercial banana was created, we should be able to do it again, right ?

RedImperator · Post by **RedImperator** » 2006-05-16 07:49am

Bounty wrote:I'm probably showing my lack of understanding of genetics here, but should the variant we call "banana" crash and burn, wouldn't it be possible to recreate it from crossbreeding the other varieties ? I mean, if that's how the moden commercial banana was created, we should be able to do it again, right ?

Not if the precursor varieties are extinct, and even if you could, it would take years to do and years more to restablish the variety worldwide. Bananas, after all, grow on trees, which aren't exactly fast growers. It's not like corn where you plant a seed in March and have a harvest by September.

Shroom Man 777 · Post by **Shroom Man 777** » 2006-05-16 07:54am

Can't we just create some artificial food, some snack bar, that precisely replicates banannas flavor, chewiness, and other properties?

Vehrec · Post by **Vehrec** » 2006-05-16 08:14am

Truth be told, the effort to preserve the bannana is already underway. New breeds are in the pipline to replace the Cavendish, although it takes a LOT of effort to produce a single seed from a modern bannana. From what I hear a lot of the problems with the new breeds is that none of them have a thick enough skin to survive being transported like the Cavendish or it's predecessor the 'Gros Michel' or Big Mike. The upside is that a lot of these new breeds are better tasting than the Cavendish. So when they finnaly get thick skinned enough, we will be eatting a better bannana.

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2006-05-16 11:20am

Shroom Man 777 wrote:Can't we just create some artificial food, some snack bar, that precisely replicates banannas flavor, chewiness, and other properties?

And you'd want to eat this rather than a bananda, because?

Broomstick wrote:As Beowulf already said, all this has happened before. The first really popular banana in what is know as "The West" was the Gros Michel, which the Cavendish replaced.

There are actually many species of "banana" in the world, many of which still have seeds and thus still maintain genetic variation to a greater degree than the Cavendish. They do not, however, taste like the Gros Michel or Cavendish which more banana-savy parts of the world consider "desert" bananas.

We are not talking about the extinction of all bananas, we are speaking of a population crash of a particular variety of banana. The fact that North America and Europe regard that one variety as THE banana is more a problem of their culture than of bananas at large.

Smithsonian magazine did a story about bananas a couple months ago, but I don't have time to dig out the issue this morning for more details.

In many respects, that is what we mean by "an end to bananas" in our context. If the consumer can't find the same taste and size etc. at the supermarket, they may just give up on them, or deal with it (I'm thinking the latter if the main breed used today does die out). People have very fickle tastes in the First World for many things, but whether they will appreciate the best selling fruit becoming something different is another thing. Everyone may just buy apples or oranges or something more exotic. I doubt those in the industry want to take that chance.

Post by **Edi** » 2006-05-16 12:33pm

RedImperator wrote:Not if the precursor varieties are extinct, and even if you could, it would take years to do and years more to restablish the variety worldwide. Bananas, after all, grow on trees, which aren't exactly fast growers. It's not like corn where you plant a seed in March and have a harvest by September.

This might be a nitpick, but I was under the impression that the banana plant isn't an actual tree, but a variety of grass-like plant akin to bamboo in many respects. I might be mistaken, though. And the difference in common usage is pretty academic anyway.

Edi

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2006-05-16 01:14pm

Herbaceousplant, or herb, actually. You can tell from the lack of wood on the plant.

Duckie · Post by **Duckie** » 2006-05-16 02:06pm

Huh, I know that plants and animals go extinct, but it's always rather mindblowing when you hear about one that you would never expect about to kick the bucket. I'm suprised, really.

And I'm disappointed in SDN. We've gone 2 pages without a single reference to how this would stop female masturbation using Bananas.

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2006-05-16 02:27pm

MRDOD wrote:
And I'm disappointed in SDN. We've gone 2 pages without a single reference to how this would stop female masturbation using Bananas.

I'll be honest, I was actually going to make such a quip as my first post on this, but decided a more serious tone was required. Darn my rationally motivated mind.

Shroom Man 777 · Post by **Shroom Man 777** » 2006-05-16 04:34pm

Admiral Valdemar wrote:
Shroom Man 777 wrote:Can't we just create some artificial food, some snack bar, that precisely replicates banannas flavor, chewiness, and other properties?
And you'd want to eat this rather than a bananda, because?

Because there won't be anymore bandanas?

Darth Servo · Post by **Darth Servo** » 2006-05-16 05:28pm

Isn't there an old song about this?

Yes, we have no bananas. We have no bananas, today

Shogoki · Post by **Shogoki** » 2006-05-16 06:31pm

Excellent, the great mango conspiracy for world domination is proceeding just as foreseen.

CarsonPalmer · Post by **CarsonPalmer** » 2006-05-16 06:34pm

Darth Servo, thou hast been beaten to the punch by a mere noob. Check page one, knave.

Post by **fgalkin** » 2006-05-16 06:40pm

Now, I'm sure that when faced with the option of eating a genetically engineered banana, or no banana at all, most people would choose the former. I wouldn't count the banana out yet, at least if steps are taken to create a resistant breed.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2006-05-16 07:09pm

Shroom Man 777 wrote:
Because there won't be anymore bandanas?

I should slap you upside the head for mocking my single typo of the day, but alas, I am too weary. You win this round, Shroom.

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2006-05-16 07:55pm

fgalkin wrote:Now, I'm sure that when faced with the option of eating a genetically engineered banana, or no banana at all, most people would choose the former. I wouldn't count the banana out yet, at least if steps are taken to create a resistant breed.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

But but but but it's frankenfood!!! You're supporting big corporations! You're killing the Earth!

wolveraptor · Post by **wolveraptor** » 2006-05-16 08:23pm

You're killing the Earth!

Frankly, with two hurricanes in a row in New Orleans, a tsunami in the East Pacific, and an earthquake in Pakistan, the bitch deserves it.

Winston Blake · Post by **Winston Blake** » 2006-05-17 04:04am

Admiral Valdemar wrote:
MRDOD wrote:
And I'm disappointed in SDN. We've gone 2 pages without a single reference to how this would stop female masturbation using Bananas.
I'll be honest, I was actually going to make such a quip as my first post on this, but decided a more serious tone was required. Darn my rationally motivated mind.

I was going to mention something about an unexpected rise in cucumber demand, but it didn't really make sense so i cut it. Alternatively....

I AM A BANANA

Magnetic · Post by **Magnetic** » 2006-05-17 09:31am

Okay, . . . . just how serious IS this? I've not heard anything about it on any other venue other than this thread.

GrandMasterTerwynn · Post by **GrandMasterTerwynn** » 2006-05-17 09:56am

Magnetic wrote:Okay, . . . . just how serious IS this? I've not heard anything about it on any other venue other than this thread. :?

Well, for most major news sources, it will only be serious if a global fungal pandemic actually attacks Cavendish bananas and cuts the yield in half. And what's worse is that the species of fungus that would likely be responsible also attacks many of the other cultivated banana and plantain varieties. And you almost have to start a new banana variety from scratch, since commercially grown bananas are seedless and have to be grown from cuttings. (To create a fungus-resistant banana cultivar/variety the old-fashioned way requires a plant that can reproduce sexually and produces seeds . . . namely the wild Indian bananas that are rapidly being wiped out by habitat destruction. Once those go, the only way to do it will be to use direct genetic modification.)

Darth Raptor · Post by **Darth Raptor** » 2006-05-17 11:32am

fgalkin wrote:Now, I'm sure that when faced with the option of eating a genetically engineered banana, or no banana at all, most people would choose the former. I wouldn't count the banana out yet, at least if steps are taken to create a resistant breed.

The more retarded governments of the world would rather starve than accept GM foods. Bye bye, banana.