Star Wars: Legacy (set 145 ABY and starring Cade Skywalker)

Stofsk · Post by **Stofsk** » 2006-06-09 09:09am

nightmare wrote:Basically it's an improvement over crap, though that's not saying very much.

Why? Isn't progress in improvement, no matter how small, better than retrogressive movement?

nightmare · Post by **nightmare** » 2006-06-09 09:20am

Sure. But don't we aim for the stars?

000 · Post by **000** » 2006-06-10 11:25pm

Darths Wyyrlok and Krayt share a touching moment.

Tychu · Post by **Tychu** » 2006-06-11 12:12am

FTeik wrote:Where is the difference between Commies and Nazies outside the economy? (and sometimes not even there)? Replace arians with workers and non-arians with capitalists and the two become indistingishable.

A huge simplification, i know, but i somehow doubt a comic could go very deep into such a matter.

simple, Communism isnt a politcal entity, its just an economic one. Thats why the Soviet Union was a Socialist government
USSR
Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, Socialist governmetn, with a Communist Economy. It was litteraly run by the Communist Party
While Nazi Germany was run by Adolf Hitler and given power by his party, he ruled the nation

Plus After reading the Legacy #0 book that gives you all the info, it kinda looks like this is really going to be alright. The one thing thats confusing is i think its a typo but it says the Imperial-Sith War but then goes on to talk about the Empire fighting the Alliance that has the Jedi on their side.
Just to be clear, is the Empire once again allied with the Sith, cause i can just read original trilogy stuff over again

000 · Post by **000** » 2006-06-11 12:18am

No, the Sith and Empire are enemies.

Tychu · Post by **Tychu** » 2006-06-11 12:27am

ok just making sure

i just got the impression from what i read that the Empire and Sith are going to be teaming up to get rid of the Jedi on Ossus

DesertFly · Post by **DesertFly** » 2006-06-11 12:34am

From what I've read, the Empire and Sith ally to slaughter the Jedi on Ossus, and take Coruscant, then the Sith backstab the Empire (what a suprise), leading to conflict.

Galvatron · Post by **Galvatron** » 2006-06-11 07:50pm

Vympel wrote:

How predictable. Over a century has passed and they still have TIE fighters, Stormtroopers, Star Destroyers ..... no bloody creative mind at all.

I have no problem with that whatsoever. Then again, I'm the guy who wishes the clone wars had been fought using TIE fighters, stormtroopers and ISDs (and even been in service for centuries prior to their outbreak).

000 · Post by **000** » 2006-06-12 09:31pm

(Crossposted on TF.N)

Alright, I finally got a copy... here's my take on the events after 75 rS.

- The Imperial Remnant-- meaning Gil's backwater society that we know and love-- puts an Emperor back on the throne and proclaims itself, once again, the Empire. Interestingly, this suggests that the Imperial Remnant was the official name of the government, which would make sense, since without an Emperor it's not much of an Empire.

- The Empire is apparently no longer a member of the GA after this point, but by all indications it coexists peacefully with it.

- At some point, the Treaty of Anaxes is signed between the Empire and GA. There is little information given about this, but based on context I'll make the following speculations:
- With the new declaration of Empire, the Empire seceded from the GA.
- The Treaty of Anaxes was signed between the two governments.
- The Treaty of Anaxes stipulated that both sides were to support one another in the event of a new threat, or something along those lines.

- The Empire sets up the Imperial Mission at some point to expand its territory without going to war. This implies that planets are able to leave the GA to join the Empire if they want-- maybe a stipulation of the Treaty of Anaxes?

- ca. 155 or so the Ossus project moves forward, with the Vong shapers terraforming a portion of Ossus's surface.

- The project's success prompts terraforming projects on 100 worlds. These are sabotaged by the Sith (which are at this point still unrevealed), but blame is placed on the Vong by the Empire.

- The Empire demands that the GA do something about the Vong. The GA refuses.

- War breaks out. Many GA member worlds refuse to support the GA, either declaring neutrality or joining the Empire.

- The Sith reveal themselves and join the Empire's side of the war.

- The war goes on for three years. Presumably, the standard Jedi side with the GA or remain neutral, and the Imperial Jedi fight for the Empire. Another possibility is this war is what splits the order into the Imperial Knights and regular Jedi.

- The GA surrenders to the Empire in 165 rS. Whether Coruscant is handed over in this surrender or conquored during the war is unknown. The GA is absorbed into the Empire.

- The Emperor tells the Jedi to surrender and serve as a part of the Empire. The Jedi refuse and pull out of Coruscant, relocating staff from the Coruscant temple to Ossus. At this point the Sith are still allied with the Empire.

- More than likely, the comic picks up here.

- The Sith follow the Jedi to Ossus, attacking and destroying the Temple there. They are apparently aided by Imperial forces.

- The Sith turn on the Empire.

Oddly, the GA-Empire war is called in the text the Sith-Imperial War. I guess it's named in the vein of the French and Indian War... which would imply that #0 is written from a pro-GA POV.

Other tidbits:

- I don't see any concrete indication that Rasi Tuum is a Bothan, or that Darth Maladi is a Devaronian.
- The entry for the Rings of Coruscant doesn't say anything about it being a prime viewing area for the Rainbow Bridge. In fact, aside from the description of Vongformed Coruscant, nothing is said about the Rainbow Bridge at all. Which is good, since it was removed in TUF.
- I'd be willing to bet that the designator Super in Pellaeon-class Super Star Destroyer not supposed to be there. The Pellaeon-class Star Destroyer-- as it's called in the actual entry-- appears to fulfill the same role as the earlier Imperator-class Star Destroyers.
- Also, I think every Star Destroyer image on that page is of a PSD, just from different angles.
- The CF9 Crossfire is the "main fighter of the Galactic Alliance Core Force." What this means is up for grabs-- maybe the GA exists as an Imperial member-state? Does Core refer to the Core?

I'm now fully on board for this project, incidentally. I still would've liked a galaxy with no galactic government, but this is the next best thing.

Noble Ire · Post by **Noble Ire** » 2006-06-12 09:37pm

That actually sounds... not too bad. Are there still Imperial Jedi? I like the concept; indeed, the Jedi Order, at least the old one, would work far better with an Imperial Remnant style government.

000 · Post by **000** » 2006-06-12 09:46pm

Yep, they're still around. Looks like at least three main-secondary characters will be Imperial Jedi.

Incidentally, feel free to PM me anyone if you'd like *ahem* more information.

Anguirus · Post by **Anguirus** » 2006-06-12 10:17pm

What scares me is that this is rapidly starting to sound better than a great deal of post-RotJ literature.

Still don't know if I'm going to go for it, though. Are the fates of any major movie characters revealed? I mean, it certainly seems like Luke's gone by this time, which is a bit weird because apparently you can't kill Luke, but you can have stories set a hundred years his life that involve his descendants.

Cao Cao · Post by **Cao Cao** » 2006-06-12 10:25pm

The background of it all sounds nice enough.
But I just can't get over the camp villians or Cade "lolzor mandalorian trained space pirate bounty hunter rogue jedi" Skywalker and his hippy comrades.

But, time will tell.

000 · Post by **000** » 2006-06-12 10:26pm

I'm willing to bet Luke'll bite it in LotF.

And, honestly, the LotF/Legacy combo is sounding like the best realized storyline yet. I mean, I like how the timeline went following RotJ from a continuity standpoint, but most of the novels were indeed pretty bad.

EDIT: Cade's more like a Smuggler/Bounty Hunter. Born and trained a Jedi, sure, but he's turned from that heritage and even ditched his 'saber. And he was apprenticed to a pirate, not Mandalorians...

Chris OFarrell · Post by **Chris OFarrell** » 2006-06-12 10:45pm

Sounds like shit. Oh yes the Imperial Remaint steamrolls the fucking rest of the Galaxy rather then the completly logical opposite, the GA inteligence service shows itself ONCE again to be completly fucked, the IR think putting an Emperor on the throne again is A Good Thing, the Sith magicly reappear from nowehere despite their line ending with Palpitine AND they join the Empire, despite strong evidence that the IR hate them even more then the Jedi for screwing up everything.

The Galaxy happily accepts the Empire back to rule it over a hundred planets teraforming being screwed up (yes 100 planets out of countless millions and of course once again NRI's successors completly fail to discover who did it).

The Jedi split. Again.

The Sith somehow manage not to kill each other, despite the whole point of Darth Banes restructring of the order was because more then 2 Sith simply CAN'T WORK TOGETHER. In other words these are just Dark Jedi pretending to be a Sith, given that the real order is long dead and certianly almost all their materials, records and so on were destroyed...

I've seen Fanfics which have far superior plots to this POS. I frankly don't give a damn if their new uber wank SSD is well designed or not, the universe is frankly dead to me.

000 · Post by **000** » 2006-06-12 11:10pm

Chris OFarrell wrote:Sounds like shit. Oh yes the Imperial Remaint steamrolls the fucking rest of the Galaxy rather then the completly logical opposite

Given that the "steamrolling" takes place over the course of three years and over a hundred years after Vong war... why is this illogical?

the GA inteligence service shows itself ONCE again to be completly fucked

How do you figure?

the IR think putting an Emperor on the throne again is A Good Thing

Why wouldn't it be?

the Sith magicly reappear from nowehere despite their line ending with Palpitine

Dark Lady Lumiya has been around in the canon since the eighties, and a confirmed Sith offshoot since the late nineties. Need I remind you also that it doesn't take a whole lot more than Sith holocrons and lore to start a new Order? Nadd did it, Kun did it, Revan did it, Ruin did it. It's not without precedent.

AND they join the Empire, despite strong evidence that the IR hate them even more then the Jedi for screwing up everything.

This is the only big qualm I have, since the Empire-- particularly the Remnant-- has never liked force users that much. Still, from what very little we know now, it seems more like the Sith jump in as an independant entity and ally with the Empire against the GA.

The Galaxy happily accepts the Empire back to rule it over a hundred planets teraforming being screwed up

This goes back a long ways. The Vong war made the Empire appealing to a large portion of the population, and it seems that many of the new generation (as of 75 rS) are feeling nostalgic for an Empire they missed being born into. And, once again, a hundred years is a long time.

(yes 100 planets out of countless millions and of course once again NRI's successors completly fail to discover who did it).

Just as Republic Intelligence never picked up on Bane's order?

The Jedi split. Again.

A split that's been in the works since the very beginning, and makes logical sense.

The Sith somehow manage not to kill each other, despite the whole point of Darth Banes restructring of the order was because more then 2 Sith simply CAN'T WORK TOGETHER.

Revan's order did fine while it lasted. Kun's Brotherhood did fine. The New Sith Empire held together for a thousand years and ruled most of the galaxy for a hundred. One again, it's not without precedent, and there's nothing to say that Bane had all the right ideas.

In other words these are just Dark Jedi pretending to be a Sith, given that the real order is long dead and certianly almost all their materials, records and so on were destroyed...

Once again, an argument could be made that pretty much every Sith Order after the fall of the old Empire were pretty much "Dark Jedi pretending to be Sith."

I've seen Fanfics which have far superior plots to this POS.

Considering you haven't yet read any of the actual material, that seems a bit premature.

I frankly don't give a damn if their new uber wank SSD is well designed or not, the universe is frankly dead to me.

Like I said above, I think the Super designator was an oversight and the PSD fills the same role as the old ISDs.

CaptainChewbacca · Post by **CaptainChewbacca** » 2006-06-13 01:08am

000 wrote:I'm willing to bet Luke'll bite it in LotF.

And, honestly, the LotF/Legacy combo is sounding like the best realized storyline yet. I mean, I like how the timeline went following RotJ from a continuity standpoint, but most of the novels were indeed pretty bad.

EDIT: Cade's more like a Smuggler/Bounty Hunter. Born and trained a Jedi, sure, but he's turned from that heritage and even ditched his 'saber. And he was apprenticed to a pirate, not Mandalorians...

Luke is still alive? I thought he'd died before this thing. Also, the "Imperial Knights" seem kinda cool, I hope we get more regional jedi "branches" for variety.

Shadowtraveler · Post by **Shadowtraveler** » 2006-06-13 03:41am

CaptainChewbacca wrote:
000 wrote:I'm willing to bet Luke'll bite it in LotF.

And, honestly, the LotF/Legacy combo is sounding like the best realized storyline yet. I mean, I like how the timeline went following RotJ from a continuity standpoint, but most of the novels were indeed pretty bad.

EDIT: Cade's more like a Smuggler/Bounty Hunter. Born and trained a Jedi, sure, but he's turned from that heritage and even ditched his 'saber. And he was apprenticed to a pirate, not Mandalorians...
Luke is still alive? I thought he'd died before this thing. Also, the "Imperial Knights" seem kinda cool, I hope we get more regional jedi "branches" for variety.

I think he means that Luke'll die in Legacy of the Force.

Personally, the new Empire thing makes sense. After all, the NR fucked up in the Vong War so badly to the point that most of the Galaxy would want them dead if they knew some of the stupid crap they did. I mean, Borsk actually tried hiding evidence of the Vong during the first few months. To think he stayed in office for another two years...

DesertFly · Post by **DesertFly** » 2006-06-13 04:11am

I might very well follow this. I'm not one given to much comic buying, but this is actually looking fun. Having had a look at the introductory comic, I have to say that some of the ideas they have in there look nice. Also, Darth Krayt totally=Jacen Solo.

EDIT-comic, not comment

Post by **K. A. Pital** » 2006-06-13 05:17am

Oh. So the Empire rose again and beat everyone to bloody pulp? And the Sith rose again too? Something comes to mind...

How very creative of them.

Lazarus · Post by **Lazarus** » 2006-06-13 05:34am

I was, and still am, very skeptical about much of this, mostly concerning the characters rather than the premise or setting. It seems to be another case of not quite hitting the bullseye, but still managing to land somewhere on the target, which you get with a lot of EU stuff. Continuity, as always, may be something of a problem, and IMO this is usually more of a problem with comics. Tacking on a 'Super' prefix for the hell of it is one example already.

I do like the idea of Imperial Jedi quite a lot though, and I hope that there's less 'Empire=Bad, NR=good' crap in this. I'm not so sure about putting an Emperor back on the throne, a council of Moffs always struck me as a better idea, but depending on how its done (ie they havent shoved some crazy ass maniac there, because of course all evil genius's must be insane) it could be acceptable. If they do refer at some point to why the GA lost, perhaps reduced military spending or somesuch, then I'll probably end up liking the whole Empire Resurrected idea. It all depends on the writing really, this can still nosedive horribly, or if we're lucky it could be passable. Maybe.

FTeik · Post by **FTeik** » 2006-06-13 05:41am

No, the empire doesn't steamroll the NR or GA. They just make the better offer and like in Zahn's HoT the worlds, that are fucked up with the NR/GA join it. Basically the empire builds up its powerbase peacefully until it is strong enough to wipe the floor with what is left of the GA.

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2006-06-13 05:43am

Actually, as much as I dislike most post-DE EU, having the Empire gain support 100 years after a brutal genocidal war that's still having reprecussions does make sense. I'm sure the IR painted a rosy picture out of the long-past era of Imperial peace under Palpatine, to contrast with the ineffectual New Republic and its successor (as per Betrayal).

Donraj · Post by **Donraj** » 2006-06-13 06:15am

Despite all the good reasons people have given as to why this is stupid and and a rehash of old ideas and such, I'm stoked to see this. I might actually start reading comics for a change. This is promising all the things I've always wanted to see in Star Wars, multiple Sith (no Rule of Two restricting them), Jedi not basically turned into happy cops by one central authority, both sides going at it, repeatedly, etc.

Say what you will, but I'm going to enjoy this.

VT-16 · Post by **VT-16** » 2006-06-13 06:44am

I'm going to enjoy watching Darth Krayt's order disintegrate like Lord Kaan's 1100 years before. If LFL stays consistent, that is. :P