Clone Army vs. Zentraedi (an actual scenario)

[Durandal]

Here's the scenario. Kyron's ship is stranded on the ground, awaiting repairs. All its weapon systems have been disabled, and the repair crews are focusing on getting the engines and fold drive back online. The crews are using salvaged parts from two other downed Zentraedi cruisers that are beyond repair in the immediate vicinity of Kyron's cruiser (within a 2km radius). The air support in all three ships has been destroyed from previous battles, and only a limited number of pods are left.

The Imperials, freshly occupying the planet, need to stop Kyron's cruiser from lifting off and escaping. The Acclamators have already landed, and they cannot lift off in time to get to Kyron's ship and stop it from escaping, as they are also engaged in pacifying other resistance. The invasion force commander left no orbiting ships in space; he has been executed for his incompetence, but what's done is done. Thus, the Imperials are diverting all local ground forces in the area to stop Kyron's ship from lifting off. Kyron must be captured for intelligence reasons; do not ask how the Imperials will hold a 50-foot tall guy. They have ways.

Zentraedi Assets

Ground forces

1 disabled Nupetiet Vergnitzs-class command cruiser (Kyron's ship), which includes its troop complement of:

• Crew (3100 men)
• Air Group (4000 men)
• Troops (8000 men)

2 effectively destroyed Thuverl Salan-class heavy cruisers, which each include their crew complements of:

• Crew (600 men)
• Air Group (400 men)
• Troops (2000 men)

Total ground forces with attrition and repair crews accounted for:

• 11,000 troops
• 2,500 crewers

Air support:

• 250 standard battle pods.
• 50 Gluuhaug battle pods.
• 25 Serauhaug battle pods.
• 25 Del battle pods.

Imperial Assets

Ground forces and artillery

• 20,000 infantry clonetroopers
• 20 Self-Propelled Heavy Artillery Turbolasers (SPHA-T's)
• 50 All-Terrain Tactical Enforcers (AT-TE's)

Air Support:

200 Low-Altitude Assault Transports (LAAT/i's)

The Imperial objective is to maneuver the SPHA-T's into range of Kyron's cruiser so that they can blast away the drive section. The Zentraedi need to stall the Imperial forces long enough to allow Kyron's ship to lift off. The engagement begins when the Imperial forces are 10km from Kyron's ship. We'll pretend that the SPHA-T's have a range of 2km. It will take approximately 1 hour for Kyron's ship to be repaired. In addition, it will take it 15 minutes to reach sufficient altitude to be out of the SPHA-T's range entirely.

The terrain has been leveled by the crashes of three heavy cruisers in the general vicinity. There is sporadic battlefield debris and wreckage, but nothing either side cannot overcome.

Engage!

[Darth Wong]

The Imperial objective is to maneuver the SPHA-T's into range of Kyron's cruiser so that they can blast away the drive section. The Zentraedi need to stall the Imperial forces long enough to allow Kyron's ship to lift off. The engagement begins when the Imperial forces are 10km from Kyron's ship. We'll pretend that the SPHA-T's have a range of 2km.

Not to ask stupid questions, but why would we limit the SPHA-T's range to a small fraction of its actual value?

[Sea Skimmer]

The Imperial objective is to maneuver the SPHA-T's into range of Kyron's cruiser so that they can blast away the drive section. The Zentraedi need to stall the Imperial forces long enough to allow Kyron's ship to lift off. The engagement begins when the Imperial forces are 10km from Kyron's ship. We'll pretend that the SPHA-T's have a range of 2km.

Not to ask stupid questions, but why would we limit the SPHA-T's range to a small fraction of its actual value?

Question, does anything offical ever give its range or is all we know based off the shots fired in ATOC?

[Darth Wong]

Question, does anything offical ever give its range or is all we know based off the shots fired in ATOC?

I don't think there's anything official, but with AT-AT range of more than 17 km and AT-AT's taking fire from Rebel small-arms at more than 5 km, it would be rather silly for the SPHA-T to have a weapons range of just 2 km.

[Durandal]

Because the SPHA-T's need to get in range of Kyron's cruiser. I guess it could work if we started them outside the range of the SPHA-T's, but that'd be on the order of 20 km away from the scene.

Let's say we make the assumed range 10 km, and the engagement zone 15 km away. How's that?

[Currald]

Couldn't the 'pods just fire missiles at the sphaats? The would eliminate any serious threat to the ship.

[Xon]

Couldn't the 'pods just fire missiles at the sphaats? The would eliminate any serious threat to the ship.

How powerful are the missiles (they arent the powerful, as there isnt any significant blast wave then they are detonate in atmosphere)?

Also, more importantly how fast are the missiles? If you can track them with the Mark 1 eyeball, in visual range then that puts a large cap on the missiles velocity.

[Currald]

The Serauhaugs can each carry four 34 kT yield nuclear missile, which go mach 2.2 and have a range of 291 km. At least, according to the Robotech Research Guide: http://www.3dgamedev.com/robotech/Mecha ... 0Artillery

Hardly official, and somewhat speculative, but the best-researched Robotech reference IMO.

So the slow-moving sphaats shouldn't be too hard to deal with. Fighting the gunships w/o fighter pods could be tough, though. The clones could send in a bunch of gunships with assault squads, who would be hard to hit because of their miniscule size in comparison to the Zentraedi. They could infiltrate Khyron's ship and sabotage it. Maybe. If they could get close enough.

[Darth Fanboy]

Zentraedi win because Kyron is the bastard love child of Grand Admiral Thrawn and a Zentraedi wench and Shmi.

In honesty I'd have to give the CLone Army/Imperial Army the nod on this one since the Zentraedi never repair their equipment, while an invasion/occupying force would use at least working order equipment if not top of the line.

[Currald]

The Zentraedi do SOME repairs. Remember when Max flew through Breetai's big screen? They installed a smaller one to replace it until they could get a new big one.

[VF5SS]

Hardly official, and somewhat speculative, but the best-researched Robotech reference IMO.

Actually its an extremely poor guide since they keep including animation errors and flawed dialogue as canon evidence. And its KAMJIN! Not Khyron. You gotta get Robotech out of your blood, man.

[Durandal]

The Serauhaugs can each carry four 34 kT yield nuclear missile, which go mach 2.2 and have a range of 291 km. At least, according to the Robotech Research Guide: http://www.3dgamedev.com/robotech/Mecha ... 0Artillery

Hardly official, and somewhat speculative, but the best-researched Robotech reference IMO.

So the slow-moving sphaats shouldn't be too hard to deal with. Fighting the gunships w/o fighter pods could be tough, though. The clones could send in a bunch of gunships with assault squads, who would be hard to hit because of their miniscule size in comparison to the Zentraedi. They could infiltrate Khyron's ship and sabotage it. Maybe. If they could get close enough.

That's somewhat preposterous. The missile detonations that we observed in the show were not twice the magnitude of the Hiroshima bomb. They were no more impressive than modern air-to-air warheads equipped on jet fighters. Also, the SPHA-T's are shielded.

[Durandal]

Oh, and we never heard a sonic boom from those missiles, so they travel below mach 1.

[Darksider]

The clones would take it hands down because we see in AOTC that the infantry weapons can blast apart super battle droids and destroyer droids in one shot (I coulden't tell weather or not it had it's shield on) and that they can put out a massive volume of fire (when all of the shots were going over the droid army) and that is not even counting the at-te's which could destroy a battlepod in one shot from it's main cannon (we see them blowing up from one AC round in the series) and they gunships mini-superlasers would defanatly be an asset (by the way durandel "an actual scenario"? no offense but what exactly is that supposed to mean?)

[Durandal]

It was in reference to the other Zentraedi vs. Clonetroopers thread, where a bunch of ground forces from each side were simply plopped into place to see who would come out on top. This scenario has goals for each side to accomplish.

[Darksider]

ah i see well i posted the other thread and was worried you were taking a shot at me but as to why i posted no objectives i just wanted to see who would win in a battle royal where the only obj. was to annihalate the other side i wanted to se who would be left standing

[Currald]

Hardly official, and somewhat speculative, but the best-researched Robotech reference IMO.

Actually its an extremely poor guide since they keep including animation errors and flawed dialogue as canon evidence.

Hmmm... so you're saying that we should ignore onscreen evidence and ignore the dialogue, leaving us with... what?

And its KAMJIN! Not Khyron. You gotta get Robotech out of your blood, man.

Gosh, and here I thought that Robotech was the subject under discussion. Silly me!


As for the rest of you, well, you're right. My appeal to authority was a complete and utter failure when compared to your analysis of empirical data.

[VF5SS]

Hmmm... so you're saying that we should ignore onscreen evidence and ignore the dialogue, leaving us with... what?

Have you seen some of the animations errors in Macross? Mis-colored VFs, color changing VFs, wonky perspective, lasers out of a VF's FLIR cameras, Zentradi constantly drawn at the wrong height, bad scaling, extra parts appearing on VFs, badly drawn enemy mecha, etc. What do you have left? What you have to understand is that animation (especially the old stuff) can be so error prone that its nearly useless.

Gosh, and here I thought that Robotech was the subject under discussion. Silly me!

Silly me, I thought that the Zentradi came from Macross Of course not. The Robotech god, Macek, created it all

[VF5SS]

Arg...sorry that was a knee jerk anti-Robotech reaction by me. I'll ty to stay out of these anime vs debates. Again I apologize. Bad call on my part.

[DPDarkPrimus]

Zentraedi win because Kyron is the bastard love child of Grand Admiral Thrawn and a Zentraedi wench and Shmi.

How does that work?

[Darth_Shinji]

The way too go thru that stuff in the original series is common sence. We know what it is supposed to be the majority of the time. Also what should we base are knoweledge of zent tech if not the series?

[Currald]

Come to think of it, I don't remember EVER hearing a sonic boom in Robotech, even when it was obvious that a ship HAD to be going supersonic. Anyone care to cite an example of a sonic boom?

[Galvatron]

Actually its an extremely poor guide since they keep including animation errors and flawed dialogue as canon evidence. And its KAMJIN! Not Khyron. You gotta get Robotech out of your blood, man.

Why? Robotech was superior to Macross.

[Durandal]

Actually its an extremely poor guide since they keep including animation errors and flawed dialogue as canon evidence. And its KAMJIN! Not Khyron. You gotta get Robotech out of your blood, man.

Why? Robotech was superior to Macross.

While I liked Robotech, Macross was infinitely cooler.

[VF5SS]

Actually its an extremely poor guide since they keep including animation errors and flawed dialogue as canon evidence. And its KAMJIN! Not Khyron. You gotta get Robotech out of your blood, man.

Why? Robotech was superior to Macross.

Gee dumbed down dialogue and a lose connection to two unrelated series make it so much better