I went into Barnes & Noble to take a look at The New Essential Guide to Droids today, and I found this gem.
Star Wars on Trial : Science Fiction and Fantasy Writers Debate the Most Popular Science Fiction Films of All Time (Smart Pop series) (Paperback)
by David Brin (Editor), Matthew Woodring Stover (Editor)
And apparently, Brin brings up Trek quite a bit (I just skimmed a few sections, and at least his "Trek represents the common man" argument is still there.)
This is going to be fun. I wonder what conclusion they'll come to (if any).
Jesse Helms died on the 4th of July and the nation celebrated with fireworks, BBQs and a day off for everyone. -- Ed Brayton, Dispatches from the Culture Wars
"And a force-sensitive mandalorian female Bountyhunter, who is also the granddaughter of Darth Vader is as cool as it can get. Almost absolute zero." -- FTeik
When ballots have fairly and constitutionally decided, there can be no successful appeal back to bullets.
—Abraham Lincoln
People pray so that God won't crush them like bugs.
—Dr. Gregory House
Oil an emergency?! It's about time, Brigadier, that the leaders of this planet of yours realised that to remain dependent upon a mineral slime simply doesn't make sense.
—The Doctor "Terror Of The Zygons" (1975)
The man was involved in the second Foundation trilogy. Nuff said.
'Next time I let Superman take charge, just hit me. Real hard.'
'You're a princess from a society of immortal warriors. I'm a rich kid with issues. Lots of issues.'
'No. No dating for the Batman. It might cut into your brooding time.'
'Tactically we have multiple objectives. So we need to split into teams.'-'Dibs on the Amazon!'
'Hey, we both have a Martian's phone number on our speed dial. I think I deserve the benefit of the doubt.'
'You know, for a guy with like 50 different kinds of vision, you sure are blind.'
I see you haven't figured out that SD.net doesn't list the complete link. The link you posted only takes you to the title page. The shredding of Brin's trash is here
"everytime a person is born the Earth weighs just a little more."--DMJ on StarTrek.com
"You see now you are using your thinking and that is not a good thing!" DMJay on StarTrek.com
"Watching Sarli argue with Vympel, Stas, Schatten and the others is as bizarre as the idea of the 40-year-old Virgin telling Hugh Hefner that Hef knows nothing about pussy, and that he is the expert."--Elfdart
[quote="Darth Servo]I see you haven't figured out that SD.net doesn't list the complete link. The link you posted only takes you to the title page. The shredding of Brin's trash is here[/quote]
I had figured it out, just forgot about it. Indeed, I was thinking about the time when I finally figured-out how to link to those pages (right-click on the link, select "Properties", then copy the url) as I was reading the article. Unfortunately it did not occur to me that I had not done that when making my post in this thread.
A Sad Pathetic Man wrote:The question Is George Lucas a hero for bringing science fiction to a mass audience or a villain who doesn't understand the genre he's working for?
Translation: WAAAAAAAHHH! GEORGE LUCAS IS SO MEAN TO ME! EVERYBODY PAYS ATTENTION TO HIM AND NOT ME WAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHH!
When ballots have fairly and constitutionally decided, there can be no successful appeal back to bullets.
—Abraham Lincoln
People pray so that God won't crush them like bugs.
—Dr. Gregory House
Oil an emergency?! It's about time, Brigadier, that the leaders of this planet of yours realised that to remain dependent upon a mineral slime simply doesn't make sense.
—The Doctor "Terror Of The Zygons" (1975)
Lucas probably did Star Wars with the express purpose of taking attention away from Brin.
'Next time I let Superman take charge, just hit me. Real hard.'
'You're a princess from a society of immortal warriors. I'm a rich kid with issues. Lots of issues.'
'No. No dating for the Batman. It might cut into your brooding time.'
'Tactically we have multiple objectives. So we need to split into teams.'-'Dibs on the Amazon!'
'Hey, we both have a Martian's phone number on our speed dial. I think I deserve the benefit of the doubt.'
'You know, for a guy with like 50 different kinds of vision, you sure are blind.'
Yep just sounds like its a case of a sad writer crying because his movie flopped while the one written by what hbe calls a hack is doing great!
WAAAAH!
Anyway I would hardly call this man's work great Sci Fi. After all most his books are about man post some sort of disasterous appolilypse and their fight to survive.
Writing about the future does not neccicarily make his work more Sci fi than someone elses.
Of course in his mind apperentally the works of Jules Verne aren't Sci fi either but modernistic writing as Verne used main stuff from his own age, ect.
He is obviously in the camp of is a Sci Fi story has even a hint of myth and legend to it its not sci fi its fantasy!
Hapan Battle Dragons Rule!
When you want peace prepare for war! --Confusious
That was disapointing ..Should we show this Federation how to build a ship so we may have worthy foes? Typhonis 1
The Prince of The Writer's Guild|HAB Spacewolf Tank General| God Bless America!
The question Is George Lucas a hero for bringing science fiction to a mass audience or a villain who doesn't understand the genre he's working for?
I think this sums it up pretty well that it's a useless opinion piece by someone who nobody cares about. . .
. . .attempting to REDEFINE scien fiction. Does he EVER justify his "definition" of sci-fi as "a new kind of storytelling that often rebels against those very same archetypes Campbell venerated. An upstart belief in progress, egalitarianism, positive-sum games -- and the slim but real possibility of decent human institutions"
I remember sending this idiot a link to Mike's thrashing of his article he wrote right after TPM came out. His response? Something along the lines of "Well, we all make mistakes. Why are people so willing to forgive Lucas' but not mine. I guess I'm just not an 'elite' ". I guess the tard doesn't get the difference between "mistakes" and "out-right lies", nor does he get that circular logic is NOT a good thing.
"everytime a person is born the Earth weighs just a little more."--DMJ on StarTrek.com
"You see now you are using your thinking and that is not a good thing!" DMJay on StarTrek.com
"Watching Sarli argue with Vympel, Stas, Schatten and the others is as bizarre as the idea of the 40-year-old Virgin telling Hugh Hefner that Hef knows nothing about pussy, and that he is the expert."--Elfdart
Isolder74 wrote:Of course in his mind apperentally the works of Jules Verne aren't Sci fi either but modernistic writing as Verne used main stuff from his own age, ect.
He is obviously in the camp of is a Sci Fi story has even a hint of myth and legend to it its not sci fi its fantasy!
According to Brin's "definition" of Sci-fi that I quoted in my last post above, War of the Worlds and 2010 are NOT sci-fi but Robin Hood is.
"everytime a person is born the Earth weighs just a little more."--DMJ on StarTrek.com
"You see now you are using your thinking and that is not a good thing!" DMJay on StarTrek.com
"Watching Sarli argue with Vympel, Stas, Schatten and the others is as bizarre as the idea of the 40-year-old Virgin telling Hugh Hefner that Hef knows nothing about pussy, and that he is the expert."--Elfdart
It *is* kind of cute how Brin takes the term 'science fiction' and decides that it *really* means 'naive proto-utopian buzzword fiction'. Maybe not even fiction - he probably sees this stories as 'the upstart dreams of the disenfranchised' or something similarly retarded. All that, instead of that OTHER definition! That one sucks because it doesn't 'venerate the individual' enough, or something. And plus it makes his work look like clueless self-indulgent nonsense.
Darth Servo wrote:
According to Brin's "definition" of Sci-fi that I quoted in my last post above, War of the Worlds and 2010 are NOT sci-fi but Robin Hood is.
But there's nothing wrong with that definition nosir. Just because Robin Hood has none of the classic elements of SF-y'know, the future, aliens, advanced technology, spaceships, robots, rayguns, that kind of stuff-while both 2010 and War of the Worlds did doesn't mean anything. Because, y'know, Brin said so.
'Next time I let Superman take charge, just hit me. Real hard.'
'You're a princess from a society of immortal warriors. I'm a rich kid with issues. Lots of issues.'
'No. No dating for the Batman. It might cut into your brooding time.'
'Tactically we have multiple objectives. So we need to split into teams.'-'Dibs on the Amazon!'
'Hey, we both have a Martian's phone number on our speed dial. I think I deserve the benefit of the doubt.'
'You know, for a guy with like 50 different kinds of vision, you sure are blind.'
I agree with Batman. Robin Hood is true, old-school science fiction at it's finest - every scene is packed with speculation about future societies, the effects on man and his society of advanced technology, and most importantly space exploration.
For an outsider on this, can someone explain how anyone could classify 2010 as NOT Sci-fi but RobinHood as?
Praying is another way of doing nothing helpful
"Congratulations, you get a cookie. You almost got a fundamental English word correct." Pick
"Outlaw star has spaceships that punch eachother" Joviwan Read "Tales From The Crossroads"! Read "One Wrong Turn"!
I believe Bounty linked to the article in question further up but here you go.
'Next time I let Superman take charge, just hit me. Real hard.'
'You're a princess from a society of immortal warriors. I'm a rich kid with issues. Lots of issues.'
'No. No dating for the Batman. It might cut into your brooding time.'
'Tactically we have multiple objectives. So we need to split into teams.'-'Dibs on the Amazon!'
'Hey, we both have a Martian's phone number on our speed dial. I think I deserve the benefit of the doubt.'
'You know, for a guy with like 50 different kinds of vision, you sure are blind.'
Crossroads Inc. wrote:For an outsider on this, can someone explain how anyone could classify 2010 as NOT Sci-fi but RobinHood as?
Don't you know? English mythology set in the dark ages is a true vision of the future, while a movie involving spaceships, alien devices, sophisticated computers, and Russian-American cooperation is pure fantasy.
Crossroads Inc. wrote:For an outsider on this, can someone explain how anyone could classify 2010 as NOT Sci-fi but RobinHood as?
When you redefine the term. According to David Brin, sci-fi has NOTHING to do with a society having more advanced technology than we currently have. Noooooooo. According to Mr Self Acclaimed Great Sci-Fi Novelist, genuine science fiction is defined as "a new kind of storytelling that often rebels against those very same archetypes Campbell venerated. An upstart belief in progress, egalitarianism, positive-sum games -- and the slim but real possibility of decent human institutions"
"everytime a person is born the Earth weighs just a little more."--DMJ on StarTrek.com
"You see now you are using your thinking and that is not a good thing!" DMJay on StarTrek.com
"Watching Sarli argue with Vympel, Stas, Schatten and the others is as bizarre as the idea of the 40-year-old Virgin telling Hugh Hefner that Hef knows nothing about pussy, and that he is the expert."--Elfdart
