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[Alan Bolte]

Eh, on Maggie - Horde side there's a severe overtanking situation as far as gear goes, but a lack of talent builds that go farther than 15 into prot. So you have all these warriors not in any way outfitted for DPS, that also can't tank as well as they should. I'm currently rocking a 0/21/30 (a/f/p) build, which makes me surprisingly capable in dealing out damage while dual wielding, while at the same time making me enough of a tank to be considered for an MT or OT position. My only problem is a lack of DPS gear, most of what I have is aimed at tanking. It certainly makes for interesting PvP.

[White Haven]

Y'see, I've got a different perspective on that. Mannoroth has tons of guilds that do BWL/AQ and such. We're wallpapered with them. I see Faith walking through Ironforge already, I know a mage with 2/9 Frostfire and a Wraith Blade, and that guild is neck-and-neck in Naxxramas with Predestined, who used to be Twelve Prophets if that name rings a bell. So on a server with decent faction balance, the PvP works fine. On an unbalanced server, the outnumbered side gets steamrolled. You can't design things specifically with a massive Alliance numerical superiority, because then they get shafted up the ass on balanced servers.

[Silver Paladin]

Eh, on Maggie - Horde side there's a severe overtanking situation as far as gear goes, but a lack of talent builds that go farther than 15 into prot. So you have all these warriors not in any way outfitted for DPS, that also can't tank as well as they should. I'm currently rocking a 0/21/30 (a/f/p) build, which makes me surprisingly capable in dealing out damage while dual wielding, while at the same time making me enough of a tank to be considered for an MT or OT position. My only problem is a lack of DPS gear, most of what I have is aimed at tanking. It certainly makes for interesting PvP.

I still can't find a justification to give up MS. Hands down, it is the absolute best debuff in PVP. It's sick.

Fury PVE kills me in DPS; but they're much less effective in PVP since they can "frontload" less damage than MS with a 3.8 weapon. Throw in the cherry on top that is the 50% heal debuff, it's awesome.

[Silver Paladin]

Y'see, I've got a different perspective on that. Mannoroth has tons of guilds that do BWL/AQ and such. We're wallpapered with them. I see Faith walking through Ironforge already, I know a mage with 2/9 Frostfire and a Wraith Blade, and that guild is neck-and-neck in Naxxramas with Predestined, who used to be Twelve Prophets if that name rings a bell. So on a server with decent faction balance, the PvP works fine. On an unbalanced server, the outnumbered side gets steamrolled. You can't design things specifically with a massive Alliance numerical superiority, because then they get shafted up the ass on balanced servers.

I have both perspective. I played on Archimonde (transferred to Dethecus) where Horde outnumbered Alliance about 1.5:1 and we got rolled. The premiere Horde guild is Nurfed, so there's a lot of Horde fanboys rerolling on the server trying to get in. 12 Prophets were the guys who corpse rezzed inside Old Ironforge to pull Magni I believe

On the other hand, I also play on Silver Hand, which Alliance outnumbers Horde 2.6:1. I've gone through an entire day without seeing a horde while I'm out grinding; in this case, they would get steamrolled in an open PVP situation.

In both cases, I'm alliance, so I definitely see the problem as well.

[Ghost Rider]

Y'see, I've got a different perspective on that. Mannoroth has tons of guilds that do BWL/AQ and such. We're wallpapered with them. I see Faith walking through Ironforge already, I know a mage with 2/9 Frostfire and a Wraith Blade, and that guild is neck-and-neck in Naxxramas with Predestined, who used to be Twelve Prophets if that name rings a bell. So on a server with decent faction balance, the PvP works fine. On an unbalanced server, the outnumbered side gets steamrolled. You can't design things specifically with a massive Alliance numerical superiority, because then they get shafted up the ass on balanced servers.

For you I can see it being fun. My post was more akin to what will happen my server when they see they can get raid wide buff for their new stomping grounds.

Literally we have 1-2 elite Horde guilds that do either AQ40 or Naxx(with only one of them just beating Anub)...maybe 3-4 that are in BWL, and barely touching AQ40. While our Alliance is 3-4 in Naxx, with 10 -15 doing AQ40 and 14 of them farming BWL.

[Ghost Rider]

All right since we left it off of what will patch 1.12 do for World PvP...we get our first look at Sand.

Holy shit, if this part is true, that has to be one of the more useless tries I've seen Blizz do in a looooong time.

[Stormin]

Are you sure that that's the PvP improvement and not just some random crap before they reveal the good stuff?

[Meest]

Well there's going to be 2 zones with "world (aka farming)" objectives, the thing with that though is everyone will flock to two zones. With the way the AQ opening crashed every few seconds I don't think this will be good, the whole world needs pvp objectives or else it will be a pure zerg fest in two dedicated zones..

[Stormin]

Make towns, cities and fortresses capturable and claimable by guilds. Every one captured gives a realm-wide bonus for as long as it is held (damage, aggro holding, pve coin drop, crafting, etc). Add siege engines and such so that assualts can be done easier too. Add special fortresses that can be captured and claimed and have realm access to a good farming/exp dungeon be based on the number held. When control switches the side now holding will attempt to go down and force out the players who have just lost control.
And finally somehow avoid the lawsuit from EA/Mythic!


Might not work for WoW though with its two sides. With a three sided conflict there is self-correction where two weaker sides will usually gang up on the stronger.