Battle Fleet Gothic

GeneralTacticus · Post by **GeneralTacticus** » 2006-07-15 07:13am

See the alternate campaign rules NecronLord posted earlier in the thread.

Personally, I'd prefer we use the basic rules from the BFG rulebook, because it's not just NL that will have to apply them - us players will need to use them as well, what with all the different orders to be given out, movement rates and industrial output to be calculated, and all the rest. However, if the majority here is in favour of using them, I'll accept it.

And, given the current prevalence of Imperial fleets, I'll be going with Chaos. List to follow when I finish drawing it up.

Prozac the Robert · Post by **Prozac the Robert** » 2006-07-15 07:51am

Imperial Overlord wrote: I suggest using the optional rules with small craft to avoid the cheesy "massive swarms of doom" attack craft strategies and the Chapter approved rules on fighters acting as a bomber screen.

Any chance of a bit of exposition on that point? I was wondering about taking quite a large number of fighta-bomber equiped ships, does this have any bearing on that? Would it be bad form?

GeneralTacticus · Post by **GeneralTacticus** » 2006-07-15 07:55am

IIRC, the rule is that you can have only as many attack craft squadrons on the table as you have launch bays for them. Otherwise, it's easy to create a Chaos or Imperial fleet capable of cranking out 12 or 16 attack craft squadrons every turn (as long as they don't run out of ordnance), which, as you might imagine, can make the game a little one-sided. Especially when some of them are boarding craft.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2006-07-15 11:47am

Apologies for the abscence, my 'net connection was down. And yeah, the alt-campaign rules are hellaciously complex.

StarshipTitanic wrote:Now I'm scared! How does one travel to unconnected systems?

With difficulty. Basically, you mention that you're going, I start rolling dice madly, and tell you how many of your ships end up arriving next year. Such is uncharted warp travel.

Feil · Post by **Feil** » 2006-07-15 11:50am

Arujei wrote:Feil, I believe the falchion's you have should come to 105, but it's such a tiny point I feel like a moron bringing it up.

One of them had a scratch on the paint, lowering the bluebook value.

T'was a typo. Fixed.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2006-07-15 11:54am

On the subject of attack craft, the one-active squadron per-bay (and they have to be launched form each bay, too) rule always struck me as a little underpowering. But then, I rather like swarms of ordnance.

InnocentBystander · Post by **InnocentBystander** » 2006-07-15 11:56am

Quick question on the Gunnery table. What happens if you get a right shift that would bring you off the table (Eldar Escort at >30cm moving away, or abeam to the attacker), is that as far as it can go; or does that mean you just don't get any hits?
What if you're firing at defenses (far right) at less than 15cm (1 shift right bonus)?

Arujei · Post by **Arujei** » 2006-07-15 12:21pm

Coalition wrote:I'll go for either Necrons, or Tyranids.

Sorry, but I think earlier on in the thread NecronLord put the date of the campaign as before the first Hive Fleet. Somewhere around 200.M41. However I think Necrons should be great, if IMPOSSIBLE TO KILL.

Keevan_Colton · Post by **Keevan_Colton** » 2006-07-15 12:22pm

NecronLord wrote:On the subject of attack craft, the one-active squadron per-bay (and they have to be launched form each bay, too) rule always struck me as a little underpowering. But then, I rather like swarms of ordnance.

Perhaps make it double the bay count so that it doesnt get too out of hand, but there can still be plenty.

Imperial Overlord · Post by **Imperial Overlord** » 2006-07-15 03:43pm

Small Craft rules:

Original: You can crank them out as fast as you can go on reload ordanance special orders. If you roll doubles when trying to go on reload ordanance, you run out.

Revised: Too many cheesy carriers hanging out of range and cranking out massive death swarms or only geting out only one wave. So you can only have as much ordanance out at one time as you have bays, but you no longer run out you roll doubles when trying to get on reload ordanance.

Proposed: As revised by the limit is double the number of bays.

Chapter Approved rules on fighter screens: If fighters are part of an attack craft wave and survive the being gunned down by turrets, each surviving fighter squadron reduces the number of turrets by one when determining how many hits the bombers get. Say two fighter squadrons and two bombers are left after turret fire from a ship with a turret rating of 3. Two fighters supress two turrets so the bombers get 1D6-1 hits each.

Coalition · Post by **Coalition** » 2006-07-16 02:59am

Arujei wrote:
Coalition wrote:I'll go for either Necrons, or Tyranids.
Sorry, but I think earlier on in the thread NecronLord put the date of the campaign as before the first Hive Fleet. Somewhere around 200.M41. However I think Necrons should be great, if IMPOSSIBLE TO KILL.

The key would be that Necrons do not get ships through appeals. They have to find new ships. So while everyone else has shipyards, assembly areas, etc, the Necrons have to hire Lara Croft to find a single Escort. If the Necrons lose a single ship, that ship is gone for them. They have to find another vessel, as they are SOL otherwise. Of course, being masters of self-repair, any surviving ships are automatically repaired at the eginning of every strategic turn.

So if you face Necrons, wounding them isn't enough, you have to kill them. The Necrons though, will be sensitive about losses, and will avoid larger fleets. But if you have a cruiser that is out by itself, and the Necrons spot it, consider it dead (drop in 4 Scythe cruisers, pop its shields, and board it for any useful intel as Necron starmaps are ~60 million years out of date).

For the Bugs, well, there can be splinter fleets arriving early.

(Also, I was thinking having a few of these battles count for the MedusaV campaign.)

Imperial Overlord · Post by **Imperial Overlord** » 2006-07-16 05:03am

InnocentBystander wrote:Quick question on the Gunnery table. What happens if you get a right shift that would bring you off the table (Eldar Escort at >30cm moving away, or abeam to the attacker), is that as far as it can go; or does that mean you just don't get any hits?
What if you're firing at defenses (far right) at less than 15cm (1 shift right bonus)?

Errata

No adjustments can push the shooter past the far right or far left columns of the gunnery chart.

Rawtooth · Post by **Rawtooth** » 2006-07-16 05:10am

Is it easier for a newbie to start off with being a raider or an actual power at the start of the game?

2000AD · Post by **2000AD** » 2006-07-16 10:39am

If we use the proposed advanced rules then i am definately not being the guy who runs it!

InnocentBystander · Post by **InnocentBystander** » 2006-07-16 10:48am

Imperial Overlord wrote:
InnocentBystander wrote:Quick question on the Gunnery table. What happens if you get a right shift that would bring you off the table (Eldar Escort at >30cm moving away, or abeam to the attacker), is that as far as it can go; or does that mean you just don't get any hits?
What if you're firing at defenses (far right) at less than 15cm (1 shift right bonus)?
Errata

No adjustments can push the shooter past the far right or far left columns of the gunnery chart.

Bah, what's the point of holofields if they don't make the amazingly weak eldar escorts very hard to hit?

StarshipTitanic · Post by **StarshipTitanic** » 2006-07-16 03:18pm

We really need to have a vote on if we're using the extended rules NecronLord suggested, since there's opposition. I am for them.

Keevan_Colton · Post by **Keevan_Colton** » 2006-07-16 03:37pm

InnocentBystander wrote:
Imperial Overlord wrote:
InnocentBystander wrote:Quick question on the Gunnery table. What happens if you get a right shift that would bring you off the table (Eldar Escort at >30cm moving away, or abeam to the attacker), is that as far as it can go; or does that mean you just don't get any hits?
What if you're firing at defenses (far right) at less than 15cm (1 shift right bonus)?
Errata

No adjustments can push the shooter past the far right or far left columns of the gunnery chart.
Bah, what's the point of holofields if they don't make the amazingly weak eldar escorts very hard to hit?

They do give a 2+ save against everything but weapon batteries.

InnocentBystander · Post by **InnocentBystander** » 2006-07-16 04:00pm

Keevan_Colton wrote:
InnocentBystander wrote:
Imperial Overlord wrote: Errata

No adjustments can push the shooter past the far right or far left columns of the gunnery chart.
Bah, what's the point of holofields if they don't make the amazingly weak eldar escorts very hard to hit?
They do give a 2+ save against everything but weapon batteries.

Err what? The rules I have say that eldar ships get a saving throw, needing a 1 to hit on non-batteries.

Keevan_Colton · Post by **Keevan_Colton** » 2006-07-16 04:16pm

Yes, only hits you on a roll of a 1 = 2+ save.

InnocentBystander · Post by **InnocentBystander** » 2006-07-16 10:41pm

Eldar Pirates: 1500pts

Glory Past
Voidstalker class Battleship
Pirate Prince Letha-Tos
360 pts

Last Spear
Shadow Class Cruiser
210 pts

Menegroth's Breath
Eclipse Class Cruiser
250 pts

Unyielding Sorrow Squadron
+++++
Tide of Woe
Aurora Class Light Cruiser
140 pts

Age of Sorrow
Aurora Class Light Cruiser
140 pts
+++++

Ordereth's Call Squadron
+++++
Befoulmentof Vanity
Aurora Class Light Cruiser
140 pts

Bringer Of Destiny
Aurora Class Light Cruiser
140 pts
+++++

Night Tempest Squadron
Nightshade Class Destroyer squadron
3 Ships
120 pts

Post by **NecronLord** » 2006-07-17 04:39am

StarshipTitanic wrote:We really need to have a vote on if we're using the extended rules NecronLord suggested, since there's opposition. I am for them.

Alternately, we could just use bits of them as and when the need comes up, and stay with the default otherwise...

Has any agreement been reached on running the games?

Imperial Overlord · Post by **Imperial Overlord** » 2006-07-17 04:49am

NecronLord wrote:
Has any agreement been reached on running the games?

I don't think so. I haven't played any Gothic campaigns, just one off skirmishes and not particularily attached to either set of rules at the moment. I do think we should be prepared to bend or substitute when something isn't working out though.

GeneralTacticus · Post by **GeneralTacticus** » 2006-07-17 07:00am

Commander:

Chaos Champion Khoros Vyserion. Ld: 8. Rerolls: 1.

******
CAPITAL SHIPS:
******

Grand Cruisers:

Black Goddess: Repulsive-class Grand Cruiser, 45 cm lances, Daemonship: 270 pts.

Heavy Cruisers:

Unholy Sacrament: Styx-class Heavy Cruiser, torpedo-bombers: 360 pts.

Altar of Darkness: Styx-class Heavy Cruiser, torpedo-bombers, Black Legion crew, Mark of Tzeentch: 420 pts.

Cruisers:

Impious: Murder-class Cruiser: 170 pts.

Blasphemer: Murder-class Cruiser: 170 pts.

* * *

Pariah: Murder-class Cruiser: 170 pts.

Traitor: Murder-class Cruiser: 170 pts.

******
ESCORTS:
******

***Void Serpents***

4 Infidel-class Raiders: 160 pts.

***Lances of Chaod***

3 Infidel-class Raiders: 120 pts.

*********
TOTAL: 2000 pts.
*********

EDIT: Torpedo-bombers added, with one escort squadorn rmeoved to pay for them.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2006-07-17 11:23am

Imperial Overlord wrote:I don't think so. I haven't played any Gothic campaigns, just one off skirmishes and not particularily attached to either set of rules at the moment. I do think we should be prepared to bend or substitute when something isn't working out though.

Yah. I plan to use whatever rules seem appropriate at the time for the campaign. Don't worry, I hate everyone here equally. Oh, aye, mind if I pilfer the name of your Inquisitorial Black Shit (Hey, it's probably at least hundreds of years old...) over on LA for campaign-related shenanigins?

Acidburns · Post by **Acidburns** » 2006-07-17 01:37pm

My proposed Chaos incursion fleet. If someone would be kind enough to give it a quick once over:

Battleships:

Harbinger of Despair
Despoiler Class Battleship
400 pts

Cruisers:

Herald of Calamity
Repulsive Class Grand Cruiser
230pts

Bane of Men
Acheron Class Heavy Cruiser
190pts

Miasma of Doom
Devstation Class Cruiser
190pts
Unholy Abomination
Carnage Class Cruiser
180pts
Fatal Attraction
Carnage Class Cruiser
180pts
Hurt Maim Kill
Slaughter Class Cruiser
165pts
Eve of Destruction
Slaughter Class Cruiser
165pts

Escorts

Tollkeepers
3 Infidel Class Raider
120pts
Reaver Squadron
3 Infidel Class Raider
120pts

Warmaster Asmodeus aboard the Harbinger of Despair
Chaos Lord Styx aboard the Miasma of Doom