Purist Thought Experiment: Post-ROTJ GFFA

[Shroom Man 777]

I guess the Tarkinian logic would be to build an even bigger gun to blow them up - which'll take away all their newfound resolve.

Hmm...the Tarkinians could use a fleet of superlaser-equipped SSDs. Not as wanky superweapons, but as a continuation of their rule through fear ideology. SSDs with less-powerful superlasers than a DS, but far cheaper.

Would Luke's Jedi be vigilantes? Half-revered and half-hated? Would they be given by the Republic the sacred duty of going throughout the shitty places of the galaxy, helping the poor and downtrodden and sabering assholes?

Would we see a neo-CIS? Amidst the turmoil, a bunch of corporate worlds go "fuck this, we're ruling ourselves and we got a droid army, fuck off"?

It'd be cool to see Leia's supporters murder neo-Tarkin leaders and slaughter their families too. Ambiguity and all.

Also, entire worlds falling into disarray as Republicans and Tarkinists slaughter each other, men, women and children, while the neo-Jedi try to bring about peace but find themselves useless.

And Tarkinists/warlords starving entire systems by conquering agriworlds or setting them ablaze.

Damn, the possibilities are limitless! If we could get some kind of fanfic project up and running...!

[RedImperator]

The ANH novelization stated pretty plainly that men like Tarkin were a major force in the Empire, and in the film itself it was obvious that Tarkin and Motti were allies, and Motti at least had nothing but contempt for Vader (until he got Force choked, anyway). From there it was easy to figure there's a faction within the Imperial government that thinks like Tarkin: autocratic rule by terror, using the fleet and the Death Star. One imagines they got knocked back on their heels after DSI was destroyed, but would make a resurgance after Palpatine's cult of personality got extinguished--after all, without that, there's not a whole lot to hold the New Order together besides terror.

Don't you think that the rule by fear doctorine would have taken a pretty substantial blow after the destruction of the second DS? Wouldn't that second massive victory give rebelling systems that had suffered under or just didn't like the Empire, that much more resolve when it came time to resisting a post-Palpatine regime of any kind?

Well yes, it does, and in this scenario, that's one of the problems the Tarkinists face, which is part of why they stage a coup. They'd blame the loss of both previous Death Stars on Palpatine and Vader's incompetence (definitely true for the second, and who's still alive to contradict them on the first?), and claim that if they could just do things their way this time, without all that nonsense about the Force or any pretense of republicanism, the Tarkin Docterine will work. In the meantime, they'd advocate bringing the Navy down on the heads of whoever resisted the Empire, on the logic that a Base Delta Zero is pretty scary all on its own.

[Galvatron]

In the meantime, they'd advocate bringing the Navy down on the heads of whoever resisted the Empire, on the logic that a Base Delta Zero is pretty scary all on its own.

Not very scary to worlds with planetary shields. The "Tarkin Doctrine" is impractical without a Death Star.

[RedImperator]

I guess the Tarkinian logic would be to build an even bigger gun to blow them up - which'll take away all their newfound resolve.

Yes, but they're sharing power in a coalition where nobody trusts them. It's not just a matter of snapping their fingers and the deed is done.

Hmm...the Tarkinians could use a fleet of superlaser-equipped SSDs. Not as wanky superweapons, but as a continuation of their rule through fear ideology. SSDs with less-powerful superlasers than a DS, but far cheaper.

No no no no no no no no no NO! No superweapons. The movies get superweapons, and the EU is not allowed to attempt to upstage the movies. Besides that, if the Tarkinians got a fleet of superlaser equipped battleships, they'd instantly own the upper hand over all the other factions and Thrawn. Why would anybody let them try to do that?

Would Luke's Jedi be vigilantes? Half-revered and half-hated?

Yes. The population would see them as almost mythic figures, and the Imperial government would deny they exist. The Rebellion wouldn't even know for sure if these were the Jedi or just someone using a lightsaber to assassinate political enemies.

Would they be given by the Republic the sacred duty of going throughout the shitty places of the galaxy, helping the poor and downtrodden and sabering assholes?

The Jedi Order in its previous incarnation allowed the Republic to remain politically retarded despite its great age and sophistication in all other matters. A unicameral legislature with no independent executive that can amend its own constitution at will is a recipe for massive instability and perfectly set up for someone like Palpatine to take over. It only worked because the Jedi were around to keep things stable. This interdependence left both the Jedi and the Republic vulnerable if the system broke down.

The new incarnation of the Jedi would not be affiliated with the Republic. The Republic has to stand on its own and the Jedi have to maintain their independence. Which leads to some interesting questions about the legality of whatever it is the Jedi are going to do once the Second Republic is established. They're certainly breaking Imperial law, but as the situation on the Outer Rim deterioriates, Imperial law matters less and less.

Would we see a neo-CIS? Amidst the turmoil, a bunch of corporate worlds go "fuck this, we're ruling ourselves and we got a droid army, fuck off"?

Do that and 20 minutes later Thrawn shows up to kick your ass. That's the one thing everybody agrees on--no independence for anybody. When things really start getting chaotic towards the end, the corporations are still backing the Corellia Senate and systems that do overthrow the local imperial presence tend to replace it with a Rebel Alliance affiliated Republican government. Everyone remembers how badly things went the last time someone tried to declare independence.

It'd be cool to see Leia's supporters murder neo-Tarkin leaders and slaughter their families too. Ambiguity and all.

That might be a little too much ambiguity for my taste, though certainly you'd have rogue elements of the Rebellion which would try to take more direct measures.

Also, entire worlds falling into disarray as Republicans and Tarkinists slaughter each other, men, women and children, while the neo-Jedi try to bring about peace but find themselves useless.

Uh, yeah, see, this is Star Wars. I don't know how much the flannel shirt is going to like a Star Wars novel where children are butchered in the streets.

And Tarkinists/warlords starving entire systems by conquering agriworlds or setting them ablaze.

Keep in mind, Palpatine II and his Tarknist puppet masters don't have very many assets; really just enough to defend themselves and raid some of the Corellia Senate's worlds. The bulk of the Navy is still neutral, but if they get out of hand, it will crash down on them like a ton of bricks.

Damn, the possibilities are limitless! If we could get some kind of fanfic project up and running...!

Unfortunately, I have way too many projects on my plate to start another one.

[RedImperator]

In the meantime, they'd advocate bringing the Navy down on the heads of whoever resisted the Empire, on the logic that a Base Delta Zero is pretty scary all on its own.

Not very scary to worlds with planetary shields. The "Tarkin Doctrine" is impractical without a Death Star.

Most of the initial trouble is happening in the Outer Rim where planetary shields aren't an issue. In the Core they would be, which is an excellent reason why the other factions won't let another Death Star get built.

[Galvatron]

Hmm...the Tarkinians could use a fleet of superlaser-equipped SSDs. Not as wanky superweapons, but as a continuation of their rule through fear ideology. SSDs with less-powerful superlasers than a DS, but far cheaper.

No no no no no no no no no NO! No superweapons. The movies get superweapons, and the EU is not allowed to attempt to upstage the movies. Besides that, if the Tarkinians got a fleet of superlaser equipped battleships, they'd instantly own the upper hand over all the other factions and Thrawn. Why would anybody let them try to do that?

Not to go off on a tangent, but I absolutely loathe the very concept of superlaser-equipped SSDs (e.g. the Eclipse). I like that such a powerful weapon requires no less than a moon-sized platform to accommodate its size and power needs. Downsizing it to fit and function on a comparatively tiny warship IS wank.

[Battlehymn Republic]

Regarding the formation of a neo-CIS: I was thinking about that too, a third or more factions arising to mess with the balance. However, there's enough intrigue already just within the mess of Imperial factions. Additionally, if corporate people want their own kingdoms outside of Imperial control, they can always go to the Corporate Sector Authority.

Could there be a subplot dealing with an attempt to create a reborn Palpatine? His plan of a post-mortem return to power always seemed to be quite prudent. Perhaps a subfaction of the Emperor's Mages and Dark Jedi Adepts or whoever start leaving the council and flocking to the Deep Core. A rival faction in the council, possibly corporate bigwigs (for giggles) send an expedition to Byss, tacitly supported by the military mainliners.

After the requisite action on-planet, in which the Emperor is reborn, the corporatists wisely send a fleet to just totally BDZ the planet, basically destroying any chance of Palpatine returning.

[RedImperator]

I don't like the Return of Palaptine because it cheapens Anakin's sacrifice in ROTJ. Yeah, he saved Luke, but he also turned on not just his master, but the entire Sith order--Anakin sacrificed his life to wipe out the Sith in one stroke. I don't like the Sith acolytes for the same reason. Actually, I never liked Palpatine as a Sith lord to begin with--I much prefer the ANH novelization idea of the Empire, where the technocrats like Tarkin really are running the show, and Palpatine is a hapless puppet (it's astounding, in the novelization, how little respect anyone has for the Emepror, including Vader).

On the other hand, an attempt to recreate Palpatine does have some dramatic potential, maybe as part of the secondary EU. I especially like the idea of a reborn Palpatine lifting his arms to the sky, bellowing about absolute power...and then getting ionized by an incoming HTL bolt from orbit.

[Battlehymn Republic]

Hm. My idea was to parody how it went in the original EU. Instead of cheapening Luke's original struggle against the Dark Side by having him go through it all over again, in this version he wouldn't even be involved. Instead, the droid-making moneymen of the Empire find this secret, backed by the no-nonsense, non-Force-using military.

It could even be written as a horror adventure. Basically, a band of mercenaries and company men venture into Byss, get slaughtered, and the main character sees the final rise of the Reborn Emperor, just before the ISDs BDZ the place.

Finally, it can show how the remaining Force-user factions within the Empire begin to permanently die off.

[Illuminatus Primus]

Mara Jade could possibly have a role in the coalition trying to hold the Empire together. She would not be a love interest for Luke Skywalker. I refuse to turn Star Wars into "All My Jedi" or "As Coruscant Turns".

Doing what? She had personal contacts and can scare people into compliance with death threats, but ad personam had no political clout and almost no one she did know knew she was anything other than a piece of scenery in Palpatine's court.

Another bit is about Thrawn. Thrawn is simply not that politically astute. The Ruling Council named him Supreme Commander because everyone else was dead and he had just come back from the UR and impressed them. But one must recall he was originally put off on the outland missions precisely because he was not astute at statesmanship or court politics. He's neither personally influential or have enough military backing personally to be of much help rallying the Empire. EU materials themselves admit that Thrawn's colleagues were in many cases near his equal, and Grant was confident he would best Thrawn if summoned by the New Republic.

Not during the main arc. Afterwards, you could have another main arc, and an extra-galactic threat could work, if done well. The biowanking goes right out the window, though. The Vong suck, and if the galaxy is going to be threatened, it's not going to because the Republic is staggeringly incompetent. In an arc like that, the Republic would fight bravely and well...and lose anyway, at least for the first half.

An extra-galactic threat is shitty in my opinion if it threatens the entire Republic. If an extra-galactic group had the economy of scale and strength to mount what they felt would be a successful invasion of the GFFA from outside, the Republic is going to get just buried by the sheer numbers we're talking about. More detail has to go into the kind of threat her for it not to be ridiculous and to not one-up the Empire.

Fuck. No. The closest I'd come is maybe during the invasion talked about above, they debate building a new Death Star.

I think a lot of EU authors didn't grasp that the thing about the Death Star and the nice thing about it compared to many sci-fi WMD is its not some super-magic special tech that for some reason only pertains to blowing up planets or solar systems (trilithium, anyone?). Its simply a really big ship with a really big turbolaser that can blow up planets.

Also, I didn't know that Tarkin's technocratic ways was backed by some sort of ideology. Interesting.

The ANH novelization stated pretty plainly that men like Tarkin were a major force in the Empire, and in the film itself it was obvious that Tarkin and Motti were allies, and Motti at least had nothing but contempt for Vader (until he got Force choked, anyway). From there it was easy to figure there's a faction within the Imperial government that thinks like Tarkin: autocratic rule by terror, using the fleet and the Death Star. One imagines they got knocked back on their heels after DSI was destroyed, but would make a resurgance after Palpatine's cult of personality got extinguished--after all, without that, there's not a whole lot to hold the New Order together besides terror.

The EU puts them in two different camps, much like Commies in many would-be dictatorships. There are the COMPNOR fanatics which demand ideological purity and Palpatine-worship and are totalitarians. They also demand centralized control and their brand of Palpatinism-Tarkinism is reminiscient of Communism, Nazism/Italian Fascism, and Jacobinism in some ways. These are the political-types which popularized and developed the ideology.

The Tarkinite faction are your sector and regional governors and fleet commanders, which believe in a more watered-down ideology but greater stress on the technocratic aspect. They are also for more colonial autonomy, because the centralized control desired by COMPNOR is in antithesis to their perogatives as governors. However the thing is, they have the means at hand to actually carry out "rule through fear" at hand, whereas the extreme political whackos do not.

In opposition within the political spheres of the Empire are Republicans and traditionalist in the former, and generational and traditional officers in the latter. A lot of room to mix-it-up.

I think you imagine there's a lot more desire for unity than there is. I think that a lot of Core Worlds swollowed a bitter pill in ROTS with Palpatine's coronation and a loss of autonomy. They had to because of the populist and corporate enthusiasm for Palpatine, but I imagine it wasn't that popular in the member states' governments. These guys are used to staging the federal agenda to their own interests, and now they can't. This is especially true after the Senate is disbanded. Another thing is the political factions which exist when Palpy goes up in flames are mostly Palpatine lackeys.

They're not representative of the interests of many extremely important power blocs, which, while they may have been unhappy, were not going to resist Palpatine, Savior of the Galaxy. In the struggles I think they're likely to only get more screwed. The political tendencies in the Empire are centrifugal and have shown very little impulse to collude or cooperate before, and I feel like Palpatine's death will make them feel like they can just get away with shit they always wanted to do but felt that Palpatine would be displeased.

There is also the major fact that people did not like the Empire in many cases, and there was knowledge of atrocities. But Palpatine's lackeys and these advisors were the ones blamed. Palpatine used the political structure so people thanked him for the stability and peace but blamed his advisors for the incompetence and failure and brutality. When they're left they not only have no legitimacy, having ruled only on Palpatine's behalf, but they're also the targets of a dozen-odd or more centrifugal political movements, god-knows how many silenced-since-the-Senate-disbanding power blocs, and the popular anger over everything that has been going wrong.

[Illuminatus Primus]

Regarding the formation of a neo-CIS: I was thinking about that too, a third or more factions arising to mess with the balance. However, there's enough intrigue already just within the mess of Imperial factions. Additionally, if corporate people want their own kingdoms outside of Imperial control, they can always go to the Corporate Sector Authority.

Could there be a subplot dealing with an attempt to create a reborn Palpatine? His plan of a post-mortem return to power always seemed to be quite prudent. Perhaps a subfaction of the Emperor's Mages and Dark Jedi Adepts or whoever start leaving the council and flocking to the Deep Core. A rival faction in the council, possibly corporate bigwigs (for giggles) send an expedition to Byss, tacitly supported by the military mainliners.

After the requisite action on-planet, in which the Emperor is reborn, the corporatists wisely send a fleet to just totally BDZ the planet, basically destroying any chance of Palpatine returning.

Why would they do that? They were terrified of and loved Palpatine at the same time. Sounds like dogshit to me.

[LordShaithis]

As interesting as Red's ideas are in synopsis, I can't help but think they would make for some awful dry novels.

[Havok]

As interesting as Red's ideas are in synopsis, I can't help but think they would make for some awful dry novels.

I think that's a little harsh, his ideas sound pretty interesting. I think they would take SW into a new place where political intriuge(sp?)and millitary tactics was the name of the game. Not Jedi/Sith or extra-galaxy invaders or killer bugs all the time. Definetly a refreshing look at the EU. Maybe Tom Clancy would write in this EU

One thought I had though... Wouldn't there be a reluctance by quite a few systems to join or go along with any faction? I would think that indivudual star systems, after watching the Republic decay and flounder for decades and then to suffer under a dictator whom everyone had, at one point, loved as their democratic leader, would be absolutely loath to return to any form of centralized government. Be it Empire 2.0, New Republic, Military dictatorship or whatever, I just don't think they would have it.

I can see small groups of systems that have historically been allies or at least on good terms banding together and creating alliances from a couple systems to hundreds of systems strong.

Thrawn as much of a milliary genius as he was, wouldn't be able to keep every system in line. Especially if these new scattered alliances began asking their millitary men to return home to serve their new governing bodies, which I think would logically happen.

I guess it could almost end up resembling something like the Star Trek galaxy where there are different Alliances, Federations, Empires, Corporate Sectors etc., all over the map. Some would go to war, some would sign treaties, some would become complete isolationists. I dunno, like I said, just a thought.

[Shroom Man 777]

I guess the Tarkinian logic would be to build an even bigger gun to blow them up - which'll take away all their newfound resolve.

Yes, but they're sharing power in a coalition where nobody trusts them. It's not just a matter of snapping their fingers and the deed is done.

Hmm...the Tarkinians could use a fleet of superlaser-equipped SSDs. Not as wanky superweapons, but as a continuation of their rule through fear ideology. SSDs with less-powerful superlasers than a DS, but far cheaper.

No no no no no no no no no NO! No superweapons. The movies get superweapons, and the EU is not allowed to attempt to upstage the movies. Besides that, if the Tarkinians got a fleet of superlaser equipped battleships, they'd instantly own the upper hand over all the other factions and Thrawn. Why would anybody let them try to do that?

Well, a single SSD armed with a weapon capable of breaching a planetary shield and causing the surface to fuck up would still be nothing compared to a monster battlestation armed with a big laser capable of literally disintegrating a fully shielded world AND enough guns to do a BDZ ten times over AND a shitload of fighters. And I guess this superlaser equipped SSD wouldn't be able to hit anything smaller than a planet and would have little in the way of secondary armaments/fighters and shields compared to a normal SSD.

And considering the resources of the SW galaxy, where a monster DSII was built in secret in six months (am I right?), even an economically troubled regime ruled by Tarkinist fanatics could build a REALLY strapped down deathweapon, right? Especially after they split from the new Republic/Correlian Senate.

If superweapons are really that distasteful, a fleet of normal SSDs? Or torpedo spheres? How about something like those ice moon-melting CIS frigates?

When things really start getting chaotic towards the end, the corporations are still backing the Corellia Senate and systems that do overthrow the local imperial presence tend to replace it with a Rebel Alliance affiliated Republican government. Everyone remembers how badly things went the last time someone tried to declare independence.

Hmmm...will we see them aid the Corellia Senate by providing battle droids? Won't it make sense for guys like the Techno Union to side with the Tarkinists, who are supposed to be technocratic?

Uh, yeah, see, this is Star Wars. I don't know how much the flannel shirt is going to like a Star Wars novel where children are butchered in the streets.

We could have it as a special occasion to convey emotionally how horrible the war is. Kind of like when Anakin murdered the younglings. Well, I guess it shouldn't happen all the time...

The new incarnation of the Jedi would not be affiliated with the Republic. The Republic has to stand on its own and the Jedi have to maintain their independence. Which leads to some interesting questions about the legality of whatever it is the Jedi are going to do once the Second Republic is established. They're certainly breaking Imperial law, but as the situation on the Outer Rim deterioriates, Imperial law matters less and less.

We could have the guys in the Core becoming outraged while having the Outer Rim honchos actually condoning the renegade Jedi. Kind of like the vigilante killings we have in my part of the Philippines.

Unfortunately, I have way too many projects on my plate to start another one.

Damned shame. If only the awesome literary masters of SDN could come together in such a grand undertaking intended to spite the EU with the purest most spiteful of spite...*sighs*

I'd pay to sit back and watch.

I think they would take SW into a new place where political intriuge(sp?)and millitary tactics was the name of the game. Not Jedi/Sith or extra-galaxy invaders or killer bugs all the time. Definetly a refreshing look at the EU.

Well, there has always been political intrigue and military shtick in Star Wars. You've got Palpy's machinations being a central point in the PT. And, for the most part, the OT was focused mostly on the Rebellion - except for the parts where you see the last of the Jedi confront with the last of the Sith. And even then, it was more of a personal thing, less of Jedi versus Sith (hell, was the word 'Sith' even mentioned in the OT?). Since the Sith are dead now, it's understandable that the Jedi-Sith shtick will be lessened, as bringing out new Sith-of-the-week would be cheap and unfair to Vader's sacrifice.

And there has always been military shtick and big explosions in Star Wars. All the time.

Extra-galaxy-bug invaders have never been part of Star Wars, in my view. Though the Force/Jedi has always been.

Parts of this fictional neo-EU could (should) be focused on Luke helping out and shtick, him and maybe his newly trained Jedi struggling in a chaotic galaxy. But like the OT, it'd be a more personal thing, with less emphasis on the Jedi Order and all the uber-flashy shtick we see in the PT and more on the Force itself. It'd still be a personal journey, though how to go about doing this is beyond me. We definately won't wank the Jedi, with Jedi this and Jedi that. The Jedi didn't blow up the DS2 or the shield generator at Endor.

[Stofsk]

An SSD armed with a spinal-mounted superlaser wouldn't necessarily have to be considered a 'superweapon' on par with the likes of the Galaxy Gun, Suncrusher, and Wankatine Force Storms. It could be that the miniaturisation involved in fielding a superlaser on an SSD platform drastically reduces it's hitting power, to the point where it wouldn't be anywhere near as effective as a Death Star. The advantage would be tactical; in a space battle the SSD would dominate... assuming the other fleet didn't field similarly equipped spinal mounts themselves.

The idea that the New Jedi Order would have nothing to do with the politics of the Rebel and Imperial factions is intriguing. It goes from the Knights Templar motif of the Prequels, where Jedi are analogous to servants of a leige, to one where the Jedi are more akin to Knights-errants, autonomous adventurers with extra-judicial authority.

Question is what to do with Leia. Regardless of Red's great ideas, we still have to treat Leia as Luke's brother if this thought experiment retains ROTJ's canon developments.

[Shroom Man 777]

So what if he's her brother? She's got her responsibilities as a leader of the Rebel Alliance. Maybe she could also be the Republic's liason with the renegade Jedi?

[Stofsk]

So what if he's her brother? She's got her responsibilities as a leader of the Rebel Alliance.

Well, duh. However she might feel betrayed that Luke would abandon the Rebels to go off as a Knight-errant, seeking other Force Sensitives to train.

Maybe she could also be the Republic's liason with the renegade Jedi?

Why not.

[Battlehymn Republic]

The Corporatists loved the Emperor? They would favor his return and a bunch of Darksiders taking power away from themselves?

[Illuminatus Primus]

The Corporatists loved the Emperor? They would favor his return and a bunch of Darksiders taking power away from themselves?

Read Publius' essay "Something This Way Wicked Comes". Palpatine's corporate allies are his longest-standing and most loyal. And do you see the Kuat of Kuat, or CEC's chairman having any direct control over the Imperial government? Either pre-DE or during? No. They rule through influence, and above all, corporations want MONEY. And stability brings money, and where have they found their best political investment in fifty years? Palpatine. The fact in that the very long term they would have no use to Palpatine is not something they were privy to. For the foreseeable future Palpatine's galactic dominion meant stable investment and business opportunity and lots of contracts. Background tells us that there was such demand by Palpatine's re-opened Deep Core strongholds for commerce that they had to offer contracts to every smuggler and freelance hauler in the galaxy because corporate sources could not meet demand. And you're telling me that Palpatine's return was bad for any of the Imperialists? In the OTL, the NR had done a shit-poor job and people were willing to give Palpatine another shot, especially because he was succeeding in quickly reunifying the galaxy. Even the warlords, while more autonomous without Palpatine had less power simply because they were struggling to merely survive; their territory eroded by constant unending conflict with the NR and each other. Palpatine provided a best-solution for nearly all parties involved, to say nothing of his personal prestige and clout.

[MKSheppard]

Could there be a subplot dealing with an attempt to create a reborn Palpatine? His plan of a post-mortem return to power always seemed to be quite prudent.

It also tied (albeit in an accidental way) in with ROTS and his claim that the Sith could create life. I always sort of liked the idea that Palpatine had that he would rule forever (and that he had found a way around the decaying effect of advanced sith power usage) through clone bodies.

It also showed him as having a plan (TM).

However, him actually coming back cheapens anakins sacrifice in ROTJ. That, and Dark Empire was shittily drawn and colored.

So let's look at this. Why would the Military or the Corporate interests actually believe the claims that Palpatine is coming back from the dead? Remember, in ANH:

"You're the last remnants of a sad religion" blah blah blah *choke*

"Release him, Vader!"

Nobody really believes in the Jedi or Sith anymore by the time of ANH. However; this does open up a legimitate plot involving Luke and the other Force Sensitives in the SW galaxy; they're the only ones who believe that Palpatine CAN come back from the dead, and go to Byss and stop the plan; Palpatine never returns to life; instead, he sees his backup plan go up in a swing of a lightsaber, and his dark essence distengrates (DE claims that it took him nearly a year of wandering the void as a disembodied spirit, and that he nearly distengrated before reaching Byss).

[MKSheppard]

Also. Here's a critical point:

Why would Palpatine train Dark Jedi/Sith Apprentices/etc?

It would only dilute his power, and open the possibility that he would be killed by his apprentices like he did to Plageuis.

The only people I can see him training would be a small cadre of trusted technocrats; e.g. he teaches them how to recite from memory the procedure to create clone bodies. All they would know literally is "push button A, then pull lever B", so they would never get ambitions for power.

[Shroom Man 777]

So what if he's her brother? She's got her responsibilities as a leader of the Rebel Alliance.

Well, duh. However she might feel betrayed that Luke would abandon the Rebels to go off as a Knight-errant, seeking other Force Sensitives to train.

Ah. But she might understand, with Luke going "I'm making a new Jedi Order, screw politics, I'm going to help the poor and downtrodden"?

In the OT, has there been any indications that Luke has any desire to rebuild the Jedi? Sure, he's the last one, but will he bother remaking the Order? Now that his Father's gone, Yoday's dead, Obi's dead and Palpy's all blown up, won't there be an equal chance of him shrugging and going "ah, it's all over, my purpose now is to help the Rebels win their cause"?

He still knows very little about the Force.

[Noble Ire]

Why would Palpatine train Dark Jedi/Sith Apprentices/etc?

It would only dilute his power, and open the possibility that he would be killed by his apprentices like he did to Plageuis.

Even if they are dangerous, dark Force users do make for good servants, and considering the size of the galaxy, they aren't all that hard to find. However, there's no indication that he ever trained any of his servants aside from Vader to be particularly powerful (aside from Jerec, who seemed to have developed his abilities largely on his own), so they could be easily smacked down.

[Illuminatus Primus]

Also. Here's a critical point:

Why would Palpatine train Dark Jedi/Sith Apprentices/etc?

It would only dilute his power, and open the possibility that he would be killed by his apprentices like he did to Plageuis.

The only people I can see him training would be a small cadre of trusted technocrats; e.g. he teaches them how to recite from memory the procedure to create clone bodies. All they would know literally is "push button A, then pull lever B", so they would never get ambitions for power.

How would dark Jedi dilute his power? Most of them were left over Jedi or initiates from before the Purge who offered their services in lieu of extermination. As for most of the others, a Jedi Padawan in the Jedi's heyday would've owned them. They were of no threat to Palpatine.

[MKSheppard]

They were of no threat to Palpatine.

So you're saying a man who patiently worked a plan for 40-50 years straight, and waited until the right moment to strike, would after gaining ULTIMATE POWER, throw all caution to the wind and start enlisting fallen jedi left and right, along with training cadres of sith acolytes?

I can understand keeping Vader as a hachetman, since Vader is crippled and weak after Obi Wan did a number on him, and because Palpatine is all he's got left, so he'll be loyal; but each person he trains in the sithly arts is one more that could potentially overthrow him. Remember, he started out as plageuis' apprentice and killed him...