New desktop parts

Dominus Atheos · Post by **Dominus Atheos** » 2006-08-19 09:56pm

Update:

My parents OK'ed the $200 used laptop idea, so I just got back from Fry's Electronics. My purchases, from the scanned receipt:

AMD X2 4600+ CPU $194.99
2x512KB Cache

ECS KN1 LITE $64.99
NFORCE4 ULTRA
DDR400;SATA2;6Ch Audio
1(16x)PCIe;2PCIe;3PCI

MXT L01S300 300GB SATA $79.99
SATA/150 INTERFACE
7200RPM; 16MB BUFFER;
1 YEAR WARRANTY

and then a 512mb x1600 pro for $170, and a $50 dvd burner.

I am probably taking the hard drive back, as I didn't know it had a 1 year warranty(it didn't say anything about it on the box), but besides that, I would say I made out pretty well.

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2006-08-19 10:01pm

The amount of money you get off your desktop will not be enough to get you a "gaming laptop".

Why do you need a laptop?

Dominus Atheos · Post by **Dominus Atheos** » 2006-08-19 10:12pm

Uraniun235 wrote:Why do you need a laptop?

I start collage this year, but really I just want a portable computer that I can access the internet on(my city is getting citywide wireless internet within a year), and play simple games on to keep me entertained when I'm not home. If it also runs Word and my Macromedia Studio, that's good too.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-08-19 10:17pm

You 'hate' antialiasing? You're against ansio texture filtering? Pffft.

The idea of flogging a half-decent desktop to buy a piece-of-shit laptop is hilarious.

I did some research, and my disproportionate disgust with 'gaming laptop' discussions is actually due to the higher cost of laptops in AU. In America mid-range laptops are significantly cheaper and the higher models don't carry as much of a premium. In AU, you could quite literally buy two top-of-the-range desktops for a single 'gaming laptop' that you need to lug around an AC adaptor for, carry in a briefcase, and looks like shit. Le sigh.

Arthur_Tuxedo · Post by **Arthur_Tuxedo** » 2006-08-20 01:39am

Pretty much the same in the US, though, I think. A $1,200 desktop system will play just about everything except Oblivion on max settings, while a $2,500 gaming laptop would probably have to settle for lower settings, and isn't even all that portable anyway. "Gaming" laptops are a load of crap, and selling a desktop to get one would be idiotic. Just get a decent laptop that will do what you need it to and use your desktop for gaming. And if you can't get your parents to sign off on that right away, then show them how much a "gaming" laptop costs, and why it's cheaper for a gamer to have a desktop and laptop than just the laptop.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-08-20 03:49am

That's a good point: having a desktop for power apps (since it's cheaper) and a laptop for flexible, low-load tasks is my preferred solution. Hence an iBook 12" is perfectly fine for me, since I'm not going to do anything like play a game on the move, and by sacrificing highend performance I get a smaller, more attractive, laptop that's also much, much cheaper.

Sriad · Post by **Sriad** » 2006-08-20 08:00am

Also a factor in favor of a two computer solution is that laptops are really hard to upgrade. You can keep a desktop computer viable pretty much forever by tossing $600 at it every year or two, but two years from now you'd need to buy a new laptop to stay top-of-the-line.

Also as mentioned, it's twice as expensive to run a gaming capable laptop as it is a desktop.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2006-08-20 02:15pm

Stark wrote:I did some research, and my disproportionate disgust with 'gaming laptop' discussions is actually due to the higher cost of laptops in AU. In America mid-range laptops are significantly cheaper and the higher models don't carry as much of a premium. In AU, you could quite literally buy two top-of-the-range desktops for a single 'gaming laptop' that you need to lug around an AC adaptor for, carry in a briefcase, and looks like shit. Le sigh.

Are there any remotely significant technical differences between computers in the two countries? Or, more accurately, between the UK and Australian systems? Where's the arbitrage?

Post by **Edi** » 2006-08-20 02:23pm

Master of Ossus wrote:
Stark wrote:I did some research, and my disproportionate disgust with 'gaming laptop' discussions is actually due to the higher cost of laptops in AU. In America mid-range laptops are significantly cheaper and the higher models don't carry as much of a premium. In AU, you could quite literally buy two top-of-the-range desktops for a single 'gaming laptop' that you need to lug around an AC adaptor for, carry in a briefcase, and looks like shit. Le sigh.

Are there any remotely significant technical differences between computers in the two countries? Or, more accurately, between the UK and Australian systems? Where's the arbitrage?

No technical differences, other than possibly the transformers, I would imagine. The only difference is the margin in the manufacturer's bottom line. Computer equipment is obscenely cheap in the US, at least based on Pint0 Extreme's gaming rig thread some way down the page. For example, he paid €86 for the Antec P180B case for his computer, whereas the cheapest you can get that here is €139. The exchange rate is something like 1.27 dollars per euro, yet the price tags here are numerically the same as what you have or even higher. And that's often for dektop components. Laptops are in a category all their own and a high end one typically costs an arm, a leg, a kidney and a retina.

Edi

Alyeska · Post by **Alyeska** » 2006-08-20 02:39pm

Arthur_Tuxedo wrote:Pretty much the same in the US, though, I think. A $1,200 desktop system will play just about everything except Oblivion on max settings, while a $2,500 gaming laptop would probably have to settle for lower settings, and isn't even all that portable anyway. "Gaming" laptops are a load of crap, and selling a desktop to get one would be idiotic. Just get a decent laptop that will do what you need it to and use your desktop for gaming. And if you can't get your parents to sign off on that right away, then show them how much a "gaming" laptop costs, and why it's cheaper for a gamer to have a desktop and laptop than just the laptop.

My gaming laptop most certainly isn't a load of crap. I've been able to play nearly ever new game I have purchased at max or very high settings. The only game that runs for crap is Ghost Recon 3, and thats because the code for that game sucks outright.

Alyeska · Post by **Alyeska** » 2006-08-20 02:41pm

Edi wrote:
Master of Ossus wrote:
Stark wrote:I did some research, and my disproportionate disgust with 'gaming laptop' discussions is actually due to the higher cost of laptops in AU. In America mid-range laptops are significantly cheaper and the higher models don't carry as much of a premium. In AU, you could quite literally buy two top-of-the-range desktops for a single 'gaming laptop' that you need to lug around an AC adaptor for, carry in a briefcase, and looks like shit. Le sigh.

Are there any remotely significant technical differences between computers in the two countries? Or, more accurately, between the UK and Australian systems? Where's the arbitrage?
No technical differences, other than possibly the transformers, I would imagine. The only difference is the margin in the manufacturer's bottom line. Computer equipment is obscenely cheap in the US, at least based on Pint0 Extreme's gaming rig thread some way down the page. For example, he paid €86 for the Antec P180B case for his computer, whereas the cheapest you can get that here is €139. The exchange rate is something like 1.27 dollars per euro, yet the price tags here are numerically the same as what you have or even higher. And that's often for dektop components. Laptops are in a category all their own and a high end one typically costs an arm, a leg, a kidney and a retina.

Edi

Shouldn't the internet make such things less of an issue? If laptops are so hard to purchase localy, wouldn't it make sense to buy them over the internet from US companies or computer stores and have them shipped over seas?

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-08-20 03:35pm

That tends to happen for individual components more than finished systems. However, the US is simply much, much cheaper than AU with regards to computers: a top-of-the-line laptop here would cost more than AU$4,000, or more than US$3,000. I should do some digging and compare the same/similar models, but it's 5am here and I've got no junk mail about.

Post by **Edi** » 2006-08-20 04:49pm

Alyeska wrote:Shouldn't the internet make such things less of an issue? If laptops are so hard to purchase localy, wouldn't it make sense to buy them over the internet from US companies or computer stores and have them shipped over seas?

On top of the shipping costs, you also have to pay duty taxes, which raise the price so high and make things so difficult with all the fucking red tape that it's not really worth it. If the contents of a package cost more than €40 or €50, don't remember which, you get an automatic VAT of 22% levied on it, plus duty tolls and then add shipping, it's expensive. If you try to get them past customs so you could avoid paying the taxes and duties, you end up in court and with a fucking criminal record, so no thank you. I'll just stick with not buying a laptop in the first place.

Edi

Alyeska · Post by **Alyeska** » 2006-08-20 05:08pm

Well that sounds absolutely fucked up.

It would seem the cheapest way to get a laptop is to buy one in the US when your over here for other reasons and simply not delcare it as a purchase on the way home.

Gotta lova international economics when they don't work.

Arthur_Tuxedo · Post by **Arthur_Tuxedo** » 2006-08-20 06:18pm

The economics is fine, it's the policy trying to manipulate the economics that's fucked up.

Master of Ossus · Post by **Master of Ossus** » 2006-08-20 06:22pm

Arthur_Tuxedo wrote:The economics is fine, it's the policy trying to manipulate the economics that's fucked up.

What are they trying to do? Create an indigenous Australian industry for everything that costs more than $50 and is generally purchased from outside of Australia?

Alyeska · Post by **Alyeska** » 2006-08-20 06:30pm

There are of course ways around these rules. Such as paying a friend in the US to buy a computer and simply ship it down, call it a present. Though if caught, fines would not be pleasent.

Dominus Atheos · Post by **Dominus Atheos** » 2006-08-20 06:33pm

Update:

My parents OK'ed the $200 used laptop idea, so I just got back from Fry's Electronics. My purchases, from the scanned receipt:

AMD X2 4600+ CPU $194.99
2x512KB Cache

ECS KN1 LITE $64.99
NFORCE4 ULTRA
DDR400;SATA2;6Ch Audio
1(16x)PCIe;2PCIe;3PCI

MXT L01S300 300GB SATA $79.99
SATA/150 INTERFACE
7200RPM; 16MB BUFFER;
1 YEAR WARRANTY

and then a 512mb x1600 pro for $170, and a $50 dvd burner.

I am probably taking the hard drive back, as I didn't know it had a 1 year warranty(it didn't say anything about it on the box), but besides that, I would say I made out pretty well.

Alyeska · Post by **Alyeska** » 2006-08-20 06:36pm

Thats not a powerful laptop, but it should handle games up to 2 generations ago moderately well.

Dominus Atheos · Post by **Dominus Atheos** » 2006-08-20 06:38pm

It's my upgrades to the desktop.

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2006-08-20 06:42pm

Wow, you seriously got a 4600+ for $195?! Damn! Are they having a sale or something?

And, most retail-box hard drives tend to have 1-year warranties... I believe Seagate has 5-year warranties on all their hard drives.

Dominus Atheos · Post by **Dominus Atheos** » 2006-08-20 06:50pm

Uraniun235 wrote:Wow, you seriously got a 4600+ for $195?! Damn! Are they having a sale or something?

don't you ever read Fry's ads? They have combo specials. That is, you have to buy that specific processor and that specific motherboard.

Uraniun235 wrote:And, most retail-box hard drives tend to have 1-year warranties... I believe Seagate has 5-year warranties on all their hard drives.

So I shouldn't take it back?

Uraniun235 · Post by **Uraniun235** » 2006-08-20 06:56pm

Dominus Atheos wrote:
Uraniun235 wrote:Wow, you seriously got a 4600+ for $195?! Damn! Are they having a sale or something?
don't you ever read Fry's ads? They have combo specials. That is, you have to buy that specific processor and that specific motherboard.

Uraniun235 wrote:And, most retail-box hard drives tend to have 1-year warranties... I believe Seagate has 5-year warranties on all their hard drives.
So I shouldn't take it back?

You didn't say it was a combo special, although the ECS motherboard makes more sense now. Suddenly it's not such a great deal to me (as I already have a motherboard).

No, I'm saying look at the Seagate hard drives when you go back because those should have a longer warranty.

Arthur_Tuxedo · Post by **Arthur_Tuxedo** » 2006-08-20 07:14pm

Master of Ossus wrote:
Arthur_Tuxedo wrote:The economics is fine, it's the policy trying to manipulate the economics that's fucked up.
What are they trying to do? Create an indigenous Australian industry for everything that costs more than $50 and is generally purchased from outside of Australia?

It's just Mercantilist thinking surviving into the 21st century. By discouraging imports and encouraging exports, more cash flows into the economy than out. Of course, it fucks up comparative advantage and if everyone does it then they all cancel each other out, but nobody said fiscal policy had to make any sense.

Arthur_Tuxedo · Post by **Arthur_Tuxedo** » 2006-08-20 07:16pm

Dominus Atheos wrote:Update:

My parents OK'ed the $200 used laptop idea, so I just got back from Fry's Electronics. My purchases, from the scanned receipt:

AMD X2 4600+ CPU $194.99
2x512KB Cache

ECS KN1 LITE $64.99
NFORCE4 ULTRA
DDR400;SATA2;6Ch Audio
1(16x)PCIe;2PCIe;3PCI

MXT L01S300 300GB SATA $79.99
SATA/150 INTERFACE
7200RPM; 16MB BUFFER;
1 YEAR WARRANTY

and then a 512mb x1600 pro for $170, and a $50 dvd burner.

I am probably taking the hard drive back, as I didn't know it had a 1 year warranty(it didn't say anything about it on the box), but besides that, I would say I made out pretty well.

That system should do quite well. I would have gone with a 7600 GT for that price range, but looks good all in all.