Borg vs. GE with a twist.

vivftp · Post by **vivftp** » 2006-09-02 12:30am

I had tried this thread on SB with some interesting results and wanted to see how it might go here since on the whole there appear to be a lot more SW knowledgable people here and that'd affect how this particular thread goes.

I decided to make this thread more open then most of these vs. fights.

A fleet of 40,000 Borg cubes (20,000 assimilation cubes (5,000 of which contain Borg spheres in them), and 20,000 tactical cubes) is dumped in a completely empty and unmonitored area in a corner of the SW galaxy (at the height of the Empire)

The twist is, YOU are given full control over all the Borg (ie. you're the Borg queen ). The ships will all do your bidding, you just have to think it - and you have full data on what's going on with each and every ship, and every single drone. You also have the full knowledge of the Borg Collective as they would have in the Trek galaxy.

So... what do you do with your armada? If anyone's planning on starting a war, the more details the better. I'd imagine there will be replies of all sorts here... but it should be fairly interesting

jegs2 · Post by **jegs2** » 2006-09-02 12:53am

I'd probably send out some scouts (assuming they have those), minimizing the whole "Lower your shields..." piece, as that might be somewhat counterproductive to a reconnaissance mission. I'd look for sparsely populated and patrolled planets on which to possibly establish small outposts. From there, I'd try to figure out a way to look less conspicuous (if such a thing is possible). Try to catch civilian shuttles to more populated world and collect intelligence on the new galaxy.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-09-02 01:19am

So it's the Borg, but totally not the Borg since all the characteristic stupid will be gone? What a stupid idea: it's just 'lolz we luvv teh borgz' as a vs. It doesn't do shit or jack to get around the thousands of years of technology disparity... but you love cubes and cybervampires. Pffft.

vivftp · Post by **vivftp** » 2006-09-02 01:23am

Stark wrote:So it's the Borg, but totally not the Borg since all the characteristic stupid will be gone? What a stupid idea: it's just 'lolz we luvv teh borgz' as a vs. It doesn't do shit or jack to get around the thousands of years of technology disparity... but you love cubes and cybervampires. Pffft.

This is a thread to see how each individual, with their own knowledge of the SW universe would decide to approach the situation if given these specific resources from this specific race.

Some people might try to make a fight out of it, some people might try to settle down, some people might try to join another group, some people might choose a completely different route.

I'm simply interested to see the various replies.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-09-02 01:37am

Don't be ridiculous. If THAT was what you wanted to explore, you wouldn't use the fucking Borg in it. The Borg, being a ST dumbasses favourite wanking post, are ALWAYS used in these things, because tards want to discuss 'how long for teh borgz to catchzor upzor'. If you were really interested in open discussion of bridging technological divides, why not use the Feds? Oh wait, they're not wanked out wet-dream material, so it's not fun.

And NOBODY will make a fight of it. They'd get SLAUGHTERED. The Borg don't even have much to offer, and if they just attached themselves to another world or group they'd eventually end up being regular people working in a bank, and not wAnKtasTIC Borgz.

Sorry, should I pretend it's a really interesting idea? Okay, a few billion borg and some shit spacecraft will be fascinating and excellent in the GE. Maybe they'll become Jedi, or terraform a world full of wonders! My personal leadership will form the inchoate borgz into a SW-shaking powerhouse of insurance salesmen! Did that work? Anyone convinced?

vivftp · Post by **vivftp** » 2006-09-02 01:41am

Well now that we've heard Starks masterful plan, anyone else?

vivftp · Post by **vivftp** » 2006-09-02 01:44am

BTW Stark, if you want to know why I used the Borg instead of the Feds, it's because of all the normal Trek races, the Borg are the only ones with galaxy-spanning FTL drives and because I wanted the person creating their own scenario to have complete control over all their forces movements. Such a scenario isn't possible with the Feds where you'll be limited to a small section of the galaxy and will have to rely on the people in charge of your starships to carry out your plan as you want it to be done.

This way you're in complete control. The Borg are the most logical choice of all Trek races for this position. Do you like it? I don't know, I don't care. You don't think this thread is good? Go find another one to play in.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-09-02 02:18am

Aww, did I hurt your feelings? Sorry, just because you think another 'lolz teh borgz in starwars' thread is fun and excellent doesn't mean shit. And you want the scenario to be flexible, so you used the most heirarchical, rigid group in Star Trek! That's BRILLIANT!

Argosh · Post by **Argosh** » 2006-09-02 04:43am

vivftp wrote:So... what do you do with your armada?

I'll do the same thing I mentioned on SB, take all the Borg with me and head away from the SW galaxy. There are easier targets somewhere else.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2006-09-02 04:53am

Where do the Borg come up with a fleet of 20,000 full-sized cubes? Is there any real evidence that they have anywhere near this number of cubes, when they only have a few thousand planets?

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-09-02 05:02am

Argosh wrote:I'll do the same thing I mentioned on SB, take all the Borg with me and head away from the SW galaxy. There are easier targets somewhere else.

How long do you think it'd take for a pathfinder ship to cross intergalactic distances? If it could be managed - even over many, many years - could they build a transwarp hub and get the rest of them through much faster?

vivftp · Post by **vivftp** » 2006-09-02 08:13am

Darth Wong wrote:Where do the Borg come up with a fleet of 20,000 full-sized cubes? Is there any real evidence that they have anywhere near this number of cubes, when they only have a few thousand planets?

It's just a number plucked out of nowhere for the sake of the OP. Since it's not really the Borg Collective controlling things I wanted to give people enough ships to have a choice on what they would want to do. ie. if anyone thinks they can make a fight out of this, I didn't want to short change them and give them a smaller force. Or in the other thread there were others who decided to dismantle a good many of the ships to build infrastructure to suit their plan.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2006-09-02 01:44pm

I construct transwarp hubs, I send my ships out to explore, and buy maps (even if I have to set up holodecks on some hole in the end of the galaxy to do it). I apply for patents on several technologies, notably transporters (even assuming they've got ethical reservations, they'll work for cargo) and transwarp, then I use the cash rolling in from having undercut the hyperdrive market (after all, it costs no energy to use a transwarp conduit, and I can issue a lifetime liscence and a transponder for twenty credits) to make all sorts of perverted fantasies happen with HRDs and holodeck technology.

The Empire is liable to cooperate, especially if I let them monitor people's movements within transwarp conduits. I will even insinuate that it would be a good idea to ban civillian hyperdrives (Call them unsafe for enough years, publicize every hyperdrive accident on the holonet...), then, the rebels would have a hard time getting them, and the Empire would control and supervise all movement, and I, patriot that I am, would happily enforce blockades and taxation.

You may say this is foolish and they'd nationalise, but Palpatine tolerated Xizor, why shouldn't he tolerate me? I offer the Empire greater order and control, and am too much of a coward (you bet, no false bravado here) to be anything but perfectly loyal. Of course, this is assuming we never reach the state of the weird mad shit from the Dark Empire Sourcebook about him sucking everyone's life out, in which case, it would be worth defecting.

If I need more drones, I either have them cloned brainless from birth, and use them as pure puppets of my will, if necessery, I divise a semi-individualistic form of drone and set up as an evangelising swarm. "Become a Borg. It's utter contentment, and you get cut in for some of our profits." What's more, I find the Unimatrix Zero shared hallucination, and propagate it to all drones. Why the hell not?

Post by **NecronLord** » 2006-09-02 02:19pm

Oh. And, backup plan. Construct one of those 'Strategic Mines' loaded with nanites from Voyager's Scorpion, and test. Should they actually work (unlikely), put into mass production to be deployed galaxy wide if the government ever decides to seriously turn against me. Same with absolutely every other one-shot-wonder.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-09-02 08:49pm

Noone would detect your test?

Also, this is Star Wars. How long until someone just steals your tech and breaks your monopoly? The Borg are going to be quite vulnerable to industrial espionage, given their heirarchy.

Argosh · Post by **Argosh** » 2006-09-03 04:32am

Stark wrote:How long do you think it'd take for a pathfinder ship to cross intergalactic distances? If it could be managed - even over many, many years - could they build a transwarp hub and get the rest of them through much faster?

Too long, the rest of the armada will be discovered by GE before it reaches the nearest galaxy. Better leave with all of them and wait/sleep/hibernate etc en route.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2006-09-03 06:38am

Stark wrote:Noone would detect your test?

Do you have any idea how mindbogglingly big space is?

Also, this is Star Wars. How long until someone just steals your tech and breaks your monopoly? The Borg are going to be quite vulnerable to industrial espionage, given their heirarchy.

Err. No they're not. Precisely because no one who can understand the tech is anything but a part of my hive mind. And I am not the canon borg. I will teleport all intruders into space, and if that fails, I blow up the ship around them. What's more, sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander. I cannot 'reverse engineer' their entirely alien tech base, why should they be able to 'reverse engineer' mine, which in the areas I'm pedalling, far outstrips theirs.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-09-03 06:44am

NL, there's a lot of 'space' out there, but huge, systemwide explosions are a bit different to inert rocks.

And sorry, but the Borg have no DATA SECURITY. You can wank out your personal involvement all you want - again, this is why using the Borg in particular is odious - but unless you basically tear them down and start again, they're still going to have chips in their bodies that contain sensitive information. Since you're going to LET PEOPLE USE these huge spacebourne structures, I'd love to hear how you expect nobody to gain access to the information. Oh wait, you just totally rewrote everything about the Borg right? So they're in Borg ships, but don't behave like Borg, aren't organised like them, probably don't look like them, don't share their goals or methods, right?

Yeah, that's not retarded at all.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2006-09-03 06:59am

Stark wrote:NL, there's a lot of 'space' out there, but huge, systemwide explosions are a bit different to inert rocks.

Still too huge. An explosion that scatters nanites is no explosion at all. You think they investigate every poxy explosion in the couple of gigaton range? By the time anyone even detects such an explosion, I'll have had YEARS to do cleanup and evaluation. All they'll get will be Voyager's reatarded nanites floating through space - and i have my doubts about that, too.

And sorry, but the Borg have no DATA SECURITY. You can wank out your personal involvement all you want - again, this is why using the Borg in particular is odious - but unless you basically tear them down and start again, they're still going to have chips in their bodies that contain sensitive information.

And people are going to get bodies... how? What's more, this data is nowhere near enough to start building your own transwarp conduits. When did you last see the UFP start using them, instead of their incredibly slow propulsion? Because Picard captured borg bodies and pulled chips out of them, and so did Janeway. Therefore they have all the information they need to assemble a transwarp hub, no? I will note that these hubs are personally 'regulated' by the queen borg - IE, me. If they're detected, they're going to find conduits collapsing around them.

Since you're going to LET PEOPLE USE these huge spacebourne structures,

Eventually. After you know... Patenting it. Something which does exist in SW. If they manage to rip it off, good, I get investors to back me, and sue the fucking pants off them, and retire. If anything, they're far better off bribing the patent office to let them have my abstract of how transwarp works, rather than trying to raid my installations for data. Or, for that matter, just making me a good offer for the liscence of the technology.

I'd love to hear how you expect nobody to gain access to the information. Oh wait, you just totally rewrote everything about the Borg right? So they're in Borg ships, but don't behave like Borg,

You fucking bet. That's the point.

aren't organised like them, probably don't look like them, don't share their goals or methods, right?

No, they share my own goals and methods. That's the point. Borg with their own methods and goals are utter retards pursuing a pointless agenda.

Yeah, that's not retarded at all.

No, shitstain, it's not. The fact that you have some congential defect that prevents you from making an post that's not a child's attempt criticism aside, there's little that's retarded in this or the previous posts in this thread.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-09-03 07:08am

I'm just saying if new unknown doods show up in sector 11, people might be keeping an eye on the area.

And most of my post isn't directed at you - it's this retarded scenario. As you say, Borgy-Borg are worthless, inflexible adversaries. So for anything to happen you have to make them not-Borgy, and where to stop? Eventually they're not the Borg at all, they're a standin for some nerd, and the whole discussion has departed from the bloody thing. But don't let that stop you!

And sorry, but they'll still be militarily weak. While they're establishing the system, they'll be very vulnerable to espionage or overt theft, and they'll probably get tricked into revealing the tech to investors anyway. But no, you're convinced industrial espionage against a weak, small group that's extraoridinarily interconnected is impossible, right? Hell, huge corporations don't have any political power and would just sit by while your NL-Borg take a huge amount of money am I right?

But hey, you used my example of their poor data security - which you're going to ignore, since you're talking about the NL-Borg, not the ACTUAL Borg - as if I was suggesting that's how someone would steal the tech! I'm going to assume that was deliberate, and you're not really that stupid. But of course, regardless of what I say based on the Actual Borg, you'll just handwave and say 'nah my NL-Borg won't do it that way'. Thanks for proving my earlier misgivings totally correct.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2006-09-03 07:19am

Stark wrote:I'm just saying if new unknown doods show up in sector 11, people might be keeping an eye on the area.

I'm insulted. You don't think I'm smart enough to pick some arse end of the rim so distant from anyone of importance that it'll make Tatooine look like Coruscant, for my ultra-secret technology tests?

And sorry, but they'll still be militarily weak. While they're establishing the system, they'll be very vulnerable to espionage or overt theft, and they'll probably get tricked into revealing the tech to investors anyway. But no, you're convinced industrial espionage against a weak, small group that's extraoridinarily interconnected is impossible, right? Hell, huge corporations don't have any political power and would just sit by while your NL-Borg take a huge amount of money am I right?

Which is why I... don't make myself publically known until I have infrastructure set up, and various contingancies (including just having my own 'queen' 'body' on a cube with a cloaking device (presuming they know how to make one) in the arse end of beyond. I'm presuming I'm immortal, and have some means of amusing myself for the decades (or more likely, centuries) this would take to set up.

But hey, you used my example of their poor data security - which you're going to ignore, since you're talking about the NL-Borg, not the ACTUAL Borg -

You bet. Their data security weaknesses are pronounced, but they're not that pronounced, and as their communication technology is entirely different from that of the locals, it's not as if they can park outside a cube with a wireless reciever in a pringles box, and patch in.

as if I was suggesting that's how someone would steal the tech!

Ahem.

The Board's Most Annoying Poster, AKA Stark wrote:Also, this is Star Wars. How long until someone just steals your tech and breaks your monopoly?

That's what I'm concerned about.

I'm going to assume that was deliberate, and you're not really that stupid. But of course, regardless of what I say based on the Actual Borg, you'll just handwave and say 'nah my NL-Borg won't do it that way'.

Damn fucking straight. When did the Borg make it their ambition to set up a trans-galacitc highway network, eh?

You don't like the thread. Got it. Just don't fucking post in it then.

Solauren · Post by **Solauren** » 2006-09-03 07:40pm

I like the idea of using the Borgs unique technology to establish a commerical empire within the Star Wars galaxy.

I can also imagine that the Empire would LOVE to get ahold of some of those wanky assimilation probes. Drop one of those on a rebel outpost, and wait for the results. Then they can download data from the rebel minds, and hand me the drones. Nice win-win situation.

There's also the option of sending drones to school to learn.

One thing I'm wondering is, the massive liabrary planet in the SW galaxy the Vong hit that caused a shit storm, Obakai-skai I think it's name is, could I pull off a successful raid on them (once I had purchased or obtained STar Wars computers for compatability/interface development) and then go into hiding for a few hundred years while I upgraded my weapons and shields?

Batman · Post by **Batman** » 2006-09-03 07:49pm

It's Obroa-Skai and I doubt that would work. You now have the knowledge to produce Wars equipment using Wars manufacturing techniques and Wars materials. You do NOT have the information on how to get there from the Borg Tech base.
Personally, I'd patent transporter technology and retire once the money comes flooding in.

vivftp · Post by **vivftp** » 2006-09-03 10:20pm

Hmm, not bad thus far. Unlike the SB thread, I guess most here won't bother trying to make a fight out of this, but tha's fine - this is providing some interesting insight into the inner workings of the way the SW galaxy works.

Probably one of the more creative ideas I had heard from the SB thread was this one... anyone want to lend some thoughts to this type of plan?

http://forum.spacebattles.com/showpost. ... ostcount=6

Incidently, I just wanted to work out roughly how many drones you'll have available to start off with, and using a figure of 50,000 drones/cube (which is pretty conservative, IMO) and 10,000 drones per sphere, that works out to 2,050,000,000 drones. So you have a fair bit of manpower to play around with.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2006-09-03 11:25pm

Is there some reason you can't bother quoting the particular idea in question? This is not the first time you've done this.

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