Gandalf's Alternative Federation Fic

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Gandalf
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Re: What's the point

Post by Gandalf »

Sean Mulligan wrote:I am confused about this Federation :? Why would a the Federation being communist make them more likely than the canon Federation to destroy a planet? So far the only nation to use an atom bomb against a civilian target has been the United States not the Soviet Union or any other communist country.
I know. That, but the Federation is more Stalinist than plain "communist".
Also how can this Federation afford to lose an important ally such as the Klingon Empire? An ally that has been with them in the war from the beginning. During World War Two the Soviet Union was loyal to its Western allies and helped them by launching offensives during D-Day even though the Western allies kept delaying the opening of the Second Front costing many Soviet lives.
Important ally? The one that went to war with the Federation in season 4 of DS9? Remember that the Klingon Empire is an unstable beast of a thing.
Fighting the betrayed Klingon defenders will take years and greatly detract from the war against the Dominion.
Attacking the Klingon Empire was mentioned in the context of post war conflicts. Remember Sloan's first scene in Inter Arma Enim Silent Leges.
Are the Romulans suppossed to be communists too? Sloan called the ambassador comrade and there was a mention of a continuing committee.
No, it was just a term of endearment. Like "mate".
"Oh no, oh yeah, tell me how can it be so fair
That we dying younger hiding from the police man over there
Just for breathing in the air they wanna leave me in the chair
Electric shocking body rocking beat streeting me to death"

- A.B. Original, Report to the Mist

"I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately."
- George Carlin
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Post by Gandalf »

I wrote:I have witnessed the tremendous energy of the masses. On this foundation it is possible to accomplish any task whatsoever. – Mao Tse-Tung

Location: Utopia Planitia Shipyards orbiting Mars.

Stardate: 51147.3

0600:

At the beginning of his shift, Chief Engineer Miles O’Brien looked over his latest dispatch from the management. His dock was to increase efficiency and expediency by the end of the month. This would mean he’d need to increase the manpower, even start working down in the zero-G environment himself.

O’Brien pushed the button on his COM panel. “O’Brien to UP Management.” This office didn’t have a visual communications device. Resource allocaturs had determined that it wasn’t necessary. He could send schematics and files, but no outgoing visual communication.



“UP Management here, CE Level 2 Peters.” By the sound of Peters’ voice, O’Brien could tell that this was a kid just out of the Academy. Probably thought he’d have some high profile career with the Council, but got stuck in a construction environment.

“Peters, I require an increase in manpower. I need about twenty qualified engineers, level 3 or above. No undergrads or apprentices with hydrospanners this time.” O’Brien wasn’t afraid to berate the low level CE’s, a rarity among most Federation citizens. This attitude, along with considerable aptitude for his job, had earned him a favourable position with the Level 5s administering at the ‘yards. So he had a free hand as long as his work was impeccable.

“Chief, I’ll put your request to the Chief of Staffing and get back to you.”

“Look kid, don’t give me the run-around. You can’t expect a twenty percent output increase without increasing manpower.”

“Peters out.”

* * *

0921:

O’Brien had finally caught up with his administrative work. 3 sick engineers were quarantined so that their illness didn’t affect the rest of the workers. 3 temps were posted there from the temp pool. The components for the deflector array they were supposed to be using tomorrow were running late, and wouldn’t be there for three or so days. The IDN cables were faulty, and came apart during installation. Repairs delayed work in that region by an hour. The Chief of the Gamma shift had become sloppy and not completed the checklist of what tasks were completed. And finally, one of the workers had to leave because she’d become pregnant.

The COM panel flashed and beeped.

“O’Brien here.”
“This is Peters from UP Management. Your requested workers have been dispatched from Earth. They will be there within an hour.”

“Very good. There’s hope for you yet Peters. Maybe you won’t be a career secretary after all.”

O’Brien ended the conversation by pushing the Close COM Channel button on the COM panel. It sometimes seemed a better way to end a conversation where he’d just taken a shot at someone.

* * *

1040:

O’Brien waited in the docking area for his new engineers. A Runabout approached. Squeezing twenty people in there for the trip from Earth must be some accomplishment.

A few minutes later, O’Brien faced a bay full of new workers.

“Greetings new staff. I am Chief Miles O’Brien. I expect hard work and discipline. If you give me that, you’ll have a good stay here. You may even get a commendation.

If not, you’ll learn to work hard in a Starfleet labour camp. I hear they’re always happy to get trained engineers to work down the dilithium mines or salvaging materials from destroyed ships. Make your choice. In the meantime, your names and the shifts you’ve been assigned will be on the Facility Network. Dismissed. Glory and Victory To The Federation.”
"Oh no, oh yeah, tell me how can it be so fair
That we dying younger hiding from the police man over there
Just for breathing in the air they wanna leave me in the chair
Electric shocking body rocking beat streeting me to death"

- A.B. Original, Report to the Mist

"I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately."
- George Carlin
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Post by CaptainChewbacca »

I agree with Gandalf, the Klingon Empire is REMARKABLY unstable. Depending on its own internal politics it can be a staunch Federation ally, isolationist, or declare war on the federation. At least with the Romulans they've been sneaky, powerful bastards the entire time we've known them.

Do the humans have cloaking tech?
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Post by Gandalf »

CaptainChewbacca wrote:At least with the Romulans they've been sneaky, powerful bastards the entire time we've known them.
True. They may be untrustworthy, but they're fairly stable. Their ships look cool too.
Do the humans have cloaking tech?
Yes. IIRC it's in one of the first sentences of the first one.
"Oh no, oh yeah, tell me how can it be so fair
That we dying younger hiding from the police man over there
Just for breathing in the air they wanna leave me in the chair
Electric shocking body rocking beat streeting me to death"

- A.B. Original, Report to the Mist

"I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately."
- George Carlin
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Post by Gandalf »

I wrote:Politics is almost as exciting as war, and quite as dangerous. In war you can only be killed once, but in politics many times. – Winston Churchill

Location: Federation Supreme Council Chambers.

Stardate 51147.3

0930 Hours.

At the Federation Council, the environment was tense as the Council Emissaries explained how bad their situation was this day.

The Supreme Council of the United Federation of Planets was the highest authority in Federation space. The Supreme Council consisted of seven Councillors, one of whom was Chief Councillor Leyton. After the Dominion scare on Earth on Stardate 49310, then Admiral Leyton assumed leadership of the Council. Having the loyalty of much of Starfleet and the Emissaria helped that go over smoothly.

The Council room was designed to look imposing. Well lit with grey walls, and the Councillors desks were elevated above the rest of the room. The Council room design often scared people who visited, and this was how they liked it. To counter this, the Emissaria often sent Vulcans to consult. The Council didn’t mind, because the Vulcans didn’t bullshit them.

“As you can see,” The CE pointed to a large screen, “the Dominion fleets have stopped to annex their conquests. Our fleets have fallen back, waiting for reinforcements and repairs. “

Councillor Yeager raised his hand. “And how long until they are combat ready again?”

“That could take some time. The shipyards are working around the clock on the new Defiant models. We expect to have forty by the end of the month. They will be deployed as necessary around the fleet within six weeks. The repairs will be done in about 2 weeks. Because of massive casualties, the Second Fleet will be disbanded and it’s men and equipment redistributed to other ships.”

There was an awkward silence in the room.

Council Chairman Leyton stood up. “What can you recommend we do, Emissary Sovak?”

“I advise that we fall back to a more defensible position. We can abandon these worthless systems. Fall back approximately 3 light years to the Churchill, Argus and Pike systems. This will create a bottleneck, as the Dominion will be unlikely to violate Breen or Ferengi space. We can order the evacuation of those systems and the removal of as much hardware as we can fit on the troop transport ships. The workers and hardware can be redistributed easily enough.”

“How long will this plan take?”

“Approximately two to three days to evacuate the planets, and another two days at most to fall back.” Sovak stood, worried that the Council would shout him down.

Councillor Satie leaned forward in her seat. “Why fall back? Won’t this be an admission that we are being soundly defeated?”

“Not necessarily, we are waiting for Klingon reinforcements to come from their reserves and the new Defiants. I’m confident that we can hold these systems until then. Also, the systems we are planning to abandon have no resources that aren’t common across the quadrant, nor do they have any real strategic value.”

Leyton sat down, and took a resigned expression. He said, tiredly; “Get it done. Meeting adjourned. Glory and Victory to The Federation.”
"Oh no, oh yeah, tell me how can it be so fair
That we dying younger hiding from the police man over there
Just for breathing in the air they wanna leave me in the chair
Electric shocking body rocking beat streeting me to death"

- A.B. Original, Report to the Mist

"I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately."
- George Carlin
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Post by Gandalf »

I wrote:Demoralize the enemy from within by surprise, terror, sabotage, assassination. This is the war of the future. – Adolph Hitler

Location: Starfleet Command

Stardate: 51304.9, 1600 hours.

In the Starfleet Command Seminar Chambers, Federal Special Projects Operative Level 3, Ben Sisko commenced his presentation.

“Welcome Esteemed Comrades, first I need to remind you that this briefing is top level confidential. All outgoing transmissions are being monitored. With that out of the way, I present you Operation Ragnarok.”

“Ragnarok?” One of the gathered Admirals piped up.

“Yes, it’s an old Earth legend of doomsday. Given the nature of the project, it feels appropriate. To continue; as you know, things do not bode well for the Glorious Federation. So we have considered what was deemed to be a last resort.”

There was much stirring and muttering among the brass. When somebody used the term “last resort”, it was a sign that many people were going to die.

Sisko continued; “Using cloaked missiles, we plan to launch several hundred antimatter loaded warheads to Cardassia Prime.” Sisko pushed a button on a remote he picked up. On a massive screen behind him, a diagram showing Cardassian space and the border that shared it appeared. Cardassia Prime was highlighted. “Theoretically we can render the planet inhabitable to all life and destroy everything up to and including a low orbit. This means the Central Command, the Founder, Gul Dukat, everything.”

The image dissolved to another showing hundreds of points on Cardassia Prime where missiles would hit.

Sisko continued; “Hopefully were can terrify the Cardassians into withdrawing from the alliance with the Dominion, as our intelligence indicates growing disharmony in their alliance. The centralised nature of Dominion command will hopefully leave them disoriented, giving us time for a massive counterattack. Questions?”

In the back of the audience, Admiral Ross stood up. Ross was not known for being a very bright Admiral. But he knew how to get the right staffers to help with that. “What about the Dominion’s ability to detect cloaked objects? I imagine the defence around Cardassia must be nothing short of impenetrable.”

Sisko paused for a moment. “We have secured the use of some gifted personnel within the Daystrom Institute. We believe they can crack into the Cardassian Defence Network and disable it in the specific areas we need. Next?”

Admiral Ross had another question; “I have another question. What will the likely Dominion response be?”

“We assume that there will be a fast and brutal response. They’ll throw everything they have at us. Which works because we have a bottleneck advantage. We’ve been able to procure some Romulan and Klingon help here. When they are in place, we launch the missiles from specially modified freighters.” The image behind Sisko dissolved the show images of freighters that resembled zeppelins of old. It showed the outer hull falling away, and missiles coming out of it like a swarm of bees.

Admiral Chesney raised his hand. “Why so many missiles? It seems like a dozen or so should be able to do the trick.”

Sisko gave the Admiral a quizzical look. “Redundancy, obviously. We don’t know if any missiles might get intercepted, run into things, or just fly off course. They’re being kept in 3 groups to avoid detection. At the front of each group, one of the missiles will have been fitted with a deflector system. This will prevent problems arising with various problems like clouds and space junk. Any more questions?”

The room was silent. They knew that this was an all or nothing manoeuvre. If something went wrong, the Federation would most likely be wiped out be an angry Dominion. If it went as planned, the Federation would be able to liberate billions from the oppressive Cardassian and Dominion regimes. It would mean Glory and Victory to the Federation.
"Oh no, oh yeah, tell me how can it be so fair
That we dying younger hiding from the police man over there
Just for breathing in the air they wanna leave me in the chair
Electric shocking body rocking beat streeting me to death"

- A.B. Original, Report to the Mist

"I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately."
- George Carlin
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Post by DrMckay »

Great story! I love seeing the Feddies we know and love go Stalinist!
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Post by Gandalf »

I wrote:In the Soviet army it takes more courage to retreat than advance. - Josef Stalin

Location: Chin'toka Prime

Stardate: 51400.9, 0500 hours.

“At this moment, I am proud to call you my comrades. As you prepare to go down to the surface, remember that you aren't fighting alone. The power of the Federation is with you.”

Aboard the Starfleet troop transport Khrushchev, Emissary John Willis' holographic image hovered above the massed troops below as they prepared to land on Chin'toka Prime. Tens of thousands waited in the expansive bay area, packed in like sardines because of a transport shortage. However, the soldiers didn't know that the landing bay was filling with clear, scentless Karamine gas.

This was something usually only done before battles which were thought to have high casualty rates. It was a pity really, they had so much invested in each soldier. Training, equipment, armour and weapons. It seemed a shame to leave it on soldiers who faced a thirty three percent chance of survival. But the Federation only really got it's investment back from one out of two troops anyway. The incoming Karamine gas made them aggressive, suppressed their natural fear and made them somewhat xenophobic. The gas virtually guaranteed they'd fight until victory or total defeat.

Of course, only the Emissary knew what was going on in that regard. The official reason for his hologram being projected was that there was no platform from which he could speak to the soldiers in the landing bay. He used his Emissary clearance to access the life support systems, and used it to wipe the logs of what he'd done. The Chin'Toka communications array needed to be captured as part of the upcoming Operation Ragnarok.

There was a notable thud when the ship hit the ground. The soldiers, now itching to get out there and tear apart anything that didn't speak Federation standard, barely twitched.

“I've received word from the bridge. In a few seconds you will go forth and shred your enemies. As long as a Jem' hadar lives, your job is unfinished. Now go forth!”

The massive bay doors opened. The Federation troops poured forth out of them. As they exited ship, they saw that the Khrushchev was but one ship in a line that stretched further than they could see. Other landers could be seen on all sides of the compound, preventing a land retreat. In the sky, ships kept monitoring the planetary surface in case anyone tried to excape on a starship.

They saw overhead, as Starfleet Point Bombers streaked by. It was their job to neutralise anything the Dominion had that could hit the approaching Starfleet horde.

“Attention!” A voice came over the communicators. “All groups will head straight for the compound. Remember that there are no civilians here on this planet, only Dominion soldiers. When you reach a position one hundred metres from the objective, halt and wait for clearance. Keep pace with your comrades, and don't forget that each of you represent your homeland and your people. Make us proud. Glory and victory to the Federation!”
Sorry for not showing the battle. But I can't write them.
"Oh no, oh yeah, tell me how can it be so fair
That we dying younger hiding from the police man over there
Just for breathing in the air they wanna leave me in the chair
Electric shocking body rocking beat streeting me to death"

- A.B. Original, Report to the Mist

"I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately."
- George Carlin
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Post by Gandalf »

You know who's going to inherit the Earth? Arms dealers. Because everyone else is too busy killing each other. - Yuri Orlov, Lord of War

Location: Classified.

Stardate: 51304.9, 1600 hours.

Quark awoke in a dark featureless cell.

Memories came flooding back to him. Gaila's offer, the arms deal and the capture.

Quark had seen this as a great opportunity, his cut of the profit would have been enough to buy some prime investments on Ferenginar. He could live out the rest of his life doing minimal work for maximum profits.

The cargo; Federation Personnel Weaponry. Very popular on the black markets, because of their rarity and the quality of their manufacture.

They were rare because stockpiles were maintained by Emissaries. How Gaila got those gun was beyond Quark, and he really didn't want to know.

The weapons were being sold to a Klingon acquisitions officer acting on behalf of his fleet commander. The Klingon weapons depots had been largely destroyed, and most Klingon energy weapons were of such poor quality that they'd malfunction after a few uses. The Federation wasn't about to give arms to an enemy they saw as evil and culturally backward, and they had too much pride to ask the Romulans.

That left one more source for massive amounts of armament, the Ferengi. It was now up to the individual fleet commanders to procure armaments for those under their command. They were given some Imperial Credits, and told to look after it on their own. It worked out to be a saving for the Empire, they just stopped making weapons for the front line soldiers, and poured that funding and manpower into other things.

This was a boon for the Ferengi arms traders. The massive upswing in demand pushed up the prices. The rise in prices led to more weapons thefts from various weapons stores as the temptation became all too much. Quark watched as rumours went around the Ferengi networks. He thought of a way to get into the trade, but being a barman in a Federation station was a poor place from which to trade arms.

Then out of the blue it came, a call from Gaila. The man with his own moon. All Quark had to do was make the contact. He knew that it was putting his own fingerprints on the deal, but for a sixty percent cut it was worth it.

After the deal was done with the Klingons in neutral space, Quark and Gaila hightailed it back to the safety of Ferengi space. That was when the ship decloaked behind them, and soon afterwards, everything went dark.

Then it started. For an indeterminable amount of time, he couldn't tell if he was conscious or not. He had vague memories of being tortured he looked down at his naked form. He had cuts, bruises and places where the tissue had been regenerated. He was sleep deprived, he was cold, he ached all over.

“Ferengi citizen Quark.” A booming voice sounded in the cell.

Quark looked around, he couldn't isolate the source of the noise.

“Ferengi citizen Quark.”

“.. yes?”

“Stand up.”

Quark didn't know what was going on, but it was best to comply. He stood at full attention.

A Ferengi woman walked into the room from behind him.

Quark was shocked to see her. “Who are you?”

She smiled, and leaned closer to Quark. “You wouldn't understand if I told you.”

“Well then... why am I being held like this?” The image of this striking woman in this terrible place had him very put off.

“Because of your weapon's sales.” She lightly stroked his ear. “Where did you get them?”

“I don't know... shouldn't the weapons themselves have some sort of tags?”

“Oh, they're tagged. In more ways than you could possibly know. We need to know the people involved, more specifically, who the buyer was. Your cousin Gaila said you arranged the deal. It could be very profitable for you if you were to help us.” She handed him a PADD with a sizable number on it with some simple contractual writing around it. “You're a smart man, think of all of that latinum. You could get your bar out of debt.”

“The latinum, is it in solid bars?” Quark tried to assert some sort of business acumen. Something about this woman was offputting. A woman negotiating like that was unthinkable.

“All yours if you co-operate. Gaila got the same amount. There's more if you stay with us. If you decide not to, we'll give you your shuttle. You'll be free to go, I trust as time goes and memories slowly return, you'll know to avoid the gunrunning business.”

“...We didn't use real names. But I know his comm frequency.”

“Excellent, just write it on this.” She handed him the PADD.

Quark spent the next few seconds scrawling down a frequency. As he handed it back to her, she looked at it and smiled.

The woman dissolved. Evidently, she was a hologram.

Quark pondered this for a moment. Who was that woman? The Rules of Acquisition gave most Ferengi a sense of security when dealing with Ferengi. If they studied the contracts they would be fine. What had he just done?

Quark stood in his cell, dumbfounded at what had just happened. All he knew about the transaction was that he'd given the comm frequency to whomever had him held prisoner.

After a few minutes of wondering to himself, the room itself dissolved. He was in a holodeck. Federation by the looks of it.

Two human men came through the door, not wearing any recognisable uniform. One was holding some folded clothes.

“Ferengi Citizen Quark. Welcome.” The first man said with a smile on his face.

“Who the hell are you people?”

“Put these on and come with us.” The second man threw the pile of clothes at Quark.

Quark hurriedly applied the clothes. They looked drab, like the outfit of a prisoner. All grey, with no pockets or anything like that. The material felt strong, which was good.

“Now for an explanation. You are now a prisoner of the United Federation of Planets. You'll be kept here until we deem otherwise.”

Quark was led to an area with “Prison Population” on the door.
"Oh no, oh yeah, tell me how can it be so fair
That we dying younger hiding from the police man over there
Just for breathing in the air they wanna leave me in the chair
Electric shocking body rocking beat streeting me to death"

- A.B. Original, Report to the Mist

"I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately."
- George Carlin
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Post by Jack Bauer »

Great stuff Gandalf. Just a quick question though, is this universe in the MU continuity at all or is it purely your own work?
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Post by Gandalf »

It's my own.

No goatees, only handlebars. :P
"Oh no, oh yeah, tell me how can it be so fair
That we dying younger hiding from the police man over there
Just for breathing in the air they wanna leave me in the chair
Electric shocking body rocking beat streeting me to death"

- A.B. Original, Report to the Mist

"I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately."
- George Carlin
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Post by Sidewinder »

Did Gaila sell out Quark, or were both Ferengi careless?

Nice preparation for the ground battle, by the way.
Please do not make Americans fight giant monsters.

Those gun nuts do not understand the meaning of "overkill," and will simply use weapon after weapon of mass destruction (WMD) until the monster is dead, or until they run out of weapons.

They have more WMD than there are monsters for us to fight. (More insanity here.)
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Post by Sean Mulligan »

Gandalf wrote:It's my own.

No goatees, only handlebars. :P

I don't know what the point of this fic is. Your federation seems to have little in common with the cannon one and you seem to be just showing a future alternate reality where the communists won the Cold War and using Star Trek names. Also, there was never any military take over of any communist government. Stalin used the threat of Trotsky who was then head of the red army launching a bonapartist coup to help isolate Trotsky and put himself in power.
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Post by MKSheppard »

Sean Mulligan wrote:Also, there was never any military take over of any communist government.
O RLY?

The Red Army was always a very powerful political force in the Soviet Union following Stalin's death. Kruschkev had Beria thrown to the wolves in the form of the Red Army, who disarmed Beria's NKVD units, and took him away; and gained their revenge on him for the 1930s.

In this way, Krushckev gained the Red Army's support in Kremlin politics.
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Re: What's the point

Post by MKSheppard »

Sean Mulligan wrote:I am confused about this Federation :? Why would a the Federation being communist make them more likely than the canon Federation to destroy a planet?
Gee, I don't know, the use of biological weapons against the Germans in World War II; the ruthless crushing of Hungary, followed up by crushinating Prague Spring in Czechslovakia, plus the utterly ruthless way in which the USSR executed it's war in Afghanistan?
So far the only nation to use an atom bomb against a civilian target has been the United States not the Soviet Union or any other communist country.
A fact which is completely irrevelant to this discussion as the United States was the only one who had the Bomb in World War II. Do you really think Stalin would have turned down the chance to pop a nuke over Berlin in 1945 right over the Reichschancellry?
During World War Two the Soviet Union was loyal to its Western allies and helped them by launching offensives during D-Day even though the Western allies kept delaying the opening of the Second Front costing many Soviet lives.
Do you have any knowledge of history?

1.) Operation Bagration was already in the works and planned separately of the Normandy invasion. The date of Bagration was merely moved up about 10~ days to exploit Normandy.

2.) There already was a second front, something called...ITALY. In fact, at the height of the Battle of Kursk in 1943, several of Manstein's crack SS units were abruptly removed from his order of battle by Hitler and entrained to go west to Italy, to attack the Anglo-American landings in Sicily.
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"The present air situation in the Pacific is entirely the result of fighting a fifth rate air power." - U.S. Navy Memo - 24 July 1944
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Post by Gandalf »

Sean Mulligan wrote:Your federation seems to have little in common with the cannon one
Yes it is different, almost as it if it were an alternative Federation fic.
and you seem to be just showing a future alternate reality where the communists won the Cold War and using Star Trek names.
The Communists didn't win the cold war. I'll address the history of the Federation in my next story on this. I've drawn up a rudimentary timeline.

Kudos for Shep for his useful posting here. :D
"Oh no, oh yeah, tell me how can it be so fair
That we dying younger hiding from the police man over there
Just for breathing in the air they wanna leave me in the chair
Electric shocking body rocking beat streeting me to death"

- A.B. Original, Report to the Mist

"I think it’s the duty of the comedian to find out where the line is drawn and cross it deliberately."
- George Carlin
Sean Mulligan
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Re: What's the point

Post by Sean Mulligan »

Gee, I don't know, the use of biological weapons against the Germans in World War II; the ruthless crushing of Hungary, followed up by crushinating Prague Spring in Czechslovakia, plus the utterly ruthless way in which the USSR executed it's war in Afghanistan?

A fact which is completely irrevelant to this discussion as the United States was the only one who had the Bomb in World War II. Do you really think Stalin would have turned down the chance to pop a nuke over Berlin in 1945 right over the Reichschancellry?

[
Do you have any knowledge of history?

1.) Operation Bagration was already in the works and planned separately of the Normandy invasion. The date of Bagration was merely moved up about 10~ days to exploit Normandy.

2.) There already was a second front, something called...ITALY. In fact, at the height of the Battle of Kursk in 1943, several of Manstein's crack SS units were abruptly removed from his order of battle by Hitler and entrained to go west to Italy, to attack the Anglo-American landings in Sicily.[/quote]


Italy and North Africa were sideshows. The Germans sent only about twenty five divisions there while two hundred and fifty divisions were fighting on the Eastern Front. Here is an article about D-Day by noted anti communist Eric Margolis. http://www.ericmargolis.com/archives/20 ... ere_al.php

Also, what biological warfare against Germany? Stalin would not have wnated to drop a bomb on Berlin in 1945. His troops in the heart of Germany and they would have been harmed by the blast. Also, Stalin wanted to capture Hitler alive and he would not have destroyed Berlin's remaining industrial equipment that could be sent to the Soviet Union as reparations.
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Post by MKSheppard »

Sean Mulligan wrote:Italy and North Africa were sideshows.
Tell that to the D-Day Dodgers who slogged along in the mud of Italy, suffering heavy casualties while Normandy got all the publicity.

As for your link by Mr Margolis where he says:

The Luftwaffe lost most of its warplanes and its best pilots in the East.

Utterly wrong.

The Luftwaffe was completely eviscerated and the majority of its pilots killed by the Mighty Eighth's bomber gunners or fighter escorts.

People who survived fighting on the eastern front came back home to fly "Defense of the Reich" missions, and they were killed in the daily grind of fighting off the Mighty Eighth.

As for your beloved Red Army; guess what? It couldn't have moved so far so fast after Kursk to the borders of Germany by 1945 if it weren't for the tens of thousands of trucks that the US shipped to the USSR by lend lease, allowing them to mechanize large parts of their army while still concentrating their heavy industry on cranking out tank after tank.

Likewise, VVS dominance was ensued by the shipment of 100+ octane aviation gasoline by the US, which allowed Soviet aircraft to perform better than the Luftwaffle, who were restricted to about 87~ or so octane gasoline.
The Germans sent only about twenty five divisions there while two hundred and fifty divisions were fighting on the Eastern Front.
Wrong.

Linka

Germany never had 250 divisions on the Eastern Front. The maximum total was 195 divisions, which was reached in February 1943. By the end of 1943, it was down to 176 divisions.

In the beginning of '43, 75 divisions were being wasted in various places like in France, Norway, the Balkans, North Africa, etc defending against the Anglo-Americans, or the threat of an Anglo-Americna Landing. That's 27% of the Wehrmacht's manpower simply being expended in merely guarding against the possibility of the Allies making a move elsewhere.

By the end of '43, the Allies were drawing 87 divisions, or 32% of the Wehrmacht's strength away, and Germany was forced for the first time to actually have to split her forces between two major fronts; Italy and the Eastern Front.

By December 1944, 115 divisions, or 46% of the Wehrmacht was facing the Western Allies; with Germany squeezed on three sides, from the West and South by the Anglo Americans, and from the East by the Soviets.
Also, what biological warfare against Germany?
Pre-war, there were only 1,000 or so Tularemia cases in the entire Soviet Union yearly; in 1942 alone, the Germans recorded over 100,000 cases of tularemia. Then in 1943, the Tularemia count went back to 1,000 or so cases. I suggest you read "Biohazard" by Ken Alibek. I've probably gotten the exact numbers wrong, but the huge disparity is correct. Where did this tularemia outbreak come from?

Same thing happened with German horses. The Soviets deliberately released Glanders; which killed off large numbers of the German pack horses and other draft animals. The Germans didn't notice this because they attributed it to the German horses not being able to withstand the harshness of the ostfront.
Stalin would not have wnated to drop a bomb on Berlin in 1945. His troops in the heart of Germany and they would have been harmed by the blast. Also, Stalin wanted to capture Hitler alive and he would not have destroyed Berlin's remaining industrial equipment that could be sent to the Soviet Union as reparations.
Firstly:

In 1945, everyone thought of the Atom Bomb as a really Big Bomb. Radiation was something that wasn't mentioned much.

And do you think Stalin cared about his troops? Nah. They were just cogs in the machine to gain him ultimate glory by seizing Berlin before the Western Allies at a bloody price.

As for capturing Hitler alive?...Stalin really doesn't care at this point. He's looking towards the future, and the eventual showdown with the Western Allies. Getting Herr Schicklegruber alive is a nice bonus, but not really necessary.

Secondly, if Stalin was so worried about destroying Berlin's remaining industrial equipment, why did he have the city shelled relentlessly with thousands of guns, and then fought for block for block?

Finally; to actually destroy Berlin totally, you need at least 12 Fat Man type atomic bombs.
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Post by Trogdor »

Great fic, Gandalf, but I'm a bit confused at this latest chapter. I was under the impression that the Feds and Klingons are, at the moment, allies against the Dominion, just as they were in the real timeline. So why wouldn't the Feds throw a few hand phasers their way if they need them so bad? Have they stopped in preparation of backstabbing them with the Romulans or something?
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Post by fusion »

I am a bit confused on what the fed ground troop were going to do.
Excellent fic, but it seem to be an be a stand alone if you change the names as the characters are changed beyond recognition.
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Post by MKSheppard »

Oh yes, Sean, before I forget:

If it wasn't for the Anglo-American Combined Bomber Offensive, about 20,000 88mm guns and the MILLIONS of rounds of ammunition they fired to defend against the B-17s/B-24s/Lancasters will suddenly appear on the Eastern Front, to the great fear of their crews.
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"The present air situation in the Pacific is entirely the result of fighting a fifth rate air power." - U.S. Navy Memo - 24 July 1944
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Post by Gandalf »

Chapter 9
I wrote:“I am become death, the destroyer of worlds.” - J Robert Oppenheimer

Location: Federation Field Hospital, Chintoka Prime.

Stardate: 51811.4, 1900 hours.

Doctor Julian Bashir slumped back to the doctor's quarters in the field hospital. Twenty hour days took their toll on a man, even a genetically enhanced one like him. He sat in front of a radio, hoping to hear some music to put him to sleep.

Some doctors had trouble with the atmosphere and they would often be seen with some synthehol concoctions after hours. Bashir did, one some level, relish this. Even though the work was exhausting, and exposed him to the worst of humanity, he was still saving lives.

Had he been working in a bigger hospital on Earth or Betazed, he would have more prestige, but be almost wasted. In a field hospital, he was always on his toes, thinking of new ways to deal with problems which appeared. He saved more lives in a day here, than he would have in a week in a regular hospital.

The music was interrupted by the announcer's voice.

“Attention all Federation citizens. The Federation is no longer at war with the Dominion. I repeat, the war is over.”

The joy in the announcer's voice was evident. Some cheers could be heard in the halls.

“The Dominion surrendered unconditionally today, following the success of Operation Ragnarok. From what we know, the missiles struck the Cardassian sun. A low level shock wave emanated over the system. The Cardassian home system was annihilated. We'll give you more news as it develops.”

Bashir couldn't believe his ears. The Cardassian system was home to billions of Cardassians. How could the government do such a thing? It must have led to massive retaliations against Federation citizens in Dominion held territory.

The announcer continued; “Following mass suicides on the part of Dominion troops, the Cardassian forces were left broken and uncoordinated. The surrender will involve the occupation of the Cardassian planets until the Federation Council deems otherwise. Remember this day, glory and victory have come to the Federation.”
Fin.

I wish I could have made the last chapter a bit more like M*A*S*H. Sweet Zeus do I love that show.

This Federation will return in; Gandalf's Alternative Federation Fic 2: The Passion of the Sisko.
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Electric shocking body rocking beat streeting me to death"

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