70,000-year-old religious snake icon found

dr. what · Post by **dr. what** » 2006-12-01 10:08am

I, for one, welcome our ancient snake overlords....

A Canadian archeologist has discovered what's being hailed as the world's oldest known religious artifact: a six-metre-long, serpentine rock carving made 70,000 years ago by a prehistoric, python-worshipping people in what is now the African nation of Botswana.

The find -- sure to startle Christians steeped in satanic images of snakes -- is described as revolutionary for understanding the origins of human ritual, pushing the roots of religion back 30,000 years and moving its apparent birthplace from Stone Age Europe to ancient southern Africa.

Called a "startling archeological discovery" that "changes our understanding of human history," the snake carving was found in a cave in northwestern Botswana's Tsodilo region, a petroglyph-rich oasis of rock hills in the middle of the Kalahari desert.

"You see these hills jutting out of the sand and you know that this place just had to get your attention as a hunter-gatherer 70,000 years ago," Sheila Coulson, a Vancouver-born archeologist with the University of Oslo, said yesterday.

"You definitely get a feeling about those hills. It's just like walking into a church."

Ms. Coulson, 56, who began her archeology training at Simon Fraser University, revealed the find this week after leading a two-year probe of the site, known to the local San culture as "the Mountain of the Gods."

First alerted to the area as a potential research target by former University of Botswana archeologist Nick Walker, Ms. Coulson directed a team that excavated a two-metre layering of sediment below the snake icon -- gathering evidence about its age, unearthing stone tools used in carving the image, and gradually unravelling its religious significance.

The python remains a key figure in San mythology, Ms. Coulson said. According to the culture's creation myth, humans descended from the snake, which was also believed to have carved ancient dry streambeds by slithering around the hills searching for water.

The find "means that humans were more organized and had the capacity for abstract thinking at a much earlier point in history than we have previously assumed," Ms. Coulson said in a statement released by the Research Council of Norway, which helped fund her probe of the site.

In the interview, Ms. Coulson said there was "definitely a eureka moment" when it became clear that she and her team were studying an enormous religious relic at the world's earliest known place of worship.

"You could see the mouth and eyes of the snake. It looked like a real python," Ms. Coulson said in the statement. "The play of sunlight over the indentations gave them the appearance of snakeskin. At night, the firelight gave one the feeling that the snake was actually moving.

"All of the indications suggest that Tsodilo has been known to mankind for almost 100,000 years as a very special place in the pre-historic landscape."

Cao Cao · Post by **Cao Cao** » 2006-12-01 10:39am

How long before Graham Hancock or whoever pops up and proclaims that this is proof of the ancient snake-lords of Atlantis?

Big Orange · Post by **Big Orange** » 2006-12-01 11:00am

Well Abrahamic faith only went back 5000 years in comparison.

Shroom Man 777 · Post by **Shroom Man 777** » 2006-12-01 11:02am

Holy shit, giant Goa'uld!

Drooling Iguana · Post by **Drooling Iguana** » 2006-12-01 11:15am

"Two or three years ago it was just another snake cult..."

CaptainChewbacca · Post by **CaptainChewbacca** » 2006-12-01 11:21am

Considering that's 7 times older than any recorded history, I'm gonna have to give that a "Frigging awesome!"

Think about it; when it was carved, humans weren't the only intelligent life on earth.

GrandMasterTerwynn · Post by **GrandMasterTerwynn** » 2006-12-01 11:31am

More detail about the monument Here

LiveScience.com wrote:Startling Discovery: The First Human Ritual
By Robert Roy Britt
LiveScience Managing Editor
posted: 30 November 2006
09:45 am ET

A startling discovery of 70,000-year-old artifacts and a python's head carved of stone appears to represent the first known human rituals.

Scientists had thought human intelligence had not evolved the capacity to perform group rituals until perhaps 40,000 years ago.

But inside a cave in remote hills in Kalahari Desert of Botswana, archeologists found the stone snake [image] that was carved long ago. It is as tall as a man and 20 feet long.

"You could see the mouth and eyes of the snake. It looked like a real python," said Sheila Coulson of the University of Oslo. "The play of sunlight over the indentations gave them the appearance of snake skin. At night, the firelight gave one the feeling that the snake was actually moving."

The bigger surprise

More significant, when Coulson and her colleagues dug a test pit near they stone figure, they found spearheads made of stone that had to have been brought to the cave from hundreds of miles away [image]. The spearheads were burned in what only could be described as some sort of ritual, the scientists conclude.

"Stone age people took these colorful spearheads, brought them to the cave, and finished carving them there," Coulson said today. "Only the red spearheads were burned. It was a ritual destruction of artifacts. There was no sign of normal habitation. No ordinary tools were found at the site."

The discovery was made in a remote region of Botswana called Tsodilo Hills, the only uplifted area for miles around. It is known to modern Sanpeople as the "Mountains of the Gods" and the "Rock that Whispers." Their legend has it that mankind descended from the python, and the ancient, arid streambeds around the hills are said to have been created by the python as it circled the hills in its ceaseless search for water.

That legend made the discovery of the stone python all the more amazing.

"Our find means that humans were more organized and had the capacity for abstract thinking at a much earlier point in history than we have previously assumed," Coulson said. "All of the indications suggest that Tsodilo has been known to mankind for almost 100,000 years as a very special place in the pre-historic landscape."

Yet another surprise

The scientists found a secret chamber behind the python carving. Worn areas indicate it's been used over the years.

"The shaman, who is still a very important person in San culture, could have kept himself hidden in that secret chamber," Coulson explained. "He would have had a good view of the inside of the cave while remaining hidden himself. When he spoke from his hiding place, it could have seemed as if the voice came from the snake itself. The shaman would have been able to control everything. It was perfect.”

The shaman could also have made himself disappear from the chamber by crawling out onto the hillside through a small shaft, the scientists found.

Paintings in the cave appear to support part of modern San mythology.

While cave paintings are common in the Tsodilo Hills, inside the python cave there are just two small paintings, of an elephant and a giraffe. The images were painted at the exact spot where water runs down the wall.

One San story has the python falling into water, unable to get out. It's saved by the giraffe. The elephant, with its long trunk, is often a metaphor for the python in San mythology.

"In the cave, we find only the San people’s three most important animals: the python, the elephant, and the giraffe," Coulson said. "That is unusual. This would appear to be a very special place. They did not burn the spearheads by chance. They brought them from hundreds of kilometers away and intentionally burned them. So many pieces of the puzzle fit together here. It has to represent a ritual."

It looks like 70,000 years ago, someone was using the site for ritual purposes involving burning spearheads in front of this carved snake rock and associated cave paintings. A site that's still used today by the locals, who have created their own mythology surrounding it. And I was going to create a thread on this very topic when I noticed I'd been beaten to the punch. Oh well.

Frank Hipper · Post by **Frank Hipper** » 2006-12-01 11:40am

I've read before that the San are most likely the oldest surviving ethnic group in the world, this would appear to be some decent supporting evidence...intensely cool.

Wyrm · Post by **Wyrm** » 2006-12-01 12:47pm

Hmmm, an ancient religion proves that the world is at least 7 times older than the age the YECs are deluded in thinking the earth is. How ironic.

Faram · Post by **Faram** » 2006-12-01 12:50pm

LIES, that cannot be true, the earth is 4231 yers old I read it in the bible!

And tobad they did not have a picture, I want tot see it.

GrandMasterTerwynn · Post by **GrandMasterTerwynn** » 2006-12-01 12:52pm

Faram wrote:LIES, that cannot be true, the earth is 4231 yers old I read it in the bible!

And tobad they did not have a picture, I want tot see it.

Click on the link to the LiveScience.com article. There's a picture there.

Post by **Surlethe** » 2006-12-01 12:55pm

The scientists found a secret chamber behind the python carving. Worn areas indicate it's been used over the years.

"The shaman, who is still a very important person in San culture, could have kept himself hidden in that secret chamber," Coulson explained. "He would have had a good view of the inside of the cave while remaining hidden himself. When he spoke from his hiding place, it could have seemed as if the voice came from the snake itself. The shaman would have been able to control everything. It was perfect.”

The shaman could also have made himself disappear from the chamber by crawling out onto the hillside through a small shaft, the scientists found.

So not only has religion been around for 70,000 years, religious fraud has been around for 70,000 years. How awesome is that?

CaptainChewbacca wrote:Think about it; when it was carved, humans weren't the only intelligent life on earth.

What do you mean?

GrandMasterTerwynn · Post by **GrandMasterTerwynn** » 2006-12-01 12:58pm

Surlethe wrote:
The scientists found a secret chamber behind the python carving. Worn areas indicate it's been used over the years.

"The shaman, who is still a very important person in San culture, could have kept himself hidden in that secret chamber," Coulson explained. "He would have had a good view of the inside of the cave while remaining hidden himself. When he spoke from his hiding place, it could have seemed as if the voice came from the snake itself. The shaman would have been able to control everything. It was perfect.”

The shaman could also have made himself disappear from the chamber by crawling out onto the hillside through a small shaft, the scientists found.
So not only has religion been around for 70,000 years, religious fraud has been around for 70,000 years. How awesome is that?

CaptainChewbacca wrote:Think about it; when it was carved, humans weren't the only intelligent life on earth.
What do you mean?

During the time, there were at least three species of hominids still alive on the planet. One was Homo Sapiens. Homo Neanderthalesis lived in the Middle East and Europe, and there were some last hold-out populations of Homo Erectus alive in east Asia.

CaptainChewbacca · Post by **CaptainChewbacca** » 2006-12-01 01:09pm

Exactly. Its not just a religious icon from our past, its a religious icon from a whole other WORLD with entirely different structures and values.

Post by **Surlethe** » 2006-12-01 01:11pm

GrandMasterTerwynn wrote:During the time, there were at least three species of hominids still alive on the planet. One was Homo Sapiens. Homo Neanderthalesis lived in the Middle East and Europe, and there were some last hold-out populations of Homo Erectus alive in east Asia.

Ah, I see. One does not associate CaptainChewbacca with ... well, the only explanation for his words I could come up with was one involving interstellar aliens.

CaptainChewbacca · Post by **CaptainChewbacca** » 2006-12-01 01:27pm

Yeah, I meant hominid species, not humanoid ones.

Maybe I'm crazy, but I can't see the snake.

Big Orange · Post by **Big Orange** » 2006-12-01 01:28pm

GrandMasterTerwynn wrote: During the time, there were at least three species of hominids still alive on the planet. One was Homo Sapiens. Homo Neanderthalesis lived in the Middle East and Europe, and there were some last hold-out populations of Homo Erectus alive in east Asia.

Very early human barbarians are worshiping giant snake idols while doing battle with prehistoric subhumans? It's like something out of Conan the Barbarian...

Seggybop · Post by **Seggybop** » 2006-12-01 01:45pm

This makes me wonder if a fantasy-style story taking place 70,000 years ago would work well. Instead of the generic fake fantasy races of humans, elves, and dwarves, we could have the real ones: humans, neanderthals and homo erectuses (erecti?).

Setesh · Post by **Setesh** » 2006-12-01 02:44pm

CaptainChewbacca wrote:Yeah, I meant hominid species, not humanoid ones.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v503/ ... Python.jpg
Maybe I'm crazy, but I can't see the snake.

A case of bad angle I think, there are drawings of Pythons, giraffes, and elephants on the walls. In the local creation myths thoose are the three 'sacred animals'.

Though you know what the YEC twits will say:
a)Its satanic lies
b)Its atheist lies
c)dating system is faulty, since carbon dating isn't reliable all dating methods aren't either
d)God made it look that old to fool us

Post by **NecronLord** » 2006-12-01 04:48pm

Big Orange wrote:Very early human barbarians are worshiping giant snake idols while doing battle with prehistoric subhumans? It's like something out of Conan the Barbarian...

Didn't you know? Robert E. Howard wasn't a writer, he was a translator, he was just eccentric in the way he published. Conan was real. EDIT: Conan was real - reality is so awesome!

Patrick Degan · Post by **Patrick Degan** » 2006-12-01 04:50pm

A Canadian archeologist has discovered what's being hailed as the world's oldest known religious artifact: a six-metre-long, serpentine rock carving made 70,000 years ago by a prehistoric, python-worshipping people in what is now the African nation of Botswana.

Yes, but did they ever discover the Riddle of Steel?

Lord Zentei · Post by **Lord Zentei** » 2006-12-01 05:35pm

Seggybop wrote:This makes me wonder if a fantasy-style story taking place 70,000 years ago would work well. Instead of the generic fake fantasy races of humans, elves, and dwarves, we could have the real ones: humans, neanderthals and homo erectuses (erecti?).

It would, obviously, be an all-wilderness setting. It can be made to work (*), but its not everyone's cup of tea.

( * see ElfQuest, for instance - and even that had iron-using trolls, magic and ancient palaces in it, so it doesn't quite qualify)

CaptainChewbacca · Post by **CaptainChewbacca** » 2006-12-01 05:54pm

Seggybop wrote:This makes me wonder if a fantasy-style story taking place 70,000 years ago would work well. Instead of the generic fake fantasy races of humans, elves, and dwarves, we could have the real ones: humans, neanderthals and homo erectuses (erecti?).

The plural form is "Many homo erectus", like deer. Not only do we have those three, but there's still Homo Florensis if you want to play a tiny warrior-hominid inhabiting tropical jungles.

Jawawithagun · Post by **Jawawithagun** » 2006-12-01 10:10pm

"I'm sick and tired of these motherfucking snakes on this motherfucking rock!"

Sorry, somebody had to.

Cool finding anyway.

Alan Bolte · Post by **Alan Bolte** » 2006-12-02 12:02am

Did you guys miss the part where the snake carving is 6 meters long? Half the rock in that picture is snake!