Question for atheists: What happens when we die?

Rye · Post by **Rye** » 2006-12-02 11:07am

Shroom Man 777 wrote:Shit. Shit. Shit. Man, the knowledge that someday I'm gonna die sucks. Man

You can't change it, so don't give a shit about it, just live decently.

Post by **K. A. Pital** » 2006-12-02 11:34am

I'd prefer to live up to when advanced nanotech is possible and thus not die. But if we die, we decompose. Cryonics is possibly a way to prevent decomposition, but it is not known whether any information that was stored in the brain could be brought back by even the most advanced technology, after brain death.

I personally think that if I die and there is no way to combat this, my children and my ideas will live on, that's good enough for me.

But the ultimate goal is, through technicism, immortality. And no other options.

Mange · Post by **Mange** » 2006-12-02 11:46am

Jason wrote:I did a search for this type of topic, but couldn't find it. If there is one that I missed feel free to link to it and lock this.

What I'm curious about is what do atheists think happens when people die? Although I would consider any kind of afterlife to be contradictory to atheism, well, you really never know for sure and I try not to make assumptions about other people. This seemed like a good place to ask given the high percentage of atheists here.

So, what do you think happens when you die? Blink out of existence (I think this is basically what George H. Smith said in his books on atheism)? Something else (I'd really be most interested in hearing from anyone who thinks something else happens)?

This is not intended to be a challenge to atheists or to turn into a big atheism/theism debate, I'm just curious. Thanks.

Oblivion. Of course, there's a part of me that doesn't want to accept that there's an end for me as a thinking and existing being, but my rational self is much stronger than that. We live on through our legacies.

Flagg · Post by **Flagg** » 2006-12-02 12:01pm

I like to think that maybe in the last few seconds or so, you start hallucinating and your concept of time disappears so that you end up in some kind of unending coma-dream that lasts an eternity.
But, probably not.

Post by **Ghost Rider** » 2006-12-02 12:06pm

You die. And this is why you do your best to live your life decently and to the fullest you are able to. This is your one and only shot.

Cao Cao · Post by **Cao Cao** » 2006-12-02 01:15pm

I don't like to think about it.
I can't grasp the concept of the end of my existance, the end of thought, the end of my own perception.
I am the sum of my memories. All existance comes from each person's individual perspective. I don't understand how this can be lost. If I can't perceive it, how do I know I'm dead?
I can't reconcile this and it scares me shitless. I hate thinking about it.

darthbob88 · Post by **darthbob88** » 2006-12-02 01:24pm

This worthless carcass of bones, fat, and protein, will become worm food. But, so long as one of my kin defends the homestead, and so long as one man continues my cause, I will never die.

Jon · Post by **Jon** » 2006-12-02 01:27pm

It doesn't bother me to think about it either. We revert to non-existence, something we were before we were born. That we will die does suck, but indeed it happens to everyone and once it has happened we'll have no concept of it anyway. I don't need to believe there's anything after death because I don't believe there's any divine purpose to our being here in the first place. We just are, and might as well make the most of it while we can.

General Zod · Post by **General Zod** » 2006-12-02 01:49pm

Admiral Valdemar wrote:
Big Orange wrote:
I'm more of an agnostic, but I don't really believe in the Abrahamic's idea of an Afterlive.
I'll spare you my usual rant against agnosticism, since myself and others have gone on about it plenty of times before. Instead, I'll ask why you feel compelled to believe in the somewhat more appealing, yet no more plausible idea of reincarnation. So why do you? From my experiences with Buddhism, it takes some pretty good living to attain a higher state of being, so more than likely, most people will become slugs or something.

Not everyone can be reincarnated as a cat.

Anyway, it's all superfluous talk. The engrams that make you are in a very much physical domain that once it loses biochemical activity, is prey to entropy and life like everything else.

Actually, just as an aside everyone gets reincarnated in Buddhism, with your actions in one life determining your station in the next. With Nirvana being the ultimate goal. (With all descriptions of it, it's pretty much similar to oblivion and means you're kicked out of the reincarnation cycle.)

Dooey Jo · Post by **Dooey Jo** » 2006-12-02 02:26pm

It's hard to tell what happens when you die, unless you die because your head was crushed; then it's all over very quickly. It would be interesting to see some MRI scans or something of people dying. I can imagine your level of awareness would gradually decrease so you don't really notice when your organs shut down, but on the other hand it could be the other way around; the brain notices the lungs and heart are giving up, and kicks into high gear to find out what going on, meaning you'll have to enjoy every last frightening moment of it... Hopefully not though, but I guess it would also depend on the manner in which you die.

After that, it's game over and you're all out of coins. Maybe it would be nice with some afterlife of perpetual happiness, but there is absolutely nothing but some people's superstitions to suggest there actually is, so I think one should try to be as happy as possible while one is still alive.

Darth Raptor · Post by **Darth Raptor** » 2006-12-02 02:50pm

Shroom Man 777 wrote:Shit. Shit. Shit. Man, the knowledge that someday I'm gonna die sucks. Man

I'm with Comrade Bush on this one. Not all of us plan on dying. Stay tuned for Raptor 2.0: The Convincing Simulation.

The Grim Squeaker · Post by **The Grim Squeaker** » 2006-12-02 03:07pm

It's threatening to discover that others plan to imitate my plan of freezing or cloning myself, then transplanting my brain into the clone or a Cyborg body (After being unfrozen depending on the technology available at the time).
Bow to my eternal well invested, above inflation rates, economical power! (And Cyborg fist or genetically enhanced ass).

Apart from that we end upon Death, like going to sleep peacefully and never waking up.
In many ways its preferable to life, after all theres no bad and without wrong would it not be good even with the absence of anything? Seriously though it ends (Though I'd like to imagine the possibility of reincarnation as I did many years ago, Give me the form of an Eagle or Dolphin and I'll be happy

).

Arthur_Tuxedo · Post by **Arthur_Tuxedo** » 2006-12-02 03:50pm

Darth Raptor wrote:
Shroom Man 777 wrote:Shit. Shit. Shit. Man, the knowledge that someday I'm gonna die sucks. Man
I'm with Comrade Bush on this one. Not all of us plan on dying. Stay tuned for Raptor 2.0: The Convincing Simulation.

Well, unless you believe in a soul, downloading your brain to a digital facsimile would still mean that you're dead. Your consciousness still ends when your brain dies, there's just a digital copy that thinks exactly like you. The only way to truly extend life for centuries or millenia is to repair damage to the brain, and either repair / replace other organs or have the brain controlling a robot body that's close enough to human to fool it. The latter might be better for not getting killed (more durable), but could require ridiculously advanced technology in order for the brain to think it's controlling a real human body and not freak out.

Sean Howard · Post by **Sean Howard** » 2006-12-02 04:58pm

Arthur_Tuxedo wrote: Well, unless you believe in a soul, downloading your brain to a digital facsimile would still mean that you're dead. Your consciousness still ends when your brain dies, there's just a digital copy that thinks exactly like you. The only way to truly extend life for centuries or millenia is to repair damage to the brain, and either repair / replace other organs or have the brain controlling a robot body that's close enough to human to fool it. The latter might be better for not getting killed (more durable), but could require ridiculously advanced technology in order for the brain to think it's controlling a real human body and not freak out.

What would happen if you put your brain into a robot body, then the body starts gradually replacing your neurons with robot ones one by one as they die until the entire brain is electronic? Would it still be your consciousness at the end?

Molyneux · Post by **Molyneux** » 2006-12-02 05:04pm

Sean Howard wrote:
Arthur_Tuxedo wrote: Well, unless you believe in a soul, downloading your brain to a digital facsimile would still mean that you're dead. Your consciousness still ends when your brain dies, there's just a digital copy that thinks exactly like you. The only way to truly extend life for centuries or millenia is to repair damage to the brain, and either repair / replace other organs or have the brain controlling a robot body that's close enough to human to fool it. The latter might be better for not getting killed (more durable), but could require ridiculously advanced technology in order for the brain to think it's controlling a real human body and not freak out.
What would happen if you put your brain into a robot body, then the body starts gradually replacing your neurons with robot ones one by one as they die until the entire brain is electronic? Would it still be your consciousness at the end?

The smart money's on 'yes', as long as consciousness is continuous...but that would be insanely difficult.

wolveraptor · Post by **wolveraptor** » 2006-12-02 06:39pm

Haven't they already cryonically frozen dogs for 12 hours? The 6 that didn't have operations performed on them while they were iced survived with no repercussions. If they can manage that, I'm confident that they'll be able to freeze me within the next 40 years.

Guardsman Bass · Post by **Guardsman Bass** » 2006-12-02 06:50pm

You simply cease to exist. Although this is not necessarily problematic, since you won't be aware that you cease to exist. It's kind of hard to wrap your head around that.

My main grief is that I won't be able to see what goes on in the future, or stand upon the planet of an alien star, or stuff like that- unless we get some pretty funky life extension. It's a real pity you can't simply go away, come back, and go away again to make observations once in a while throughout the future up until the point that the universe dies a heat death.

Fire Fly · Post by **Fire Fly** » 2006-12-02 08:08pm

In a way, being an atheist is depressing. We know that when we die, we will simply cease to exist in any metaphysical form. But in a way, I think atheists also appreciate life more than others, simply because when it ends, it ends. That's why I really want my life to have meaning so than when I am no more, others will remember me; that's the only way I will continue to live on. That's why there's religion, because people don't like that aspect of death.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2006-12-02 08:14pm

It's hilarious watching people flail about for immortality.

Why do people describe death like 'going to sleep'? It's nothing of the sort: that's like saying changing the channel is like turning the television off. Oblivion isn't something I can easily imagine, but it's sure not going to be snuggling up and drifting off.

Superman · Post by **Superman** » 2006-12-02 08:42pm

I think that just asking this question really shows a big part of what their religion is about. No healthy person wants to die, so that's why we make the most of what we have while we're here. Almost every form of life is biologically programmed to survive, right? So what happens when you mix that survival instinct with a brain capable of knowing that death is inevitable, and that there's NOTHING anyone can do about it? It comes up with a control mechanism (just like it does for everything else). It believes in a fairy tale that says you can live forever.

By the way, how egotistical is it to believe that you have a way of achieving immortality? Isn't that kinda like the ultimate in ego fulfillment?

Cao Cao · Post by **Cao Cao** » 2006-12-02 09:31pm

I'm sure the concept of an afterlife started with people who just couldn't get around the idea of becoming nothing.
It's extremely hard to accept; it's impossible to imagine becoming nothing.
When I think about it, it's like my brain panics. I think maybe there is an afterlife. Maybe my conciousness will live on as part of the universe. Maybe the moment I die, the real me steps out of the VR simulation. Game over. Maybe it'll be different for me because I'm me and there cannot be anything without me.

But it's all fantasy - the product of a sapient mind unable to accept it's role in nature. Grow, breed, die, make way for the next generation. In that respect I resent nature and evolution. Because it's a system that has no concern for intelligence and self-awareness. In many ways, religion was created to shield us from how truly small we are.

mr friendly guy · Post by **mr friendly guy** » 2006-12-02 10:10pm

What happens when I die.

I regenerate. Most likely into Peter Davison.

Kudos to those who get the reference.

But seriously, this question is stupid. When other people die, thats end. Its all she wrote. Kudos. The end. How hard can that concept be?

Pick · Post by **Pick** » 2006-12-02 10:12pm

Show's over. That's it, really.

Cao Cao · Post by **Cao Cao** » 2006-12-02 10:24pm

mr friendly guy wrote:But seriously, this question is stupid. When other people die, thats end. Its all she wrote. Kudos. The end. How hard can that concept be?

It's not the concept of "the end" that's hard.. it's what comes after.
Now I'm sure everyone will say "nothing" or "oblivion". But what *is* nothing or oblivion? It's nothing. But you will not know you are in nothing because you are nothing and.. well. See what I mean? That's what I can't grasp.

Post by **Simplicius** » 2006-12-02 10:56pm

I suppose this is a related question - can anyone think of a religion, offhand, that doesn't involve some kind of postmortem continuation of life, be it in an afterworld or a return to this one?

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Question for atheists: What happens when we die?

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