Need help with Darkstar's follower!

[Ritterin Sophia]

My bad then, I just thought it'd be more meaningful if parts of the rebuttle weren't just copy-paste.

[MagnusTheReD]

If he does start to pull out the absolutely retarded "chain-reaction" bullshit, be sure to keep the focus on the big picture. It's easy to get lost in the subtleties of his convoluted argument, and forget that MCR explains precisely nothing, whereas DET actually explains everything that happens except the preposterous relativistic shockwave in the SE movies.

I will, thanks!

EDIT: This is assuming you create your own arguments instead of copy-pasting what you see here.

I concede, it was the easy thing to do.
I'll be sure to be more patient next time.

[Darth Wong]

Darkstar has the unique honour of being the only Trekkie I've ever heard of who was actually told he was wrong about a Star Trek episode by the writer of the episode himself, after which he accused the writer of dishonesty. It still boggles the mind that anyone could take him seriously.

[MagnusTheReD]

Darkstar has the unique honour of being the only Trekkie I've ever heard of who was actually told he was wrong about a Star Trek episode by the writer of the episode himself, after which he accused the writer of dishonesty. It still boggles the mind that anyone could take him seriously.

I'm sure that if this guy would've been aware of that he wouldn't be so prone to use his arguments.
That's what I hope at least...

[Darth Servo]

If the tard tries to quote Darkstar's idiocy about Stormtrooper armor not being sealed, show him this

I remember a scene from this Clone Wars cartoon:

But he's a Mindless Scooter Cockgoblin and therefore might start throwing out everything but the movies. With that picture, its highest canon that not even Scooter can deny...well, Scooter probably will deny it anyway. He's just THAT delusional.

A regiment of Clonetroopers abandoning a dying Venator by leaping across space towards an enemy vessel and take over it with the help of the Jedi master who was leading them. Battle of Coruscat I think.
I think this is conclusive enough evidence!

Oh crap. Don't even tell me the Clone Wars were copying Star Trek Nemesis.

[MagnusTheReD]

Don't even tell me the Clone Wars were copying Star Trek Nemesis.

No, man! Clone Wars version looks much more impressive!
The Jedi master gathering his me like some kind of medieval Viking leader, and the hundreds of soldiers in white armor flying across space looked almost graceful!

[Darth Servo]

Darkstar has the unique honour of being the only Trekkie I've ever heard of who was actually told he was wrong about a Star Trek episode by the writer of the episode himself, after which he accused the writer of dishonesty. It still boggles the mind that anyone could take him seriously.

I'm sure that if this guy would've been aware of that he wouldn't be so prone to use his arguments.
That's what I hope at least...

Read the whole story. RSA went to both ST.com and SW.com and VIPs from BOTH corporations told him he was flat-out wrong about his "Canon Policy"

[Batman]

While I think he's talking about ragoonwhatever, not RSA himself, I'm not sure the conclusion would be much different.

[Darth Servo]

While I think he's talking about ragoonwhatever, not RSA himself, I'm not sure the conclusion would be much different.

Still no reason not to...educate...his sparing partner on just how deep the stupidity goes with RSA.

[OmegaGuy]

"Contradicting a high example with a low one"- classic mentality of the unscientific idiot. It's not as if you're supposed to explain both, right? Oh no, pick one of them and run with it!

This brings up something I've been wondering about for a while: What do you do when you're attempting to analyze something that is full of high,low,medium, etc. examples all contradicting each other with no plausible way to rationalize them? Do you just give up and say it's impossible to analyze?

[Ghost Rider]

"Contradicting a high example with a low one"- classic mentality of the unscientific idiot. It's not as if you're supposed to explain both, right? Oh no, pick one of them and run with it!

This brings up something I've been wondering about for a while: What do you do when you're attempting to analyze something that is full of high,low,medium, etc. examples all contradicting each other with no plausible way to rationalize them? Do you just give up and say it's impossible to analyze?

You look at the circumstances. In mediums such as comics where this happens there is never a case where the Highs, Mediums and Lows are exactly the same cicrumstances. There is always some enviromental change, be it internal or external.

[harbringer]

This isnt conclusive proof but a lot of gun positions in star wars designed for the stormtroopers/clone troopers on naval ships are actually open to space you see it briefly in ROTS during the coruscant battle (complete with return fire destroying the gun which may prove it was un sheilded.

[Surlethe]

This brings up something I've been wondering about for a while: What do you do when you're attempting to analyze something that is full of high,low,medium, etc. examples all contradicting each other with no plausible way to rationalize them? Do you just give up and say it's impossible to analyze?

I do believe you're missing the point: when you're analyzing something full of a range of examples, you're still supposed to explain them all with some sort of mechanism.

To illustrate, this is like saying in real life while you're looking at various roads of a city, "Well, here the cars are going 20 mph; here, 30 mph; here, 45 mph; and on the onramp to the interstate, they accelerate up to 70. How am I supposed to explain them all?" You can't just throw out everything less than 70 and say, "Cars always go 70 mph", or run with 20 and say, "How could a car go 70 when they all go 20?" Instead, you search for some mechanism to explain all of the observations.

In the analogy above, it's obviously variable engines in the cars. For Star Wars weapons, we tend to talk about variable outputs; for example, this is how Slave One's weapons can just knock Obi-Wan back, and then turn around and fragment asteroids. Note that the proposed mechanism actually explains all of the observations, instead of only some of them. Problems arise when you have the mentality of idiots like Darkstar or that Sarlis moron, who use one set of observations at the expense of others -- (apparently) slow hyperdrive speeds in AOTC to contradict the blindingly fast speeds we see in ROTS and ANH, e.g., or one shot of the Death Star II to scale it, discarding other shots easier to scale by.

When you have observations that actually contradict each other (this is probably rarer than you suspect; it's difficult to show that there definitely does not exist a rationalization), then you have to throw one out in favor of another. For example, the absurd EU claim that "the Executor nearly bankrupted the Empire" has been largely discredited, since the second Death Star is eight or nine orders of magnitude more massive, and was constructed in absolute secrecy. Even so, it's still rationalizable: you can say, for example, that the book is New Republic propaganda.

[Lord Poe]

Looks like Marnus' playmate has run over to Darkstar's latest fan forum for help of his own:

+http://www.starfleetjedi.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=178

[MagnusTheReD]

Looks like Magnus' playmate has run over to Darkstar's latest fan forum for help of his own:

+http://www.starfleetjedi.net/forum/viewtopic.php?t=178

Thank's Mr. Poe!
This is an extremely good thing as now I can know his next move.
I'm looking at his latest piece of crap right now, and what do you know... it is full of said crap!
I'll be posting it shortly.

[Darth Wong]

"Contradicting a high example with a low one"- classic mentality of the unscientific idiot. It's not as if you're supposed to explain both, right? Oh no, pick one of them and run with it!

This brings up something I've been wondering about for a while: What do you do when you're attempting to analyze something that is full of high,low,medium, etc. examples all contradicting each other with no plausible way to rationalize them? Do you just give up and say it's impossible to analyze?

It's possible for a piece of fiction to be so inconsistent that you can't make heads or tails of it no matter how hard you try. In this case one might either declare that the fiction is of such poor quality that it can't be objectively analyzed at all (in which case "vs" conclusions are impossible), or one might declare that one of the incidents must be an outlier. Of course, declaring something an outlier is not something that one should do lightly; if one starts declaring things to be "outliers" willy-nilly, then one is just opening the door to let people throw out anything that offends them. There have to be criteria similar to what you see in real-life science, such as non-repeatability (ie- it happens once and never gets repeated or referenced again).

However, in most cases where people claim that you can't rationalize things, they're just not trying. It's called the "failure of imagination" fallacy, and it underlies most religious arguments against science (to wit, they claim that there are things which science cannot explain, even if it can, and then declare that the explanation is God, even though this explanation itself does not actually explain anything). Darkstar's famous MCR is a perfect example of this pseudo-logic.

[MagnusTheReD]

For some reason he divided his reply into three parts, mere minutes between the first and the second, several hours between the second ans the third.
Here they are:

You're obviously from SDN. No point. No matter what evidence I provide, you will merely shout it down and scream "BUT ICS IS CANON!"

Furthermore, Lucas (and others) have specifically said that there are two continuities: the movies/novelizations and movies + the EU.

Thus, you essentially have two different canons. Which one takes precedence? The movie-only one, obviously.



Regardless, I would tell YOU to stay away from SDN and Wong. He picks and chooses which novels to take away from and other EU sources. HE also insults his opponents constantly and assumes perfect competence on the part of the Empire, while assuming that the FEderation is incredibly incompetent.

If you examine the EU and compare it to the ICS, then most (if not all) EU canon contradicts the ICS. For example, the X-Wing books, Zahn's books and multiple others have capital ships engaging NOT at 'light-hour' ranges, but in the 100s of kilometers range. Federation ships have been seen to successfully engage and destroy targets at 200-300,000 kilometers.

Furthermore, if the turbolaser blasts actually exchanged in the AoTC battle were actually in the gigaton range, the hit that dismounted that gun would've created an explosion of hiroshima proportions. You can say "They weren't full power!" But why not? Why wouldn't they be exchanging full power blasts when engaged in combat?

You also have no evidence for the ESB figures being merely LTL or MTL.

In addition, the X-WIng books also put the fighter weapons energy output at 'kilojoules' (read it some time) and the proton torpedoes are not the incredibly high yield weapons they are said to be in the ICS. They have shrapnel.


Evidence of the mass charge? Virtually the only thing we see them use. And evidence they would actually hurt the armor? FOr god's sake! The armor can barely stop blasters! Phasers put out mejajoules of energy, enough to vaporize metal, human beings, etc.

Furthermore, there is no evidence of widespread chemical warfare. Daala does use nerve gas to kill people in 'Darksaber', but it has never been seen to be used by the Empire in widespread use.

The Emperor's 'best troops' also get their asses handed to them by Ewoks. 'Nuff said.

Furthermore, there are multiple references to using the wide setting on kill (need to look these up).

The second one:

Furthermore, there is no evidence that they cross their entire galaxy in 'days'. Months maybe, but not days.

And you can't downscale from the Death Star! The superlaser ISN'T a giant turbolaser! If you look at the new DVD versions (which are canon) it starts a chain reaction and is not DET.

Why would you even need tracers if your weapons move at lightspeed anyway? There is no evidence to back up light speed weapons. If they actually were, the Death Star would have shot down the incoming rebel fighters as soon as they rounded Yavin. (need I remind you that the TLs on the DS were capital ship level?)

Unfortunately, the ONLY thing that supports the 200 gigaton turbolaser theory is the ICS. Nothing else in the EU, the movies or the novelizations supports that.

The third one:

It has been brought to my attention that you ran for backup for the fellows at SDN. And here I thought we were having a one-on-one debate...

I don't see any problem with this, even I can take on such a flimsy rebuttal- provided there is no one!

[Ghost Rider]

Because I'm bored.

You're obviously from SDN. No point. No matter what evidence I provide, you will merely shout it down and scream "BUT ICS IS CANON!"

Burden of proof to show otherwise, on both counts. One to show SDN is biased, two to demonstrate the ICS is not canon.

Furthermore, Lucas (and others) have specifically said that there are two continuities: the movies/novelizations and movies + the EU.

Distortion.

Lucas himself claimed the EU intrudes upon the movie and that it tell of the SW universe other then the movies.

Thus, you essentially have two different canons. Which one takes precedence? The movie-only one, obviously.

Distortion. The movies take precendence in light of contraditions of terms.

Regardless, I would tell YOU to stay away from SDN and Wong. He picks and chooses which novels to take away from and other EU sources. HE also insults his opponents constantly and assumes perfect competence on the part of the Empire, while assuming that the FEderation is incredibly incompetent.

Ad hominem. He purposefully attacks Wong without demonstrating any relevant points to demonstrating bias or dishonesty.

If you examine the EU and compare it to the ICS, then most (if not all) EU canon contradicts the ICS. For example, the X-Wing books, Zahn's books and multiple others have capital ships engaging NOT at 'light-hour' ranges, but in the 100s of kilometers range. Federation ships have been seen to successfully engage and destroy targets at 200-300,000 kilometers.

The ICS takes it's values from the movies. Thus the canoncity is higher given the source.

The Federation has demonstrated I believe only ONCE to engage at 300K and I believe that was dialogue. Visuals paint a far lesser range.

Furthermore, if the turbolaser blasts actually exchanged in the AoTC battle were actually in the gigaton range, the hit that dismounted that gun would've created an explosion of hiroshima proportions. You can say "They weren't full power!" But why not? Why wouldn't they be exchanging full power blasts when engaged in combat?

1. Variable power levels. This has been verifed in canon by General Veers.

2. Hiroshima is red herring given both what it was(a bomb) and the power involved.

3. Engaging in combat with full power is a double edged sword, given the same could be said for Trek. As well as it is shown that they have power variables for the same reason we have them in real life.

You also have no evidence for the ESB figures being merely LTL or MTL.

Onus on him to provide the fact that blast was from a HTL as per his implication.

That and there is proof it came from an LTL given the placement of the shot as well as the model of the ISD used.

In addition, the X-WIng books also put the fighter weapons energy output at 'kilojoules' (read it some time) and the proton torpedoes are not the incredibly high yield weapons they are said to be in the ICS. They have shrapnel.

Movie overrides this by providing near Kiloton level blast with the Death Star. Maybe he should watch it sometime.

Evidence of the mass charge? Virtually the only thing we see them use. And evidence they would actually hurt the armor? FOr god's sake! The armor can barely stop blasters! Phasers put out mejajoules of energy, enough to vaporize metal, human beings, etc.

Onus to demonstrate that Phaser can reach Megajoules level(and Reed in Enterprise counting upwards counts as much as zilch given the visuals do not match the scene) and do the effects he claims. Simple break down is not vaporization.

Other then that, red herring....again.

Furthermore, there is no evidence of widespread chemical warfare. Daala does use nerve gas to kill people in 'Darksaber', but it has never been seen to be used by the Empire in widespread use.

Once again....poor leap of logic. If a Imperial Admiral has access to an Imperial weapon, it is up to him to show that the Imperial Army/Navy did not use this Imperial weapon.

The Emperor's 'best troops' also get their asses handed to them by Ewoks. 'Nuff said.

You mean when they were routing the Ewoks?

Strange, it took Chewbacca to commandeer a AT-ST to turn the tide.

Furthermore, there are multiple references to using the wide setting on kill (need to look these up).

No, there is not. Blatant lie and Burden of proof for him to demonstrate otherwise.

Furthermore, there is no evidence that they cross their entire galaxy in 'days'. Months maybe, but not days.

Yes, there is. If he wants to use the EU...they demonstrate Galaxy jumping easily.

The movies demonstrate even faster.

Lie again.

And you can't downscale from the Death Star! The superlaser ISN'T a giant turbolaser! If you look at the new DVD versions (which are canon) it starts a chain reaction and is not DET.

Ah, the chain reaction. Take Science again.

A chain reaction event would demonstrate a series of reactions as per the point of a chain reaction.

An energy dump would not.

Why would you even need tracers if your weapons move at lightspeed anyway? There is no evidence to back up light speed weapons. If they actually were, the Death Star would have shot down the incoming rebel fighters as soon as they rounded Yavin. (need I remind you that the TLs on the DS were capital ship level?)

Strange how he avoid the point that one officer claimed why they couldn't shoot fighters down.

And he's using EU again to justify his response to movie canon.

Unfortunately, the ONLY thing that supports the 200 gigaton turbolaser theory is the ICS. Nothing else in the EU, the movies or the novelizations supports that.

The RoTJ battle demonstrates easily GT level blasts on ISD.

It has been brought to my attention that you ran for backup for the fellows at SDN. And here I thought we were having a one-on-one debate...

Then don't run to Darkstar's site.

All in all....only continue because it's amusing you. He's an idiot and his points are either outright lies or gross exagerrations. His proof is flimsy and cherry picked and oft times he cannot even keep his internal logic straight.

[MagnusTheReD]

Thanks for the response!

All in all....only continue because it's amusing you. He's an idiot and his points are either outright lies or gross exagerrations. His proof is flimsy and cherry picked and oft times he cannot even keep his internal logic straight.

I'm am!
This guy is amusing, and his typo's in the recent reply show that he was somewhat upset!

But can you clarify a point of yours to me, please?

The RoTJ battle demonstrates easily GT level blasts on ISD.

Can you please specify where do we see it?

[MagnusTheReD]

Aye, here's my rebuttal (his text is in bold now):

I'll be replying to this in a single thread in order to avoid the mess which the DA.com public boards are:

"You're obviously from SDN. No point. No matter what evidence I provide, you will merely shout it down and scream "BUT ICS IS CANON!""
Because ICS IS canon.
And until you provide us with some valid reasoning to why shouldn't we take it as total canon, you will accepts LucasArts official canon and continuity policy!

"Furthermore, Lucas (and others)"
Others like who?

"have specifically said that there are two continuities: the movies/novelizations and movies + the EU. "
No, he just said that they are parallel, means they exist in the same universe, but never interact! They just deal with different stories and characters, that's it!
I doesn't mean they occur in different universes!

"Thus, you essentially have two different canons."
No you don't! Or are you going to argue with LucasArts official canon policy, which clearly states that EU IS CANON!

"Which one takes precedence? The movie-only one, obviously."
Why, based on what? On Dorkstarts homegrown canon policy?!
As I said before, in the past he was confronted by LucasArts officials telling his his interpretation of canon is wrong!
So Dorkstar just accused him in dishonesty, and have never taken any measures to correct his mistakes!

"Regardless, I would tell YOU to stay away from SDN and Wong."
Why? Unlike Dorkstar's shitty, SW vs ST obsessed site, SD.net got more to it than just sci-fi! It got discussion boards for politics, news, and all other thing from... you know, REAL LIFE! Does st-vs-sw.net got anything to improve your further growth as a person?

"He picks and chooses which novels to take away from and other EU sources."
Any examples to this alleged bias?

"HE also insults his opponents constantly..."
So? Why shouldn't he insult someone if the prick haven't even bothered to THINK while writing his brain dead essay?

"...and assumes perfect competence on the part of the Empire, while assuming that the Federation is incredibly incompetent."
Again, any examples? IIRC, when he does, he usually provides evidence and some strong reasoning to his assumptions.

"If you examine the EU and compare it to the ICS, then most (if not all) EU canon contradicts the ICS."
Yet again, evidence? Examples? Elaborate please...
And BTW, ICS takes much of it's info DIRECTLY from the movies- higher canon!

"For example, the X-Wing books, Zahn's books and multiple others have capital ships engaging NOT at 'light-hour' ranges, but in the 100s of kilometers range."
You just fail to comprehend that it does not imply that any other references about range are false! Exception does not override the rule!
It doesn't mean that if they would like to confront on greater ranges, they couldn't, 100s kilometers is just a lower limit- we know that they can engage over such distances, but have no reason to think that it's their limit.
Plus, the lighthours range is only for stationary or unaware targets- if the ship knows you're shooting at it, it can just dodge the bolt!

"Federation ships have been seen to successfully engage and destroy targets at 200-300,000 kilometers."
IIRC, it happened only once, in a dialogue, and I have to ask you whether the target was stationary or unaware of the attack. Because it's not something to be proud of when you hit a stationary target from that distance!
The rule is that ST ships engage each other from ranges not exceeding several kilometers, and still manage to miss!

"Furthermore, if the turbolaser blasts actually exchanged in the AoTC battle were actually in the gigaton range, the hit that dismounted that gun would've created an explosion of Hiroshima proportions."
As I have pointed out before, SW weapon yields are variable, just like ST weapons- what reason did they have to use it on full power?
And you forget that TL's, just like photorps, are NOT shaped charges!
They cause spherical damage, thus, if the firing ship is positioned too close to it's target, it will to get hit by the shot. Further, I will direct you to this pic: [link]

"You can say "They weren't full power!" But why not? Why wouldn't they be exchanging full power blasts when engaged in combat?"
I'm not sure what the hell are you talking about.
There was no capship fire exchanges in AoTC!

"You also have no evidence for the ESB figures being merely LTL or MTL."
I have, and if you would've actually watched the movie, you wouldn't say such dumb thing making yourself look like an idiot.
We know that those were LTL's because of the the arc on which the ISD was facing the asteroids- there is no way it could've used the HTL's from that angle!

"In addition, the X-WIng books also put the fighter weapons energy output at 'kilojoules'..."
Overridden by movies with kiloton blasts over the DS.

"...and the proton torpedoes are not the incredibly high yield weapons they are said to be in the ICS. They have shrapnel."
This "Broken Record" fallacy of yours is getting really tiresome.
I have already pointed out that according the protorp's yield is depended solely on the warhead.

"Virtually the only thing we see them use."
No they don't. They weren't charging on Kashyyyk, they weren't charging on Utapau, and they weren't charing on multiple EU engagements.
Prove me where WERE they mass-chargin.

"The armor can barely stop blasters!"
Blasters are powerful DET weapons, DC-15 rifle have maximum power of 8MJ per shot- that's A LOT! Phasers on the other hand are chain reaction weapons- they have never been witnessed to cause any significant damage to metals, let alone 'vaporising' any! Prove that phasers can actually penetrate Clone/Stormtrooper's armor.

"Phasers put out mejajoules of energy, enough to vaporize metal, human beings, etc."
False on all three points- prove that phasers output MJ's of energy, show when we saw them "vaporising" metal an humans.

"Furthermore, there is no evidence of widespread chemical warfare. Daala does use nerve gas to kill people in 'Darksaber', but it has never been seen to be used by the Empire in widespread use."
Again, just because they didn't see fit to use it at any point doesn't mean they don't have the capability! Many countries in our world have NBC warfare capabilities, yet they don't use it in every second engagement- does this mean they don't have the capability?
Furthermore, in "Mandalorian Armor", prince Xizor point's out that Darth Vader ordered to destroy his homeworld due to possible contamination by a biologocal weapon that was researched there.

"The Emperor's 'best troops' also get their asses handed to them by Ewoks. 'Nuff said."
Oh yeah, because combat in jungle against the native specie which heavily outnumbers you is such an arbitrary affair!
Just remember that according to the novelization, Stromies were basically slathering Ewoks by the hundreds until Chewbacca took over that AT-ST!

"Furthermore, there are multiple references to using the wide setting on kill"
Blatant lie. Wide setting, even on stun, was used only a few time during the whole ST, it was never used on hight settings.

"Furthermore, there is no evidence that they cross their entire galaxy in 'days'. Months maybe, but not days."
Another lie.
Darht Maul travaled from Coruscant to Tatooine.

"And you can't downscale from the Death Star! The superlaser ISN'T a giant turbolaser! If you look at the new DVD versions (which are canon) it starts a chain reaction and is not DET."
Further lies.
A chain reaction event would demonstrate a series of reactions as per the point of a chain reaction. Show me those reactions, would you?
Besides, we can observe weapons similar to the superlaser just smaller scale, mounted on LAAT gunships and SPHA-T self propelled artillery- they both are DET weapons.

"Why would you even need tracers if your weapons move at lightspeed anyway? There is no evidence to back up light speed weapons."
Nowhere have I implied that TL's travel at c. TL's aren't lasers, they don't travel at c.
This is direct observation of filmed material - that's what we see in the movies- why do they need it? Don't know.

"If they actually were, the Death Star would have shot down the incoming rebel fighters as soon as they rounded Yavin. (need I remind you that the TLs on the DS were capital ship level?)"
Are you a moron or something?!
I have specifically pointed out for you that DS TL's couldn't hit starfighters because they were anti-capship weapons! That's the reason they can't hit starfighters- they aren't designed for it!
And what do you do? Come here and claim that because theTL's on the DS were anti-capships they are somehow supposed to hit starfighters!
Your ignorance of anything military is just staggering.

"Unfortunately, the ONLY thing that supports the 200 gigaton turbolaser theory is the ICS. Nothing else in the EU, the movies or the novelizations supports that."
Shameless, blatant lie.
RotJ supports high GT level, every second novel supports high GT levels, what further evidence do you need?

"It has been brought to my attention that you ran for backup for the fellows at SDN. And here I thought we were having a one-on-one debate..."
It has been brought to my attention that you ran for backup for the fellows at [link] And here I thought we were having a one-on-one debate...

I can't believe how hypocritical you are!
You dare to condemn me for going to SD.net after you, yourself, basically mass-quoted Dorkstar's arguments without even understanding them?!
Next time don't run to Dorkstar's site!

My thanks to Darth Servo, Batman, Ghost Rider and Mr. Poe!
You've bee a lot of help to me- thanks!

[Batman]

Actually TLs DO appear to be lightspeed weapons. Their tracers are STL.
"Why would you even need tracers if your weapons move at lightspeed anyway?"
What the hell kind of argument is that? What has the speed of the projectile got to do with wether or not tracers are useful? Tracers let you see wether or not your shot was on target in the first place and if not aid you in correcting for that. Wether you miss at a furlong per fortnight or c is irrelevant if you can't tell wether you missed or not, in which tracers can be quite useful (what use tracers would be to a society with Wars sensors is another matter, but we know for a fact they use'em, so there).

[Aaron]

I would suspect that the tubolaser tracers are there for when jamming is an issue in battle. It may not be readily apparent when a round hits the target without them. We know that they have jamming so heavy that it affects the ability of starfighters to manouver, it's not impossible that they could render your ability to tell if you scored a hit useless. Plus if your targeting sensors are knocked offline during a battle you can point the weapon in the direction of the target and fire off a round and correct your fire based off the tracers position. Basically the same thing we do today with real weapons.

[Isolder74]

I figure tracers are used because they are cheap and since they make use of the mark one eyeball they give you the ability to keep firing if your fancy sensors fail.

[Pint0 Xtreme]

His "ships travel in months" argument is so stupidly humorous. So does that mean that Darth Vader was searching the area for the Millenium Falcon for months before he ordered his fleet to disperse? Or does that mean that while Padme was racing to Mustafar, Darth Vader was just sitting there for months watching the corpses deteriorating before informing Palpatine that the separatist leaders were dead? You should inform your idiot Trekkie that Star Wars ships travel the galaxy in hours, not days and certainly not months. Of course, using the examples above would imply he's actually watched the movies with sufficient analysis to remember those events, which I doubt he has considering he thinks there were capital ship engagements in AoTC.

[MagnusTheReD]

His "ships travel in months" argument is so stupidly humorous. So does that mean that Darth Vader was searching the area for the Millenium Falcon for months before he ordered his fleet to disperse? Or does that mean that while Padme was racing to Mustafar, Darth Vader was just sitting there for months watching the corpses deteriorating before informing Palpatine that the separatist leaders were dead? You should inform your idiot Trekkie that Star Wars ships travel the galaxy in hours, not days and certainly not months. Of course, using the examples above would imply he's actually watched the movies with sufficient analysis to remember those events,

I'm starting to doubt he watched any of the movies.
He don't even know the basic stuff!

which I doubt he has considering he thinks there were capital ship engagements in AoTC.

It's this or he just implies the Acclamators should've used their HTL's to clear out that arena! Together with all the jedi masters...