I found this offa a website that has some good software tips and source code. Unfortunately the guy who runs it claims to be some guy educated in the world and believes all this new world order bs and how the gov'ts of the world are trying to control us blah blah blah. Anyhoo, here is a clip he posted about "free" energy. Here is there website.
Now I have never taken physics, nor am I any kind of science major, but when you start spewing bs about "defying the law of conservation of energy" I just have to say
Y'know, if these people are really serious about only seeking scientific validation for their technology, why not release the specification of their machine, so that it can be built independently by various scientists and verified that it does indeed work? Or doesn't work, as the case is probably?
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Wyrm wrote:Y'know, if these people are really serious about only seeking scientific validation for their technology, why not release the specification of their machine, so that it can be built independently by various scientists and verified that it does indeed work? Or doesn't work, as the case is probably?
Theft of the technology if it actually worked? Theoritically speaking, if you did have this technology, you'd be a complete moron to think there isn't going to be some major players trying to steal the technology from you or suppress it's existence.
Wyrm wrote:Y'know, if these people are really serious about only seeking scientific validation for their technology, why not release the specification of their machine, so that it can be built independently by various scientists and verified that it does indeed work? Or doesn't work, as the case is probably?
Theft of the technology if it actually worked? Theoritically speaking, if you did have this technology, you'd be a complete moron to think there isn't going to be some major players trying to steal the technology from you or suppress it's existence.
They have these things called patents to protect against that sort of thing.
"It's you Americans. There's something about nipples you hate. If this were Germany, we'd be romping around naked on the stage here."
Wyrm wrote:Y'know, if these people are really serious about only seeking scientific validation for their technology, why not release the specification of their machine, so that it can be built independently by various scientists and verified that it does indeed work? Or doesn't work, as the case is probably?
Theft of the technology if it actually worked? Theoritically speaking, if you did have this technology, you'd be a complete moron to think there isn't going to be some major players trying to steal the technology from you or suppress it's existence.
They have these things called patents to protect against that sort of thing.
You think patents are a fool proof way of protecting an invention? You're talking about going head to head with the energy industry, one of the most powerful and rich sectors in the modern world.
Maybe you'd trust a patent to protect you...I sure as fuck wouldn't.
If they steal your technology then with a patent you would just sue them in court. The energy industry is big, but so is the lawyer industry. With the amount of money involved you'd have the best patent attornies in the country banging on your front door wanting to represent you. Without a patent anyone could simply reverse engineer your product when it goes to market and there would be not a goddamn thing you could do about it.
The most basic assumption about the world is that it does not contradict itself.
Wicked Pilot wrote:If they steal your technology then with a patent you would just sue them in court. The energy industry is big, but so is the lawyer industry. With the amount of money involved you'd have the best patent attornies in the country banging on your front door wanting to represent you. Without a patent anyone could simply reverse engineer your product when it goes to market and there would be not a goddamn thing you could do about it.
At the risk of sounding like those paranoid conspiracy nuts, my issue wouldn't be having the law on your side. It would be actions and events that may not necessarily be legal or obvious to public observation that are employed to ensure the energy sectors either themselves profit from the invention, or ensure their profits aren't compromised (and employing whatever means necessary to make sure that doesn't happen).
I suppose it depends on just how public the situation is and how smart the inventor(s) are, but thinking those who have so much to lose wouldn't be willing (or at least consider) to do whatever necessary strikes me as naive.
Wicked Pilot wrote:If they steal your technology then with a patent you would just sue them in court. The energy industry is big, but so is the lawyer industry. With the amount of money involved you'd have the best patent attornies in the country banging on your front door wanting to represent you. Without a patent anyone could simply reverse engineer your product when it goes to market and there would be not a goddamn thing you could do about it.
At the risk of sounding like those paranoid conspiracy nuts, my issue wouldn't be having the law on your side. It would be actions and events that may not necessarily be legal or obvious to public observation that are employed to ensure the energy sectors either themselves profit from the invention, or ensure their profits aren't compromised (and employing whatever means necessary to make sure that doesn't happen).
I suppose it depends on just how public the situation is and how smart the inventor(s) are, but thinking those who have so much to lose wouldn't be willing (or at least consider) to do whatever necessary strikes me as naive.
Frankly, you're an imbecile. The patent system is broken, but considering that a smallish company just won out a huge patent case on .mp3 technology, it's safe to say that it is very difficult to successfully steal technology for long.
"It's you Americans. There's something about nipples you hate. If this were Germany, we'd be romping around naked on the stage here."
Bubble Boy wrote:
Theft of the technology if it actually worked? Theoritically speaking, if you did have this technology, you'd be a complete moron to think there isn't going to be some major players trying to steal the technology from you or suppress it's existence.
They have these things called patents to protect against that sort of thing.
You think patents are a fool proof way of protecting an invention? You're talking about going head to head with the energy industry, one of the most powerful and rich sectors in the modern world.
Maybe you'd trust a patent to protect you...I sure as fuck wouldn't.
So go sell the patent to the highest bidder, then let them sue the rest. Or do you have a non-profit motive for keeping this secret ?
If there are shadowy conspiracies out there which are run by wealthy powerful energy corporations and which operate above the law, why hasn't this guy been kidnapped and his website taken off the Internet? It seems to me that an awful lot of people who rant on the Internet about all-powerful evil unstoppable conspiracies have no particular fear of these conspiracies going after them for blabbing their secrets on the Web.
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
Of course Mike, you know these companies let these random internet denizens say what they will. So that they can make you think they aren't doing anything!
The simple fact is that Steorn hasn't done squat to demonstrate they have a device that can do what they say it does. Instead of evidence, they have a publicity stunt press release to try to sucker "investors" out of some money.
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"This is not bad; this is a conspiracy to remove happiness from existence. It seeks to wrap its hedgehog hand around the still beating heart of the personification of good and squeeze until it is stilled."
-- Chuck Sonnenburg on Voyager's "Elogium"
Darth Wong wrote:If there are shadowy conspiracies out there which are run by wealthy powerful energy corporations and which operate above the law, why hasn't this guy been kidnapped and his website taken off the Internet? It seems to me that an awful lot of people who rant on the Internet about all-powerful evil unstoppable conspiracies have no particular fear of these conspiracies going after them for blabbing their secrets on the Web.
For the record I'd like to point out I'm not suggesting I take the claim seriously or give it much credit.
My arguement was along the lines of caution isn't necessarily unwarranted in such a situation. I would argue large corperations are similar to people. Sure, the majority are at least half decent and law abiding enough, but it's naive to think there aren't a couple out there that wouldn't knife you in the back for something they consider valueable if you're not careful enough. Or just because you happen to challenge the top dog position of their particular sandbox.
So? It's still a dumbshit idea. You're basically saying that we can't dismiss the idea of something which violates the most fundamental laws of physics because a corporation might want to cover it up (never mind the fact that it appears to be impossible).
Carl Sagan once said that extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. You're saying that extraordinary claims can't be dismissed if someone can mumble something about why an imaginary conspiracy might want to take away this imaginary evidence.
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
I'm very tired of hearing conspiracy 'theories' from whack-a-loons. Do you want to know the real reason why nobody takes any claims of energy-from-nothing seriously? Because every machine that we base our entire civilization on (and every machine that works, period) is built on the assumption that the claim isn't true in any form. Furthermore, big-deal companies (the kind conspiracy whack-a-loons accuse of keeping them down) are built upon selling machines that work.
Clearly, reality is in on this conspiracy.
Darth Wong on Strollers vs. Assholes: "There were days when I wished that my stroller had weapons on it." wilfulton on Bible genetics: "If two screaming lunatics copulate in front of another screaming lunatic, the result will be yet another screaming lunatic. " SirNitram: "The nation of France is a theory, not a fact. It should therefore be approached with an open mind, and critically debated and considered."
Cornivore! | BAN-WATCH CANE: XVII | WWJDFAKB? - What Would Jesus Do... For a Klondike Bar? | Evil Bayesian Conspiracy
Wicked Pilot wrote:If they steal your technology then with a patent you would just sue them in court. The energy industry is big, but so is the lawyer industry. With the amount of money involved you'd have the best patent attornies in the country banging on your front door wanting to represent you. Without a patent anyone could simply reverse engineer your product when it goes to market and there would be not a goddamn thing you could do about it.
I attended a symposium last year on commercialisation of research. One of the things several of the key note speakers touched on is that a patent is no guarantee your idea is safe. One chap came out and said that if a large corporation wants your idea, they can usually find a way of getting around a patent.
For something like a free energy device (nevermind it doesn't exist for the case of example), yes, you could probably get lawyers banging on your doors. For less monumental advances, small companies often can't afford the lawyers they need to fight the cases in court.
It was quite a depressing symposium, really. The entire point of it was to encourage young scientists to commercialise their work and I left with a very dour view on the whole process.
Darth Wong wrote:So? It's still a dumbshit idea. You're basically saying that we can't dismiss the idea of something which violates the most fundamental laws of physics because a corporation might want to cover it up (never mind the fact that it appears to be impossible).
Perhaps I haven't made myself clear...I'm not suggesting the claim in question has any credibility at all. I thought my very first post made it abundantly clear that I didn't give the idea much credit in the first place.
I was merely pointing out that, in a purely hypothetical situation based upon the claim made here, that caution isn't an unwarranted stance.
Carl Sagan once said that extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence. You're saying that extraordinary claims can't be dismissed if someone can mumble something about why an imaginary conspiracy might want to take away this imaginary evidence.
I most certainly do not subscribe to this ridiculas line of reasoning, and never would.
Perhaps you could point out where I erred and made you come to this conclusion on my position?
Sorry, I didn't pick up on the fact that your entire tangent was just a discussion of the hypothetical scenario where the idea would be taken seriously.
To be honest, if it was me and I had the secret to limitless free energy, I would try to make money off it but I sure as hell wouldn't suppress it until I was sure I could secure my intellectual property rights. With the amount of good that such technology could do in the world, and the high likelihood of people trying to suppress it, I'd go to the press, give the fucking thing away to the public domain with as much publicity as possible, and not worry too much about getting compensation. Having my name go down in history as the man who solved the world's energy problems forever would be reward enough. That, and the interview/motivational speaking circuit.
Last edited by Darth Wong on 2007-03-06 09:18pm, edited 1 time in total.
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
Spin Echo wrote:I attended a symposium last year on commercialisation of research. One of the things several of the key note speakers touched on is that a patent is no guarantee your idea is safe. One chap came out and said that if a large corporation wants your idea, they can usually find a way of getting around a patent.
This the primary arguement I've been subscribing to, although apparently not wording it as clearly.
Darth Wong wrote:Sorry, I didn't pick up on the fact that your entire tangent was just a discussion of the hypothetical scenario where the idea would be taken seriously.
Colour me stupid, but I honestly don't know if you're actually apologizing or mocking me. I'm assuming the latter, in which case I simply regress.
"
Perhaps I haven't made myself clear...I'm not suggesting the claim in question has any credibility at all. I thought my very first post made it abundantly clear that I didn't give the idea much credit in the first place.