The Circus

[Cairber]

Do you feel that circuses are ethical? Would you ever take your kids to a circus?

[Cairber]

I suppose I should clarify: I mean circuses with animals.

[Enforcer Talen]

Off hand, I dont see the issue with it; wouldn't they be similar to zoos? Animals for our entertainment?

Ive had fun at circuses

[Cairber]

I remember going to the circus as a kid. I also remember the protest outside although I didn't understand it then. The Ringling bros circus is coming into town and a friend mentioned taking the kids. Although she didn't rbing it up at the time, the other woman that was with us sent me this link via email last night:

http://www.circuses.com/introduction.asp

There is some pretty scarey stuff on that site (esp if you read about the ringling circus via the "the circuses" link).

But I guess I am sitting here wondering, is it any worse than the zoo? But that link makes me think it is if beating and killing and starvation are happening.

So now I'm thinking maybe it isn't such a great idea.

[Raesene]

I suppose I should clarify: I mean circuses with animals.

So no 'Lions and Christians' ? Heard it was a popular show

If the animals are treated well during training (no beatings, electroshocks) and appropriate housing, no problem. Proper care must assured and controlled regularly.

Our new animal protection laws made it nearly impossible to show big cats etc in a circus - last I heard there are only horses etc shown nowadays.

[LadyTevar]

I hit the link you posted Cairber, and I saw all I needed to know at the top: PETA.

Forgive me, but I've learned long ago to take everything those nutjobs say with a block of rocksalt.

Now, yes, there has been abuse in the past, but PETA takes that and blows it up bigger than a clown's balloon animal, trying to make it look like *all* circuses act that way. They don't, and new rules and regulations are making sure that the abuses of the past don't happen again. Circuses have become very self-regulating, and from what I understand Ringling Bros is one of the strictest.

So go ahead and take the kids. Enjoy the show yourself. And try to ignore the naked PETA girl who'll be protesting outside, pretending to be an animal in a cage.

[Darth Wong]

A circus is not necessarily the same thing as a zoo. Toronto has one of the largest zoos on the continent and one of the reasons it's so big is that they make sure to have plenty of room for each animal. A circus, by necessity, keeps animals in confined spaces except when they're brought out to entertain the guests. There's simply no way to give the animals the kind of roaming room that a good zoo will give them. That's not PETA alarmism; that's a simple and inescapable fact of the portable nature of circuses.

When we put people into a cage that's too small for comfort, we call that "torture". Should we call it torture when we do it to animals? That's your call, but don't tell yourself that a circus is the same thing as a zoo because it's not.

[Admiral Valdemar]

I don't too like circuses for that very reason that animals are on the move and don't have the most leisurely of lives, regardless of how well loved they are. Safari parks are far more preferable over zoos too, given an area where there are no cages and only restricted compounds is a nicer environment for featured animals and humans alike than larger-than-circus cages.

[Pick]

Considering the honest tales I've heard of the treatment of animals in circuses, I absolutely refuse to attend any show that makes use of large animals (tiny dogs and stuff would be OK if they're treated respectably.)

I also make an exemption for things like Sigfried and Roy, since they take good care of their animals and do keep them in environments that are healthy. They're not shoved in little cages and toted across the nation.

I even have qualms about a lot of zoos that I think are insufficient for the animals' happiness.

[Wicked Pilot]

I suppose I should clarify: I mean circuses with animals.

Domesticated, yes, wild animals, no.


Of course I say screw the elephant show, I rather see the cute Romanian chick bend six ways till Sunday.

Giggidy.

[Flagg]

I won't go to circuses that feature animals for the reasons Mike mentioned, and because I've seen too many "Elephant goes apeshit and kills trainer, then rampages across town until the police kill it" stories and it turns out there were prior allegations of animal abuse made against the trainer.

As for zoos, some are better than others but I usually end up feeling bad for the big cats pacing around their cages. Generally I have no problem with them as long are they are set up in a way that educates.

[Vendetta]

Even without malicious treatment, it is simply impossible to keep large wild animals in any form of humane fashion and have them travel regularly.

For very large animals, even zoo enclosures aren't anything like their normal home range size in the wild.

If I wanted to see animals, I'd go to a zoo or safari park. Circuses should be all about people performing.

[RazorOutlaw]

I never really found animals doing tricks to be very interesting, so I kind of find little reason to go to a circus in the first place. Animals are at least half of what the show is supposed to be, right?

I'd say I don't much like animals being in confined spaces nor do I like the training tactics of those pricks in the video. I'd imagine when an elephant screams that it hurts A LOT, so I'm kind of bothered by that whole aspect. I'd say no, take your kids to a zoo.

[FSTargetDrone]

A circus where animals are made to perform for the amusement of gawking masses, with all the other baggage already mentioned?

Please, do not attend. Take the kids to a wildlife sanctuary or a nice zoo.

[Cairber]

We've decided not to attend. We go to the zoo every other week (I love zoo membership) and my kids love it. Anna is obsessed with animals, but the more I read about circuses, the worse it seems to get. Even if it all is exaggerated, it's still pretty bad taking that into account.

Maybe instead we will go to the aquarium over in Jersey.

[KrauserKrauser]

I'm making a trip to the Baltimore Aquarium this weekend as I have heard it is quite top notch. We shall see.

[The Original Nex]

I'm making a trip to the Baltimore Aquarium this weekend as I have heard it is quite top notch. We shall see.

If I remember correctly, you're in for a good time. Of course my own bias makes me like the New England Aquarium better by default.

[FSTargetDrone]

We've decided not to attend. We go to the zoo every other week (I love zoo membership) and my kids love it. Anna is obsessed with animals, but the more I read about circuses, the worse it seems to get. Even if it all is exaggerated, it's still pretty bad taking that into account.

Maybe instead we will go to the aquarium over in Jersey.

Excellent! Regardless of one's opinions on "animal rights," it seems like a perfect opportunity to educate your children about how animals do not deserve to be made to perform for people's amusement. I would think that the animals are generally less stressed and more comfortable in a "natural" environment (as much as it can be in a zoo) than in any circus.

Hope you have a great time!

[Singular Intellect]

When we put people into a cage that's too small for comfort, we call that "torture". Should we call it torture when we do it to animals? That's your call

Out of curiousity, why should we argue the label 'torture' is optional when dealing with animals instead of humans?

[Darth Wong]

When we put people into a cage that's too small for comfort, we call that "torture". Should we call it torture when we do it to animals? That's your call

Out of curiousity, why should we argue the label 'torture' is optional when dealing with animals instead of humans?

We put humans in cages without calling it "torture" as long as the cage is several times the length of the human. Animals require a proportionally much larger habitat than that. The analogy doesn't track perfectly.