What makes rural areas retarded?

[sketerpot]

I think the root cause of rural backwardsness is the small population:necessary space ratio: it accounts for the "closed community" effect, the little concentration doesn't warrant the installation of universities, and the unavailability of the land makes it unattractive for big factories to be installed. Result: no industrial economy.

That's the key, really: industry. It needs educated people.

What the hell? If there's one thing that rural areas have, it's available land.

[Invictus ChiKen]

I withdraw my statement.

I alwaus figured pumping our swiming and drinking water into and out of the plant couldn't be healthy... Besides it would only explain my hometown...

[Broomstick]

A few reasons smart people might live in a rural area:

Lower crime rate
They don't like the city environment
Certain activities more tolerated than in the cities (hunting, aviation, certain motor sports)
Investment in land
Hobby farming

Good reasons all,

ALL? Three out of the five were based on HOBBIES rather than anything objective.

So?

If you're heavily into a particular hobby that is better suited to a rural rather than urban environment, such that nearly every weeked and perhaps weekday evenings you might be engaged in that hobby, why not?

I've lived in a city most of my life (23 years in Los Angeles and 6.5 in Houston) and realize that I can always take a vacation in the rural areas if I want to engage in any of those "non-urban" activities.

My rural-friendly hobby requires me, by law, to put in a certain amount of participation over a particular time period or that same set of regulations severely limits my privileges. Merely taking a vacation once or twice a year will not fulfill those requirements. Some sub-sections of the hobby can not be legally done near urban areas. Particularly if you have a job that allows you to telecommute, or you have a means of employment in rural areas, living way outside of the city makes a lot more sense than driving hours and hours every weekend.

My college roommate likes to hike in the wilderness. A lot. As a doctor she could live anywhere, but she chooses to live in a rural area so she can indulge her hobby more often than once or twice a year.

If you want a hobby farm you can NOT do it in the city.

[His Divine Shadow]

As a semi-serious question in regards to Wong's post - how in the HELL do you account for the majority of the Southeastern United States?

What makes you think that the Deep South contradicts anything I've said?

I think he means that even the big cities down there that have access to libraries and higher education, as well as diverse neighborhoods, still tend to be packed full of insular chuckleheads.

This has got to be something american. The rural areas in Finland are not behind the urban areas. Maybe it's because we all have good media connections, libraries, schools and such services even in very small communities. I dunno but meeting the kinds of crazy conservative jesus lovers you do in american south is not an issue here.

Infact in Finland alot of the religious crazies live in a few cities up north such as Jakobstad and Nykarleby.

[Darth Wong]

What makes you think that the Deep South contradicts anything I've said?

I think he means that even the big cities down there that have access to libraries and higher education, as well as diverse neighborhoods, still tend to be packed full of insular chuckleheads.

This has got to be something american. The rural areas in Finland are not behind the urban areas. Maybe it's because we all have good media connections, libraries, schools and such services even in very small communities. I dunno but meeting the kinds of crazy conservative jesus lovers you do in american south is not an issue here.

Infact in Finland alot of the religious crazies live in a few cities up north such as Jakobstad and Nykarleby.

We've been over this before. Your whole fucking country is small enough that nobody can be isolated the way rural communities in North America can be. Finland could be dropped into an American map and promptly lost forever.

[Elaro]

I think the root cause of rural backwardsness is the small population:necessary space ratio: it accounts for the "closed community" effect, the little concentration doesn't warrant the installation of universities, and the unavailability of the land makes it unattractive for big factories to be installed. Result: no industrial economy.

That's the key, really: industry. It needs educated people.

What the hell? If there's one thing that rural areas have, it's available land.

Available? Available for crops, yes. The land is being used for farming. But that's a weak point, I admit. The main statement was that low population density causes the "retardation" of rural communities.

[Broomstick]

I think he means that even the big cities down there that have access to libraries and higher education, as well as diverse neighborhoods, still tend to be packed full of insular chuckleheads.

This has got to be something american. The rural areas in Finland are not behind the urban areas. Maybe it's because we all have good media connections, libraries, schools and such services even in very small communities. I dunno but meeting the kinds of crazy conservative jesus lovers you do in american south is not an issue here.

Infact in Finland alot of the religious crazies live in a few cities up north such as Jakobstad and Nykarleby.

We've been over this before. Your whole fucking country is small enough that nobody can be isolated the way rural communities in North America can be. Finland could be dropped into an American map and promptly lost forever.

I have to agree with this - I've heard Finland described as "slightly smaller than Montana" (which is not the largest State) with a population of 5 million or so. Montana has about 900,000 people, less than a million. The largest city in Montana is Billings, with a population of about 90,000 or so. Helsinki has 560,000 more or less.

Although Finland may be the least densely populated European country, it's quite crowded by Montana standards. Wyoming is slightly less densely inhabited than Montana. Alaska is the least densely populated State in the US, with 1/6 the population density of Montana which, as we have seen, is about 1/5 that of Finland.

All of the above is somewhat rough, but it may given you a better idea that what qualifies as "rural" and "remote" in Finland is quite populated compared to large parts of the US.

[His Divine Shadow]

Yes, Finland is just a little bit smaller than Montana, and we got ~5 million inhabitants, 1 million alone down in the metropolitan area around Helsinki.

The rest of the country is a handfull of cities (not that you americans would call them cities, towns mayhaps) dotted with small rural communities all over, the average population density is 16km^2 per individual. I live in a municipalitythat has 2200 people in 240 square kilometers, which gives us a population density of 10/km^2

Ofcourse 50km north we got the city of Vasa with a pop of 65,000.

[Imperial Overlord]

My dad grew up in a very small town . . . . that was not ethnically homogenous and right in between L.A. and San Diego. It's not the same kind of place at all as a small rural community away from a big city.

[Patrick Degan]

He clearly was being sarcastic, particularly since a family with a TOTAL of 32 teeth among all the members teeth is easy to explain by a combination of bad oral hygiene and bar fights.

Or family "opening beer-bottles with your teeth" lessons.

[Lusankya]

In the country town that I grew up in, about half of the doctors left not long after their children reached high school age. The anaesthetist who came out to replace my father left within about a year, or thereabouts, because he found India to be less backwards.

The town had huge issues:

- the local high school was very poor, so not a single person passed year 12 maths in the year that I would have graduated.

- the community was insular - people who hadn't been in the town for a few generations were considered outsiders.

- the locals didn't want to change. They had their little culture, and they didn't want some uppity Adelaide folk telling them what to do.

- the town couldn't attract professionals for any length of time, because of the above issues, and as such, anyone who was educated was by necessity an outsider, who wasn't accepted by the community. They have difficulty attracting and maintaining services, because the people who have the expertise to run them don't want to live out there, which makes the places more backwards and retarded...

[mr friendly guy]

I have to ask, which South Australian town was this?

[Lusankya]

Berri. It's an absolute shithole. I recommend that you don't go there. I can't imagine that the area's gotten any better, given that I believe that American orange imports are overriding the local citrus industry.

I feel particularly sorry for one of my friends, whose father was one of the local car dealers. She was a bright girl, but I can't help but feel that her life was hampered by the fact that she went to the local high school.

[BrandonMustang]

I am from a relatively small town. I graduated from high school with 165 but most are from farming areas with names but no schools so they transfer in. My best friend wrote an english paper once called "The Cycle of Stupidity" as a farce in high school. He wrote that 7 out of 10 girls in my high school got "knocked up" at least once before graduating or dropping out while only 3 of those 7 knew who the biological fathers were (True statistics. Lots of unsafe sex in redneck-land.). On top of that, our town has only a 5% move-out rate over 20 years and only 2% move in (More true stats.) After a while, all of those illegitimate children add up (the average number of children per family in my town is 4, btw). Eventually, since an overwhelming number of people do not know the identity of their fathers, the cycle repeats itself as all cycles do with the new batch of redneck bastards unknowingly making a new generation of illegitimate children with many of their own biological half-siblings. Thankfully, I am part of the 2% that moved in from somewhere else. However, most of my town MUST belong to incestuous lineage.

Other fun facts: over 75% of my school district K-12 was on free or reduced lunches (poverty).
The average income in my town is whatever welfare+disability equals for the given year with the town's average size family (that's right. for this to be average many make less).
We have one stoplight in my hometown... it's broken.
Every Friday a government convoy comes into town and everyone meets at City Hall to pick up their welfare cheese, etc.
82% of my town's families qualify for food stamps.

My family is pretty well-to-do for my hometown. We have our own tractor and everything. People think we are rich but we barely qualify as middle class.

The average ACT score for those that actually took it (in my Senior class, which was considered the smartest class to ever go through my high school) was 11. I would definately qualify my hometown as "retarded"...

[Darth Wong]

I lived in a town like that once. It was OK to stay there for a few years because we weren't actually living in the town itself, and we met a few people we got along with pretty well, but when Matthew got to be a couple of years old we decided that there was no way we'd raise him in that environment, so I set up some job interviews over the phone and we ended up moving back to Toronto.

[BrandonMustang]

Yeah. It's very interesting to look at the differences between my sister and myself. I was already 11 years old when we moved there and my sister was just 6. We moved from an amazing school district and I had been raised in a completely different environment. Needless to say, I never fit in. My sister, however, has completely conformed. Tact, class, reason, morals, etc. are lost on her and all of her friends. She is ignorant of the outside world and will be lucky to get into a community college with her grades while I was able to go to a big state school on scholarship. This is not a priority, however, as long as she is head cheerleader and boinking the star of the football team. Seriously, reading comprehension and basic arithmetic is not important where I'm from. That's why I'll never raise my children in a place like Tecumseh, Oklahoma.

[wolveraptor]

Heh. They're named after a northern general that devastated them. Sweet irony.

[Broomstick]

Either that, or the Native American who was the original Tecumseh.

[Uraniun235]

You know, once the big oil crash dealie happens, these places are only going to become more isolated and the problem's going to get worse.

[BrandonMustang]

Heh. They're named after a northern general that devastated them. Sweet irony.

Actually, the town is named for the Native American hero that united the tribes... most of my town is Native American, BTW.

[Lisa]

I live in a rural area by choice, but mostly because I enjoy my privacy and the quiet. Other then occasionally buying gasoline or picking up packages I rarely interact with the locals. Schooling is done in the city (20 min away) so I imagine it's not quite as bad as when I lived in Saskatchewan.

[Lisa]

Ghetto edit: If I didn't have a high speed internet connection I'd probably go nuts...

[Patrick Degan]

Either that, or the Native American who was the original Tecumseh.

He was.

[Aeolus]

As a semi-serious question in regards to Wong's post - how in the HELL do you account for the majority of the Southeastern United States?

The Southeast has a very large population but it is spread out among ALOT of small towns and mid sized cites. There are a few large cities and those are more liberal and diverse. The rule of thumb in the south if you are gay is. Stay in the cities and things are great but avoid the rural areas. Dallas, Atlanta and Houston have vibrant gay communities but then there is well all of Mississippi...ugh

[Darth Mortis]

[[*]Lack of learning resources. For example, in Toronto we have a huge public library system, including the well-stocked public reference library downtown. Anyone can also walk into the University of Toronto libraries and read material, although you need a membership to borrow anything. The sheer volume of literature at your disposal in a major city is staggering. Now go into the public library in a typical small town. Pretty damned sad, isn't it? And no, Google is not a substitute.

In general, towns too small to have a library will not have internet access, either.

Oh come on, this isn't 1991, I highly doubt that small town America doesn't at least have DSL by now.