Why Shep hates anime....

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2003-01-06 07:23pm

Yogi wrote:OK Shep, I beleive I'll put you out of your misery.

Which type of non-Anime shows do you like? Tell me, so I can find the anime equivalent and post it on my FTP server.

He likes Historical Military Drama
Early Science Fiction
&
Otherthings of the like

Would not Suggest:
Lensman (Yes, I know it's based on Classic Sci-Fi, but it includes all of the Brain bugs that ticks shep off)

Basically: No Magic, No Giant Robots, No Whiny Brats

Suggestions: The Cockpit, I can think of a couple of other very realistic stories. Also Wings over Hollendaise, Lone Wolf & Cub.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-01-06 07:23pm

Maybe I was a bit rash in my early proclaimation that I hate
anime. That's perhaps too harsh a word....my brother just showed
me right now an anime called Irresponsible Captain Tyler,
and it looks to me to be an anime version of the Space Quest series.

What I hate is the so-called "serious" anime, in which they
overuse every goddamn cliche, and have brain-dead idiots
controlling their forces.

I can accept SOME leeway due to the "suspension of disbelief"
bit required of most sci-fi universes, but there is a point
where it's just bullshit masturbatory wanking.

Neon Genesis Evangelion when I first saw it, I figured it
was a somewhat decent giant robot fighting anime because
the EVAs required a bigass power cable to run, and without
it, you only had 30 seconds of power before shutdown...

But then I found out how the writers and animators took it
on a religious/spirituality trip in the later episodes.

YECH. Leave that shit for the theologians, dammit. If I
want that shit on the meaning of God, and what He is,
then I'll go to Mass, not watch it for entertainment.

(what, did you think Shep is Fundie who laps
up that shit like a dog does his own vomit?)

The later NGE episodes and EoE are the anime version of
the craptacular LEFT BEHIND book series written by fundies,
IMHO. If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then it's
a fucking duck, no matter what the director tries to deny.

Onto other anime.

Ghost in the Shell/Dominion Tank Police features a new
"prototype tank" that is a fucking piece of shit. It runs
around on "legs" that give it an abmysally high ground
pressure, and it manages to defeat every countermeasure
by uplinking into the weapon systems.

This cheap trick conviently assumes that the people in
charge somehow forgot to disable the uplink access that
the tank had by changing the system's password, or even
jamming the damn thing.

Also, their solution when the tank dodged/defeated every
guided weapon thrown at it was to wait for a guy with a 20mm
semi-automatic cannon to take it out.....but conviently
enough this guy has a cybernetic eye that the tank uplinks to
and uses to dodge his shots.

The guy finally shuts off his cybernetic eye, and the tank
then pops smoke just as the guy is about to fire unaided.

I jumped out of my seat at that point, screaming "FIRE YOU
STUPID FUCK, FIRE FIRE!" because the tank can't magically
jump out of the way if he fires upon seeing that the tank
is popping smoke.

After an eternity, the guy finally DID fire, and because
he waited so damn long, he only scored a glancing shot on
the tank, doing jack shit.

My thought was, what, nobody thought to bring along a
unguided FFAR rocket on an attack helicopter or even a
fucking RPG-14?

A long time ago, my mentor on ASVS stated that he was neither
pro-SW nor anti-ST, but was instead anti-IDIOT, and that's
the philosophy I follow in vs. debates.

Even Bolo books aren't immune from my criticism because in most of them,
the bad guys simply keep coming in direct frontal assaults against
the Bolos, instead of using indirect fire weapons to overwhelm a
Bolo's point defenses and damage it before following up with a
direct fire assault...

Each Bolo writer makes it out so that each time the Bolos are deployed
on the battlefield, they win because the enemy has never seen one
before, and never adjusts their tactics to counter the Bolos, despite
the fact that they've been around for quite awhile...

Sheesh, you'd think that word would get out that these pesky humans
have these gigantic tanks that can fire 5 megatons a second from
their hellbores....

willburns84 · Post by **willburns84** » 2003-01-06 07:24pm

MKSheppard wrote:
willburns84 wrote: The disturbing part of this is that not only did someone come up with the idea for the anime but someone also said - "Hey, here's a shitload of money to make your idea come to life! Rape a few for me eh?"

RAYCAV LIVES

That statement means nothing to me. At the risk of being even more disturbed than I currently am, please elaborate.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-01-06 07:27pm

Most anime reminds me of James Bond movies. It's fun to watch,
but you shouldn't take it too seriously like some Mecha/otaku fanwhores
do...

In Real life, James Bond would have died a long time ago and his
bug-eaten corpse would be rotting in the jungles outside the Mad
Scientists' Lair after the Mad Scientist simply shoots him immediately,
rather than explaining his plan to him, and then putting him into an
elaborate death room.

A lot of anime reminds me of that, in which the evil villains let the cute
little girl power up during her 30 second power up sequence that
includes a swirly background, instead of simply shooting her in the
head as she powers up.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-01-06 07:31pm

MKSheppard wrote:In Real life, James Bond would have died a long time ago and his bug-eaten corpse would be rotting in the jungles outside the Mad Scientists' Lair after the Mad Scientist simply shoots him immediately, rather than explaining his plan to him, and then putting him into an
elaborate death room.

In real life, James Bond would be spending all his time trying to talk people into giving up information for money. That's what real spies do, isn't it?

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-01-06 07:32pm

Just to let you know Shep:

Q) Is there religious meaning to Evangelion?

A) No. Evangelion is not, and never was a religious anime and does not contain any direct commentary on the world's religions. The Judeo-Christian elements it contains are simply plot devices used to convey the story. Nothing more.

The cross shaped explosions, the Kabalah, and all other references do have religious roots and do have relevance to Evangelion but it is very important to remember that Eva is a work of fiction and should not have it's symbols taken that seriously. I think that Mamorou Oshii (director of "Ghost in The Shell" and "Patlabor") described religious elements in anime best when he said "These are used as the prototype for the stories; not for religious reasons, but for ideology and literary inspiration".

Finally, at the Otakon anime convention held in 2001, assistant director Kazuya Tsurumaki (who was the director of The End of Evangelion: Episode 25' Air - while Anno personally undetook The End of Evangelion: Episode 26' Sincerely Yours and acted as Chief Director) was asked directly what relvance Christianity had to Evangelion. This was his reply:
Tsurumaki: There are a lot of giant robot shows in Japan, and we did want our story to have a religious theme to help distinguish us.
Because Christianity is an uncommon religion in Japan we thought it would be mysterious. None of the staff who worked on Eva are Christians.
There is no actual Christian meaning to the show, we just thought the visual symbols of Christianity look cool. If we had known the show would get
distributed in the US and Europe we might have rethought that choice.

So, while Evangelion's basic plot elements are borrowed from some religious texts and myths, they merely act as inspiration for a different story. They are just there for aesthetics. Evangelion also borrowed several elements from earlier Tomino anime shows. Evangelion owes more to Ideon, than it does to Revelation.

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2003-01-06 07:32pm

Hey Shep Get ahold of The Cockpit THe WWI & WWII sequences are beutiful, like they were drawn from gun camera footage....

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-01-06 07:33pm

Darth Wong wrote: In real life, James Bond would be spending all his time trying
to talk people into giving up information for money. That's
what real spies do, isn't it?

Basically, yeah. But every intelligence agency has an OPERATIONS
department, where people actually go out and sneak people out from
another country, plant bugs, etc. They also (rarely, and not much anymore)
kill people in wetwork.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-01-06 07:35pm

Spanky The Dolphin wrote: A) No. Evangelion is not, and never was a religious anime and does not contain any direct commentary on the world's religions. The Judeo-Christian elements it contains are simply plot devices used to convey the story. Nothing more.

If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, then it's a duck.

Icehawk · Post by **Icehawk** » 2003-01-06 07:36pm

Shep. Go and watch Jin Roh. Then come back and tell me you don't like "serious" anime.

willburns84 · Post by **willburns84** » 2003-01-06 07:36pm

MKSheppard wrote:Most anime reminds me of James Bond movies. It's fun to watch,
but you shouldn't take it too seriously like some Mecha/otaku fanwhores
do...

In Real life, James Bond would have died a long time ago and his
bug-eaten corpse would be rotting in the jungles outside the Mad
Scientists' Lair after the Mad Scientist simply shoots him immediately,
rather than explaining his plan to him, and then putting him into an
elaborate death room.

A lot of anime reminds me of that, in which the evil villains let the cute
little girl power up during her 30 second power up sequence that
includes a swirly background, instead of simply shooting her in the
head as she powers up.

For Heaven's sake!
It's a work of fiction! Suspension of disbelief is often required! Arrrggghhh... If realistic stories were all that were told, well, there would be far more unhappy stories to tell than happy ones and society can't tolerate that.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2003-01-06 07:36pm

Shep, you might want to try looking into some of the non-fantasy/sci-fi anime that's out there.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-01-06 07:37pm

Icehawk wrote:Shep. Go and watch Jin Roh. Then come back and tell me you don't like "serious" anime.

Does it include doe eyed bitchy girls, swirly backgrounds, and brain dead
villains/main characters?

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-01-06 07:38pm

willburns84 wrote: For Heaven's sake!
It's a work of fiction! Suspension of disbelief is often required! Arrrggghhh... If realistic stories were all that were told, well, there would be far more unhappy stories to tell than happy ones and society can't tolerate that.

Then Lord Wong should let all the gross engineering and safety violations
that Starfleet routinely commits in it's design of starship warp cores during
TNG and later shows slide because "suspension of Disbelief" is required?

Yogi · Post by **Yogi** » 2003-01-06 07:39pm

MKSheppard wrote:Does it include doe eyed bitchy girls, swirly backgrounds, and brain dead villains/main characters?

No.

Icehawk · Post by **Icehawk** » 2003-01-06 07:41pm

Does it include doe eyed bitchy girls, swirly backgrounds, and brain dead
villains/main characters?

Nope not a single one of those. Heres the official website.

http://www.jin-roh.net/

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-01-06 07:45pm

Icehawk wrote: Nope not a single one of those. Heres the official website.

mmm.....nazi-like stormtroopers

Seriously, do they behave intelligently? Do they have any major fucking
brain bugs during the show that make you want to scream at the TV in
disgust

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2003-01-06 07:45pm

Well Shojin Anime would be more up your Alley.

Gunsmith Cats: To well armed female Bounty Hunters, No swirly backgrounds, Lots of explosions, realisticly smart villians

Riding Bean: Forget the Name of the character, It's got intellegent villians, great chase scenes (They aritst is a big fan of the French Connection, and American Action Adventure movies)

Golgoto 13: The Man with a custom M16, 5mil buys you the killer that never misses.

Lone Wolf and Cub: aka the Killer with the baby carriage,

Ninja Scroll:

trust me these are kick ass.

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-01-06 07:46pm

The Yosemite Bear wrote: Golgo 13: The Man with a custom M16, 5mil buys you the killer that never misses.

Yep. I remember the NES game from waaaaaay back then

Yogi · Post by **Yogi** » 2003-01-06 07:49pm

The Yosemite Bear wrote: He likes Historical Military Drama
Early Science Fiction
&
Otherthings of the like

Would not Suggest:
Lensman (Yes, I know it's based on Classic Sci-Fi, but it includes all of the Brain bugs that ticks shep off)

Basically: No Magic, No Giant Robots, No Whiny Brats

Suggestions: The Cockpit, I can think of a couple of other very realistic stories. Also Wings over Hollendaise, Lone Wolf & Cub.

Historical Military Drama? Don't have that.
Early Sci-fi without Giant Robots? I heard that Crest of the Stars was pretty good, but that's a bit recent, plus I haven't seen it. Only EARLY sci-fi I have is Macross, and it has mecha, kind of. Infinite Ryuvis is pretty good, and it doesn't have Mecha (well, the Ryvius is kind of a mecha I guess). I heard Space Battleship Yamato is good. I wonder if you'll like FLCL...
Battle Angel Alita, the manga?

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2003-01-06 07:49pm

Dude hey's been a Japanese Comic Book character since the late 60's early 70's, Hey's been in two live action films (Sonny Chiba Played him), then He got into a computer game, and Now there are 3 DVD's of Anime involving him.

Yogi · Post by **Yogi** » 2003-01-06 07:51pm

MKSheppard wrote:mmm.....nazi-like stormtroopers

Seriously, do they behave intelligently? Do they have any major fucking brain bugs during the show that make you want to scream at the TV in disgust

No.

Icehawk · Post by **Icehawk** » 2003-01-06 07:54pm

mmm.....nazi-like stormtroopers [icon_twisted.gif]

Seriously, do they behave intelligently? Do they have any major fucking
brain bugs during the show that make you want to scream at the TV in
disgust

Hehe. I figured that would get your attention. And yes they do act very professionally. They are part of an elite counterterrorist unit formed after the GERMAN military occupation of Japan left. The story takes place in an alternate past where it was Germany who won the war against Japan. But the story is much more focused on the main character who is part of the unit and his struggles to cope with his actions and with who and what he is. Its a very dark and realistic story.

willburns84 · Post by **willburns84** » 2003-01-06 07:54pm

MKSheppard wrote:
willburns84 wrote: For Heaven's sake!
It's a work of fiction! Suspension of disbelief is often required! Arrrggghhh... If realistic stories were all that were told, well, there would be far more unhappy stories to tell than happy ones and society can't tolerate that.
Then Lord Wong should let all the gross engineering and safety violations
that Starfleet routinely commits in it's design of starship warp cores during
TNG and later shows slide because "suspension of Disbelief" is required?

Give me a break. "Suspension of disbelief" allows us to accept certain things in order to help place the setting for the movie / plot / story to move forward - FTL travel and communications, matter-energy transport, time-travel, etc. The setting might have those things, accept them and move on. Focus on the plot and the characters instead...

MKSheppard · Post by **MKSheppard** » 2003-01-06 07:58pm

willburns84 wrote: Focus on the plot and the characters instead...

Why do you remind me all of a sudden of a whiny trektard complaining
about Wong ripping your precious show to shreds?