Looking back on: Titan A.E.

[Adrian Laguna]

These people blew up a planet and killed billions maybe tens of billions of people, the novel even implies they did it to many other worlds who opposed them.

He'd have to be an idiot to think they wouldnt double cross him. Course, Corso and Preed were idiots so...

He actually was probably aware about the Drej's utter disregard for organic life. Preed likely figured that opposing the Drej meant certain death (there's no way he could know that the Titan had a Deus ex Machina included), while working for them meant that they *might* let him live. A slim chance is better than none.

[CaptHawkeye]

He also made the mistake of following them onto the Titan. He KNEW the Drej would try to destroy the Titan. So did Korso. Ruling out the Titan's Deus Ex Machina Gun, which no one could possibly know what it was capable of other than Professor Tucker himself.

Why should they waste time following them onto the ship? They've given the Drej the location of it. The Drej are unlikely to find usefull evidence in the Titan's debris field, much less search it at all.

If Preed really wanted to pull a hard one over on them, he could have shot Korso while they were walking down the hallway. He could have given overly trusting Gune the walkie talkie from hell, instead of Stith, who spares little trust and hates him.

Even if the explosive failed again, he would find them both unconscious on the boarding deck and could kill them. Then take the Valkerie for himself and go with the flow.

[CaptHawkeye]

Ghetto Edit: Scratch that "giving the death talkie to Gune" thing. I just remembered it was Gune who called out how strange the situation was and it was Stith who was falling for the trick.

[Big Orange]

I wonder if the Drej were distantly related to those stingray type energy creatures that inhabited the giant nebula? And why did the Drej have only one flagship?

[Molyneux]

I wonder if the Drej were distantly related to those stingray type energy creatures that inhabited the giant nebula? And why did the Drej have only one flagship?

I think it was a worldship, like a gigantic city more than a warship - and there's probably more than one. The thing is that with the Titan available to them, the humans can easily defeat a Drej planetbuster.

[CaptHawkeye]

I wonder if the Drej were distantly related to those stingray type energy creatures that inhabited the giant nebula? And why did the Drej have only one flagship?

I think it was a worldship, like a gigantic city more than a warship - and there's probably more than one. The thing is that with the Titan available to them, the humans can easily defeat a Drej planetbuster.

I don't think the Titan was ever intended to be used as an "Anti Son of a Bitch" machine. A lot of its internal and external workings are exposed and seem pretty fragile. It's main "projector" is meant to collect matter necessary for the construction of a planet. So it's clearly not a dedicated Alderaan killer. We also can't be certain if the Titan was capable of using its power more than once in a battle, or ever again.

If it is intended to be used as a weapon, then it would probably need a lot of heavy escort.

[Molyneux]

I wonder if the Drej were distantly related to those stingray type energy creatures that inhabited the giant nebula? And why did the Drej have only one flagship?

I think it was a worldship, like a gigantic city more than a warship - and there's probably more than one. The thing is that with the Titan available to them, the humans can easily defeat a Drej planetbuster.

I don't think the Titan was ever intended to be used as an "Anti Son of a Bitch" machine. A lot of its internal and external workings are exposed and seem pretty fragile. It's main "projector" is meant to collect matter necessary for the construction of a planet. So it's clearly not a dedicated Alderaan killer. We also can't be certain if the Titan was capable of using its power more than once in a battle, or ever again.

If it is intended to be used as a weapon, then it would probably need a lot of heavy escort.

Oh, no, I don't think that the Titan was intended as a weapon - it was a planet builder, that seemed pretty clear to me. It was just a fortunate coincidence that it could be rewired, with a bit of work, into something virtually immune to energy-based weapons - which happen to be all that the Drej use.

I figured that the Drej heard about humanity's work on the Titan, realised what that would mean if they ever tried to expand their territory into human space, and struck preemptively - but the humans themselves didn't figure out that the Titan could do that. Did humanity even know what the Drej were before they attacked the Solar System?

[CaptHawkeye]

Oh, no, I don't think that the Titan was intended as a weapon - it was a planet builder, that seemed pretty clear to me. It was just a fortunate coincidence that it could be rewired, with a bit of work, into something virtually immune to energy-based weapons - which happen to be all that the Drej use.

It's possible that Professor Tucker rewired it before he died. Then again, this is unlikely. The Titan can be operated by a very small crew. This may have been for security purposes, less people on the Titan when it escapes Earth means less people to later captured by the Drej or spill information. Given the Titan's size and complexity, I doubt Tucker alone could handle such a conversion job. And then again, why would he assume Cale would use it against the Drej?

I also have to wonder what his plan was in general. The Titan's power cells are empty, so even if Cale finds it, he can't use it. If the Titan does somehow get power and create a new planet, what's stopping the Drej from just blowing it up again? It's not like the lcoation of humanity's new homeworld is something they'll be able to keep secret. Especially if every mamby pamby drifter bum knows where it is. They can't possibly reorganize a military responce in time to counter a Drej assault on planet Bob.

It may also be possible that Tucker believed Cale might be able to use the Titan as a political symbol for humanity and maybe even form alliances with other Alien empires. This is also challenging. Most races in the galaxy DESPISE humanity.

figured that the Drej heard about humanity's work on the Titan, realised what that would mean if they ever tried to expand their territory into human space, and struck preemptively - but the humans themselves didn't figure out that the Titan could do that. Did humanity even know what the Drej were before they attacked the Solar System?

Thr Titan's logistical uses are immense. The ability to create entire planets can potentially allow one's military to be given unlimited natural resources and "beach head's on demand!" whereever they go. Frankly, I don't blame anyone in the galaxy for being concerned about it.

[Molyneux]

Oh, no, I don't think that the Titan was intended as a weapon - it was a planet builder, that seemed pretty clear to me. It was just a fortunate coincidence that it could be rewired, with a bit of work, into something virtually immune to energy-based weapons - which happen to be all that the Drej use.

It's possible that Professor Tucker rewired it before he died. Then again, this is unlikely. The Titan can be operated by a very small crew. This may have been for security purposes, less people on the Titan when it escapes Earth means less people to later captured by the Drej or spill information. Given the Titan's size and complexity, I doubt Tucker alone could handle such a conversion job. And then again, why would he assume Cale would use it against the Drej?

I also have to wonder what his plan was in general. The Titan's power cells are empty, so even if Cale finds it, he can't use it. If the Titan does somehow get power and create a new planet, what's stopping the Drej from just blowing it up again? It's not like the lcoation of humanity's new homeworld is something they'll be able to keep secret. Especially if every mamby pamby drifter bum knows where it is. They can't possibly reorganize a military responce in time to counter a Drej assault on planet Bob.

It may also be possible that Tucker believed Cale might be able to use the Titan as a political symbol for humanity and maybe even form alliances with other Alien empires. This is also challenging. Most races in the galaxy DESPISE humanity.

figured that the Drej heard about humanity's work on the Titan, realised what that would mean if they ever tried to expand their territory into human space, and struck preemptively - but the humans themselves didn't figure out that the Titan could do that. Did humanity even know what the Drej were before they attacked the Solar System?

Thr Titan's logistical uses are immense. The ability to create entire planets can potentially allow one's military to be given unlimited natural resources and "beach head's on demand!" whereever they go. Frankly, I don't blame anyone in the galaxy for being concerned about it.

I also thought for awhile that the Drej might be concerned about the Titan operating through what appears to be some sort of gravity-generating mechanism - but then I remebered the "gravity pump" on the fritz at the mining station.

[Admiral Valdemar]

When you think about the strategic advantages the Titan gives you as a species, practically instant terraforming provided the energy and materials are there, then of course the Drej were going to pre-emptively attack the human first system and try and destroy such technology. It reminds me of the prisoner's dilemma when applied to relativistic kill vehicles that can eradicate most life on a planet.

Given the way humanity was wiped out so thoroughly, it's obvious we were no major force and only had the potential for being one once we'd made first contact and gotten out into the bustling galaxy of life. The Drej had a nice empire there and their fear alone kept everyone else in check. Anything challenging that status quo would be a severe threat, even if humanity didn't use the technology, some other species may have found the Titan and used it for their own gains, or even reverse engineered it in secret, jet off somewhere remote, then use their existing industry base to form a much larger military force to counter the Drej's.

Had it not been for the nice energy absorbing abilities of the Titan, the ship would have been destroyed and with it all of humanity and what was left of Earth's biosphere. As noted, even if the Drej didn't find it before it made New Earth, humanity was still classed as a bunch of refugees so such a planet would be an easy target to find and decimate all over again.

[CaptHawkeye]

When you think about the strategic advantages the Titan gives you as a species, practically instant terraforming provided the energy and materials are there, then of course the Drej were going to pre-emptively attack the human first system and try and destroy such technology. It reminds me of the prisoner's dilemma when applied to relativistic kill vehicles that can eradicate most life on a planet.

The Drej appear to have established quite the reputation for themselves in the galaxy. Every other race tends to cower in their presence. It's easy to believe the Drej have in fact set up a kind of status quo upon which other Alien spieces exist more as Vassal States than anything. The Drej also act violently and swiftly on even the mere rumor of revolt or challenge to their authority.

Given the way humanity was wiped out so thoroughly, it's obvious we were no major force and only had the potential for being one once we'd made first contact and gotten out into the bustling galaxy of life. The Drej had a nice empire there and their fear alone kept everyone else in check. Anything challenging that status quo would be a severe threat, even if humanity didn't use the technology, some other species may have found the Titan and used it for their own gains, or even reverse engineered it in secret, jet off somewhere remote, then use their existing industry base to form a much larger military force to counter the Drej's.

One thing I wonder is how the Drej even learned of the Titan's development. Tek seemed to indicate that other alien spieces may have been aiding humanity through third parties or external supplying. While most aliens seem to despise humanity, their is absolutely no reason to assume they ALL do. Still, with a lot of different alien spieces on Earth, it's not hard to conclude that the Drej may have had a double agent working for them and they were able to get detailed information on the Titan. As shown by Korso, the Drej will employ even the likes of worst enemies to obtain information.

Had it not been for the nice energy absorbing abilities of the Titan, the ship would have been destroyed and with it all of humanity and what was left of Earth's biosphere. As noted, even if the Drej didn't find it before it made New Earth, humanity was still classed as a bunch of refugees so such a planet would be an easy target to find and decimate all over again.

I think it is also implied that the Drej entice a lot of races to treat humanity in cruel terms on purpose. Much like the Nazis towards the Jews.

[Darth Ruinus]

I always wondered why the last human survivors were just sitting around twiddling their thumbs and why they just didnt find a new planet somewhere.

[Gil Hamilton]

I suspect because they were moving targets when they were in drifter colonies. However, the problem is that they didn't so you "Titan A.E: 28 Days Later" when a second Drej planet killer shows up looking for the first and blasts Planet Bob out of the sky.

[Vertigo1]

I wonder if the Drej were distantly related to those stingray type energy creatures that inhabited the giant nebula? And why did the Drej have only one flagship?

I think it was a worldship, like a gigantic city more than a warship - and there's probably more than one. The thing is that with the Titan available to them, the humans can easily defeat a Drej planetbuster.

Neat factoid: Back when the movie was in development, they were originally going to have the planet surrounded by Drej motherships. (ala the Sathanas fleet surrounding Capella in Freespace2) For those of you that own the movie on DVD, you can see a picture of it there in the extras.

[Admiral Valdemar]

The Drej, pfft. They should have run into the Inhibitors when they expanded their empire beyond their home system.

Then you'd see a true arse whuppin'.

[Vertigo1]

The Drej, pfft. They should have run into the Inhibitors when they expanded their empire beyond their home system.

Then you'd see a true arse whuppin'.

To be honest, I didn't see the Drej as a competent threat. Their hand weapons are pathetic, and I've seen dynamite make bigger bangs than their fighters do....which are conveniently shot apart by HAND GUNS! The only competent thing they did in the movie was zap the bug cook. How such a force could have nearly wiped out humanity is beyond me.

[Admiral Valdemar]

That's my major niggle with the film. It's bad enough that humanity was... non-existent. I mean, we usually expect at least some form of a space empire given how humans are. To be made nearly extinct by a foe that has but one planet buster and has only rumours of being undefeatable, despite basic weapons blasting them apart, it is quite depressing.

You can only wonder what would happen if the Empire, Sathanas, Goa'uld or Inhibitors appeared. It'd be a massacre.

[CaptHawkeye]

It's also kind of stupid when you look at human equipment in the movies. Korso's blaster was able to vaporize a 2 meter wide hole out of a metal door. One shot was usually enough to kill a single Drej warrior. Even from Korso's little popgun. The guns on the Titan and the Valkerie could ice Drej fighters in single shots as well, not to mention the infantry rifles the characters were using on the boat ride. So one can't apply the "human technology wasn't optimized for the Drej!" mantra. Human technology was fairly strong, and it killed Drej laughably easy. And we're supposed to believe that humanity got its ass handed to it in the fight against them over Earth?

Maybe it's the Drej energy based nature. IE: They can't suffer population reduction. As long as the Queen exists the Drej can spawn in almost limitless quantity.

I also don't think the Drej planet destroyer was the only ship they had. The ship that attacked Earth and the ship that attacked the Titan differed in size greatly.

[Admiral Valdemar]

Well, as Dalek Sec said: You are only superior to us in one respect, you are better at dying!

[Darth Ruinus]

since the Drej are "pure energy" shouldnt they be able to spawn indefinately? Even if the Queen was destroyed maybe? perhaps tho it takes them time to do so (reassembling themselves or whatnot)

Also it seems funny how easy it is to escape from their prisons.

[CaptHawkeye]

With the prison bit I came to the conclusion the Drej let Cale escape.

Why?

1. The map's functionality - As we've seen, the map points to clues of the location of the Titan. Not the actual location of the Titan itself. The map only shows a clue one at a time. The Drej probably know humans can be desperate at times, resorting to things such as suicide. If Cale were to kill himself, any chance of finding the Titan soon would be lost.

2. They still had Korso - If Cale is allowed to escape, he can believe he gave the Drej the slip and continue his search for the Titan. Korso was on the Drej payroll and leaving a trail of breadcrumbs for them to follow.

[Zed Snardbody]

It's also kind of stupid when you look at human equipment in the movies. Korso's blaster was able to vaporize a 2 meter wide hole out of a metal door. One shot was usually enough to kill a single Drej warrior. Even from Korso's little popgun. The guns on the Titan and the Valkerie could ice Drej fighters in single shots as well, not to mention the infantry rifles the characters were using on the boat ride. So one can't apply the "human technology wasn't optimized for the Drej!" mantra. Human technology was fairly strong, and it killed Drej laughably easy. And we're supposed to believe that humanity got its ass handed to it in the fight against them over Earth?

Maybe it's the Drej energy based nature. IE: They can't suffer population reduction. As long as the Queen exists the Drej can spawn in almost limitless quantity.

I also don't think the Drej planet destroyer was the only ship they had. The ship that attacked Earth and the ship that attacked the Titan differed in size greatly.

So the human army was up to the fight. What if it was an all naval war and we just weren't able to field enough ships to make a proper showing.

[phred]

So the human army was up to the fight. What if it was an all naval war and we just weren't able to field enough ships to make a proper showing.

That was the idea I got from the first scene. Relations were strained and suddenly came to the breaking point when the Drej found out about Titan. Earth realized they were coming but didnt have enough time to put together a strong enough navy, so they tried to cut and run instead

[Admiral Valdemar]

Given the Drej fleet appeared and ploughed right through the Earth Defence Force with barely all the evac. ships making it out in time, I'd say whatever navy the humans had was either absent or totally inadequate in numbers even if they had the firepower. There's no real sign of them before Terra is toasted, though we don't know how much of a warning they had before the evacuation order was given. They may have been waiting till the last minute after several hours of fighting further out in Sol.

[Molyneux]

Think of it this way: if the Drej take the time to drain, say, a sun that no-one's using, they've got all the energy they need for a few trillion of those weak fighters. They've got literally limitless numbers in far less time than it takes for corporeal races to build up their fleets.