Autism: Your opinion on it

[Zor]

This is something i have been wondering. I personally have mild Asperger's syndrome and i am interested in this. I don't mean to offend anyone, i am just curious.

Autism is a term covering a large number of neurological conditions that have the brain wired diferently and as such, fuctions diferently in social intereactions, communication and interests. Many diferent levels adn types of Autism have. Autism can cause people to be social outcasts or have fuctional diferences. However, simply having Autism is not a prerequesit for failure and many people on the Autistic spectrum and there is some debate over weither or not it is a problem.

What is your opinion on Autism?

Zor

[Eris]

I'm not quite sure I understand the question. My opinion on autism? Well, it sucks to have, I can imagine. And it's a family of disorders I'd like to see treatable in the future, although I'm not optimistic for the immediate future save for an unexpected breakthrough in research.

Those are, loosely, my opinions on autism. What did you have in mind?

[Admiral Drason]

Yeah your increadibly vague on the question.

I personally feel that Autisom would suck to have and we should probably invest more time and resources into understanding it. Other than that I really don't know what eles to say.

[Starglider]

And it's a family of disorders I'd like to see treatable in the future, although I'm not optimistic for the immediate future save for an unexpected breakthrough in research.

Unfortunately saying stuff like this can easily get you mobbed by a load of people shouting about 'tyranny of the neurotypicals' and 'it isn't a disability, it's a different way of being, just as valid as yours, though of course you should still make special allowances for us'. This happens a lot on Slashdot, not sure how much of it is from genuine sufferers and how much is from wannabes trying to explain away the fact they have no social skills.

[Superman]

This is something i have been wondering. I personally have mild Asperger's syndrome and i am interested in this. I don't mean to offend anyone, i am just curious.

Autism is a term covering a large number of neurological conditions that have the brain wired diferently and as such, fuctions diferently in social intereactions, communication and interests. Many diferent levels adn types of Autism have. Autism can cause people to be social outcasts or have fuctional diferences. However, simply having Autism is not a prerequesit for failure and many people on the Autistic spectrum and there is some debate over weither or not it is a problem.

What is your opinion on Autism?

Zor

Zor, there are different opinions on this topic. I have a good friend who is a neurologist, and he rejects the idea that AS is 'mild autism' entirely.

If you don't mind me asking, were you diagnosed with this as a child or more recently?

[CaptainChewbacca]

I wasn't diagnosed until I was twenty-three. Growing up I was 'peculiar' and 'different' and 'in my own world'. I could do times-tables for hours, but I couldn't tell when someone was being sarcastic.

[Superman]

I wasn't diagnosed until I was twenty-three. Growing up I was 'peculiar' and 'different' and 'in my own world'. I could do times-tables for hours, but I couldn't tell when someone was being sarcastic.

You know CC, I've done some volunteer hours at the MIND clinic for a while, and I've heard what you just said almost verbatim a few times. If you don't mind, how did you get your diagnosis?

[Eris]

And it's a family of disorders I'd like to see treatable in the future, although I'm not optimistic for the immediate future save for an unexpected breakthrough in research.

Unfortunately saying stuff like this can easily get you mobbed by a load of people shouting about 'tyranny of the neurotypicals' and 'it isn't a disability, it's a different way of being, just as valid as yours, though of course you should still make special allowances for us'. This happens a lot on Slashdot, not sure how much of it is from genuine sufferers and how much is from wannabes trying to explain away the fact they have no social skills.

This way of thinking has always confused me. For all they would accuse someone like me of degrading people with autism or whatever happened to gbe in question, I think it's them who are really putting down the sufferers of the malady. It is objectively harder to live your life with many of these "different ways of being," and the people who deal with it should get help, and credit for overcoming the challenges that they do.

It very much feels like the whole fat as different, not bad movement that's gaining popularity as, well, people get fatter, at least in the US. Except it makes even less sense, since people who are overweight are usually responsible for it, so there's motivation for absolving themselves of guilt. People with autism and other disabilities honestly couldn't have been otherwise.

Interestingly enough, though, some forms of mild autism are actually a boon in certain situations. There are some jobs that are performed wonderfully well by an autistic person, better than someone without the disorder. Autism is a very strange thing. Way more research needs to happen.

[Zor]

If you don't mind me asking, were you diagnosed with this as a child or more recently?

Around when i was five.

Zor

[Kwizard]

And it's a family of disorders I'd like to see treatable in the future, although I'm not optimistic for the immediate future save for an unexpected breakthrough in research.

Unfortunately saying stuff like this can easily get you mobbed by a load of people shouting about 'tyranny of the neurotypicals' and 'it isn't a disability, it's a different way of being, just as valid as yours, though of course you should still make special allowances for us'. This happens a lot on Slashdot, not sure how much of it is from genuine sufferers and how much is from wannabes trying to explain away the fact they have no social skills.

That crowd annoys me to no end. For as long as I can remember I've lived with a severely autistic older brother - he couldn't possibly take care of himself, has a very limited ability to communicate, etc. Understanding the nature of this disorder held my interest from the beginning, but it seems that there aren't enough people out there willing to invest in research.

People like the Slashdot members you mentioned worry me - efforts to probe the disorder could easily be labeled by such crowds as "unnatural" or seen as programs to weed out abnormal genes. That phase wouldn't even come first, would it? After all, the human genome isn't exactly like a rain forest teeming with undiscovered and easy-to-exterminate species. We presumably have to map out the brain in great detail before hacking away at its functions.

[Boyish-Tigerlilly]

Well, I don't really know what you want us to say about Autism. Autism is my field of specialization. What is it in you have in mind?

One of my opinions is that parents need to be careful when they learn their child is diagnosed by Autism, and at this time, doctors and professionals should make very clear what methods are useful and actually work to treat the disability rather than let parents go off on their happy own and find shit.

While it's good to have parental involvement, I wouldn't "empower" them without giving them some direction, resources, etc. A lot of parents rush out in desperation and unfortunately get sucked into "alternative treatments" which are bullshit, don't work.

Parents should also know that one method, although it has utility for most, might not work for all. There are some alternative methods which aren't bullshit.

For instance, ABA and discrete trial training are excellent core methods to help children with Autism Spectrum Disorder, but often, people think this is the FIRST thing they should try, the only thing they should try, and they get depressed when it doesn't work with some children who have difficulty with differentiation.

Then you have PECS. It's neat, it's simple, and it has a good track record of working. A lot of parents don't know what the hell it is, and even some educators don't.


But again, what do you mean in specific? Opinions on what? Treatment? Causes? Why the education departments of schools suck on this topic?

[Johonebesus]

Back when I was seeing some doctors, one of them suggested I might have Asperger's. Only remembering a bit from my Psy 101 I was quite put off at being diagnosed as Autistic, but assured me Asperger's isn't classical Autism.

Of course, while I am sure I am a nut, I don't think I'm autistic. I can't memorize anything and always made D's and F's in elementary math because I couldn't learn my times tables or squares. It wasn't until geometry and trigonometry that I started to do well in math. I didn't stare at things catatonically for hours, or become obsessed with narrow topics. I do have a pathological lack of social instinct, like failing to interpret or utilize tone-of-voice and facial expressions, or being able to tell what is socially acceptable and what isn't, but I have no problem empathising. Whatever is wrong with me, I don't think it's Autism.

That being said, if an Autistic or Asperger's patient has an even more difficult time interacting with people, I would call that a disability. I have a hard enough time getting along with coworkers, and I've never managed to have a romantic relationship (though the lack of opportunity in this region certainly doesn't help). I don't see how I could even hold a job or go to the store if it were substantially worse. It seems to me silly to insist that Autism and Asperger's Syndrome aren't ailments to be treated if at all possible.

[Boyish-Tigerlilly]

Well, if you do have Aspergers Syndrome, it wouldn't be a surprise that you don't have a lot of the characteristics of autistic individuals. Aspergers is largely without the major detriments. It's rather high functioning.

Although Autism and Aspergers tend to overlap in social skills, Aspergers tends not to be as severe. You do say you have difficulty with socioemotional interpretation and pragmatics (receptive and expressive language). That seems to fit.

I can't diagnose you on the internet, obviously, but from what you say your core traits are and are not, I wouldn't say you have "Autism." It seems you have a relatively mild version of Aspergers.

[Singular Intellect]

My only direct experience with Autism has been with one or two individuals who admitted having it.

So far it irritates the shit out of me because in each case they always harp on about how having it makes them special and they like to rattle off names of famous or influential people who had it (or at least so they claim). Usually in the vein of 'smarter' or 'more creative' or some other self deluded bullshit.

Because as we all know Autism makes people special and people not affected by it cannot be...oh wait.

[Boyish-Tigerlilly]

Yes, Bubble Boy. There are many Autistic children who blurt out things that are ultimately irritating or inconsiderate. That's often a consequence of having Autism. That tends to be part of their social malfunctioning, but the behavior can be properly dealt with through training. It just takes time, effort, and often, a lot of money (ABA programmes are often notoriously expensive).

[Singular Intellect]

Yes, Bubble Boy. There are many Autistic children who blurt out things that are ultimately irritating or inconsiderate. That's often a consequence of having Autism. That tends to be part of their social malfunctioning, but the behavior can be properly dealt with through training. It just takes time, effort, and often, a lot of money (ABA programmes are often notoriously expensive).

The ones I've dealt with were adults, so presumeably they didn't get that benefit or it didn't work for them.

[Lisa]

I've only known a few people with it, 2 of them were "functional" in that they could go to work, be trusted with making their own dinner and cleaning after themselves, my friend's kid on the other hand, was none of that, and was your typical off in ones world, unable to communicate with the rest of the world (i don't believe he's said more then 2 words to me), even when fighting with his brother and sisters he's isolated. The first two I mentioned I found I didn't like them, and thus didn't hang around them much (one of them had a grasp on reality and was just annoying, the other was convinced fantasy was reality).

It would be nice if it could be treated, but I'm not sure severe cases like my friend's kid are really treatable any time in the near future.... I'm not sure even what causes it, but anything that makes the tortured have better lives, i'm all for it.... If there was a cure, at what point would rejecting treatment be allowed?

[Starglider]

People like the Slashdot members you mentioned worry me - efforts to probe the disorder could easily be labeled by such crowds as "unnatural" or seen as programs to weed out abnormal genes. That phase wouldn't even come first, would it? After all, the human genome isn't exactly like a rain forest teeming with undiscovered and easy-to-exterminate species. We presumably have to map out the brain in great detail before hacking away at its functions.

Generally research and treatment of severely disabled people is ok. The criticism comes if you say anything like 'we as much as possible prevent children from developing autism', similar to the problems you get if you suggest that all profoundly deaf children should be given cochlea implants; 'you are trying to destroy our deaf culture!!!1!11!'.

[Darth Servo]

I hope I never have any children thus afflicted. There's my opinion of it.

[Boyish-Tigerlilly]

I've only known a few people with it, 2 of them were "functional" in that they could go to work, be trusted with making their own dinner and cleaning after themselves, my friend's kid on the other hand, was none of that, and was your typical off in ones world, unable to communicate with the rest of the world (i don't believe he's said more then 2 words to me), even when fighting with his brother and sisters he's isolated. The first two I mentioned I found I didn't like them, and thus didn't hang around them much (one of them had a grasp on reality and was just annoying, the other was convinced fantasy was reality).

It would be nice if it could be treated, but I'm not sure severe cases like my friend's kid are really treatable any time in the near future.... I'm not sure even what causes it, but anything that makes the tortured have better lives, i'm all for it.... If there was a cure, at what point would rejecting treatment be allowed?

That is very unfortunate yes. Sadly, a lot of educators are not prepared to deal with children who have severe Autism. Every cause is unique, so not all methods will always work for every kid. However, there have been clinical demonstrations of dual ABA/PECS programmes that have significantly improved the life quality of children with severe Autism.

I would recommend the book Turn Around Bright Eyes. It gives a brief treatment narrative of a PECS programme for a particular family's child. This was a kid who wobbled in the corner, wouldn't look at you when you spoke to him, often screamed and hit his head against the wall, couldn't speak, etc. They finally did circumvent most of those problems, but it took a lot of work. The family spent probably over ten grand to do it, and they experienced multiple programme failures. They eventually had to send their child to a special PECS summercamp with individualized treatment. That's largely what did it.

One day after countless trials, he came up to his mother and asked her for a cookie, and it was continual progress from there on.

[SirNitram]

It's a flaw in the hardware, not the person. Those who stamp their feet over the importance of accepting neurodivergence need kicked in the balls until they realize how much they're going to handicap people with these disorders, as well as the search for the cause, treatment, and someday cure. And those who let it define themselves are weak.

That's my opinion.

[Big Orange]

How is Austism different from Psychopathy? I get the impression that many sociopaths or psychopaths have good to excellent social skills but are pathologically selfish, deceitful and antagonistic with it.

[CaptainChewbacca]

I wasn't diagnosed until I was twenty-three. Growing up I was 'peculiar' and 'different' and 'in my own world'. I could do times-tables for hours, but I couldn't tell when someone was being sarcastic.

You know CC, I've done some volunteer hours at the MIND clinic for a while, and I've heard what you just said almost verbatim a few times. If you don't mind, how did you get your diagnosis?

For my first 'real' job I needed military clearance, and they do a psych-screening with that. I came back just enough off-normal to throw up some red flags and send me to a follow-up evaluation.

How is Austism different from Psychopathy? I get the impression that many sociopaths or psychopaths have good to excellent social skills but are pathologically selfish, deceitful and antagonistic with it.

Autistics have incredibly POOR social skills, in general, as well as relational and spatial thinking, but can be incredibly gifted in aspects of memory, lexia, and mathematics.

[Big Orange]

Autistics have incredibly POOR social skills, in general, as well as relational and spatial thinking, but can be incredibly gifted in aspects of memory, lexia, and mathematics.

What are the psychopaths like in comparison, apart from being chronic arseholes?

[Boyish-Tigerlilly]

Both Sociopaths and Psychopaths are often, but not always, able to have good outward social skills. Whereas many Autistic children lack receptive and expressive language skills (verbal and non-verbal on a spectrum of severity), sociopaths usually don't. They simply lack empathy and are narcissistic. They enjoy manipulating others for their own benefit.

Depending on the intelligence of the pyscho and sociopath, he is fully capable of understanding moral customs or social mores and the pragmatics of communication. He just doesn't give a shit unless it benefits him.

They can project their emotions, read yours, and use interpersonal generally far better than those of the autistic. Many are often so good that they are often very good manipulators.

That's generally not characteristic of someone who's autistic. Sometimes, people who are autistic can seem assholish because they blurt things out, but that's due to a misunderstanding or difficulty utilizing communicative pragmatics. A sociopath or psycho wouldn't do that in public, usually, unless he's an idiot, because it would harm himself.