Dr.Who S29E12 "The Sound Of Drums"

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2007-06-25 05:56pm

And I'd have preferred it if Jack had taken off the Master's head with .455 Webley. Sadly, we have to live with what we have - which is, aside from some awesome Master/Doctor stuff and the whole 'drums' thing, pretty average. Oh no, the baddie caught the Doctor! GOSH! His female companion will save Earth from the hordes of flying badguys! NEVER SEEN THAT BEFORE! I wonder what will happen to the Valiant, I hope it's safely parked NEXT TO THE GIANT RIFT IT CREATED LOL.

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2007-06-25 06:47pm

You're no fun, Stark.

And I thought the Webley was an auto in .38. My mistake.

Big Orange · Post by **Big Orange** » 2007-06-25 07:49pm

Stark wrote:I love watching Orange make shit up.

Here's more plot suggestions from my arsehole

- "Utopia" is perhaps the Master's Bizarro-TARDIS that is waiting for all those human refugees and it captures them all, converting them into those Taclofane drones, then finally released from the vast bowls of the Bizarro-TARDIS by the Paradox Machine in the Doctor's own TARDIS. The Master's essence was extracted from the Eye of Harmony's central hub back in Gallifrey then placed into a new cloned body after his old body was destroyed in the Eye's entry point in the Doc's TARDIS, that joins the current series up with the ill fated TV movie adequately enough (but it'll surely whitewash a lot of Doctor Who EU material). Season Two of Torchwood should be about how the slow children of Torchwood Three are easily hoodwinked by the Master into going up into the depths of the Himalayans, run low on supplies and then hopefully resorting to cannibalism with Ianto being the first to be eaten.

And if Captain Jack went up to the Master then either blasted his brains out or snapped his neck, the Master would've simply regenerated and the good guys then swiftly getting gunned down by the RAF troops, police SWAT and Master henchpersons milling about.

Lost Soal wrote: He saw through nothing, and cared for international law only so far as it served his purpose. He was the typical arrogant US President who believes they should be running everything. He was probably the same president who tried take over during the Christmas Invasion.
You only have to look at his responce to the Toclaphane;
"You are not The Master"
"I can be your master if you want"

If he was such a prick, how come he never took direct action against the Master and followed UN guidelines, despite mostly seeing the Master for what he was? He gave multiple threats and ultimatums against the Master, but he had his arms tied and he patiently allowed the Master to attend the diplomatic conference onboard the Valiant: heck he even allowed the UNIT guards to leave the meeting chamber and bravely faced the Toclafane alone (it was not the President's fault that the Master was secretly in command of six billion balls of doom).

Flakin · Post by **Flakin** » 2007-06-25 09:13pm

Bounty wrote:
Oh yeah, Christoph 'Doom' Schneider. Best doomsday music EVER. Here come the drums here come the drums.....hey there baby baby.....
...the album's called "Here come the drums". Damn, I hadn't even noticed that

If anyone wants to here this wonderfully employed little bit of unexpected dance music in full, YouTube has it here.

For some reason I felt a bit let down by this episode. John Simm played a great Master, but at the same time the episode itself was just lacking in something.

And he's been around for 18 months and in that time developed a worldwide satellite system and been instrumental in bringing to life and building Captain Scarlets' hangout? Don't think so.

Maybe it's a bit of "The Two Towers" syndrome, being the middle in a three parter. I hope so.

Flakin · Post by **Flakin** » 2007-06-25 09:14pm

I fail, can a mod please fix that url tag for me? Thanks.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2007-06-26 12:55am

Big Orange wrote:And if Captain Jack went up to the Master then either blasted his brains out or snapped his neck, the Master would've simply regenerated and the good guys then swiftly getting gunned down by the RAF troops, police SWAT and Master henchpersons milling about.

Wrong. Only Jack would be visible, and he's - get this - immortal. How is 'blowing his head off and then getting temporarily put to sleep' any worse than 'do absolutely nothing while the Master becomes the greatest mass murderer in history, and then decide to WALK OVER AND GIVE HIM A HUG, thus being put to sleep for NOTHING'. See? He got killed ANYWAY, only his way he achieved nothing. And these ARE the henchmen who can't catch three identified terrorists with a known starting location. I bet they only found her flat because she was in the phone book! And given the chance, the Master TOTALLY IGNORES THEM, not even killing the Doctor or interfering with Martha's 'walk around looking lost then porting out' plan.

Ironically, after saying he's not going to explain his plan so the Doctor can stop him, he was absolutely CHOCKERS with expository dialogue this time around. 18 months in London can do that to a man, I imagine.

I bought some chips, but I don't think anyone saw me. It's one of those robotic chip shops. But the robots don't talk to the police.

And honestly I'd just love to see a Time Lord regenerate from a missing head. No doubt they can, but let's see him be insane with a 100% new brain!

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2007-06-26 01:54am

And I totally wanted the Master to break into song.

I ran - I ran so far away. I just ran - I ran all night and day! I couldn't get away. FLOATING IN A BEAM OF LIGHT WITH YOU!

Flock of Seagulls = instant win. Also, on the bridge/conference room of Plot Device, I expected song. I have been disappointed for the last time.

Big Orange · Post by **Big Orange** » 2007-06-26 07:05am

Stark wrote: Wrong. Only Jack would be visible, and he's - get this - immortal. How is 'blowing his head off and then getting temporarily put to sleep' any worse than 'do absolutely nothing while the Master becomes the greatest mass murderer in history, and then decide to WALK OVER AND GIVE HIM A HUG, thus being put to sleep for NOTHING'. See? He got killed ANYWAY, only his way he achieved nothing.

Captain Jack is not just immortal in not aging and living forever, but he's also essentially indestructible to practically everything and does not disintegrate when totally exposed to the Time Vortex or funky super radiation that turns normal people into ash - if Jack did snuck up and attempted to kill the Master then the accompanying soldiers and guards would've kept him down through continuingly shooting him, then restrained him rather than try to kill him.

And these ARE the henchmen who can't catch three identified terrorists with a known starting location. I bet they only found her flat because she was in the phone book! And given the chance, the Master TOTALLY IGNORES THEM, not even killing the Doctor or interfering with Martha's 'walk around looking lost then porting out' plan.

*snip*

I bought some chips, but I don't think anyone saw me. It's one of those robotic chip shops. But the robots don't talk to the police.

The Master was obviously leading them into trap onboard the Valiant - he turned the authorities against the Doctor to isolate his group from getting outside help and force them to get to him quicker so he could get the Doctor where he wanted (for gloating). The Master's henchmen and London police seemed to be herding the Doctor's team and blocking them off from assistance, rather than doggedly chasing after them.

And honestly I'd just love to see a Time Lord regenerate from a missing head. No doubt they can, but let's see him be insane with a 100% new brain!

Jack had the intention of breaking the Master's neck, not destroying his brain...

Yuri2356 · Post by **Yuri2356** » 2007-06-26 11:26am

Wouldn't getting killed and then regenerating in such a wide open space be sort of Bad for the Master's plans? I don't think archangel's signal will quite be able to make the people of Brittain ignore seeing their Prime Minister drop dead, get engulfed in a light show, and then stand up as a completely different man...

As for the trans-dimentional deathballs, I have a feeling that they're part of a species similar to the Gelth from The Unquiet Dead. (And not just 'cause they reused a voice actor) Annother race that suffered horribly, or was perhaps destroyed altogeater, by collateral damage from the Time War. I recall quite clearly how emotional the Ninth Doctor got when the Nestene confronted him about what it has lost during the war, and it was shown the he carried a lot of guilt over what happened to the bystanders. (Possibly as a direct result of whatever he did to end the war)

Given the childlike behavior of the drones, and their willingess to do as the Master commands, it may even be that the Time Lords used them in some way before or during the War which made them somewhat blindly trusting of Time Lords, leading to tragic destruction.

But really, I'm just babbling here, and would just prefer if they werren't baby Time Lords / SuperDaleks / Some fusion of the two. The Utopia Humans or Futurekind would be ok, but some fresh source of survivors from these civilizations which were supposedly annihilated in a rediculously high-tech war. It was enough to have three separate groups of Daleks escape the carnage, can we just stick with the two Time Lords?

Drooling Iguana · Post by **Drooling Iguana** » 2007-06-26 12:32pm

Yuri2356 wrote:Wouldn't getting killed and then regenerating in such a wide open space be sort of Bad for the Master's plans? I don't think archangel's signal will quite be able to make the people of Brittain ignore seeing their Prime Minister drop dead, get engulfed in a light show, and then stand up as a completely different man...

Really?

Starglider · Post by **Starglider** » 2007-06-26 12:39pm

Yuri2356 wrote:It was enough to have three separate groups of Daleks escape the carnage, can we just stick with the two Time Lords?

No. We must have some plotline where Romana and the Rani are trapped inside a stasis field, as it was the only way for Romana to stop the Rani from doing something awful. Then the Doctor comes along and breaks the field and they have to find a new way to stop the Rani. Why? Because the Rani is cool and Romana is awesome. That is all the justification required.

Oh and as per Valdemar's request Romana will have regenerated into a catgirl.

Drooling Iguana · Post by **Drooling Iguana** » 2007-06-26 01:01pm

The only Rani episode I've seen is the one where the Sixth Doctor regenerates into the Seventh, but based on her performance in that I'm not terribly eager to see her again. Unless it's so that she can make out with Romana III.

Starglider · Post by **Starglider** » 2007-06-26 01:26pm

Drooling Iguana wrote:Unless it's so that she can make out with Romana III.

I can see RTD going for that.

Crazedwraith · Post by **Crazedwraith** » 2007-06-26 01:33pm

Drooling Iguana wrote:
Yuri2356 wrote:Wouldn't getting killed and then regenerating in such a wide open space be sort of Bad for the Master's plans? I don't think archangel's signal will quite be able to make the people of Brittain ignore seeing their Prime Minister drop dead, get engulfed in a light show, and then stand up as a completely different man...
Really?

That sir is awesome! I must of missed that being broadcast. I can't beleive they got Tennant to actually do that. I assumed from the blurb that it would be their Blair impression regenerating into a Tennat impression, rather than Tennant himself.

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2007-06-26 07:33pm

Girls getting it on and more insane Master are needed. I could live with the world ending, The Doctor being a POW and everyone else doomed so long as The Simm-Master and assorted eye candy rule the day in the end.

Though I expect his new found joy of actually winning will be dealt with soon enough.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2007-06-26 07:59pm

Big Orange wrote:
Stark wrote: Wrong. Only Jack would be visible, and he's - get this - immortal. How is 'blowing his head off and then getting temporarily put to sleep' any worse than 'do absolutely nothing while the Master becomes the greatest mass murderer in history, and then decide to WALK OVER AND GIVE HIM A HUG, thus being put to sleep for NOTHING'. See? He got killed ANYWAY, only his way he achieved nothing.

Captain Jack is not just immortal in not aging and living forever, but he's also essentially indestructible to practically everything and does not disintegrate when totally exposed to the Time Vortex or funky super radiation that turns normal people into ash - if Jack did snuck up and attempted to kill the Master then the accompanying soldiers and guards would've kept him down through continuingly shooting him, then restrained him rather than try to kill him.

FUCK you're stupid. The most offensive part is you presume to lecture me, when you CAN'T EVEN FUCKING READ.

There's this phrase up there, genius. The phrase I'm thinking of is 'blow his head off'. What does that mean to you? Here's a hint - it's a doing word! It involves killing someone instantly with a gun from across the room, NOT WALK OVER AND GIVE HIM A HUG. If you honestly think an invisible man can't shoot someone, I hope you don't choke on the kool-aid.

In short, you're an idiot and I hate you. You're not just ignorant, you're arrogant and can't read. If you had a fucking BRAIN between your ears you'd say 'Jack may be out of ammunition'. But NO, you decide to argue with me by totally ignoring the fucking point and dribbling out scifi trivia EVERYONE IN THIS THREAD ALREADY KNOWS.

The Master was obviously leading them into trap onboard the Valiant - he turned the authorities against the Doctor to isolate his group from getting outside help and force them to get to him quicker so he could get the Doctor where he wanted (for gloating). The Master's henchmen and London police seemed to be herding the Doctor's team and blocking them off from assistance, rather than doggedly chasing after them.

RUN! RUN FOR YOUR LIFE! Oh, no, wait, nevermind. Where were the police shown to ever be herding them? Or is this another pathetic Orange invention? I could mention that I already address the 'lol I gloat now' thing, but what's the point? You'd probably then make a post DESCRIBING THE GLOATING as if I didn't just fucking mention it.

Jack had the intention of breaking the Master's neck, not destroying his brain...

Try reading you fucking retard. Oh wait, you're off in fanfic fantasy-land! Let's pretend Stark never described taking off the Master's head with a firearm, la la la la la la la!

Also, thanks for responding to the substance of that excerpt, by contributing to the 'what level of trauma can a Time Lord regenerate from' discussion. You're so insightful!

Valds, you do realise you just encouraged them to turn Doctor Who into Torchwood, right? Now you've done it!

Admiral Valdemar · Post by **Admiral Valdemar** » 2007-06-26 08:05pm

Stark wrote:
Valds, you do realise you just encouraged them to turn Doctor Who into Torchwood, right? Now you've done it!

As opposed to "Quick! Hit the reset button, an alien invasion is going to nuke Earth and the Doctor needs to stop the Daleks EX-TER-MIN-ATING/Cybermen deleting/Master decimating all and sundry before his companions cop it!".

As much fun as I'm now having watching The Master here, I know it will end in tears and we'll have just seen the third aborted invasion of Earth. Although The Master seems to have actually completed enslaving Earth as his first of many bigger objectives. Sucks to be the last Dalek/Cyberman watching from the void as he gets all the publicity.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2007-06-26 08:25pm

That's pretty much why I'm meh about the finale, actually: seen it all before, and the jeopardy is just *too big* to not be wrapped up by Martha God of Thunder in time for tea. Maybe it'll all work out, but this 'we need flying badguys killing people in the finale it's the law' stuff is just a distraction from the Doctor/Master stuff and the whole drumming thing. Scope for some good Doctor hypocrisy, though, so all is not lost... yet.

PS maybe it's Abbadon, he's back again like his 40k counterpart to get ruled again.

Bluewolf · Post by **Bluewolf** » 2007-06-27 06:10am

Out intrest Stark, how would you of done this three parter?(so far)

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2007-06-27 06:59am

I'm not sure, really: Utopia was pretty much 100% awesome. It's just the choice of the two-three part break: the scene on the bridge of the Valiant was one of the weakest of the episode, and it's supposed to carry the 'cliffhanger'. The heroes being basically passive the whole episode doesn't help the obvious writers fiat all over the place. I think it may well work out fine, but less McGann-like staring wistfully for the Doctor and more emphasis on their conflict would have been a huge improvement.

The *idea* of the Doctor being on the back foot is a good one, particularly with Tennant's fantastic performance in Utopia. Perhaps a less ambitious, multi-aspect plot would have served the 'bring back the Master' story better - they haven't just brought back the Master, they're delivering bricks of exposition, developing a new alien AND the bizarre 'drums' thing, AND handwaving things like Archangel, AND they're working the Doctor/Master angle, all in a two-parter. Simply bringing the Master back and putting him in conflict with the Doctor would have been fine, but dredging up the Time Lords and putting the whole world in flamboyant peril at the same time is just a bit much for 45m.

As a plus, we get more Barrowman-waving-guns-around action, which is always good.

frogcurry · Post by **frogcurry** » 2007-06-28 04:12pm

What the hell is going on with the dancing totty standing next to the Master? Is she certifiable or just not able to grasp that her species is now obsolete?

Bounty · Post by **Bounty** » 2007-06-28 04:20pm

frogcurry wrote:What the hell is going on with the dancing totty standing next to the Master? Is she certifiable or just not able to grasp that her species is now obsolete?

I'm guessing certifiable, or at least drunk with power, but considering the Master's skill in hypnotism she may just had her brain fritzed.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2007-06-28 05:33pm

From the rest of the episode, she's clearly an idiot. We can't necessarily blame the Master for that.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2007-06-28 06:06pm

frogcurry wrote:What the hell is going on with the dancing totty standing next to the Master? Is she certifiable or just not able to grasp that her species is now obsolete?

Perhaps you simply do not comprehend how well endowed you can be with a binary vasular system backing you up.

Big Orange · Post by **Big Orange** » 2007-06-29 07:21pm

Stark wrote:
Big Orange wrote: *Snip histrionics*

Try reading you fucking retard. Oh wait, you're off in fanfic fantasy-land! Let's pretend Stark never described taking off the Master's head with a firearm, la la la la la la la!

Also, thanks for responding to the substance of that excerpt, by contributing to the 'what level of trauma can a Time Lord regenerate from' discussion. You're so insightful!

Valds, you do realise you just encouraged them to turn Doctor Who into Torchwood, right? Now you've done it!

The Doctor implicitly stated that the TARDIS keys were effective at hiding from human senses but they were however not totally foolproof, that their "spell" could be broken and they would be noticed if they made sudden obvious actions (like blowing off the head of the PM for example). And the Master could mostly sense them with their keys on anyway and was armed with his laser screwdriver, so he could feasibly react with it if Jack or the others did anything stupid.

And law enforcement officers or Master goons not rapidly converging in on the Doctor in the centre of a dense urban area is either the Master intentionally holding them back or a minor plothole.

And as for the ending of tomorrow's episode - I also really hope that their is not going to be another Deus-Ex resolution and that the problem with the Master ruling over Earth would not go away properly until next season or the Christmas special (but I'll probably be setting myself up for a disappointment).

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Dr.Who S29E12 "The Sound Of Drums"

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