Chris Benoit & Family Dead. Murder-Suicide

[Darth Wong]

You can respect a persons work, if not the person.

What is there to respect? Is a wrestler more deserving of "respect for his work" than any other occupation? If he turned out to be a cop, would you still be falling over yourself trying to show "respect" for his professional work despite the fact that he did something absolutely horrible?

You're just looking for excuses to say something, anything positive about this worthless piece of shit excuse for a human being. Get over it. He was nothing more than a roid-filled pseudo-sport fucktard.

And yes, I will call him a worthless piece of shit excuse for a human being even if it turns out to be "roid rage", for the same reason that I despise drunk drivers. It is still a voluntary choice to put everyone around you at risk, therefore you are liable for whatever actions you commit while under the influence. If you didn't want to do something bad while under the influence, you shouldn't take the junk.

[haas mark]

Thank you for the advanced forensic analysis, Matlock. And for demonstrating the idiotic lengths people will go to in order to defend their favourite shithead media pseudo-sports idols. I'll bet you thought people were fucking idiots to reflexively defend OJ Simpson, didn't you? But of course, you grew up with a different generation of sports heroes, and when one of them committed a murder, guess what: you reacted exactly the same way.

No, I see why people won't defend him or his actions; in fact, neither do I. I just don't support the idea that this somehow nullifies or erases any positive accomplishments.

As far as the timeline goes, it just seems off, mainly because, how would he be able to have so much time between the deaths without it being somehow interfered with? To me, that makes no sense. On the other hand, some other information has been brought to light to me that may solve that problem:

Source

Canadian female Pam Winthrope told News 1130 in Canada that Chris Benoit's son had a genetic condition called Fragile X syndrome.

According to WebMD, "Fragile X Syndrome is a defect of the X chromosome which causes mild mental retardation. The disorder occurs more frequently and severely among males than females. This condition is the leading known familial cause of mental retardation in the United States. Language delays, behavioral problems, autism or autistic-like behavior (including poor eye contact and hand-flapping), enlarged external genitalia (macroorchidism), large or prominent ears, hyperactivity, delayed motor development and/or poor sensory skills are among the wide range of symptoms associated with this disorder."

Winthrope, whose son also suffers from the condition, told the Canadian news outlet that her husband reached out to Benoit five years ago in an attempt to increase awareness about Fragile X.

She told News 1130, "We talked to him because I was trying to set up a support group in BC and in Canada, we only have a couple of them. My husband was struggling when we got diagnosed with our son, and Chris was struggling with his. They talked for a few minutes and then he said he didn't want to be a public face for Fragile X, he just wanted to keep it really, really quiet."

Winthrope noted that the lack of support for those affected by the disorder can tear families apart. Nonetheless, "she couldn't believe the news that Benoit had taken his life along with his wife and 7-year-old son," wrote News 1130.

[Darth Wong]

No, I see why people won't defend him or his actions; in fact, neither do I. I just don't support the idea that this somehow nullifies or erases any positive accomplishments.

Are you seriously suggesting that prancing around on TV in a pair of Speedos while flexing roid-enhanced muscles is such a grand accomplishment that it should not be considered inconsequential in light of his horrific crime?

As far as the timeline goes, it just seems off, mainly because, how would he be able to have so much time between the deaths without it being somehow interfered with? To me, that makes no sense.

So? To a creationist, evolution doesn't make sense. You have to show WHY it is illogical, rather than just mumbling that it strikes you as "fishy" or doesn't make sense to you without explaining the disconnect. Is there some particular reason why someone should have barged into his fucking house during the weekend and interrupted him?

[haas mark]

No, I see why people won't defend him or his actions; in fact, neither do I. I just don't support the idea that this somehow nullifies or erases any positive accomplishments.

Are you seriously suggesting that prancing around on TV in a pair of Speedos while flexing roid-enhanced muscles is such a grand accomplishment that it should not be considered inconsequential in light of his horrific crime?

No, I am not, that's not important in lieu of recent events, in the least. Even as a fan of wrestling the whole situation is rather confusing, as he was someone that I did admire as an athlete. Though, I feel that later on, when maybe it's a little less heated of an issue, that one way or another, these kinds of things are not necessarily quantifiable.

Granted, yes, he has committed murder, that much is plainly clear. However, in the span of his life, there were good things that he had done (as well as many others in the business), too (most of those relating to charities of some form or another, one notable one being the Make a Wish Foundation). That is what I mean by "positive accomplishments," not his ability in the ring or as an athlete.

So? To a creationist, evolution doesn't make sense. You have to show WHY it is illogical, rather than just mumbling that it strikes you as "fishy" or doesn't make sense to you without explaining the disconnect. Is there some particular reason why someone should have barged into his fucking house during the weekend and interrupted him?

I'm not thinking in regards to third party, I'm thinking in regards to his family. The idea is that he killed his wife, then his child several hours later. Though, again, more information has been brought to light, and I see where the possibilities may lie in that area.

[Darth Wong]

No, I am not, that's not important in lieu of recent events, in the least. Even as a fan of wrestling the whole situation is rather confusing, as he was someone that I did admire as an athlete. Though, I feel that later on, when maybe it's a little less heated of an issue, that one way or another, these kinds of things are not necessarily quantifiable.

Granted, yes, he has committed murder, that much is plainly clear. However, in the span of his life, there were good things that he had done (as well as many others in the business), too (most of those relating to charities of some form or another, one notable one being the Make a Wish Foundation). That is what I mean by "positive accomplishments," not his ability in the ring or as an athlete.

Being a good person or a bad one is not a mathematical function where you try to add up positives and cancel out a huge negative. A murderer who did volunteer work for 10 years before committing murder is still a fucking murderer. Child-molesting priests shouldn't get special consideration for their charity work; why should this clown get any?

I'm not thinking in regards to third party, I'm thinking in regards to his family. The idea is that he killed his wife, then his child several hours later. Though, again, more information has been brought to light, and I see where the possibilities may lie in that area.

You never did explain what was "fishy" about this even before new information came to light. Nothing about it suggested that there was anything wrong with the police conclusion. You were just looking for excuses.

[haas mark]

Being a good person or a bad one is not a mathematical function where you try to add up positives and cancel out a huge negative. A murderer who did volunteer work for 10 years before committing murder is still a fucking murderer.

Show me precisely where I denied that.

You never did explain what was "fishy" about this even before new information came to light. Nothing about it suggested that there was anything wrong with the police conclusion. You were just looking for excuses.

I thought I had. If not, then my mistake; I've been talking about this a lot of different places. Point conceded.

[Darth Wong]

Being a good person or a bad one is not a mathematical function where you try to add up positives and cancel out a huge negative. A murderer who did volunteer work for 10 years before committing murder is still a fucking murderer.

Show me precisely where I denied that.

The part where you keep whining about how people are being unfair to him by ignoring all of the good stuff he did before he decided to be a fucking monster.

[Flagg]

The only thing odd about the timeline is the fact that he seemed to have taken quite awhile to kill his kid after he strangled his wife. But that's probably just due to the circumstances of the crime. If I had to make an educated guess based on the apparent facts (and from watching way too much Court TV) I would say that he killed his wife on impulse, tried to figure out what he was going to do, decided to commit suicide, and then killed his kid so as not to leave him an orphan before finally hanging himself.

[haas mark]

Being a good person or a bad one is not a mathematical function where you try to add up positives and cancel out a huge negative. A murderer who did volunteer work for 10 years before committing murder is still a fucking murderer.

Show me precisely where I denied that.

The part where you keep whining about how people are being unfair to him by ignoring all of the good stuff he did before he decided to be a fucking monster.

So that means I said, "OMG HES NOT A MURDERRER!!!111!!"? Funny, because I thought you, of all people, would know by now how to read. I never said he was not a murderer, nor did I ever say anything to imply such. Yeah, I blatantly fanboy wanked, big fucking deal, but I never said he didn't kill his family. So, again, I'll ask you to show me where I said he wasn't a killer, criminal, whatever other word you have for it.

EDIT - Better yet, did I anywhere say that I condoned his actions per the murders?

[Havok]

I have to admit that I like watching wrestling sometimes. I will get back into it every couple of years, catch up on story lines, see who is grouped with who etc. Just a kids pastime I still follow up on.
Chris Benoit was always entertaining to watch... but he now falls into the category with O.J. Simpson and Robert Blake.
Yes, they were entertaining to watch and even root for, but they negated all that shit when they started killing people. Now they are just criminals, murderers. The only positive acknowledgment that Benoit will get from me is that he had the decency to off himself instead of making us watch some bullshit trial that could fuel our ridiculous media machine.

[haas mark]

And real quick, something else from WWE.com. They have a tendency to randomly delete things once in a while, so I'm quoting here, too:

link

Detailed WWE/Benoit timeline
Written: June 26, 2007

Below is a detailed WWE/Chris Benoit timeline from Saturday to Monday:

Saturday, June 23, 2007

Chris Benoit was scheduled to appear at the WWE SmackDown/ ECW live event in Beaumont, Texas

3:30pm
A co-worker received a voice message from Benoit. The message from Benoit stated he missed his flight and over slept and would be late to the WWE Live Event. The co-worker called Benoit back, Benoit confirmed everything he said in his voice message and sounded tired and groggy. Benoit then stated, “I love you”. The co-worker stated that it was “out of context.”

3:42pm
The same co-worker was concerned with Benoit’s tone and demeanor and called Benoit for a second time. Benoit did not answer the call and the co-worker left a message stating “just call me back.”

3:44pm
Benoit called the co-worker back stating he didn’t answer the call because he was on the phone with Delta changing his flight. Benoit stated he had a real stressful day due to Nancy and Daniel being sick with food poisoning. They discussed travel plans for the WWE Tour of Texas with Benoit still sounding groggy at this point according to the co-worker.

4:30pm
A co-worker who consistently travels with Benoit, called Benoit from outside Houston airport and Benoit answered. Benoit told the co-worker that Nancy was throwing up blood and that Daniel was also throwing up. Benoit thought they had food poisoning. Benoit stated he changed his flight and he would be arriving into Houston at 6:30pm. Benoit told the co-worker to drive onto the WWE event.

5:35pm
Benoit called WWE Talent Relations stating that his son was throwing up and that he and Nancy were in the hospital with their son, and that Benoit would be taking a later flight into Houston, landing late, but would make the WWE live event in Beaumont.

6:10pm
A representative of Talent Relations called Benoit. The representative from Talent Relations asked Benoit what time Benoit was getting into Beaumont. Benoit responded he was leaving Atlanta at 9:20pm Eastern time arriving into Houston at 9:24pm Central time. The representative from Talent Relations advised Benoit that it would be too late to make the WWE live event in Beaumont. Benoit apologized citing he had a family emergency. The representative from Talent Relations suggested to Benoit that instead of going to the WWE live event in Beaumont, Benoit should take the flight to Houston, rest up and be ready for the Vengeance Pay-Per-View event.

6:13pm
The representative from Talent Relations called Benoit to reconfirm the travel plans with no answer from Benoit. The representative from Talent Relations left a voice message to take the flight and rest up.



Sunday, June 24, 2007

Text messages sent to co-workers from Chris Benoit and Nancy Benoit’s cell phones:

Text Message 1
Sent to: Two Co-Workers (the same who had verbal correspondence with Benoit the day before)
From: Benoit’s cell phone
When: 6/24 at 3:53am from
Message: C, S. My physical address is 130 Green Meadow Lane. Fayetteville Georgia. 30215

Text Message 2
Sent to: Two Co-Workers (the same who had verbal correspondence with Benoit the day before)
From: Benoit’s cell phone
When: 6/24 at 3:53am
Message: The dogs are in the enclosed pool area. Garage side door is open

Text Message 3
Sent to: Two Co-Workers (the same who had verbal correspondence with Benoit the day before)
From: Nancy Benoit’s cell phone
When: 6/24 at 3:54am
Message: C, S. My physical address is 130 Green Meadow Lane. Fayetteville Georgia. 30215

Text Message 4
Sent to: Two Co-Workers (the same who had verbal correspondence with Benoit the day before)
From: Nancy Benoit’s cell phone
When: 6/24 at 3:55am
Message: C, S. My physical address is 130 Green Meadow Lane. Fayetteville Georgia. 30215

Text Message 5
Sent to: A Co-Worker who consistently traveled with Benoit
From: Nancy Benoit’s cell phone
When: 6/24 at 3:58am
Message: My address is 130 Green Meadow Lane. Fayetteville Georgia. 30215

WWE made several attempts to contact Benoit via phone and text messages, as well as, the local hospitals in the Atlanta area. As of 11:00 pm Sunday night there was no contact made with Benoit.



Monday, June 25, 2007

12:30pm
WWE was notified of text messages sent to the two co-workers.

12:45pm
WWE contacted the Fayetteville County Sheriff’s office and requested them to go to Benoit’s
residence

4:00pm
WWE received a call from the Fayetteville County Sheriff’s office, advising that they entered
the house of Benoit and found 3 deceased bodies (a male, a female and a child). The Fayette County Sheriff’s office has secured the house as a “major crime scene” and that the Fayette County Sheriff’s Office had no further information.

[Darth Wong]

So that means I said, "OMG HES NOT A MURDERRER!!!111!!"?

You implied exactly that, with your idiotic "fishy timeline" shit. A prime example of how you have been desperately looking for excuses to get him off the hook through this whole thread, like the fucking fanboy that you are.

Funny, because I thought you, of all people, would know by now how to read. I never said he was not a murderer, nor did I ever say anything to imply such.

You're a fucking liar. What was all that "fishy timeline" bullshit, or you taking that ridiculous "she killed the boy and then he AVENGED HIS SON" bullshit seriously?

Yeah, I blatantly fanboy wanked, big fucking deal, but I never said he didn't kill his family. So, again, I'll ask you to show me where I said he wasn't a killer, criminal, whatever other word you have for it.

See above. You never flat-out said he was innocent of killing his wife and son, but you certainly implied it.

EDIT - Better yet, did I anywhere say that I condoned his actions per the murders?

Yet again, you lie in defense of your favourite homoerotic Speedo hero. I never said you condoned murder, you lying cuntrag. I said that you keep making up excuses to keep saying good things about him even though he deserves none.

[haas mark]

So that means I said, "OMG HES NOT A MURDERRER!!!111!!"?

You implied exactly that, with your idiotic "fishy timeline" shit. A prime example of how you have been desperately looking for excuses to get him off the hook through this whole thread, like the fucking fanboy that you are.

So... being a fanboy = he's not a murderer. Right.

Funny, because I thought you, of all people, would know by now how to read. I never said he was not a murderer, nor did I ever say anything to imply such.

You're a fucking liar. What was all that "fishy timeline" bullshit, or you taking that ridiculous "she killed the boy and then he AVENGED HIS SON" bullshit seriously?

You really think I'm that stupid, then, don't you. First off, I'm not a liar, and secondly, I conceded that point, so get the fuck off my back.

Yeah, I blatantly fanboy wanked, big fucking deal, but I never said he didn't kill his family. So, again, I'll ask you to show me where I said he wasn't a killer, criminal, whatever other word you have for it.

See above. You never flat-out said he was innocent of killing his wife and son, but you certainly implied it.

I still don't see how I implied that he was innocent. I just said that his accomplishments prior were good.

EDIT - Better yet, did I anywhere say that I condoned his actions per the murders?

Yet again, you lie in defense of your favourite homoerotic Speedo hero. I never said you condoned murder, you lying cuntrag. I said that you keep making up excuses to keep saying good things about him even though he deserves none.

Boohoo, I defended his good deeds. Big fucking deal. In any regard, you keep saying that I implied that he's innocent, and you're still failing to show me HOW, because SOMEHOW fanboyism = his innocence. I don't see the connection there.

[Darth Wong]

So that means I said, "OMG HES NOT A MURDERRER!!!111!!"?

You implied exactly that, with your idiotic "fishy timeline" shit. A prime example of how you have been desperately looking for excuses to get him off the hook through this whole thread, like the fucking fanboy that you are.

So... being a fanboy = he's not a murderer. Right.

Again, you demonstrate that you're a lying cuntrag. I specifically mentioned your "fishy timeline" bullshit, yet you ignored that in your reply.

You really think I'm that stupid, then, don't you. First off, I'm not a liar, and secondly, I conceded that point, so get the fuck off my back.

Yes you are. You're a lying cuntrag, and you continue to demonstrate as much. And why the fuck should I get off your back, asshole? Do you think I've developed a fondness for lying cuntrags?

I still don't see how I implied that he was innocent. I just said that his accomplishments prior were good.

Again, you ignore the part about your "fishy timeline" bullshit, you lying cuntrag.

Boohoo, I defended his good deeds. Big fucking deal. In any regard, you keep saying that I implied that he's innocent, and you're still failing to show me HOW, because SOMEHOW fanboyism = his innocence. I don't see the connection there.

See above, lying cuntrag.

[haas mark]

Re: timeline:

You never did explain what was "fishy" about this even before new information came to light. Nothing about it suggested that there was anything wrong with the police conclusion. You were just looking for excuses.

I thought I had. If not, then my mistake; I've been talking about this a lot of different places. Point conceded.

My thoughts on the timeline were this:

One of the stories went that he killed Nancy on Saturday, his son on Sunday, himself on Monday. Another was that there is some delay in the timespan between each of the deaths (and as far as I know, the latter is the official word). What I saw as "fishy" was the time periods being so long, especially considering they smelled "decaying bodies" upon entering the house. (see page 2 where I posted the article on that)

Also from page 2 where I said something about it:

First off, his wife is both a smart and strong woman. Secondly, I highly doubt his son would've stuck around. So... the timeline seems off to me. Unless of course, son was somehow bound or something.

Turns out that she was the one bound, and it's likely that the kid could've been asleep, so either way I was wrong and your point's moot. And I'll point you to page 4, the second post on the page, where I posted this (emphasis added):

As far as the timeline goes, it just seems off, mainly because, how would he be able to have so much time between the deaths without it being somehow interfered with? To me, that makes no sense. On the other hand, some other information has been brought to light to me that may solve that problem:

Or, there's this:

Yeah, I had the same issue with the timeline, strikes me as fishy, as I've already said.

In response to this:

Given the timeline, I have difficulty believing a pure 'Benoit killed them over several days' timeline.

Nancy snapping, and then Benoit counter-snapping, I have a more easier time believing.

However, I fully admit, I could be wrong.

I'd still be looking for signs of a break in or something if I was the police. Just because they both had so bloody much to live for.

And in response to you at the top of this page:

As far as the timeline goes, it just seems off, mainly because, how would he be able to have so much time between the deaths without it being somehow interfered with? To me, that makes no sense.

Effectively, I've proven my point that, hey, I may have been wrong and I'm willing to admit that about the timeline issue.

Furthermore, I don't see how I'm "lying." You haven't shown in any way, shape or form that being a fanboy in this instance necessitates belief of his innocence. No, I don't want to think him to have done this, but as I have said to my even more fangirlish friend, anyone is capable of this.

Out of context from AIM logs with someone off the board:

sn removed for privacy (10:54:19 PM): Shit. Sources in the Fayette County Police Department have told Dave Meltzer that they are now working under the theory that Chris Benoit killed his wife on Saturday, his son on Sunday, and then himself on Monday. Benoit's body was found in his weight room, his wife's body was found in the living room, and his son's body was found in his bedroom.

Credit: WrestlingObserver.com

the mark 0f evil (10:54:35 PM): Jonathan just sent me that, too

sn removed for privacy (10:55:28 PM): This is like, too out there to be real.

the mark 0f evil (10:55:08 PM): I know... It's like... I dunno, he went all Here's Johnny... and it's creepy.

sn removed for privacy (10:56:23 PM): I was saying that, if this is really what happened..... ever since Eddie passed, ya know, hes been under a lot of stress... he may have snapped.

sn removed for privacy (10:56:30 PM): But I still don't think Chris is capable of this

the mark 0f evil (10:56:27 PM): i don't know... anyone's capable of anything... it's just so weird it's hard to believe.

That was from Monday night (I can screencap the logs if you really want).

As far as "getting off my back," it's because I've conceded the point regarding timeline, and yet you seem intent on hounding me over it.

Now, how am I lying, and about what? That I think he's guilty of it?

Like I said before, IIRC, the doors were all locked from the inside. I don't personally see how this could have been done by a third party myself, either. It sucks that things happened like this, but ... not much that one can do to change the past.

Even despite this, from page 3:

Criminals or not, you can still celebrate the accomplishments. Chris Benoit was one of the most influential people in the wrestling business, and one of the most charismatic personalities, to boot. Regardless of his final actions, that much should be noted. You cannot NEGATE any of those actions because of one incident, no matter how harsh they were, because THEY STILL HAPPENED.

I still never said he was innocent, and I don't see how that implied it, even with that probably being the most fanboyish post in this thread I've made, save the first post I made in the thread. Nor did I say that they are more important than the events from this weekend, just that they should be noted. If that deigns me to have claimed his innocence... I would really like to see how.

Odd, though, how you've targeted me on this all, even though I've made my stances on the timeline several times throughout the thread. Even so, I conceded the timeline thing, so I don't understand why you're so hung up on it.

[Solauren]

What is there to respect? Is a wrestler more deserving of "respect for his work" than any other occupation?

Not at all.

If he turned out to be a cop, would you still be falling over yourself trying to show "respect" for his professional work despite the fact that he did something absolutely horrible?

Would a cop killing someone invalidate his police work up until that point?
(Yes, I know with police work, it would probably warrant a review)

You're just looking for excuses to say something, anything positive about this worthless piece of shit excuse for a human being. Get over it. He was nothing more than a roid-filled pseudo-sport fucktard.

I do believe I've said that I no longer have any respect for Chris Beniot the person.. If not, consider that my clarification.

(24 hours and a good nights rest often helps clarify things on my part)

And yes, I will call him a worthless piece of shit excuse for a human being even if it turns out to be "roid rage", for the same reason that I despise drunk drivers. It is still a voluntary choice to put everyone around you at risk, therefore you are liable for whatever actions you commit while under the influence. If you didn't want to do something bad while under the influence, you shouldn't take the junk.

I agree with you 100%. Steroids have proven negative side effects that have been known for years and years. If he was taking them, that makes this worse.

I hope my cousin that became a professional wreslter in the last year avoids those pitfalls.

To clarify my viewpoint;

Let me ask you this. Suppose say, George Lucas, were to snap and do something similiar. Would that invalidate his movies or other previous positive contributions to society?

No. It would certainly color them, as Benoit's actions have colored my opinion of his wrestling career.

Chris Benoit, the person, has shown himself to be a rather dispicable human being. He apparently hide it very well. What he did does not deserve any respect, and has complete elminated any previous respect I had for the man. He should be vilified and dispised.

Chris Benoit the character , however, was just that. A character. I'm not going to fault a character for the actions of the person that played them.

Five years from now, if someone asks me about Benoit, here's what I'll say:

Cool persona, good worker, fun to watch. Too bad it turns out the guy behind all that was a murderous asshole not worthy of further consideration as a person.

[Edward Yee]

I hope my cousin that became a professional wreslter in the last year avoids those pitfalls.

May I ask which promotions he's worked or aspired to?

This situation has given me an appreciation for the guys who seem to have worked to get where they are without steroids, even if that staying clean will (unfairly) limit their potential.

EDIT: Wonder if there's any way for autopsy, or if not that toxicology, to find "Fragile X" in Daniel Benoit? (That was claimed here.)

[Superman]

I seriously doubt that the WWE's 'timeline' is a great source here. Nevertheless, it changes nothing.

Fragile X Syndrome is dwarfism. What does this have to do with anything as far as Benoit killing his family?

Let me go out on a limb with another prediction; when the autopsy is complete, steroids won't be the only substance involved in Benoit's life... I guess the pathologist who conducts the autopsy could be part of this conspiracy though, if this indeed turns out to be the case.

[Surlethe]

It's not about 'cycling,' it's about the dosage he was taking. If he's been using steroids for many years, he may be taking them with no 'off cycle' at all; his body may have stopped producing testosterone on its own. When people experience what is known as Steroid-Induced Psychotic Disorder, we're talking aboutf doses of at least 1,000 mg of testosterone per week. What occurs is similar to what happens to meth users (in terms of mood regulation breaking down); they start to develop symptoms of mania, followed by psychosis. They hallucinate, become extremely paranoid, depressed, and many start to idealize suicide. People who suddenly stop taking them after prolonged periods of use may actually require hospitalization, as the withdrawal syndrome is also characterized by severe depression.

There have been recorded cases of people with no criminal or violent histories committing murders because of a psychotic state, and this textbook specifically brings this up when talking about psychosis induced by steroids.

Maybe I'm missing something, but I'm not seeing any reason to assume anything more is going on here. I sure as hell see no reason to start delving into conspiracy theories because some people bought into this man's wrestling hero persona... and instead of just assuming how steroids may or may not affect someone, check out the facts instead of filling the gaps with "I dunno, there's something fishy here..."

Ah, I see what you're saying. All I've been saying is that the facts don't seem to support a murder of passion, and instead point to premeditation. Psychosis, I'd think, could lead to premeditated murder. The Bibles indicate that there's some religious aspect to the murders; perhaps that's one of the things his brain hit upon to use in hallucinations?

[Lord Pounder]

I just feel sorry for the people close to the Benoits who will forever be effected by this. As pointed out in IWC forums Benoit was close with many wrestlers who died too young, Owen Hart, Mike Awesome, Brian Pillman and most recently Eddie G.

I partially blame the WWE for his apparent breakdown, Eddies corpse wasn't even cold when the WWE started fucking it for all it was worth. How hard is it to lose a best friend without the trauma of seeing that friend exploited and being surrounded by constant reminders of that friend.

On the other hand Benoit will forever now be remembered as a bastard who murdered his wife and kid. There is no excuse for that no matter how fucked up you are.

I was in the middle of playing Smackdown 2007 on my PSP funily enough with Benoit, I don't think I'll be able to use him ever again. I hear Benoit is gonna be pulled off the next WWE game which is due out this fall

[Aenigma]

Maybe he found out his son wasn't his?

[Stormbringer]

I had not heard that part -- the part about it being "well known," that is. (The only indication picked up before the restraining order news was people noticing William Regal's reaction video.)

It was apparently well know among the people that knew him and his family.

Check this out.

I stand corrected.

Despite statements of his few close friends?

The accusations of spousal abuse are a matter of public record. The restraining order and divorce filings are a matter of public record.

I'm inclined to think that they're just trying to be nice seeing as how they are friends. I doubt many people's friends will go on television and say a dead some one, even a dead murder, was a world class douche.

Not to detract from the topic at hand, but please tell me you're not one of those fake-blood wankers just because everything's scripted. In three shows with our local organization, I've witnessed a broken ankle, a concussion, a rolled ankle and more.

I don't care whether they get hurt performing stunts or not. The point is that the personas, the personalities, and action is all a facade. A lot of these guys are complete bastards in their personal life, living down to the worst of professional "sports" activities.

So you wonder why I think there is a huge disconnect between Chris Benoit the Character and the Chris Benoit the Fucked in the Head Double Murdering Person?

Evidence?

For the fact that he had a restraining order taken out against him? That he was nearly divorced from this woman amidst allegations of abuse? Public record which is on the fucking news.

As for the evidence that these wrestlers have a high rate of criminal behavior, look at an article (even wikipedia for fuck's sake) and you'll see that most of them have a fair number of criminal behaviors on their record. Some don't. Far too many do.

I highly doubt that you could prove that. So don't even bother making strawmen like that, eh?

Obviously I can't read his mind. But the fact is that his "friends" almost certainly knew of the allegations surrounding his near divorce and ongoing relationship. And if some of the information coming out is to be believing, some of those same friends were the ones that called the cops worrying about what he had done.

So they're either fucking deliberately ignorant or are being insincere.

Criminals or not, you can still celebrate the accomplishments. Chris Benoit was one of the most influential people in the wrestling business, and one of the most charismatic personalities, to boot. Regardless of his final actions, that much should be noted. You cannot NEGATE any of those actions because of one incident, no matter how harsh they were, because THEY STILL HAPPENED.

Of course his actions still happened. And so did the double murder.

What I'm saying is that people really out to take him down off the damned pedestal. It's one thing to admire his achievements, another to keep up the mindless adulation of the man.

[Darth Wong]

Even so, I conceded the timeline thing, so I don't understand why you're so hung up on it.

Are you totally retarded? I pointed out that you were being an idiot fanboy, and gave the timeline thing as an example. The fact that you have since conceded it does not mean that the accusation of being an idiot fanboy is somehow nullified. You had to be an idiot fanboy to say it in the first place, regardless of whether you were eventually forced to concede.

You're a walking example of one of the biggest problems we have in our society: people who worship useless entertainment industry celebrities. And so what if he did charity appearances? They don't really cost him anything, and the only reason these people want to see him in the first place is that same culture of celebrity worship. The very same culture that created monsters like Paris Hilton.

[Stormbringer]

As far as the timeline goes, it just seems off, mainly because, how would he be able to have so much time between the deaths without it being somehow interfered with?

PA-THETIC!

He's a goddamned celebrity living in a gated fucking mansion. Is it really so hard to believe under the circumstances that he wasn't interfered with? It certainly is enough for the police and most other human beings. And your supposition isn't nearly enough to overturn the police investigation.

[Darth Wong]

Would a cop killing someone invalidate his police work up until that point?
(Yes, I know with police work, it would probably warrant a review)

It would mean that the only people who still say he should be "respected" in any way would be his family.

Let me ask you this. Suppose say, George Lucas, were to snap and do something similiar. Would that invalidate his movies or other previous positive contributions to society?

It wouldn't erase them, but I would have absolutely no problem with someone saying that he was a worthless piece of shit excuse for a human being if he did something like that. I certainly wouldn't rush to remind everyone of how he made the Star Wars movies. If he did something like that, the first thing I'd do is distance my fandom from his name. That's what is so irksome about the Benoit apologists; before the bodies are even buried they're already out there trying to look for reasons to say something good about their favourite no-brain roid-head hero.