Minor Battle of Courscant Questions

[NeoGoomba]

I've never read the RotS novelization, and I'm sure it touched upon this, but did Courscant have its planetary shields up during the Separatist attack? And if so, did they get knocked down by the CIS fleet by the time the Invisible Hand was crashing through the atmosphere?

And on that note, when Invisible Hand went down, was there any significant damage sustained to the planet by debris, stray turbolasers, or other crashing hulks?

[Noble Ire]

There were planetary shields mentioned in a few of the novels (LoE, at least, and possibly the novelization as well), but they were large, overlapping theater shields, like those used to protect Bothawui. I suspect that Corsucant also had a heavier, orbital-level shield, like the one employed by the time of the Yuuzhan Vong invasion, but its possible that the defense forces didn't have time to activate it before Grevious' fleet moved below its perimeter. After all, his assault was a complete surprise, and the Coruscant controllers couldn't exactly block off the planet at the drop of a hat; unannounced, such an act could destroy hundreds of starships moving up and down the gravity well.

And I believe that there was mention of significant damage to Coruscant's surface following the battle due to falling debris, on the order of millions of casulaties.

[Adam Reynolds]

I've never read the RotS novelization, and I'm sure it touched upon this, but did Courscant have its planetary shields up during the Separatist attack? And if so, did they get knocked down by the CIS fleet by the time the Invisible Hand was crashing through the atmosphere?

Actually the sheild was up and the Sepratist fleet was trapped under it. You see the sheilds lowered to allow Anakin and Obi Wan to fly their fighters through the shield to enter the upper atmosphere.

[Chris OFarrell]

I've never read the RotS novelization, and I'm sure it touched upon this, but did Courscant have its planetary shields up during the Separatist attack? And if so, did they get knocked down by the CIS fleet by the time the Invisible Hand was crashing through the atmosphere?

Actually the sheild was up and the Sepratist fleet was trapped under it. You see the sheilds lowered to allow Anakin and Obi Wan to fly their fighters through the shield to enter the upper atmosphere.

If you're talking about that blue flash as the two fighters dive, no that was their engines firing a brief bust of acceleration.

I initially though it was the two ships moving through the Venators shields and into the fight, but close examination shows it is clearly the fighters engines firing.

[Darwin]

There were planetary shields mentioned in a few of the novels (LoE, at least, and possibly the novelization as well), but they were large, overlapping theater shields, like those used to protect Bothawui. I suspect that Corsucant also had a heavier, orbital-level shield, like the one employed by the time of the Yuuzhan Vong invasion, but its possible that the defense forces didn't have time to activate it before Grevious' fleet moved below its perimeter.

I don't have LoE, but wasn't it outright stated that the planetary shields had been sabotaged?

[Mange]

People, you're forgetting about the ROTS ICS which mentions the planetary shields.

[Molyneux]

I was definitely under the impression that the Separatist fleet attacked too quickly for the shields to be raised, but that they were trapped underneath them when it became clear that Palpatine had been abducted. Why else would they have such close-range ship-to-ship battle like that?

[CaptHawkeye]

Possibly to keep the Seperatists from escaping? If the Open Circle Fleet engages them at long range, it gives the Seperatists lots of room to gun their hyperdrives and flee with Palps.

[Molyneux]

Possibly to keep the Seperatists from escaping? If the Open Circle Fleet engages them at long range, it gives the Seperatists lots of room to gun their hyperdrives and flee with Palps.

Hm...I figured they'd engaged Coruscant's planetary shield to do precisely that, thus forcing an atmospheric battle at extremely close ranges. I suppose both make sense, assuming that another ship in close proximity will prevent a battleship from jumping to H.

[apocolypse]

From what I recall the Sep fleet was indeed trapped under the Coruscant shield. Grevious escaped because droids on the ground sabotaged a section of it so that the Lucrehulk he boarded could get out.

[Cykeisme]

The nature of the attack (a sudden attack from an unmonitored direction) probably did not allow time to raise the shield. Firstly, shields of that scale may take time to activate.. and as was stated, it would cause the destruction of vast numbers of civilian starships.

Recall Vader's extreme dissatisfaction with Admiral Ozzel's handling of the Hoth attack: he later summarily executed Ozzel for providing the Rebels sufficient warning to raise their planetary shields.
By extension, one might assume that a properly executed assault would not allow a defender to raise their planetary shields in time.

An attacker who had properly gotten the jump on their enemy could have then targeted shield generators and projectors from orbit with turbolaser fire.


At this point, as the RotS novelization described, smaller Republic ships actually took up positions to physically obstruct Separatist ships to prevent them from escaping Coruscant's gravity well, thereby disallowing their escape via hyperspace. Logically, larger Republic ships (or groups thereof) could have also used tractor beams to prevent the egress of Separatish ships.

Note that the Coruscant defense fleets were already engaged at close quarters in this manner when the heroes' Open Circle fleet arrived in-system, hours after the battle had started.

This is mostly inconsequential, but the LoE novel also mentioned that individual districts (particlar more important and influential ones) had their own regional theatre shields.

And on that note, when Invisible Hand went down, was there any significant damage sustained to the planet by debris, stray turbolasers, or other crashing hulks?

The RotS novelization mentions that portions of the Coruscant night sky were lit orange by massive fires that burned into the night; the city had sustained collateral damage caused by debris and stay fire from massive orbital exchange, as well as raids with droid starfighters and ground troops.

From what I recall the Sep fleet was indeed trapped under the Coruscant shield. Grevious escaped because droids on the ground sabotaged a section of it so that the Lucrehulk he boarded could get out.

What source is this from?

[apocolypse]

What source is this from?

I honestly am not sure, I just recall reading it online. It may not have even been from any specific source, but instead rationalization to explain Grevious's escape despite being trapped behind the shield.

[The Original Nex]

What source is this from?

I honestly am not sure, I just recall reading it online. It may not have even been from any specific source, but instead rationalization to explain Grevious's escape despite being trapped behind the shield.

RotS ICS references the Invisible Hand and likely much of the close range battle around it, being trapped beneath Coruscant's shield.

[Bluewolf]

but before they can flee-thousands of Republic battleships engage the craft, trapping it in an upper atmosphere combat within the planet's defensive shield

There.

[apocolypse]

What source is this from?

I honestly am not sure, I just recall reading it online. It may not have even been from any specific source, but instead rationalization to explain Grevious's escape despite being trapped behind the shield.

RotS ICS references the Invisible Hand and likely much of the close range battle around it, being trapped beneath Coruscant's shield.

Right, sorry. I meant the bit about the droid army sabotaging a section of the Coruscant shield, allowing Grevious to escape. That's the part that I'm not sure where, or even if, it's actually stated in written sources.

[Cykeisme]

but before they can flee-thousands of Republic battleships engage the craft, trapping it in an upper atmosphere combat within the planet's defensive shield

There.

Ah, okay. The shield must have come on after the Separatist fleet had already entered within its radius then.
Droid sabotage wouldn't have been neccessary, however; the Separatist ships could have simply blasted the some generators, shield projectors or the power conduits between the two in order to open an escape window.


Pardon, but what's the ROTS IRC, though?

[The Original Nex]

Pardon, but what's the ROTS IRC, though?

An unfortunate bastardization of ROTS ICS is my guess....

[Warsie]

The Planetary shield was not up when the CIS fleet attacked.

Several theater shields on Coruscant were on at the time the CIS fleet ecxted hyperspace and some others were able to activate relatively-quickly, example the one over the Senate housing district. (LoE)

Grievous did take the Republic by surprise, as shown by the beginning where sevral Republic warships were caught with shields down and subsequently fucked up so I'd expect the Planetary shields to be in that peredicament but Grievous did mention sending droid fighters on suicide missions against some of the generators.

By the time Anakin and Obi-Wan arrived yes the Republic did activate the planetary shield and trap the CIS fleet under it.

And yes, damage was sustained from debris. The Coruscant defenses did blast some debris but many of it hit the surface, causing miles-wide craters (ROTS: ICS mentions this).

I didn't get how the CIS fleet caught under the shields escaped, probabnly blasted a hole in the shield like Lusanyka did after the NR took it; the CIS fleet could do that , given the Munificent's capabilities.

At this point, as the RotS novelization described, smaller Republic ships actually took up positions to physically obstruct Separatist ships to prevent them from escaping Coruscant's gravity well, thereby disallowing their escape via hyperspace. Logically, larger Republic ships (or groups thereof) could have also used tractor beams to prevent the egress of Separatish ships.

Didn't they mainly do that with Invisible Hand? If the other CIS ships were trapped like that they might get desperate....

The Republic might've even lowered the shield to allow the CIS to flee, they could've fucked up Coruscant in a battle if they were trapped and the Republic would have a Pyrrhic victory.

The CIS flet did escape, AFTER Grievous made it to the Lucrehulk and ordered a general retreat....most ships did escap, so any effect of that was minimal (based on the ROTS novelization and the ICS)

[Stark]

Dude, if the fleet could blow a hole out of the shield, the shield is WORTHLESS. The fleet could blow a hole INTO the shield too!

[The Original Nex]

Indeed. The Republic likely let them out once the Chancellor was recovered. Better to let the enemy escape wounded, than trap them next to your capital where they may decide to fight to the last.

[Warsie]

Dude, if the fleet could blow a hole out of the shield, the shield is WORTHLESS. The fleet could blow a hole INTO the shield too!

Not necessarily...

Remember the Lusanyka example I mentioned. Coruscant's shield wasn't "worthless"; the deactivation of it was important enough to delay the entire operation when the NR went to take the world ~26 years later..

But Lusanyka could blast a decent-sized hole when escaping from the world.

I'm sure the CIS could as well.

And you mention the fleet blowing holes into the shield. that could be possible too; in ESB Vader wanted a Clean bombardment (ESB novelization), not that an orbital bombardment was impossible. An the shield over Hoth was a new type of shield that somehow could withstand more firepower (Rogue Squadron 3).

Care to explain that

[Stark]

Er, no? I have no idea what you're talking about and you haven't quoted shit. It sounds like you're saying shields are more vulnerable to attacks from inside than outside, so why don't you provide some evidence? Even the ability to blow a small hole in a shield means (for instance) that the DS blast was weaker than an Executor - a emasculated EU Executor even.

Oh christ, you're using GAME RETCONS as evidence? Fuck off. Show that SW shields are weaker on the inside, that's all you have to do. Or do you not understand that the ability to 'blow a hole' large enough to fit a ship out of means they could have killed billions of people, even with the shield up?

[Warsie]

Er, no? I have no idea what you're talking about and you haven't quoted shit.

I cited the ESB novelization and Rogue Squadron 3 (which is a game)

"The scientists have developed a powerful new shield. In fact, the only reason they haven't been captured yet is due to the shield"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AFQzI0VFGWo

Oh, and Lusanyka and Coruscant's shields: The Source is The Krytos Trap:

"While Rogue Squadron returned to base for refueling, the Lusankya continued to climb and turned its weapons toward Coruscant's planetary shields. The ship quickly punched a hole in the shields and passed through, and encountered a Golan III orbital defense station. "

http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Second_B ... vil_War%29

It sounds like you're saying shields are more vulnerable to attacks from inside than outside, so why don't you provide some evidence?

No, I never said that.

I mentioned that the same thing could happen with shooting at shields from above. Torpedo Spheres do that as well (overwhelm shields from above creating holes through which proton torpedoes hit generators)

[Warsie]

Oh christ, you're using GAME RETCONS as evidence? Fuck off. Show that SW shields are weaker on the inside, that's all you have to do. Or do you not understand that the ability to 'blow a hole' large enough to fit a ship out of means they could have killed billions of people, even with the shield up?

I never said that it's easier to take shields out from the inside. I never said that.

Oh and by "blow a hole" I'm referring to heavy turbolaser fire (As Lusanyka did when escaping from Coruscant.

[PainRack]

Possibly to keep the Seperatists from escaping? If the Open Circle Fleet engages them at long range, it gives the Seperatists lots of room to gun their hyperdrives and flee with Palps.

Hm...I figured they'd engaged Coruscant's planetary shield to do precisely that, thus forcing an atmospheric battle at extremely close ranges. I suppose both make sense, assuming that another ship in close proximity will prevent a battleship from jumping to H.

I believe that the ROTS novel,Lietuant commander Needa did attempt to block Invisible Hand from escaping with several warships, and General Grievious ordered the blocking ships destroyed so he could escape.