Pope Benedict Admits Evidence for Evolution and GW

Mange · Post by **Mange** » 2007-07-27 08:49am

POPE Benedict has said there is substantial scientific proof of the theory of evolution.

The Pope, speaking as he was concluding his holiday in northern Italy, also said the human race must listen to "the voice of the Earth" or risk destroying its very existence.

In a talk with 400 priests, the Pope spoke of the current debate raging in some countries, particularly the US and his native Germany, between creationism and evolution.

“They are presented as alternatives that exclude each other,” the Pope said.

“This clash is an absurdity because on one hand there is much scientific proof in favour of evolution, which appears as a reality that we must see and which enriches our understanding of life and being as such.”

But he said evolution did not answer all the questions and could not exclude a role by God.

Continued here.

Redleader34 · Post by **Redleader34** » 2007-07-27 08:59am

Fail, for lack of Catholic Knowledge. We have acknowledged this since at Least JP2.

Bounty · Post by **Bounty** » 2007-07-27 09:01am

The evolution statement is hardly new, since acceptance of (divinely-started) evolution has been accepted by the Vatican for some time, but it's reassuring to see Benedict decides to follow up on it.

The environmental angle is a surprise, but the again, the blatant disrespect for nature does seem to be a trait predominantly of American protestantism.

Mange · Post by **Mange** » 2007-07-27 09:15am

I was a bit surprised as it seemed as if this pope is more radical than his predecessor.

Stravo · Post by **Stravo** » 2007-07-27 09:17am

I wouldn't be so quick on the draw to say that the Vatican has acknowledged this for a long time because I remember an article last year where Pope Benny seemed to be using language that wanted to make a shift towards Intelligent Design. It's nice to see someone slapped him in the back of his head and got him back on track.

The "listen to the voice of the Earth" bit was a little surprising and amusing as it sort of assigns the Earth some sort of role as deity or spiritual entity. How does that work in a Monotheistic framework? That's right, this is Cathlicism, with Saints and such so of course it fits.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2007-07-27 09:39am

Unfortunately, Catholics are not the primary source of the anti-GW campaign anyway, so I doubt this will make any difference. It's the big American Protestant gun-wanking warmongering SUV-driving NFL-watching NASCAR-loving beer-swilling Bush-voting dickhead population that's primarily behind the anti-GW campaign.

Post by **Surlethe** » 2007-07-27 10:50am

Stravo wrote:I wouldn't be so quick on the draw to say that the Vatican has acknowledged this for a long time because I remember an article last year where Pope Benny seemed to be using language that wanted to make a shift towards Intelligent Design. It's nice to see someone slapped him in the back of his head and got him back on track.

People who are not well-versed in the evolution debate often see little or no distinction between theistic evolution, creationism, and intelligent design. I have no doubt that the Pope will continue to use rhetoric that is very similar in style to that of the intelligent design and creationist movements; for example, "But he said evolution did not answer all the questions and could not exclude a role by God." It is important nonetheless to bear in mind that, whatever rhetoric Benny pulls out of a hat in the future, he is advocating theistic evolution, not trying to overturn the scientific theory.

Twoyboy · Post by **Twoyboy** » 2007-07-27 09:04pm

I was pleasantly surprised by this. Especially as I don't think he was advocating ID.

"But he said evolution did not answer all the questions and could not exclude a role by God. "

I took this to mean he endorsed theistic evolution and the whole "where did the universe come from" bit was still God's domain. (Which I personally think is a weak God of the Gaps arguement, but it's better than what the fundies believe.) But when he said "there is much scientific proof in favour of evolution", I think it shot ID, which is not a theory on its own, but an arguement against evolution, in the arse.

Rye · Post by **Rye** » 2007-07-27 09:40pm

ID says evolution and common descent of all life on earth are true, it just claims that various gaps in knowledge were designed because we don't know how they came about. The Pope isn't far enough removed from that position. Behe and the Pope would get along fine.

Twoyboy · Post by **Twoyboy** » 2007-07-27 10:22pm

Yeah, now you mention it, he's been a bit ambiguous. Said enough to keep the "evolutionists" happy, but not enough to get the "IDers" offside.

These popes can be sneaky.

Post by **Surlethe** » 2007-07-27 10:31pm

Rye wrote:ID says evolution and common descent of all life on earth are true, it just claims that various gaps in knowledge were designed because we don't know how they came about. The Pope isn't far enough removed from that position. Behe and the Pope would get along fine.

Behe's in fact Catholic (here). However, he explicitly advocates that there exist biological structures which did not evolve. The Pope, as I understand, is implicitly rejecting that view. Yes, they're close together, but theistic evolution is very close to ID anyway. That's why ID's version of clownsuited Creationism is so seductive to a Christian who'd be turned off of YEC.

wautd · Post by **wautd** » 2007-07-28 04:57am

What does GW stand for?

Post by **Gandalf** » 2007-07-28 05:06am

wautd wrote:What does GW stand for?

Global warming.