Who believes in ghosts?

Pink Eye · Post by **Pink Eye** » 2003-01-11 10:28am

Anyone believe in ghosts?

I have come across many ghost websites that declare themselves to be "scientific" in their research methods but I never see any theories to help support the paranormal; only "I cannot explain these photos with science [because none of them have credentials] so therefore they are ghosts."

I am sure you all seen the legendary 'orb' pics all over the internet and other phenomena...what do you all think? We are surrounded in paranormal energy or it is just bunk?

Evil Sadistic Bastard · Post by **Evil Sadistic Bastard** » 2003-01-11 10:31am

How tremendously interesting.

A rational no0b.

Welcome. *extends hand in welcome*

ANd BTW, I don't exactly belive in ghosts. However, considering that the island I train on is rumoured to have been the site of a massive muslim massacre...

Post by **Ghost Rider** » 2003-01-11 10:32am

That's pretty cool ESB...so no screams in the night other than one's one you would expect?

Evil Sadistic Bastard · Post by **Evil Sadistic Bastard** » 2003-01-11 10:35am

Ghost Rider wrote:That's pretty cool ESB...so no screams in the night other than one's one you would expect?

My bunkmates have been talking about hearing the sound of a baby crying in the toilet at 3-4 am in the morning...

And they say that when we do jungle route marches and the headcount comes up exactly the same, someone's dead...

Pink Eye · Post by **Pink Eye** » 2003-01-11 10:42am

Evil Sadistic Bastard wrote:How tremendously interesting.

A rational no0b.

Welcome. *extends hand in welcome*

ANd BTW, I don't exactly belive in ghosts. However, considering that the island I train on is rumoured to have been the site of a massive muslim massacre...

One of the reasons I ask is because I have debated people on occasion on their forums. I made a statement that I am rationally justified in dismissing their claims of ghosts because they have no real evidence; just photos and personal experiences. No valid scientific theories are ever presented (or that I am aware of).

I was attacked when I said that I am rationally justified in dismissing such fantasical claims because "no proof is simply lack of proof, not lack of untruth." I was considered a hypocrite because I wanted evidence to help support the paranomal, but had no evidence to disprove ghosts outright.

Isn't this a proof of a negative which ultimatly is impossible? I am well aware that logic, reasoning, and science can be wrong, nothing is 100% certain. But am I not right in saying that it is ok to dismiss claims in general if no one has proof to help support them?

Wicked Pilot · Post by **Wicked Pilot** » 2003-01-11 11:04am

I won't believe in them until I see that little red dot on my command center.

Sir Sirius · Post by **Sir Sirius** » 2003-01-11 11:10am

It is undesirable to believe a proposition when there is no ground whatever for supposing it true.
-- Bertrand Russel, On the Value of Scepticism.

I'm having a very "Bertrand Russel" like day today.

Post by **Vympel** » 2003-01-11 11:16am

Please change your avatar. It is truly disturbing to look at.

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2003-01-11 12:24pm

If ghosts are spirits of people, you have to ask the question, "Where does the spirit come from?" If it comes from the person and leaves upon death, we should observe a large energy release of some sort. We don't.

salm · Post by **salm** » 2003-01-11 12:27pm

who voted for "yes"?

ArmorPierce · Post by **ArmorPierce** » 2003-01-11 12:33pm

No rational person believes in ghosts j00 n00b

salm · Post by **salm** » 2003-01-11 12:50pm

Durandal wrote:If ghosts are spirits of people, you have to ask the question, "Where does the spirit come from?" If it comes from the person and leaves upon death, we should observe a large energy release of some sort. We don't.

why would you observe an energy release?

Keevan_Colton · Post by **Keevan_Colton** » 2003-01-11 01:04pm

salm wrote:
Durandal wrote:If ghosts are spirits of people, you have to ask the question, "Where does the spirit come from?" If it comes from the person and leaves upon death, we should observe a large energy release of some sort. We don't.
why would you observe an energy release?

CoE....it has to do something.....

salm · Post by **salm** » 2003-01-11 01:06pm

Keevan_Colton wrote:
salm wrote:
Durandal wrote:If ghosts are spirits of people, you have to ask the question, "Where does the spirit come from?" If it comes from the person and leaves upon death, we should observe a large energy release of some sort. We don't.
why would you observe an energy release?
CoE....it has to do something.....

CoE = abreviation for?

Keevan_Colton · Post by **Keevan_Colton** » 2003-01-11 01:12pm

CoE - Conservation of Energy.
i.e. Energy can neither be created nor destroyed, it always goes somewhere....

though CoE is also part of my own theory on the Conservation of Embaressment....but thats not what I'm talking about here....

Mr Flibble · Post by **Mr Flibble** » 2003-01-11 01:12pm

salm wrote:
Keevan_Colton wrote:
salm wrote: why would you observe an energy release?
CoE....it has to do something.....
CoE = abreviation for?

Conservation of Energy
or Church of England, but I am pretty sure in this case he means Conservation of Energy

salm · Post by **salm** » 2003-01-11 01:18pm

Keevan_Colton wrote:CoE - Conservation of Energy.
i.e. Energy can neither be created nor destroyed, it always goes somewhere....

though CoE is also part of my own theory on the Conservation of Embaressment....but thats not what I'm talking about here....

ah, ok. this argument wont work with people who belive in ghost though, because they´re going to argue that either the energy is transmitted in a way we dont notice and cant measure or they´ll say that ghost dont need conventional energy but have some other source of different energy, which we of course also cant notice.

Keevan_Colton · Post by **Keevan_Colton** » 2003-01-11 01:20pm

salm wrote:
Keevan_Colton wrote:CoE - Conservation of Energy.
i.e. Energy can neither be created nor destroyed, it always goes somewhere....

though CoE is also part of my own theory on the Conservation of Embaressment....but thats not what I'm talking about here....
ah, ok. this argument wont work with people who belive in ghost though, because they´re going to argue that either the energy is transmitted in a way we dont notice and cant measure or they´ll say that ghost dont need conventional energy but have some other source of different energy, which we of course also cant notice.

If it cant be observed in any way shape or form and has no mesurable impact on anything....then for all intensive purposes it isnt there at all.....

TrailerParkJawa · Post by **TrailerParkJawa** » 2003-01-11 01:23pm

Wicked Pilot wrote:I won't believe in them until I see that little red dot on my command center.

The problem I have with ghosts is what about population? There are more people on Earth than ever. Should we not see a corresponding increase in ghost sightings as the population grows ( thus more deaths ) of all sorts.

My idea also applies to people who believe in reincarnation. We cant have all lived a previous life because there are more people alive now, than existed in the past put together. ( at least I think thats the case )

salm · Post by **salm** » 2003-01-11 01:23pm

Keevan_Colton wrote:
salm wrote:
Keevan_Colton wrote:CoE - Conservation of Energy.
i.e. Energy can neither be created nor destroyed, it always goes somewhere....

though CoE is also part of my own theory on the Conservation of Embaressment....but thats not what I'm talking about here....
ah, ok. this argument wont work with people who belive in ghost though, because they´re going to argue that either the energy is transmitted in a way we dont notice and cant measure or they´ll say that ghost dont need conventional energy but have some other source of different energy, which we of course also cant notice.
If it cant be observed in any way shape or form and has no mesurable impact on anything....then for all intensive purposes it isnt there at all.....

sure. just wanted to point out that it´s impossible to hammer that into some idiot who seriously puts up ghost homepages.

Keevan_Colton · Post by **Keevan_Colton** » 2003-01-11 01:30pm

salm wrote:
Keevan_Colton wrote:
salm wrote: ah, ok. this argument wont work with people who belive in ghost though, because they´re going to argue that either the energy is transmitted in a way we dont notice and cant measure or they´ll say that ghost dont need conventional energy but have some other source of different energy, which we of course also cant notice.
If it cant be observed in any way shape or form and has no mesurable impact on anything....then for all intensive purposes it isnt there at all.....
sure. just wanted to point out that it´s impossible to hammer that into some idiot who seriously puts up ghost homepages.

Very true....under such circumstances serious education requires the use of a hammer.

kheegster · Post by **kheegster** » 2003-01-11 02:33pm

TrailerParkJawa wrote: My idea also applies to people who believe in reincarnation. We cant have all lived a previous life because there are more people alive now, than existed in the past put together. ( at least I think thats the case )

You can get round this problem by allowing reincarnation to occur between animals and humans, as Buddhists do. To thicken the plot, you can assume that reincarnation can occur between us and aliens as well.

I think that paranormal phenomena exists, but that they exist WITHIN the minds of those who see them. In other words, I think ghosts are psychological phenomena...

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2003-01-11 03:01pm

my personal belief is that every human has a soul. This soul is energy. Maybe just maybe there are times when that energy doesn't convert to the next stage properly and you have a residual soul appearing. Kinda like the dofference between water steam and superheated steam which would be invisible.

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2003-01-11 03:17pm

salm wrote:
Keevan_Colton wrote:CoE - Conservation of Energy.
i.e. Energy can neither be created nor destroyed, it always goes somewhere....

though CoE is also part of my own theory on the Conservation of Embaressment....but thats not what I'm talking about here....
ah, ok. this argument wont work with people who belive in ghost though, because they´re going to argue that either the energy is transmitted in a way we dont notice and cant measure or they´ll say that ghost dont need conventional energy but have some other source of different energy, which we of course also cant notice.

Just because people apply moronic counterarguments doesn't mean the argument doesn't work. According to these ghost-hunter lunatics, they can see ghosts. If this is the case, then ghosts interact with light, so they must be radiating EM radiation. Clearly they are not some mystical, unknown form of energy.

Furthermore, energy doesn't just go from place to place without leaving a trail. Since ghosts radiate EM radiation, when the spirit exits the body, it should leave a detectable EM trail.

I'm sick of everyone claiming that their idea of a spirit is actually "energy." It isn't. It's a fantasy. All of your body's mass can be accounted for with the mass of your physical components. If you had extra spiritual "energy," you would have more mass. This is not the case, so spiritual energy does not exist.

Crayz9000 · Post by **Crayz9000** » 2003-01-11 03:26pm

Wicked Pilot wrote:I won't believe in them until I see that little red dot on my command center.

LOL!

I see someone's been playing StarCraft lately.

StarDestroyer.Net BBS

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