An interesting spin on Star Wars

Ted C · Post by **Ted C** » 2007-08-30 10:19am

A New Sith, or Revenge of the Hope
Reconsidering Star Wars IV in the light of I-III

Darth Fanboy · Post by **Darth Fanboy** » 2007-08-30 10:32am

If we accept all the Star Wars films as the same canon, then a lot that happens in the original films has to be reinterpreted in the light of the prequels. As we now know, the rebel Alliance was founded by Yoda, Obi-Wan Kenobi and Bail Organa. What can readily be deduced is that their first recruit, who soon became their top field agent, was R2-D2.

Actually, total bullshit. Yoda, Obi Wan, and Bail Organa conspired to hide Luke and Leia so they would be hidden from the Sith. Even if you ignore the EU, deleted scenes in RoTS clearly show how it was intended that Mon Mothma and other Senators building the foundation for the Rebel Alliance.

Consider: at the end of RotS, Bail Organan orders 3PO's memory wiped but not R2's. He wouldn't make the distinction casually. Both droids know that Yoda and Obi-Wan are alive and are plotting sedition with the Senator from Alderaan. They know that Amidala survived long enough to have twins and could easily deduce where they went. However, R2 must make an impassioned speech to the effect that he is far more use to them with his mind intact: he has observed Palpatine and Anakin at close quarters for many years, knows much that is useful and is one of the galaxy's top experts at hacking into other people's systems. Also he can lie through his teeth with a straight face. Organa, in immediate need of espionage resources, agrees.

Such a convoluted explanation when a much simpler one exists. ARTOO CAN KEEP A FUCKING SECRET! It is also a plus that he doesn't speak basic. Threepio couldn't keep his mouth shut.

For the next 20 years, as far as 3PO knows, he is the property of Captain Antilles, doing protocol duties on a diplomatic transport. He is vaguely aware of the existence of the princess but doesn't know much about her. Wherever 3PO goes, being as loud and obvious as he always is, his unobtrusive little counterpart goes with him. 3PO is R2's front man. Wherever they land, R2 is passing messages between rebel sympathisers and sizing up governments as potential rebel recruits - both by personal contact and by hacking into their networks. He passes his recommendations on to Organa.

What the fuck is this? This author is the Karen Traviss of R2D2 fans.

Yoda is out of the picture by this stage, using the Force-infused swamps of Dagobah to hide himself from Vader and the Emperor. Or something. He is meditating on the future and keeping in touch with Obi-Wan via the ghost of Qui-Gon Jin, which as comm systems go has the virtue of being untappable. Obi-Wan, on Tattoine, keeps in touch with Bail Organa and the other Rebel leaders by courier, of which more later.

OBI WAN IS NOT IN TOUCH WITH THE OTHER REBELS! HE IS IN TOTAL ISOLATION! HOW DUMB ARE YOU? The only reason Leia knew where to look is because of Bail Organa.

As Star Wars opens, R2 is rushing the Death Star plans to the Rebellion. R2, not Leia. The plans are always in R2. What Leia puts into him in the early scene is only her own holographic message to Kenobi. Leia's own mission, as she says in the holographic message, is to pick up Obi-Wan and take him to Alderaan - or so she thinks. Actually, her father just wants her to meet Kenobi, which up to this point she never has. There's a reason for that.

Oh I'm dying to hear this reason....

...actually i'm not. This is as far as i'm going to go through this piece of shit. Please tell me this is a goddamn joke and i'm falling for some kind of prank designed to get me upset, please please.

General Trelane (Retired) · Post by **General Trelane (Retired)** » 2007-08-30 11:26am

There, there. It's all a goddamn joke. You're just falling for some kind of prank designed to get you upset.

Feeling better?

Ryushikaze · Post by **Ryushikaze** » 2007-08-30 11:33am

Naw, R2 isn't an espionage agent, he's a Jedi Master.

No, I don't believe that. It's just one of my favorite running gags that R2 and C3P0 are the spirits of an ancient Jedi Master and Ancient Sith lord respectively, locked into droid bodies through some old arcane force technique.

Sidewinder · Post by **Sidewinder** » 2007-08-30 01:01pm

If we accept all the Star Wars films as the same canon, then a lot that happens in the original films has to be reinterpreted in the light of the prequels. As we now know, the rebel Alliance was founded by Yoda, Obi-Wan Kenobi and Bail Organa. What can readily be deduced is that their first recruit, who soon became their top field agent, was R2-D2...

Yoda is out of the picture by this stage, using the Force-infused swamps of Dagobah to hide himself from Vader and the Emperor. Or something. He is meditating on the future and keeping in touch with Obi-Wan via the ghost of Qui-Gon Jin, which as comm systems go has the virtue of being untappable. Obi-Wan, on Tattoine, keeps in touch with Bail Organa and the other Rebel leaders by courier, of which more later.

Problem with this idea: if Yoda and Obi-Wan were founders of the Rebel Alliance, how the hell did they keep in touch with other rebels to plan operations?! Qui-Gon's ghost can NOT communicate with people who aren't Force sensitive, and when I see inside Yoda and Obi-Wan's houses, I see NO radios or other long-range communications devices that would allow the Jedi to talk to people who aren't Force sensitive.

Sidewinder · Post by **Sidewinder** » 2007-08-30 01:03pm

Ryushikaze wrote:Naw, R2 isn't an espionage agent, he's a Jedi Master.

No, I don't believe that. It's just one of my favorite running gags that R2 and C3P0 are the spirits of an ancient Jedi Master and Ancient Sith lord respectively, locked into droid bodies through some old arcane force technique.

Where the hell did this running gag begin? And have you used this running gag in your fanfics?

Battlehymn Republic · Post by **Battlehymn Republic** » 2007-08-30 03:03pm

I still think that one of the main ways that the PT and OT don't connect, in my opinion at least, is that the galaxy seems to have drastically changed in barely two decades, as I mentioned here. Kurgan brought up some good points.

Kurgan wrote:It's not that hard to imagine. Anakin/Vader looks old, Palpatine looks old. Everything in the galaxy looks "worn" and "battered" like it's really old. Obi-Wan and Yoda are old. Obi-Wan speaks about the "Old" Republic as if it were a long bygone era (before the Dark Times, etc). People like Han Solo and Admiral Motti who are in their 30's or so act like they've never seen Jedi before... like they're just forgotten legends.

So the notion of an old Empire seems like a natural enough vibe to get without all the baggage that comes later to explain it...

That, and the apparently rapid dissemination of Imperial propaganda that causes a lot of people to forget about the Jedi and disbelieve in the existence of the Force.

Darwin · Post by **Darwin** » 2007-08-30 03:41pm

I can't find it cause the search system won't do specific terms, but this essay got torn the hell up on these forums last year.

Ryushikaze · Post by **Ryushikaze** » 2007-08-30 05:26pm

Sidewinder wrote:
Ryushikaze wrote:Naw, R2 isn't an espionage agent, he's a Jedi Master.

No, I don't believe that. It's just one of my favorite running gags that R2 and C3P0 are the spirits of an ancient Jedi Master and Ancient Sith lord respectively, locked into droid bodies through some old arcane force technique.
Where the hell did this running gag begin? And have you used this running gag in your fanfics?

I forget exactly when it began, but I started it as a response to the R2/ 3P0 gay lovers joke (it was getting trite at the time) and have been running with it ever since. As of ep3 I considered declaring that 3P0 was Plagueis (sp?), but decided to set them into antiquity instead.

And no, I haven't used it in my fanfics yet. Just among friends, though it's funny how many people I've gotten to believe the thing.

Warsie · Post by **Warsie** » 2007-08-30 10:09pm

I apologize for this being off-topic..but her pic looks like Cracky-chan; but her profile doesn't.

Onward to the topic, I have to say "interesting" especially the idea that Yoda and Obi-Wan started the Rebel Alliance; rather than the CIS remnant fortress worlds and Old Republic senators...but she likely doesn't involve the EU so,,,

EDIT: about Obi-Wan communicating with the Alliance, hmm he was able to help the Acherin Separatists right with a contact; at the end of Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader it's seen that Obi-Wan would occasionally go to Mos Eisley or Mos Espa occasionally?

Civil War Man · Post by **Civil War Man** » 2007-08-30 10:21pm

Warsie wrote:at the end of Dark Lord: The Rise of Darth Vader it's seen that Obi-Wan would occasionally go to Mos Eisley or Mos Espa occasionally?

1. He's keeping an eye on Luke.

2. Even Jedi need food.

3. Obi-Wan drinks a lot.

Warsie · Post by **Warsie** » 2007-08-31 12:17am

Civil War Man wrote: 1. He's keeping an eye on Luke.

2. Even Jedi need food.

3. Obi-Wan drinks a lot.

3 is funny. I thank you for that.

Ritterin Sophia · Post by **Ritterin Sophia** » 2007-08-31 07:09am

Civil War Man wrote:3. Obi-Wan drinks a lot.

That reminded me so much of this parody.