GEoM > Chaos Gods?

Murazor · Post by **Murazor** » 2007-09-01 03:54pm

Just asking, because I have recently gone out of my depth in debating 40k against a guy claiming that the Chaos Gods are much, much stronger than the GEoM, something that goes against most of what I have read in forums like these.

Anyone can confirm or refute this, please?

Post by **NecronLord** » 2007-09-01 05:11pm

Eye of Terror (novel). Tzeentch's highest ranking demons are uncertain of who will win in the final confrontation between Chaos and the Emperor Ascendant/Star Child.

It's my impression that the 'power levels' are pretty much GEoM ~= Chaos but it can vary depending on galactic events, and many other factors.

Duckie · Post by **Duckie** » 2007-09-01 05:35pm

In a way, the Chaos Gods are, because the Emperor is devoting nearly 100% of his massive warpcraft and willpower into stopping them from bursting forth from the Eye and eating everything.

Meanwhile, the Chaos Gods have lesser avatars of themselves, the Greater Daemons and the like, running about.

But it's bascially a draw.

Rye · Post by **Rye** » 2007-09-01 08:30pm

If it were a draw, wouldn't the Eye/other similar weak points be more numerous or voluminous since if/when Chaos is meant to win the whole galaxy sinks into the warp? If that's the case and they're being held in a small percentage of it, I would've thought that'd mean the Emperor's stronger overall.

Teleros · Post by **Teleros** » 2007-09-01 09:11pm

I think the Emperor is more powerful, but as said he's busy trying to protect the universe. I say this because I remember reading waaay back in the old 2nd Edition of 40K how, when the Emperor fought Horus, the latter was heavily empowered by the Chaos Gods - and of course still lost. Assuming they were serious about Horus beating the Emperor of course - kinda hard to tell with Chaos.

Connor MacLeod · Post by **Connor MacLeod** » 2007-09-02 01:12am

Like NecronLord said, the GEoM is > Chaos gods, or at least has the potential to be that. Bear in mind that the "GEoM" is actually an aggregate of a bunch of thousands of ancient reincarnated psykers (a multi-mind, as per the novel Draco) and is further bolstered by the countless millions (billions) of psykers he is soul bound to/with, as well as the belief/faith of the entire Imperium (ie the latent psychic potential of trillions or quadrillions of other humans.)

Its also quite possible (due to hints in other novels) that the Emperor's powers are also bolstered by the dead souls of countless humans and psykers including hte Primarchs (the "Angels" Larkin mentions, or the visions/visitations of Primarchs in some cases, ,such as in the Blood Angels novels.)

Generally, he's like the other "Warp Gods" like the Chaso Gods, the Orks, or what the Eldar are trying to do with their spirit stones/infinity circuit (they're all "powered" by the faith/latent psychic potential of the racial members) but much more numerous as well as more focused/coherent (vs the various Chaos entities who have trouble cooperating, and the Ork Gods, who while as numerous if not mores othan Humanity, are too fragmented to be unified.)

The reason why the GEoM cannot yet kick the asses of everyone else is probably because he's busy all over the Imperium helping to keep it together as well as manage myriad other things (the AStronomican, Soul binding, saving Ciaphas Cain/Leoten Semper/Ibram Gaunt/etc., and so on and so forth.) Much in th esame way that the Imperium as a whole could crush anyone if they concentrated on any one force, but the fact they are fighting on multiple fronts constantly keeps them dispersed and distracted. Give him some more time to expand, gain more adherents (ie humanity multiplying) or consume more psykers, he probably will at some point kick their asses.

PainRack · Post by **PainRack** » 2007-09-02 05:51am

Teleros wrote:I think the Emperor is more powerful, but as said he's busy trying to protect the universe. I say this because I remember reading waaay back in the old 2nd Edition of 40K how, when the Emperor fought Horus, the latter was heavily empowered by the Chaos Gods - and of course still lost. Assuming they were serious about Horus beating the Emperor of course - kinda hard to tell with Chaos.

Its mentioned specifically that the Emperor lost in WD because he couldn't bear to kill Horus. At some level, he still could not accept that Horus had been possessed by Chaos..... indeed, when his powers defeated Horus and the Chaos gods were driven from him, he had to force himself to deliver the killing blow as to not do so would allow Chaos to repossess Horus, and the crippling injury already inflicted on him would mean he couldn't defeat the Chaos champion.