ST vs. SW

[Darth Servo]

I'd REALLY like to see gunpowder rockets do the things we've seen phasers do.

Then again, gunpowder doesn't malfunction in the presence of the technobabble of the week (tm) the way phasers do.

[Batman]

I'd REALLY like to see gunpowder rockets do the things we've seen phasers do.

Then again, gunpowder doesn't malfunction in the presence of the technobabble of the week (tm) the way phasers do.

It does if the technobabble of the week happens to be water

[timewarp]

I'd REALLY like to see gunpowder rockets do the things we've seen phasers do.

It was an exaggeration.

[DPDarkPrimus]

I'd REALLY like to see gunpowder rockets do the things we've seen phasers do.

Then again, gunpowder doesn't malfunction in the presence of the technobabble of the week (tm) the way phasers do.

It does if the technobabble of the week happens to be dihydrogen monoxide

Corrected for technobattle.

[Batman]

I'd REALLY like to see gunpowder rockets do the things we've seen phasers do.

It was an exaggeration.

You could've said so. Batman. No sense of humour, remember?
*
And while Trek hand phasers suck where ergonomics are concerned TNG+ and may not have the raw firepower of Wars blasters they're perfectly serviceable sidearms (before the dustbuster).
And you specifically said gunpowder rockets were more POWERFUL than phasers. Use them to take out a Connie.
I'm waiting.

[timewarp]

I'd REALLY like to see gunpowder rockets do the things we've seen phasers do.

It was an exaggeration.

You could've said so. Batman. No sense of humour, remember?
*
And while Trek hand phasers suck where ergonomics are concerned TNG+ and may not have the raw firepower of Wars blasters they're perfectly serviceable sidearms (before the dustbuster).
And you specifically said gunpowder rockets were more POWERFUL than phasers. Use them to take out a Connie.
I'm waiting.

I said nothing of the sort. I said (in jest) that gunpowder was superior to phasers. That does not necessarily mean more powerful.

[Batman]

Then again, gunpowder doesn't malfunction in the presence of the technobabble of the week (tm) the way phasers do.

It does if the technobabble of the week happens to be dihydrogen monoxide

Corrected for technobattle.

Duly noted

[Batman]

Incidentally, timewarp, you are due an apology. You indeed never claimed gunpowder rockets were more POWERFUL than phasers, that was paradox244.
So for whatever it's worth I apologize.

[timewarp]

Incidentally, timewarp, you are due an apology. You indeed never claimed gunpowder rockets were more POWERFUL than phasers, that was paradox244.
So for whatever it's worth I apologize.

Don't worry about it. I was never offended or angry, but it's hard to convey that through text.

[Paradox244]

Incidentally, timewarp, you are due an apology. You indeed never claimed gunpowder rockets were more POWERFUL than phasers, that was paradox244.

Oops.

[Batman]

Incidentally, timewarp, you are due an apology. You indeed never claimed gunpowder rockets were more POWERFUL than phasers, that was paradox244.

Oops.

Oops, indeed.
For the record, Paradox 244 never claimed that. Quite the opposite, in fact.

[Havok]

The Federation deployed illegal bioweapons against the Dominion, in an attempt to win the war through genocide. If they had a phase cloak, they would have used it.

I thought that was Section 31 and that they operated autonomous of The Federation and were unknown to all but a hand full of Starfleet personnel.

[Darth Wong]

The Federation deployed illegal bioweapons against the Dominion, in an attempt to win the war through genocide. If they had a phase cloak, they would have used it.

I thought that was Section 31 and that they operated autonomous of The Federation and were unknown to all but a hand full of Starfleet personnel.

Since Section 31 is the much-wanked organization that supposedly confiscated and hid the phase-cloak, this doesn't refute the point.

[Darth Wong]

Why is it safe to assume that power production of these ships ought to scale down linearly with total volume?

Why is it safe for you to comment on a thread without reading it as per the forum rules?

[Darth Servo]

Then again, gunpowder doesn't malfunction in the presence of the technobabble of the week (tm) the way phasers do.

It does if the technobabble of the week happens to be dihydrogen monoxide

Corrected for technobattle.

"Dihydrogen monoxide" is real science, not technobabble. And just don't get it IN the gunpowder. You can still fire a musket on the beach.

[DPDarkPrimus]

It does if the technobabble of the week happens to be dihydrogen monoxide

Corrected for technobattle.

"Dihydrogen monoxide" is real science, not technobabble.

I know, but if you're going to be using it as an excuse for why something isn't working, you're not going to just say "Water got in it".

[DogsOfWar]

I know, but if you're going to be using it as an excuse for why something isn't working, you're not going to just say "Water got in it".

Yeah, it's the same kind of thing as Data calling air a "nitrogen-oxygen mix" in Insurrection

[Ender]

The first Death Star was a perfect sphere 160 kilometers in diameter. From this you can derive its volume and scale down to get a rough estimate of the power an Imperial-class Star Destroyer ought to be capable of producing.

I remember reading a similar thing on the main site in the past, but I don't recall the justification for scaling like this. I don't doubt the conclusion, but I would like some clarification on this particular methodology.


Why is it safe to assume that power production of these ships ought to scale down linearly with total volume?

Isn't it possible that there is some wall it hits as you go smaller; perhaps the Death Star reactor requires a huge critical mass or something, that a smaller ship cannot reproduce (consider a formula like power = k(volume - x), so if the volume was close to x, it is all support gear (maybe radiation shielding, which would be dependent on actual reactor geometry as well as the ship size itself) and no actual generator)?

I guess what I'm saying is it seems to me that a volume scale should be inconclusive at best without additional information, but if I am missing understanding, please, I'd like to get it.

Volume scaling in and of itself would be insufficient, yes. Even without the issues you raised, not all reactor technology scales the same - some fusion designs would scale to a factor of 7, for example.

However, when you run the math for the required peak power of other ships, you get additional data points that let you define the power curve. And that's where it gets interesting - scaling down the DS reactor to the ISD reactor gets you a power of 2.5*10^25 watts, while process analysis gives the ISD a power of at least 10^25 watts. Precision is a factor, but its the same order of magnitude. Do the same for another ship with a known rector volume, and 3 points gives you a curve. The curve actually ends up being roughly linear in this case. I was pleasantly surprised when I discovered this myself.

[Ender]

and have rapid fire anti-fighter laser cannons for small ships just like Amidala's.

Actually, the Trade Federation battleship only has 42 quad turbolaser turrets. However, none of the shots looked like direct hits. It looked more like they glanced off the shields and hull.

Quite a bit more - count the ones in the films. And the core alone had 280 light lasers

[The Evil Shadow]

Back, I still hate work.

anyways.

Phasers do vape people. That is canon. (thanks to it being said so in episodes and movies.)

If yall are going to SW EU. I'll just have to use ST EU. won't that be fun?

Oh did mention ST ship weapons can do more damage than a nuke?
Based on movie evidence SW capital ship weapons are below nuke level fire power.


And remember bigger isn't always better.

and what weapons did boba fett's ship have?

[General Zod]

If yall are going to SW EU. I'll just have to use ST EU. won't that be fun?

Too bad ST eu isn't canon.

Oh did mention ST ship weapons can do more damage than a nuke?
Based on movie evidence SW capital ship weapons are below nuke level fire power.

Blowing up a planet is below nuke level firepower?

[The Spartan]

Oh did mention ST ship weapons can do more damage than a nuke?
Based on movie evidence SW capital ship weapons are below nuke level fire power.

You will of course provide calculations demonstrating this.

[Darth Servo]

Back, I still hate work.

As much as you hate rationality.

Phasers do vape people. That is canon. (thanks to it being said so in episodes and movies.)

Only if you redefine 'vape' to mean 'disappear into thin air without producing any vapor'

If yall are going to SW EU. I'll just have to use ST EU. won't that be fun?

We aren't the ones who define canon. You don't like those rules, complain to the respective franchises.

Oh did mention ST ship weapons can do more damage than a nuke?

Rarely. The torp in ST5 did less damage than artillery shells.

Based on movie evidence SW capital ship weapons are below nuke level fire power.

Based on WHAT exactly?

And remember bigger isn't always better.

Depends on what you're trying to do.

and what weapons did boba fett's ship have?

Rapid repeating blasters, missles and seismic charges that did more damage each than "most" of the E-D's torp payload would have done in "Pegasus"

[Darth Lucifer]

Phasers do vape people. That is canon. (thanks to it being said so in episodes and movies.)

When visuals and dialogue are in conflict, it is generally better to go with the former for objective analysis, since the latter can be highly subjective.

Example: Cmdr. Shelby in BOBW made an estimate that a Borg Cube can still function even if 75% of it was inoperative. But ST:FC clearly contradicts this. On top of that, she had never encountered the Borg up until that very episode.

If yall are going to SW EU. I'll just have to use ST EU. won't that be fun?

ST doesn't have an EU, dumbass.

Oh did mention ST ship weapons can do more damage than a nuke?

Evidence?

Based on movie evidence SW capital ship weapons are below nuke level fire power.

The ISD in the asteroid field in TESB clearly contradicts this. And what are you calling "nuke level?" You're not even trying to quantify anything here.

[Ender]

Back, I still hate work.

anyways.

Phasers do vape people. That is canon. (thanks to it being said so in episodes and movies.)

Provide quotes stating that they vaporized, though it is irrelevant as characters have also claimed the existence of temperatures below 0 Kelvin. Not to mention that one need only watch the show to see they do not vaporize their objects. They disappear, but they are not vaporized.