Who else is sick of super sword-wielding babes?

Post by **Ghost Rider** » 2007-10-04 05:09pm

Adrian Laguna wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:For me, the straw that broke the camel's back was the advertising tagline for the new Heavenly Sword game: "Vengeance has never looked so beautiful". I remember looking at the TV and actually saying out loud "Oh for fuck's sake, what a load of bullshit."
I'll take this moment to point out that the gigantic tits sported by Heavenly Sword's protagonist are not beautiful at all (to me, anyway). I actually visibly cringed when I saw the picture posed by Covenant.

That character, in Covenant's picture, is Rachel from Ninja Gaiden.

VF5SS · Post by **VF5SS** » 2007-10-04 05:35pm

Rachel's case is slightly different. If you're playing Ninja Gaiden for this worthless piece of ass that doesn't affect the game (or even feature heavily on the box) in any way then you need to get your priorities straight. Haha

Molyneux · Post by **Molyneux** » 2007-10-04 05:38pm

Resinence wrote:
Halo ?
Cortana.

First: as has been mentioned, she doesn't HAVE a body. What she has is a holographic representation which doesn't have to engage in combat, eat, breathe, sleep or really do anything other than be PG-13 or less.

Secondly: technically, at least for most of Halo: CE (as I haven't played too much of the Halo 2 single player, and none as of yet of Halo 3), Cortana is wearing plausible armor. She's riding with you in the MJOLNIR, and while she might be (apparently) nude in just her avatar, it's pretty hard to not be naked underneath your clothes.

I do have to give credit to Marvel for, as far as I can remember, avoiding putting their physical heroines in high heels. DC has some heroines in comfortable shoes - Hawkwoman in JLAU, for one - but far too many people who think that hand-to-hand fighting is a perfect activity to perform in stilettoes, most notably the new Batwoman.

salm · Post by **salm** » 2007-10-04 05:39pm

For me it really depends. If it´s a mindless action slasher in which the story and character development counts for absolutely nothing (the way i imagine Heavenly Sword to be) i really don´t give a damn if the main character is a super chick/super dude or a nun or a geek.

In games in which the story is actually worth something it´s different. If for example the MGS games used mindless, cliche characters, then i´d have a problem.

A character i hate with a passion is the guy from Gears of War. For some reason he carries an (for the lack of a better expression) aura of American Conservatism. I don´t know, it´s hard to explain.

Molyneux · Post by **Molyneux** » 2007-10-04 05:41pm

salm wrote:For me it really depends. If it´s a mindless action slasher in which the story and character development counts for absolutely nothing (the way i imagine Heavenly Sword to be) i really don´t give a damn if the main character is a super chick/super dude or a nun or a geek.

In games in which the story is actually worth something it´s different. If for example the MGS games used mindless, cliche characters, then i´d have a problem.

A character i hate with a passion is the guy from Gears of War. For some reason he carries an (for the lack of a better expression) aura of American Conservatism. I don´t know, it´s hard to explain.

Doesn't he run around in full powered battle armor...with no helmet?

Sidewinder · Post by **Sidewinder** » 2007-10-04 05:51pm

Brother-Captain Gaius wrote:I want to do horrible things to the first person who put heels on an outfit intended for combat.

I agree; combat boots-- something a normal human can actually run around in-- are more appropriate.

Slightly OT, regarding Covenant's post: One thing I've never understood about anime is the fascination with over-stylized, pseudo-European aesthetics (usually 16th century or thereabouts). Can someone explain this to me?

To the native (Japanese) audience, such settings seem exotic and appropriate for a fantasy story. (Inversely, think about all the fantasy that Western writers set in an Asian background.)

Brother-Captain Gaius · Post by **Brother-Captain Gaius** » 2007-10-04 06:06pm

Sidewinder wrote:To the native (Japanese) audience, such settings seem exotic and appropriate for a fantasy story. (Inversely, think about all the fantasy that Western writers set in an Asian background.)

I see. Thank you.

Adrian Laguna · Post by **Adrian Laguna** » 2007-10-04 06:44pm

Ghost Rider wrote:That character, in Covenant's picture, is Rachel from Ninja Gaiden.

Ah okay.

*looks up Heavenly Sword's main character*

Whoa talk about an obvious God of War rip-off... with bigger and more unergonomic swords.

She is attractive, though her failed attempt at having a bad-ass expression heavily detracts from it. Also, even if she's so good at dodging that armour would actually be a hindrance, her hair's gonna get her killed.

In all probability regarding this game: GoW did it first and did it better, character genders not withstanding.

Spanky The Dolphin · Post by **Spanky The Dolphin** » 2007-10-04 07:52pm

God of War also did it longer, from what I understand.

Andrew_Fireborn · Post by **Andrew_Fireborn** » 2007-10-04 07:58pm

Well, from the first time I'd heard about it, it was all "God of War, WITH TITS!" even completely forgetting that GoW had tits, good tits, ones that featured pretty fully exposed in a fair number of cut scenes... In both games... (GoW was made on the Testosterone symbol... no if, ands, or buts about it.)

... Well, that brings me back to the "if it's being sold on tits" rule I have.

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2007-10-04 07:59pm

See, I might be out of place here, because I'm one of those wierd guys who likes the idea of a chick with a sword, wailling on badguys. Some, knowing this facet of me, and also my penchant for redheads and forgiveness for size of melee weapons, might think I'd forgive this.

Wrong.

A female sword-swinger should be wearing armour, not some damn silly gypsy outfit. Preferrably full plate. Why? Duh, it's logically consistant. The 'No armour required!' bit was refreshing... very, very briefly. By this point it just incites me to want to smack people. The only game that got a pass on this was Metriod: Zero Mission, because it was a fun gimmick to run around until you get the suit.

So. From the minds of one of those damn strange people this was no doubt aiming to snag.

PS. The game apparently is pathetically short and simple. God Of War it ain't.

Ryushikaze · Post by **Ryushikaze** » 2007-10-04 08:04pm

Darth Wong wrote:For me, the straw that broke the camel's back was the advertising tagline for the new Heavenly Sword game: "Vengeance has never looked so beautiful". I remember looking at the TV and actually saying out loud "Oh for fuck's sake, what a load of bullshit."

Granted, that is bullshit, and a really stupid fucking tagline, but I don't think the heroine of Heavenly Sword is guilt of being an over the top battle babe, physically, at least. She's actually quite thin and toned, what one might expect from a warrior. Her hair is utterly ridiculous, though.

As is that sword, but at least it's got "teh magicals" to somewhat excuse the fact that it's an utterly implausible weapon.

salm · Post by **salm** » 2007-10-04 08:11pm

Molyneux wrote: Doesn't he run around in full powered battle armor...with no helmet?

Yeah. But that´s not my gripe with him. Main characters not wearing helmets is necessary for cinematic effects.
Same reason why important people in War Hammer 40K don´t wear helmets.

Ritterin Sophia · Post by **Ritterin Sophia** » 2007-10-04 08:15pm

Wow, this thread reminds me of the problem that some Warhammer 40k players are having with people who want to model Female Space Marines or Cadians, the problem with the FSMs is that there's NO FEMALES in the Adeptus Astartes, the problem with the Female Guardsmen isn't that there are no chicks in the Guard, it's that they don't realize that a chick in full gear looks no different from another guy and they still insist on modelling FF-Cups and bulbous butts.

Chris OFarrell · Post by **Chris OFarrell** » 2007-10-04 08:32pm

http://www.ctrlaltdel-online.com/comic.php?d=20070922

Vendetta · Post by **Vendetta** » 2007-10-04 08:42pm

VF5SS wrote:Rachel's case is slightly different. If you're playing Ninja Gaiden for this worthless piece of ass that doesn't affect the game (or even feature heavily on the box) in any way then you need to get your priorities straight. Haha

True, Rachael is also an object lesson in "why wearing skimpy leather is a bad idea", because all she does is get herself gutpunched and then kidnapped.

Covenant · Post by **Covenant** » 2007-10-04 09:59pm

Vendetta wrote:
VF5SS wrote:Rachel's case is slightly different. If you're playing Ninja Gaiden for this worthless piece of ass that doesn't affect the game (or even feature heavily on the box) in any way then you need to get your priorities straight. Haha
True, Rachael is also an object lesson in "why wearing skimpy leather is a bad idea", because all she does is get herself gutpunched and then kidnapped.

She also gets completely covered in goo. Remember that. Slick, glistening goo. On her knees.

I chose Rachel as my example for that very reason--while I love hawt chiks Rachel comes off as some kind of action-hero prostitute who got put into the game only because the game-makers were too tired from making the Ninja to do anything other than import the first Poser Model they could download off of www.nogirlfriend.com/posermodels.html. There was no purpose for Rachel in that game whatsoever besides to be a pair of breasts that get kidnapped. It's not even like there was a love interest.

If Rachel had been fully clothed, she'd still be absolutely ridiculous, from her jangly earrings and stripper makeup, she's just a horrible waste of space. I'm totally happy to bounce around as a busty superheroine, but for Goodness Sake, don't try to make me think the game is serious. Heavenly Blade is the worst of the bunch because not only does it think it's a serious game (or a good game) but that it is a martial arts drama. You lose all right to be pretentious about your game around that point.

VF5SS · Post by **VF5SS** » 2007-10-04 10:14pm

Chris OFarrell wrote:http://www.ctrlaltdel-online.com/comic.php?d=20070922

8^U

I like Ivy's 2P outfit from SC1 a lot better haha. Seriously though, fighting games aren't paragons of realism when a person can take fifty slices from a sword and just fall down. Only Bushido Blade tried the realism approach when it came to sword play. Oddly enough that game had a "sword vs gun" encounter with one of the bosses. If you didn't move immediately, then you'd get shot and die.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2007-10-04 10:22pm

Ryushikaze wrote:
Darth Wong wrote:For me, the straw that broke the camel's back was the advertising tagline for the new Heavenly Sword game: "Vengeance has never looked so beautiful". I remember looking at the TV and actually saying out loud "Oh for fuck's sake, what a load of bullshit."
Granted, that is bullshit, and a really stupid fucking tagline, but I don't think the heroine of Heavenly Sword is guilt of being an over the top battle babe, physically, at least. She's actually quite thin and toned, what one might expect from a warrior. Her hair is utterly ridiculous, though.

Since when do you expect a "warrior" to have a thin, straight nose, model-like face, and be "thin and toned"? I expect a "warrior" to be tough-looking, grizzled, solidly built, and have scars or a flattened nose or some other visible symptom of a life of violence. That should be true regardless of whether we're talking about a male or female.

As is that sword, but at least it's got "teh magicals" to somewhat excuse the fact that it's an utterly implausible weapon.

"Beautiful" and "thin and toned" are good descriptions of a swimsuit model, not a "warrior", no matter what kind of sword he or she is using.

VF5SS · Post by **VF5SS** » 2007-10-04 10:45pm

Covenant wrote:
She also gets completely covered in goo. Remember that. Slick, glistening goo. On her knees.

After being attacked by a tentacle monster no less. Somehow young Ayane who has maybe five lines in the game is a much more interesting character (and better dressed). I'd rather they let you play as her instead of Rachel in the later versions of Ninja Gaiden. I see a lot of Rachel hate among Ninja Gaiden fans. Crazy German guy probably has more fans haha.

Molyneux · Post by **Molyneux** » 2007-10-04 11:28pm

Darth Wong wrote: Since when do you expect a "warrior" to have a thin, straight nose, model-like face, and be "thin and toned"? I expect a "warrior" to be tough-looking, grizzled, solidly built, and have scars or a flattened nose or some other visible symptom of a life of violence. That should be true regardless of whether we're talking about a male or female.

Completely agreed, except in worlds where there is magical or similarly "super" healing available. Of course, in that kind of world the males shouldn't be any more scarred than the females without good reason.

A good example of a female warrior in a fantasy-type setting really doesn't get better, I think, than Rachel Hart from Dominic Deegan. She generally eschews armor completely, being more of the "berserker" type fighter, but at least she's tall, visibly muscular and is not inexplicably scarless.

...Of course, she does wear buttless chaps on occasion...but that's her choice, and it's been brought up by other characters several times that she has a unique fashion sense in that world.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2007-10-04 11:30pm

Ironically, 'berserker' type fighting is utterly retarded by itself. Get this guys: vikings had good armour. People running into combat in their underpants and no defence don't get +5 to attack, they get fucking murdered.

Unless they're Picts and freak out the poor Romans.

Fingolfin_Noldor · Post by **Fingolfin_Noldor** » 2007-10-04 11:38pm

VF5SS wrote:
Covenant wrote:
She also gets completely covered in goo. Remember that. Slick, glistening goo. On her knees.

After being attacked by a tentacle monster no less. Somehow young Ayane who has maybe five lines in the game is a much more interesting character (and better dressed). I'd rather they let you play as her instead of Rachel in the later versions of Ninja Gaiden. I see a lot of Rachel hate among Ninja Gaiden fans. Crazy German guy probably has more fans haha.

Didn't know they would sell a... xxx game for XBox. Or is this some earlier game?

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2007-10-04 11:43pm

Stark wrote:Ironically, 'berserker' type fighting is utterly retarded by itself. Get this guys: vikings had good armour. People running into combat in their underpants and no defence don't get +5 to attack, they get fucking murdered.

Unless they're Picts and freak out the poor Romans.

If you've ever seen a Pict drunk and naked, you'd understand.

Molyneux · Post by **Molyneux** » 2007-10-04 11:44pm

Stark wrote:Ironically, 'berserker' type fighting is utterly retarded by itself. Get this guys: vikings had good armour. People running into combat in their underpants and no defence don't get +5 to attack, they get fucking murdered.

Unless they're Picts and freak out the poor Romans.

Keep in mind that Rachel (Should I just call her "Hart", to differentiate from the Ninja Gaiden one?) is at least durable enough to break quite hard objects with her face, with no injury. It's sort of a specialty of hers.

salm wrote:
Molyneux wrote:Doesn't he run around in full powered battle armor...with no helmet?
Yeah. But that´s not my gripe with him. Main characters not wearing helmets is necessary for cinematic effects.
Same reason why important people in War Hammer 40K don´t wear helmets.

Bull. Need I remind you of Halo? Or of Starcraft, where Jim Raynor never even leaves his vehicle? Or Darth Vader? Or, say, Metroid?