Who could beat Jedi/Sith easily?

[fgalkin2]

Let me see now...the Shrike can disembowel one before they know it's even there. A strong 40k psyker could make their head explode from half a city away. Strong fantasy magic users like the Others can blow them up from a distance (or utterly mind-rape them). A Culture drone would chop one up with knife missiles, blow him up, or simply ram him through the chest. Q would teleport one into the Sun.

Need I go on with this list?

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[lance]

What about Bugs Bunny? He seems to bounce back from most things including surviving being on a moon that got mostly destroyed.

[fgalkin2]

Now here's an intersting question: could an Ork Warboss defeat a Jedi? The Jedi has a lightsaber and pre-cog, but the Ork is huge, armored, and has cool gadjets like powerklaws and such. And a very big gun.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[SilverWingedSeraph]

Now here's an intersting question: could an Ork Warboss defeat a Jedi? The Jedi has a lightsaber and pre-cog, but the Ork is huge, armored, and has cool gadjets like powerklaws and such. And a very big gun.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

An Ork Warboss sounds like an over-sized Gamorrean. Or a baby Rancor with a gun. I'd go for the Jedi. Besides, the title of the thread is "Who can defeat a Jedi easily?", and I highly doubt any Ork could beat a Jedi with ease.

[Crazedwraith]

An unpopular choice but Q could likely do it. No matter where his powers come from. He can just flick his fingers and teleport things, in the case the jedi into deep space.

[fgalkin2]

Now here's an intersting question: could an Ork Warboss defeat a Jedi? The Jedi has a lightsaber and pre-cog, but the Ork is huge, armored, and has cool gadjets like powerklaws and such. And a very big gun.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

An Ork Warboss sounds like an over-sized Gamorrean. Or a baby Rancor with a gun. I'd go for the Jedi. Besides, the title of the thread is "Who can defeat a Jedi easily?", and I highly doubt any Ork could beat a Jedi with ease.

Well, Ghazghkull probably could. Not only is he 6 meters tall and massively stong and fast, he is also easily the strongest and smartest Ork alive. Any hit that connects will probably kill your average jedi.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[Ford Prefect]

Well, Ghazghkull probably could. Not only is he 6 meters tall and massively stong and fast, he is also easily the strongest and smartest Ork alive. Any hit that connects will probably kill your average jedi.

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

If Ghazgkull won, it would be primarily because he is extremely cunning, more than his general combat capabilities. Certainly, we know that if he wasn't prohibited by the OP, he would almost definitely teleport in an Orkish attacck force and drown the Jedi in blood/bullets.

Certainly in direct combat a Jedi only has to pick him up telekinetically then stand behind him and he's pretty much stuffed. Ghazgkull is ludicrously killy, but there's nothing he can do about that.

[Covenant]

Certainly in direct combat a Jedi only has to pick him up telekinetically then stand behind him and he's pretty much stuffed. Ghazgkull is ludicrously killy, but there's nothing he can do about that.

Honestly, this excuse is really becoming pretty silly. The whole 'pick them up and ___' thing is fairly ridiculous. Rarely do we see Jedi be able to do something like pick up a person AND take an action at once. Shoving something, yanking something, sure. Little flick-of-the-wrist motions are okay to do in combat, but levitating things? We see Yoda himself have to stop combat to stop that big thing from tipping over.

And if Sith are so able to just main people to death with organ rupturing at a glance, why didn't he just bust an artery in Obi-Wan's neck and take off while Yoda was forced to force heal him?

Sure, there might be a lot of good reasons, but I think it's a worthless cop-out. Is the EU rife with levitating people, or does the Dark Force Shroud also make it hard to levitate people and droids and stuff?

If not, I think it's BS. Ghazgkull certainly has a mass above that of a wall-mounted sconce or piece of rubbish. I'm sure Yoda could lift him, with effort and great concentration but we don't see any evidence that this kind of concentration is available to him while he's moving, or when the target is alive.

I think it's more likely that Yoda would attempt to lift Ghaz, requiring both his hands free and a moment of silence and concentration, and then is torn apart by a hail of bullets. Do we see any consistant repeatable evidence that Jedi are able to lift living, mobile combatants mid-combat and do anything in the meantime? Even Vader decided to stand there and chill out when he was throwing shit at Luke.

Also, Yoda may assert that size means nothing, but this is clearly not the case in the instances we see he himself try to levitate things. A large object takes him greatly more concentration to move--or, in this case, stop--than a small one or multiple small ones. While Yoda may be able to try to knock the big Ork on hiz green arse bitz with a shove, it's so crazy to keep asserting that Jedi can kill anything just by lifting it off the ground, walking behind, and stabbing repeatedly. I'd say that Ghaz probably has much metal and mass on him as a small tank, and if Jedi push/lift ability really is limited or hindered by mass (as it woudl appear) then it's not going to be at all that simple.

Do we have EU examples of jedi being able to lift/hold things (not just recklessly shove/toss them) while engaging in other actions? If we can find someone actually doing it, like a post ROTS Luke for example, that'll put a nice theoretical lower limit on the power level required to do such a thing, since we see several times that the Jedi needlessly do not do such things--which proves they're either too foolish to do this in a real fight, or that they're not able.

[Ghost Rider]

Certainly in direct combat a Jedi only has to pick him up telekinetically then stand behind him and he's pretty much stuffed. Ghazgkull is ludicrously killy, but there's nothing he can do about that.

Honestly, this excuse is really becoming pretty silly. The whole 'pick them up and ___' thing is fairly ridiculous. Rarely do we see Jedi be able to do something like pick up a person AND take an action at once. Shoving something, yanking something, sure. Little flick-of-the-wrist motions are okay to do in combat, but levitating things? We see Yoda himself have to stop combat to stop that big thing from tipping over.

And if Sith are so able to just main people to death with organ rupturing at a glance, why didn't he just bust an artery in Obi-Wan's neck and take off while Yoda was forced to force heal him?

Sure, there might be a lot of good reasons, but I think it's a worthless cop-out. Is the EU rife with levitating people, or does the Dark Force Shroud also make it hard to levitate people and droids and stuff?

Yes it does.

And The novels of canon go into great detail that when Jedi/Sith fight, they are not just fighting with just lightsabers. They are trying to overwhelm the other person with the Force to do exactly that.

And they do have EU examples of Sith/Jedi fucking someone by flinging them like dolls. Vader does this extensively.

[OmegaGuy]

What about a FORCE: Ground soldier from the Hyperion cantos?

Their weapons are homing and have nearly perfect accuracy at up to 9 kilometers, they can blanket an area with all kinds of firepower at once (what most people say is the best way to overcome a Jedi), their armor gives them superhuman speed and reactions, camouflage, light pulses that can blind their opponents, auto - tracking features, laser beams that can melt large boulders in a single shot, incredibly powerful rifle bullets (that can split a boulder in half), plasma bolts that can hit a moon from the surface, beams of high energy electrons that can drill through .5 kilometers of solid rock, swarms of heat - seeking darts, flechette weapons, canister grenades, and probably some other things I'm forgetting.

[Ford Prefect]

And if Sith are so able to just main people to death with organ rupturing at a glance, why didn't he just bust an artery in Obi-Wan's neck and take off while Yoda was forced to force heal him?

First of all, I think this is pretty much bullshit myself. I'm pretty sure it has never been demonstrated.

Sure, there might be a lot of good reasons, but I think it's a worthless cop-out. Is the EU rife with levitating people, or does the Dark Force Shroud also make it hard to levitate people and droids and stuff?

Dooku picks up Obi Wan with telekinesis while similtaneously kicking Anakin across a room. And frankly, it seems absurd to assume that a Jedi could not levitate a person, given they have levitated other objects before. How heavy do you think Ghaz is? He might be really large and clad in Mega-Armour, but he's not going to outmass an X-wing, or probably come all that close to one in terms of mass.

[fgalkin]

Certainly in direct combat a Jedi only has to pick him up telekinetically then stand behind him and he's pretty much stuffed. Ghazgkull is ludicrously killy, but there's nothing he can do about that.

Honestly, this excuse is really becoming pretty silly. The whole 'pick them up and ___' thing is fairly ridiculous. Rarely do we see Jedi be able to do something like pick up a person AND take an action at once. Shoving something, yanking something, sure. Little flick-of-the-wrist motions are okay to do in combat, but levitating things? We see Yoda himself have to stop combat to stop that big thing from tipping over.

And if Sith are so able to just main people to death with organ rupturing at a glance, why didn't he just bust an artery in Obi-Wan's neck and take off while Yoda was forced to force heal him?

Sure, there might be a lot of good reasons, but I think it's a worthless cop-out. Is the EU rife with levitating people, or does the Dark Force Shroud also make it hard to levitate people and droids and stuff?

Yes it does.

And The novels of canon go into great detail that when Jedi/Sith fight, they are not just fighting with just lightsabers. They are trying to overwhelm the other person with the Force to do exactly that.

And they do have EU examples of Sith/Jedi fucking someone by flinging them like dolls. Vader does this extensively.

Were any of the people so flung the size of a rancor and the weight of a tank?

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

[Ghost Rider]

Honestly, this excuse is really becoming pretty silly. The whole 'pick them up and ___' thing is fairly ridiculous. Rarely do we see Jedi be able to do something like pick up a person AND take an action at once. Shoving something, yanking something, sure. Little flick-of-the-wrist motions are okay to do in combat, but levitating things? We see Yoda himself have to stop combat to stop that big thing from tipping over.

And if Sith are so able to just main people to death with organ rupturing at a glance, why didn't he just bust an artery in Obi-Wan's neck and take off while Yoda was forced to force heal him?

Sure, there might be a lot of good reasons, but I think it's a worthless cop-out. Is the EU rife with levitating people, or does the Dark Force Shroud also make it hard to levitate people and droids and stuff?

Yes it does.

And The novels of canon go into great detail that when Jedi/Sith fight, they are not just fighting with just lightsabers. They are trying to overwhelm the other person with the Force to do exactly that.

And they do have EU examples of Sith/Jedi fucking someone by flinging them like dolls. Vader does this extensively.

Were any of the people so flung the size of a rancor and the weight of a tank?

Have a very nice day.
-fgalkin

That part I am not disputing, given that honestly the fight between onw of the largest Warbosses ever and Jedi is going to be ugly. Hell, I'd be amazed if the Jedi could kill him without extensive chopping and the bastard standing there, thus making the point moot.

I was talking about the thought that because it wasn't constantly throw in the movies or about why don't two Force users just pop heads like pimples is a gross fallacy and pure cherry picking.

[Covenant]

Yes it does.

And The novels of canon go into great detail that when Jedi/Sith fight, they are not just fighting with just lightsabers. They are trying to overwhelm the other person with the Force to do exactly that.

And they do have EU examples of Sith/Jedi fucking someone by flinging them like dolls. Vader does this extensively.

*rubs his temples*

Well, conceded then. At least for some of these top fights. It seems so completely out of the realm of possibility based on the things we see in the movie, but the history of Star Wars novelization canon is pretty substantial. I certainly do say it is a rather distasteful result, given how pathetic Jedi are always depicted as looking, but I don't need to like it for it to be the case. Ah well.

In that kind of a case, I suppose that anything that doesn't have a telekinetic ability of it's own is basically just waiting to have it's organs boxed in. I guess it's down to people like Gandalf and Eldar Farseers who have the ability to do all sorts of fancy telekinetic sparring, and have also been demonstrated as melee proficent fighters.