Moderator: Vympel
lol wutI would posit that, in any universe with shared physics, the principles that cause phasers and disruptors to make objects outright vanish are the same that cause portions of Alderaan and the Liberty to phase out of existence. We may examine the visual effects in painstaking detail, or we may rely upon the novelization:
You remember correctly.Peptuck wrote:lol wutI would posit that, in any universe with shared physics, the principles that cause phasers and disruptors to make objects outright vanish are the same that cause portions of Alderaan and the Liberty to phase out of existence. We may examine the visual effects in painstaking detail, or we may rely upon the novelization:
I don't remeber Alderaan or the Liberty "phasing out" of existence. I do remember them exploding violently however.
No he wouldn't and thats not the only thing he wouldn't know.JMSpock wouldn't know consistency and honesty if it bit him on the ass.
The stupidity is amazing,we all know that movies precede the novels in terms of canon.Check out the thread its full of this shit.Though it looks more like a Big Sauce Gun pouring something hot over Alderaan, than a superlaser destroying the surface of a world, the message is actually pretty clear: the concept behind the drawing was that the planet's surface was already being scorched while the beam was still hitting it, and above, while it was still being fired by the Death Star.
But above all, we notice that the artist was not given any directive to show the presence of a shield whatsoever, and the text next to the picture makes no reference to a planetary shield.
Knowing Saxton's habits to sneak small bits of wank here and there, we know such a reference would have made it if he had been writing that snipset.
Same goes for the EU's manga illustrations of the film. No shield.
All this is perfectly in agreement with the interpretation that there was no shield.
It only fails to work when you believe that there was a shield.
Well, SD.net has a flagrant hatred for stupidity, so I'd estimate that the feeling is quite mutual.They don't like us SD.net guys much.
Well, you see, you have a life outside of the vs. debate. These fucks have nothing else to live for. Defeat means loss of all purpose to their lives.Elfdart wrote:I just don't get these people. I am a major league fanwhore of Sam Peckinpah movies, but there's no way in hell I'd ever argue that Pike Bishop could kick Darth Vader's ass in single combat unless I was joking. I'd rather punch myself in the cock with brass knuckles than subject myself to the humiliation of lying and bullshitting about something I like in order to "win" an argument about fictional people, places and things. There's a limit to how much of a fool I can make of myself.
If it did phase out, then they've just basically given SW a weapon that will (for all intents and purposes) ignore ST shields unless they can prove otherwise. Technobabble hyperspace weapons are funny that way.Peptuck wrote:lol wutI would posit that, in any universe with shared physics, the principles that cause phasers and disruptors to make objects outright vanish are the same that cause portions of Alderaan and the Liberty to phase out of existence. We may examine the visual effects in painstaking detail, or we may rely upon the novelization:
I don't remeber Alderaan or the Liberty "phasing out" of existence. I do remember them exploding violently however.
Which novel? If we're talking the "Death STar" novel I don't see what the hell they're babbling about, since that cover has nothign to do with Alderaan (I have the bloody book, so I should know.)DarthShady wrote:No he wouldn't and thats not the only thing he wouldn't know.
It seems the trektards are trying to prove that Alderan didn't have a planetary shield by using the cover of a novel.
But of course, Spock can't be bothered to go into any real detail WHY what he claims is to be so. He just makes vague declarations that it is. Clearly we are dealing with a Stewartian level intellect we cannot hope to begin to comprehend, nor should we try. Let's just take all his words at face value!!!Kane Starkiller wrote:JMSpock wouldn't know consistency and honesty if it bit him on the ass.
I like how he arbitrarily assumes that the comet must be heated to 4000-5000 K, even though ice will boil at far lower temperatures. Hell, evne going by color, metal and rock will only glow yellow-orange at a fraction of the temps he's claiming. Then agian, what do you expect for someone who makes no effort to back up his claims. Did I mention his temp assumption also boosts the calc by more than 3-4x what it needs to be?JMSpock, on TNG Weaponry page wrote:In "Masks," a comet we may estimate as several kilometers across is flashboiled away by phasers at 10% of maximum power. The comet's material is evaporated and heated to an incandescent yellow-orange (i.e., 4000-5000 kelvins). If the comet contained roughly 100-500 kg/m3 of ice and 5 kilometers across, with the remainder being negligible substances, we could estimate the energy in vaporizing the ice of the comet as being roughly 16-84 gigatons, applied in a very short order. A short maximum power burst is therefore likely to exceed a gigaton.
Secondly, you note he's using an unsubstantiated size for the comet (nope, he can't even be bothered to scale it.) It is worth noting that in the image he puts alongside this "calc", the Enterprise is in the background and the comet in the foreground, so the are looks to be at best no wider than the E-D's saucer section (tops.)
I also notice that in the rather tiny picture he uses, we can see what looks to be brown matter being blasted away from the "comet", which tends to contradict his insane temperature ideas.
The entirety of that "weapons" page is little more than conjecture and unsubstantiated fact coupled with arbitrary calcs. Anyone who has had a passing familiarity with the guy will not be surprised by this. (This is the same guy who arbitrarily declares SW uses diesel-supplemented fusion due to deleted scenes in ROTS, because he doesn't have a fucking clue how combustion engines work, and that 40K must use only nuclear reactors because it has the word "plasma" in it.)
Let this be a lesson to people - just becuase someone can do math does not neccesarily make their calculations true. The Math can be 100% accurate and still be wrong if they make a bunch of idiotic or unproven assumptions.
Funny, I don't recall the novelization describing anything like a phaser effecting the planet Alderaan. And I also note he does not even seem to bother actually going through proving the rest of his stuff regarding visual appearance (even though anyone can see that the "disappearing" act of phasers has nothign to do with what happened to Alderaan or the Liberty.)JMSpock, on starfleetjedi forum wrote:I would posit that, in any universe with shared physics, the principles that cause phasers and disruptors to make objects outright vanish are the same that cause portions of Alderaan and the Liberty to phase out of existence. We may examine the visual effects in painstaking detail, or we may rely upon the novelization:
JMSpock, on ANH power tech page wrote:This reactor core was capable of providing enough power for all the systems onboard the battlestation, and most notably the main weapon, a device of unknown but complex operation capable of blowing up a planet. This suggests a high if difficult to quantify level of power consumption and generation.
If I lose five ships out of a fifty ship fleet, I've suffered ten percent casualties. If I lose five ships out of a five hundred ship fleet, I've suffered one percent casualties."I don't understand how a larger fleet size means a lower percent casualty rate"
.....what the fuck?"Sure, sources say Biggs joined the Imperial Navy, but in the novelization he says he was going to be conscripted, therefore Biggs must be telling the truth."
Biggs joins so that he wouldn't get conscripted, duh! If he got conscripted he would not have ended up a fighter pilot.Peptuck wrote:If I lose five ships out of a fifty ship fleet, I've suffered ten percent casualties. If I lose five ships out of a five hundred ship fleet, I've suffered one percent casualties."I don't understand how a larger fleet size means a lower percent casualty rate"
For fuck's sake, I have trouble with anything past high school algebra and this math doesn't confuse me.
.....what the fuck?"Sure, sources say Biggs joined the Imperial Navy, but in the novelization he says he was going to be conscripted, therefore Biggs must be telling the truth."
Thats sadly typical of him. In his "analysis" of one of the TNG drilling incidents, he gives a length but no diameter and then says, "See, that means X many joules."Connor MacLeod wrote:Secondly, you note he's using an unsubstantiated size for the comet (nope, he can't even be bothered to scale it.) It is worth noting that in the image he puts alongside this "calc", the Enterprise is in the background and the comet in the foreground, so the are looks to be at best no wider than the E-D's saucer section (tops.)
We're talking about a guy who mindlessly parrots Darkstar's "Superlaser Effect" theory. Remember the "band of brightness"?Funny, I don't recall the novelization describing anything like a phaser effecting the planet Alderaan. And I also note he does not even seem to bother actually going through proving the rest of his stuff regarding visual appearance (even though anyone can see that the "disappearing" act of phasers has nothign to do with what happened to Alderaan or the Liberty.)
Spock is in love with "because I say so" arguments.But of course, Spock can't be bothered to go into any real detail WHY what he claims is to be so. He just makes vague declarations that it is. Clearly we are dealing with a Stewartian level intellect we cannot hope to begin to comprehend, nor should we try. Let's just take all his words at face value!!!
Really Spock? What z-score were you using in that analysis? Do you even know what a z-score is? <Watch as Spock runs to google.>TC Pilot quoting Spock-tard wrote:"Samples can immediately be correlated the entire population, therefore the Rebel Alliance had fifty thousand member worlds"
Yes, but Spock references Deja-Q trying to say that is the TYPICAL amount of energy needed to sustain a warp field.Batman wrote:In all fairness in Trek it DOES apparently require a constant energy input to maintain a Warp field and ships DO apparently drop to sublight speeds if the field breaks down.
Argh, it burns! Phoenix really seems to be so...Because believe it or not, it's illogical to use any more technology to accomplish a task than absolutely necessary when low tech is just as good? Look at Star Trek, they seem to use forcefields for everything when in many situations forcefields are prone to failure.
Using that logic the Empire uses Low tech because its better to do so, meaning you just admitted ST has the better tech. Thank you.
Video clip?Kane Starkiller wrote:Well I primarily posted that example to show his lack of internal consistency but yes the Mask example is idiotic. I mean if you watch the clip you see the ice slowly disappearing instead of violently exploding as it should if it was hit by anything close to gigatons of energy. Not to mention that the entire point of the operation was to carefully dislodge the ancient relic within the comet which would hardly entail blasting it with gigatons of energy.
Do you really need to ask? For these morons, literally anything = superior trek tech. Kirk farting means superior Trek tech to them.Peptuck wrote:How the hell did he come up with the idea that using older, cheaper, more reliable technology over newer, expensive, unreliable technology means that all your technology is low tech?
hereConnor MacLeod wrote: Video clip?
JMSpock wrote:And a Star Wars Insider article on the Grand Army of the Republic places the clones at three million. Likewise, Karen Traviss's novels place the clone army at around three million. The Cestus Deception places total clone casualties at around 1 million a year or so after Geonosis. The Revised Core Rulebook puts the Republic's TO&E desires at around 1,000 new Acclamators on top of the handful used at Geonosis.
Odds, a short story, suggests there are hundreds of millions of droids, and that any larger figures are part of Palpatine's clever fear-mongering propaganda.
It's enough to say that the ICS is suspect.
We had THAT when he tried to insist that the R2 units repairing Padme's ship weren't destroyed by direct hits.TC Pilot wrote:*trumpet blow* Attention, ladies and gentlemen. I now have conclusive proof that JMSpock is as much of an idiot as he appears:
[/quote]JMSpocktard wrote:It's enough to say that the ICS is suspect.
