Who believes in ghosts?

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2003-01-15 09:05pm

If we can take personal observations as evidence, things can be repeatedly tested(I can make people who claim to be empathic or otherwise supernaturally inclined recoil by imagining a beam of light between outstretched hands, and doing such causes a neat little tingle in my palms), but I can't get a geiger counter or anything to react to such.

Post by **Darth Wong** » 2003-01-15 09:06pm

UltraViolence83 wrote:Actually, some researchers have put a dying person on very sensitive scales, and on the exact moment of death the corpse's weight dropped by a very, very small fraction. (It could just be exhaled air from the lungs, but I think it was too heavy or something. )

Yes, let's all discard the mundane explanation in favour of the absurd one

same thing with powerful psychics: guy had his hand over a super-sensitive scale, sitting on one too, he forced energy to come out of his hand onto the scale, and a slight loss of weight occured in his body whilst the same amount was gained on the hand-scale ...

Under controlled conditions, with equipment provided by reputable scientists?

That and also the things I've read [and personally experienced] by people who seem to have their heads screwed on tight leads me to believe that "spiritual energy" i.e., soul, spirit, ghost, entity maintains a slight link with this plane of reality; while the energy still seems to have mass or whatever (vibration waves?) else. And if all paranormal activity is just in your head, that doesn't explain phenonema witnessed by more than one person... it also appears to be different with every person (unless it is a group phenomenon, like I just mentioned).

With no method of quantification, the people cannot be sure they witnessed precisely the same thing. It is not objective, particularly when the people are communicating with one another about their "shared" experience.

And since these things almost always can only be reported by people, not by intruments, or how people can lie while instruments cannot, is why discussions on religion and metaphysics are almost purely a philosophical realm. To honestly study such strange things, we have to group the reported observations into archetypes...

Simple: one is subjective, the other is objective. The subjective is a waste of time.

Too many things are too similiar to be just fantasy...

Ah, the "if it's popular, it must be true" fallacy. Good one.

By the way, NO I am NOT a kook. I simply have reason to belive that there's more to the universe than pure logic and repeatable observations.

And what reason is that? I haven't heard one yet ...

Wicked Pilot · Post by **Wicked Pilot** » 2003-01-15 09:18pm

[whisper]I see stupid people[/whisper]

HemlockGrey · Post by **HemlockGrey** » 2003-01-15 09:20pm

I have ghosts. They're in my pool.

It's a dead pool.

Get it?

SirNitram · Post by **SirNitram** » 2003-01-15 09:20pm

HemlockGrey wrote:I have ghosts. They're in my pool.

It's a dead pool.

Get it?

Badumchi.

Pink Eye · Post by **Pink Eye** » 2003-01-15 09:38pm

UltraViolence83 wrote:Actually, some researchers have put a dying person on very sensitive scales, and on the exact moment of death the corpse's weight dropped by a very, very small fraction. (It could just be exhaled air from the lungs, but I think it was too heavy or something. )

Mmm hmm. "Some researchers."

Gilligan, grab the Skipper's body. I know he is suffering right now and is about to die, and although we probably should try to save him, put him on this scale so I can get a measurement of his weight.

same thing with powerful psychics: guy had his hand over a super-sensitive scale, sitting on one too, he forced energy to come out of his hand onto the scale, and a slight loss of weight occured in his body whilst the same amount was gained on the hand-scale ...

Mmm hmm. "Powerful psychics." "Super sensitive scales."

Even on a normal scale, any movement will cause the weight to fluxuate. If a scale can be that sensitive, even a puff of air would cause it to register a weight.

That and also the things I've read [and personally experienced] by people who seem to have their heads screwed on tight leads me to believe that "spiritual energy" i.e., soul, spirit, ghost, entity maintains a slight link with this plane of reality

Mmm hmm. That's nice and all but can you tell me where this other plane of reality is? What is spiritual energy anyway?

Edit...

Mr. Wong already got this one.

UltraViolence83 · Post by **UltraViolence83** » 2003-01-15 09:59pm

Ok,, I'm backing out of this topic. I'm apparentely too stupid to post here.

Wicked Pilot · Post by **Wicked Pilot** » 2003-01-15 10:30pm

UltraViolence83 wrote:Ok,, I'm backing out of this topic. I'm apparentely too stupid to post here.

We all say stupid things sometimes. Use logic and reason in your arguements, don't post any bullshit, and keep a sense of humor, and you will do fine here.

UltraViolence83 · Post by **UltraViolence83** » 2003-01-15 10:32pm

Eh. I take that last post back...I'm edgy...need sleep...gahh

....as for that "personal experience" i mentioned, i shouldn't have even said that because i didn't want to talk about it, due to it's um.."personal" nature. my bad.

maybe i should stick to just discussing this in a philosphical rather than rational sense

however, i still hold firm my belief that there's more to this world than meets the eye...but that's just a feeling. if i imagined reality as a bucket, with the water in it repersenting what we know as repeatable fact (sure the water level is still very low in the bucket), why should i put my head in the bucket, only seeing the proposed boundries of our concieved reality? why not stand over the bucket, able to see everything around it, to know the bucket is not all that exists?

...that's just me, though.

as for psychics, i know they exist (no, i'm not talking about fuckheads like John Edwards and that black Tarot woman!). i know everyone's going to laugh at and ridicule me for this, but i've had psychic, or at least beyond common coincidence, experiences.
1. back when i meditated, i was able to wake up in the middle of the night, spend a few seconds guessing the time on my vcr, turn over in bed and open my eyes, see that my guess was very accurate, usually within 5-20 minutes. (i also sleep in VERY irregular cycles, so i'm sure it's not because of my 'body's clock')
2. in january 2000, i kept thinking something important was going to happen feb.11th...that day in school i learned three of my friends got into a bad car wreck.

laugh away. *braces for impact*

Pink Eye · Post by **Pink Eye** » 2003-01-15 11:27pm

UltraViolence83 wrote:why should i put my head in the bucket, only seeing the proposed boundries of our concieved reality? why not stand over the bucket, able to see everything around it, to know the bucket is not all that exists?

And how do you propose we "stand over the bucket and see the rest of reality"? The best way we have is through the scientific method. It is not perfect and we ultimately can be wrong, but to my knowledge, there is not a better way to verify claims.

as for psychics, i know they exist i know everyone's going to laugh at and ridicule me for this, but i've had psychic, or at least beyond common coincidence, experiences.

Yes, we are all pointing and laughing.

[Nelson] Ahhhhh haaaa! [/Nelson]

1. back when i meditated, i was able to wake up in the middle of the night, spend a few seconds guessing the time on my vcr, turn over in bed and open my eyes, see that my guess was very accurate, usually within 5-20 minutes. (i also sleep in VERY irregular cycles, so i'm sure it's not because of my 'body's clock')

Mmm hmm. Lucky guess. I wake up around the same time, an hour before my alarm, which pisses me off. And 5-20 minutes is not every accurate in my opinion. As to "very irregular" cycles, you mean what by this?

2. in january 2000, i kept thinking something important was going to happen feb.11th...that day in school i learned three of my friends got into a bad car wreck.

Wouldn't this fall under the Law of Parisimony?

SeebianWurm · Post by **SeebianWurm** » 2003-01-15 11:34pm

Stamp: Leapin Logic

UltraViolence83 · Post by **UltraViolence83** » 2003-01-15 11:43pm

5-10 minutes IS pretty accurate when you've been sleeping the entire day.

yeah, you got a good point about the scientific method, there. by 'irregular' i mean either sleeping for 14 hours or 2...also, i tend to fall asleep only after i've been awake for over 12 hours. or sometimes i'll sleep for a couple hours every few hours. help me. *screams in closet*

i accept your laughter with dignity. NO TANTRUM TO GRATIFY YOU!!

UltraViolence83 · Post by **UltraViolence83** » 2003-01-15 11:45pm

ok, let's just drop this...you're not going to convince me, i'm not going to convince you...useless to argue. if you still want to argue, i'll let you win.

SeebianWurm · Post by **SeebianWurm** » 2003-01-16 12:00am

You mean you didn't already?

StarDestroyer.Net BBS

Who believes in ghosts?

Ghosts are real yes/no