Leopard is here!

Lisa · Post by **Lisa** » 2007-10-28 06:51pm

It's expected there will be a 10.4.11

I won't be switching to leopard (even if i could afford it) for a while, I've got a few things that would probably break if I switched (requires proprietary drivers) how ever some of the features are quite nice, the number one I'm looking forward to is spaces. I also hear samba is easier to manage other then that it's all fluff to me.

RThurmont · Post by **RThurmont** » 2007-10-28 08:38pm

[quoteOut of curiosity, are you trying to goad me or something[/quote]

Nope. The compliments are genuine....I am extremely impressed by OS X Leopard.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2007-10-28 08:42pm

You RThurmont always had a problem with the lack of cohesion to the UI in Tiger. How much has that changed in Leopard? Praxis said that there's much less clashing application UI floating around, but is it as homogenous as it could be?

RThurmont · Post by **RThurmont** » 2007-10-28 08:54pm

Honestly, Stark, my biggest problem with Tiger was that it was slow. Veery slow. Especially when you had more than five or six programs open. Now I'm using the lowest end Mac that was availible, a Mac Mini with 512 mb of RAM, but 512 is plenty for other operating systems (including Leopard).

My gripe about the inconsistent UI styles was largely a counter-gripe against criticism of a lack of visual integration between Qt and GTK apps on Linux (and in both cases, IMO the criticism would be valid). I'd say that Tiger would've looked much better if everything were in that slick brushed metal theme. In Leopard, there still appear to be a few different styles, but the differences between them are less jarring (dark grey versus light grey).

Also, other aspects of the Leopard UI have been improved to a beautiful effect, for example, the new dock is simply exquisite, especially the way applications reflect off of it, and the transparent blur effects in the menu bar and other menus are stunning (and IMO somewhat more refined than similar effects in Vista Aero).

From a purely aesthetic perspective, Tiger was paradise compared to Windows XP (you have no idea how sick I am of looking at that OS), but Leopard, in addition to generally looking better than Tiger, is also substantially faster.

I could see myself shelling out, in the next few months, for one of those sexy silver and black iMacs so that I can spend more time with this new OS.

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2007-10-29 03:09am

Stark wrote:You RThurmont always had a problem with the lack of cohesion to the UI in Tiger. How much has that changed in Leopard?

The much-maligned brushed metal is gone. All windows are now a single style.

Lisa · Post by **Lisa** » 2007-10-29 04:01pm

Durandal wrote:
Stark wrote:You RThurmont always had a problem with the lack of cohesion to the UI in Tiger. How much has that changed in Leopard?
The much-maligned brushed metal is gone. All windows are now a single style.

Noooooooooooo! I like the brushed metal.....

RThurmont · Post by **RThurmont** » 2007-10-29 05:26pm

I actually loved the brush metal, for the most part. The top portion of the windeco (the titlebar and that sort of vague mass that descends from it in Aqua) looked beautiful...however, the narrow sides of the windows looked less like metal to me, and more like grey colored deteriorated organic matter...not dissimiliar to the larvae of certain fleas I've seen. They should've tweaked the effect across the depth of the window a tad.

IMO OS X Tiger would probably have looked a lot better if everything had been in the brushed metal, as opposed to a limited set of Apple-released applications. Leopard strikes me as being better in that there is less of a clash between the Apple and non-Apple theming (Firefox and Safari no longer look completely different, for example).

That said, I do hope that the brushed metal makes a comeback in the future, in a more refined form.

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2007-10-30 02:07am

I'm really impressed by how smoothly Leopard is running. Safari is blindly quick to launch and render web pages, so fast now I hesitate to launch FireFox because it bounces too much and takes more system resources.

I just realized that I'm running two OSes (Windows in a Virtual Machine on a separate Virtual Desktop) while running Microsoft Word within a PowerPC emulator and utilizing two separate chat apps and a half dozen browser windows and there's no slowdown whatsoever.

Also, running a Parallels VM in full screen in Spaces is awesome. Ctrl-Right and I'm in Windows. Ctrl-Left and I'm in OS X. It's seamless.

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2007-10-30 02:33am

RThurmont wrote:IMO OS X Tiger would probably have looked a lot better if everything had been in the brushed metal, as opposed to a limited set of Apple-released applications.

The brushed metal appearance was available to any developer who wanted to use it. Unfortunately.

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2007-10-30 02:55am

I do wish Apple had put in some more options for customizability. For example, I'd prefer the black triangles to the blue glowies in the dock because the blue glowies get hard to see with all the reflections going on.

And it'd be nice to be able to choose between the "shelf" or flat look on the dock. I know it's possible; people have already been able to edit preference files with Terminal to get the dock to look flat while on the bottom. Apple just needs to add a check box.

Also, I discovered a new use for Stacks. I put shortcuts to all my MS Office and similar apps in one stack, all my iLife and similar apps in another stack, and the few pro apps I have like Photoshop in another stack. I click on it and they all pop out and I choose the application. Saves a lot of dock space...BUT the jury's still out. The disadvantage to stacks is that I can't drag a file onto an icon in the stack like I could drag it onto a dock icon; the stack doesn't automatically open up when I mouse over while dragging!

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2007-10-30 03:33am

http://www.mac-forums.com/forums/showth ... post516253

there are 4 image files in system>library>core services>dock>contents>resources called 'scurve'.

Back them up to a safe folder and open them up in Photoshop (or your preferred choice of software). Alter the colours or contrast and replace the originals.

Then go into terminal and type killall Dock. This will just reload the dock shelf so you can see your creation.

Results?

And even better (super wide image):
http://www.violetmount.com/dock.png

RThurmont · Post by **RThurmont** » 2007-10-30 04:14am

Hmm looks good.

I have to say, after a few days of using it, I really am genuinely impressed by Leopard. This, IMO, is a great operating system.

I was particularly interested in reading the Ars Technica review to learn of some of the BeOS-inspired improvements to the filesystem. IMO this could be interesting to play with more, and I'm really interested in trying out DTrace (I do have Solaris running in a VM, but that particular install is rather too unstable to be much fun) and some of the other exciting internals upgrades. As mentioned earlier, unlike the reviewer, I also find the visual theme in Leopard to be a huge improvement.

I've been enjoying doing some fun experimentation with the OS already. I installed Inferno, the distributed OS derived from Plan 9, and have messing around with the filesystem remotely, using it.

Ypoknons · Post by **Ypoknons** » 2007-10-30 04:13pm

Apparently, this is the icon Leopard uses to denote a PC on a network.

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2007-10-30 04:25pm

Yeah, I noticed that

Click on any PC in the sidebar and press Space and it pops up.

Covenant · Post by **Covenant** » 2007-10-30 04:29pm

A fine attempt at humor! If there's one thing about apple UI's that I don't like (for an actual reason), it's that buying one means giving money to people who think that's hilarious, or accurate. I'd say that kind of sniping is one of the biggest barriers for people who would otherwise be interested in the Mac. It's like you need to fight through this Berlin Wall made entirely of bullshit. It's enough to compare OS's on their merit, and I know that as the underdog, Apple needs to make OS snipes to stay relevent, but c'mon. I'm not a fan of encourage apple fans to snicker at me or blame my computer for issues on a network, and casting it as a buggy piece of shit on the network is really crass.

I'd be just as derisive if Microsoft made a Mac on the network look like something equally as stupid. It should be an OS, not a fashion statement!

RThurmont · Post by **RThurmont** » 2007-10-30 04:52pm

I would agree that the use of a PC bluescreening as an icon to represent one is in extremely poor taste (if not to say unethical).

Covenant · Post by **Covenant** » 2007-10-30 05:03pm

RThurmont wrote:I would agree that the use of a PC bluescreening as an icon to represent one is in extremely poor taste (if not to say unethical).

It's fine for their website or something, just seems in poor taste on the Network stuff.

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2007-10-31 12:25am

Covenant wrote:A fine attempt at humor! If there's one thing about apple UI's that I don't like (for an actual reason), it's that buying one means giving money to people who think that's hilarious, or accurate.

I think it's hilarious.

I'd say that kind of sniping is one of the biggest barriers for people who would otherwise be interested in the Mac.

Oh please. Do you really think the average consumer gives two shits? No one cares except people who get offended when their choice operating system is insulted.

It's like you need to fight through this Berlin Wall made entirely of bullshit.

Really? All I had to do is give them my credit card number.

It's enough to compare OS's on their merit, and I know that as the underdog, Apple needs to make OS snipes to stay relevent, but c'mon. I'm not a fan of encourage apple fans to snicker at me or blame my computer for issues on a network, and casting it as a buggy piece of shit on the network is really crass.

No, it's funny.

I'd be just as derisive if Microsoft made a Mac on the network look like something equally as stupid. It should be an OS, not a fashion statement!

The little touches are what attract people to Apple products. The whole point of what Apple does it that it's not just a computer or an phone. Looks matter. But I honestly don't see how the blue screen PC is a fashion statement.

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2007-10-31 03:12am

I found it pretty funny. But let's be honest here; have you seen the SIZE of the icon? On the sidebar it just looks like a blue desktop, and if you actually click on it it's still pretty darn small and easy to not notice it. It's a minor touch.

And honestly, I always enjoy apps when programmers inject a little humor into it. The MegaMan Battle Network series had all kinds of little inside programming jokes hidden around, and Phoenix Wright and Super Paper Mario utilize l33tsp34k.

The BSOD is a pretty common internet meme. I mean, they sell BSOD T-shirts. It's nothing to get all offended about; it's funny.

DaveJB · Post by **DaveJB** » 2007-10-31 04:23am

The whole thing probably wasn't anything more than whoever was in charge of Leopard's network code having a bit of a laugh, and the rest of the team not really caring enough to get rid of the icon.

Personally I'd be a bit more offended by the insinuation that all PC users still run such ugly, boxy monitors!

RThurmont · Post by **RThurmont** » 2007-10-31 11:16pm

I still use a CRT.

CRTs are a must for gaming or graphics, IMO...you just can't get the same performance from any LCD I've seen (either in terms of refresh rates or the ability to display multiple resolutions correctly).

phongn · Post by **phongn** » 2007-11-01 12:35am

RThurmont wrote:CRTs are a must for gaming or graphics, IMO...you just can't get the same performance from any LCD I've seen (either in terms of refresh rates or the ability to display multiple resolutions correctly).

Well, refresh beyond 60Hz isn't really all that important, IMHO, and I don't particularly mind the "letterboxing" effect of dropping resolution if needed. But for graphics? I don't think there's any CRT out now that can match one of the professional and calibrated S-IPS displays.

Stark · Post by **Stark** » 2007-11-01 01:39am

As a gamer I simply don't give two shits about colour gamut or 'true colour', and a 4ms panel doesn't have any 'ghosting' in games. I've never used a rubbish one, but since the panel types that have better colour accuracy are also worse for gaming, it's a tradeoff I'm quite happy making.

Non-graphic artists using CRTs strike me as the sort of people who would be using Windows 98SE and saying how 'efficient' their setup is.

phongn · Post by **phongn** » 2007-11-01 01:42am

Stark wrote:Non-graphic artists using CRTs strike me as the sort of people who would be using Windows 98SE and saying how 'efficient' their setup is.

Well, I have a pair of 21" CRTs that I've been loathe to replace even as one of them slowly dies (electron gun is becoming more and more unaligned

), mostly because I do both gaming and photo work and to get a display that'll do both reasonably well at ~1600x1200 isn't cheap (nevermind getting two!)

Praxis · Post by **Praxis** » 2007-11-01 02:11am

Not really specific to Leopard, but has anyone found themselves getting too used to shortcuts? I command-Q to quit all the time, but I've on occasion accidentally Command-Q'd while an iChat or Adium window was in front and killed everything. It's habit!