Predator vs. Boba Fett

Post by **Ghost Rider** » 2003-01-16 05:42pm

One small thing the burden of proof is upon you to show why this cloak(because it wasn't in Predator 1) is BULLETPROOF.

Literally you are claiming something that no one is agreeing upon and unless you have said proof, it's dismissed.

And the reason Slartiblast is saying concession is because without said proof which you would have to provide it's essentially a point in their column in terms that the Predator does not have a bulletproof cloak.

So unless you can prove such a thing...don't bring it up.

Slartibartfast · Post by **Slartibartfast** » 2003-01-16 06:02pm

I never said that you said that you couldn't be bothered. So you just lied.

Slartibartfast · Post by **Slartibartfast** » 2003-01-16 06:08pm

Darth_Shinji wrote:
You were CLAIMING that it was unnecessary to show the scene BEFORE you had conceeded, and that we had to believe you blindly, idiot! Just because you conceed doesn't change the fact that you were being illogical when you were claiming that WE HAD THE FUCKING BURDEN OF PROOF!
I was claiming that becuse it was true. Other people did the same thing and I don't see you flaiming them? Is the fact that they are on your side have anything to do with it? And the matter is done.

It is NOT true that it is unnecessary to provide the scene. What it is TRUE, is that you DO have to provide the scene. So stop making stupid claims.

beyond hope · Post by **beyond hope** » 2003-01-16 06:41pm

Shinji:

I didn't mean what I said as an attack: the purpose was to get you to step back and think about how you sounded in the thread. You really sound like you're letting this raise your blood pressure through the roof: a debate over whether Boba Fett could beat the Pred up and take his lunch money just isn't worth that. Regardless of who started flaming who, angry replies are just going to keep on getting you flamed.

On the topic:

One thing about the Pred-Glover fight... note that the Pred is pausing on the roof to inhale from a respirator while Glover is out of it's sight. He takes that opening to charge it and knock it off the roof. After it gets its arm severed and is patching itself up in the apartment bathroom its breathing is quite labored. Going forward to the ship scene, Glover coughs a few times while he's breathing the misty air on the Pred ship. So aside from shotgun wounds and the severed arm, the Pred is also having difficulty breathing Earth atmosphere. (Not so abnormal in LA of course... pretty much anything has trouble with the air there

)

Darth_Shinji · Post by **Darth_Shinji** » 2003-01-16 07:34pm

beyond hope wrote:Shinji:

I didn't mean what I said as an attack: the purpose was to get you to step back and think about how you sounded in the thread. You really sound like you're letting this raise your blood pressure through the roof: a debate over whether Boba Fett could beat the Pred up and take his lunch money just isn't worth that. Regardless of who started flaming who, angry replies are just going to keep on getting you flamed.

My blood pressure isn't the one rising apperently... Some poeple are frothing at the mouth. But i agree till I can post it this I won't post anymore rebuttals to the flamers. I'll also post a cool concession pic from the movie as well.

On the topic:

One thing about the Pred-Glover fight... note that the Pred is pausing on the roof to inhale from a respirator while Glover is out of it's sight. He takes that opening to charge it and knock it off the roof. After it gets its arm severed and is patching itself up in the apartment bathroom its breathing is quite labored. Going forward to the ship scene, Glover coughs a few times while he's breathing the misty air on the Pred ship. So aside from shotgun wounds and the severed arm, the Pred is also having difficulty breathing Earth atmosphere. (Not so abnormal in LA of course... pretty much anything has trouble with the air there )

Would you consider that fight a true hth fight anyway? Danny got lucky on many levels.

Darth_Shinji · Post by **Darth_Shinji** » 2003-01-16 07:36pm

And just so I make it clear I never took your posts as an attack. I replied reasonable with my concerns.

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2003-01-17 03:10pm

Concession Accepted.

Darth_Shinji · Post by **Darth_Shinji** » 2003-01-17 05:08pm

Darth Pounder wrote:Concession Accepted.

Who are you? Are you talking to me?

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2003-01-17 05:09pm

No the other muppet in this discussion making unfoundd claims and talking shite.

Darth_Shinji · Post by **Darth_Shinji** » 2003-01-17 05:14pm

Darth Pounder wrote:No the other muppet in this discussion making unfoundd claims and talking shite.

That would be yourself. So I think your talking to me. So what is it that you think I missed? I've replied to everything posted to me hundreds of times.

Strate_Egg · Post by **Strate_Egg** » 2003-01-17 07:20pm

Ok there are several factors that could determine this. Both are highly skilled fighters. Technically, they are both a type of bounty hunter.

Secondly, i can only see three benefits that are on the side of Boba

1 He is a skilled bounty hunter of many years.
2. He has Mandalorian Armor and a set of helm mounted sensors.( do these sensors have multi range scanning that is active all the time)? It is hard to explain what i mean. Preds have several vision modes, i am not sure if boba's equipment is the same. If he can switch vision modes as was stated previously, can he still see otherwise?

3. he has the mobility of a jetpack, however, no one is going to be flying all the time, or using the multitude of scanner equipment available.

Predator:

Most likely, if the pred knows whom he is hunting, and he is competent, he will have the element of surprise. This counts for a lot. How will boba know to dodge or use his scanning equipment. That is the whole object of predator. He DOESNT make himself known untill your dead.

Many of his weapons are silent and do not give off major visual by-products.

In the end, one has to make the encounter more limited than just, pred plods into the city looking for boba. That cannot work.

beyond hope · Post by **beyond hope** » 2003-01-17 08:13pm

Welcome to SD.net, and I hope you brought an asbestos suit with you to this thread

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2003-01-17 08:24pm

Strate_Egg wrote:Most likely, if the pred knows whom he is hunting, and he is competent, he will have the element of surprise. This counts for a lot. How will boba know to dodge or use his scanning equipment. That is the whole object of predator. He DOESNT make himself known untill your dead.
Many of his weapons are silent and do not give off major visual by-products.

Read the fucking thread.

Strate_Egg · Post by **Strate_Egg** » 2003-01-18 12:45pm

i did read the the thread twat. i still didnt say anything other than what you morons cannot figure out.

i recall i just said LOOK at what your saying. It depends upon the situation.
Just because he is boba fett doesnt mean he will win all the time lol.

Preds arent that intelligent either, so they MIGHT not win as much as he MIGHT not win.

Strate_Egg · Post by **Strate_Egg** » 2003-01-18 12:56pm

I have nothing to PROVE because i didnt say anything. I just read all of the posts...at the end, no one can agree still.

Before you rave and cuss, learn to read. Therefore you will find that i said nothing derrogatory.

beyond hope · Post by **beyond hope** » 2003-01-18 02:51pm

Okay, I finally had time to sit down and refresh my memory. Here are my observations.

On Predator 2:

First, note that in the beginning of the film (when Glover and the SWAT team are ordered to remain outside the building) the order comes in right when an explosion goes off up on the side of the building. Keyes and his team are there with equipment within minutes. In other words, they're already in LA looking for a Predator. They already know the Pred's habit of returning to the warehouse every few days to eat (unless someone wants to argue that they figured that out in the few days between the Pred killing El Scorpio and his gang, and the fight in the meat packing plant.) Seems to me that the Pred didn't just pop up in the beginning of the film and start killing: they're already aware that it's there in the city.

Second, the final nail in the coffin of the bulletproof cloak. For parts of the subway fight, the Pred is uncloaked. If it was relying on the cloak to protect it from bullets, dropping it in the face of multiple armed opponents would be downright foolhardy. The two bullets I observed striking the Pred while cloaked both bounce off it's shoulder armor (right and left sides, respectively.)

Third, I retract my statement about the Pred's body appearing cooler in it's thermal vision. The Predator's unarmored parts are clearly depicted as roughly the same temperature as a human body.

Fourth, note what alerts the Pred to the presence of Keyes' capture team: it stops dead in it's tracks and starts scanning different visual wavelengths when it hears the wooden steps on the other side of the meat packing plant creak under their boots.

Now, on to the Master Bounty Hunter. Boba comes dashing out the top of the sail barge after you see one of Jabba's thugs clamp a large blaster to the sail barge railing and shoot at the prisoner skiff, knocking both Lando and the last surviving guard overboard. Not even pausing at the railing, Boba lights off his rocket pack, sailing through the air over to the prisoner skiff and landing right in front of Luke, who promptly cuts his blaster carbine in half as he's taking aim. The gunner up on the barge fires again, wounding Chewie and knocking Han and Chewie both down to the deck. Boba takes advantage of Luke's momentary distraction to fire his grappling line, which Luke promptly severs. Right as Luke severs the line the gunner up on the barge fires again, and Boba gets knocked down to the deck. At this point the guard skiff comes roaring in and Luke jumps onto it. Boba slowly gets up from the deck, taking aim and firing a shot from his left arm blaster that goes over Lukes head by about 3 feet. The scene cuts to Han crouched over Chewie, saying "Boba Fett? where?!" as Boba fires *again* at Luke and misses. Han whirls around to look and the spear he's holding slams into Boba's rocket pack and sends Boba sailing off into the side of the barge. Note that Boba hits the side of the barge with his shoulder before bouncing off and rolling into the Sarlacc's waiting mouth.

So, confronted with an opponent wielding a melee weapon, Boba places himself right within striking range of that weapon. He does not use his rocket pack to stay out of Luke's reach. He does not fire that backpack-mounted rocket at Luke despite the only three people on the skiff being Luke, Han, and Chewie (no "friendlies" to worry about.) He does not use his flamethrower when Han, Luke and Chewie were *all* in front of him where they could be hit. He ignores the presence of Han and Chewie on the skiff with him, with Han even moving around and armed, to fire two missed shots at Luke. And people call it "wishful thinking" when the Pred faction speculates on the Pred getting close enough for a physical fight? Boba's just lucky his rocket pack didn't detonate on impact with the sail barge like Jango's did when it came off his back on Kamino.

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2003-01-18 02:52pm

You made the claim that the Predator would surprise Boba Fett, which has been dealt with in this thread. Again, read it. This time pay attention.

Darth_Shinji · Post by **Darth_Shinji** » 2003-01-18 05:37pm

He is only uncloacked before he drobs down and when he attacks the girl. That scene in question when he is jkneeling down to sho straight at the pred we see from the girls position no interference in seeing the bullet flash. And the pred is clearly between her and Dobbs.

Strate_Egg · Post by **Strate_Egg** » 2003-01-18 05:58pm

Maybe i should have chosen a better wording. I did not mean it the way you think. I am sorry.

Strate_Egg · Post by **Strate_Egg** » 2003-01-18 06:02pm

I meant... just because boba fett has a helm equipped with sensors, does not mean that he can auto see the pred just because. Im sure he could surpise the pred even~

Strate_Egg · Post by **Strate_Egg** » 2003-01-18 06:04pm

OH and the cloak is not bulletproof. Its not a personal shield, its a cloak.

Durandal · Post by **Durandal** » 2003-01-18 08:21pm

I somehow doubt that Fett actually wanted to kill Luke, which would explain his use of the grappling line. Fett knew that Vader wanted Luke alive, as he was a big part of the trap meant to capture him, and Vader made it clear that Solo's dip in the freezing unit was a trial run for Luke.

In fact, I'm surprised that Jabba went ahead and sentenced Luke to death; it either indicates a huge pair of balls or monstrous stupidity. Jabba undoubtedly knew that Vader was looking for Luke alive -- it was pretty common knowledge in his circles.

beyond hope · Post by **beyond hope** » 2003-01-18 09:23pm

Then why is Fett lining up on Skywalker for a shot as soon as he lands on the skiff, and why does he take a shot at Luke's head when he's across on the guard skiff? Sure seems to me as if Fett was trying to kill him. What Vader wished and what he was willing to pay for are two entirely different things. If there was no money to be had, it would be a lot more expedient to Fett to just kill Luke and find a way to place the blame on Jabba's head. Plus, the Emperor was quietly trying to have Luke killed at the time (Shadows of the Empire.) Goodwill from the Emperor could have saved Fett from possible retaliation from Vader.

Shinji: the Pred was uncloaked for part of the fight in the subway car. It's right around when the guy with the briefcase buys it to gunfire from the other commuters, and the Pred has one of the gang members lifted up to the cieling. You clearly see his helmet in two of the scene cuts while he's slaughtering everyone in that car.

Darth_Shinji · Post by **Darth_Shinji** » 2003-01-19 10:29am

beyond hope wrote:
Shinji: the Pred was uncloaked for part of the fight in the subway car. It's right around when the guy with the briefcase buys it to gunfire from the other commuters, and the Pred has one of the gang members lifted up to the cieling. You clearly see his helmet in two of the scene cuts while he's slaughtering everyone in that car.

Yes You are right. He is claoked when he drops down, then unclaoks, then claoks right before the guy makes it to the back of the train, looks for the pred, see's the claok pred "yeah thats right, come and get it." and fires. He is kneeling down and taken aim on the pred.

Lord Pounder · Post by **Lord Pounder** » 2003-01-19 01:14pm

Village Idiot titles do not come with the wind Shinji. Concede the arguement now or prove with pics that the cloak is bullet proof you've yet to do that. Do it and i'll publically put my head between my legs and suck my own sack. Neither seem likely to STFU while you have any credability. The Burdan of Proof is still upon you.

This thread is getting painful now and monotonous Shinji is just digging himself a grave.

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Predator vs. Boba Fett

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