Vancouver Man Dies After Taser

[Lord Poe]

The problem with tasers is that they turn closet sadists into fullblown sturmabteilungsmenner because they make subduing a person much easier than it should be.

I'm not going to tell Death or Sith how to do their jobs. If they think they need taser to take someone down, then so be it.

Forgive me if I'm misreading the above comments, but are you two implying the cops who use Tasers aren't "man" enough to apprehend a suspect mano a mano? That sure looks like the implication. That is NOT a cop's job. There are instances where someone will act like an asshole and resist arrest even while being physically restrained, where its clear as fucking day - no matter what language you speak - that your ass needs to stop resisting.

Take a look at the "Don't tase me, bro" incident, for instance. This guy was given every opportunity to cooperate. I don't give a fuck if he thinks he shouldn't be detained.

Look again at the Rodney King incident. He clearly wasn't cooperating, even after being tasered, which gave the asshole cops the excuse to savagely beat him because he "dared" not listen to their instructions. This is the other side of the coin; we're all well aware there are cops like these fucks in existence, so there's nothing to be won by resisting arrest.

Again, this hysterical woman was given every opportunity to cooperate. The Taser took her out without the cops resorting to choke holds or anything else.

The Vancouver cops looked to be way too trigger happy, yes. But what I said in the OP stands. Don't put yourself in these situations where the police need to be called to subdue you. Especially, when you know bad cops do exist, and you can be hurt. This guy calmed his shit down immediately once the cops arrived. So he clearly had control of himself; I don't give a fuck how "distressed" he was.

[Darth Wong]

To be honest, if you're going to fault someone here, you should fault Customs and the airport administration, as Broomstick suggested. When you call the RCMP in, you're elevating the situation beyond what it needs to be. And there's no excuse for ignoring the man's mother, who wanted to send a message to him and offered to translate. You'd think the first thing a reasonable cop would do, if confronted by a foreign language speaker, would be to use the first translator he can get his hands on.

Mind you, this is part of the reason why I don't really plan to go to a non English-speaking country unless I have some reasonable foreknowledge that there are enough service personnel there who do speak English. I have better things to do than to try and resolve some of the inevitable complications of international travel through a language barrier.

[Kamakazie Sith]

That's an absolutely retarded suggestion, Brian.

Not really. If the British can do it, so can other human beings.

Last time I checked British Police do use tasers, and not just in a strictly tactic setting. The benefits of a taser are quite clear despite these rare instances.

The argument is not that tasers kill, therefore they shouldn't be used. Pencils kill. The classification between lethal and non-lethal device obviously isn't based on scientific chance of killing. I'm sure you can find statistics that handcuffs have killed more people than guns because gun use by officers while on duty is rare. The question is whether we as a society will tolerate a gun-like device which someone in this thread has suggested makes it too easy to kill at worst or too easy to use excessive force at best. You can beat someone to death with a baton, but the problem with a gun is pressing a trigger makes it too easy unless we expect our officers to know how to use them.

Again, your argument completely ignores the benefits of the taser, and the fact that they simply don't kill people. Let me put it this way. If you can make an argument to remove tasers because of the potential for abuse then you can do so for any police weapon.

If someone abuses the use of a baton they can still kill, but they will certainly do lasting damage. The same isn't true with a taser, but yes they do hurt. However, they also record the number of discharges and duration so they can be easily retrieved for examination by the courts.

I'm not going to tell Death or Sith how to do their jobs. If they think they need taser to take someone down, then so be it. Just if and when other cops -- or they -- face a situation like this, where the commanding officer says "Yes" to tasers, I hope they all don't turn their brains off and fire two more at a man convulsing on the ground (and speak up and say what the fuck if the other cops around them are.)

Well, there are a number of ways to look at this from hindsight and say how it would be better. The question is were these cops excessive with their use of force? Were their actions unreasonable?

[brianeyci]

Last time I checked British Police do use tasers, and not just in a strictly tactic setting. The benefits of a taser are quite clear despite these rare instances.

You missed the point. Maybe you should point out the benefit of a taser, because last time I checked police did without them before TASER International was incorporated.

I would be a lot more willing to accept TASER company's version of events if several things didn't happen. One, they deny anybody has ever died due to a taser, or even been hurt by a taser. They blame anxiety and underlying medical conditions for every death, ever. If they didn't have their heads up their ass more people would listen.

Let me put it this way. If you can make an argument to remove tasers because of the potential for abuse then you can do so for any police weapon.

That's right. Last time I checked, police with AK-74 and M-16 don't walk around the street, even in America. Maybe instead of pussying around you should explain why you guys need it. Perhaps you will further miss the point and say that some police do have M-16's available in their squad cars.

Well, there are a number of ways to look at this from hindsight and say how it would be better. The question is were these cops excessive with their use of force? Were their actions unreasonable?

Why can't you watch the video and condemn your fellow cops? Is that too hard to do? They shot tasers at the guy convulsing on the ground. My point is what is reasonable to a bystander and what is reasonable to a cop have a higher standard. Cops want tasers, cops got them, but if cops misuse them they better be prepared to eat the consequences. It might be fine for a rent-a-cop or a citizen to freak out and fire too many taser, but cops cannot and if they do even if it's "reasonable" then they don't get off.

If this scares you maybe you can rethink tasers for cops.

This guy calmed his shit down immediately once the cops arrived. So he clearly had control of himself; I don't give a fuck how "distressed" he was.

Come on man. When were you born? I thought older guys like you had all the civil disobedience built into you. All he did was run around swearing in a foreign language, block a door and destroy a computer. Mike's made "scenes," maybe not as bad as physically destroying property but he's done them before.

Sometimes it's entirely necessary for civil disobedience to get your point across. It's the same point liberals (I assume you) use to defend trashing up of conservative bull-talk when they're not given a chance to speak. So when guy gets stuck for 10 hours in airport with no chance to speak and isn't allowed to leave, his only recourse is cause a scene.

[Lord Poe]

You missed the point. Maybe you should point out the benefit of a taser, because last time I checked police did without them before TASER International was incorporated.

Yeah, they did without them and used the choke hold instead, which was banned in the late 70's in most of the US and Canada due to its lethal potential. Fuckin' pussy cops; they should give suspects a fighting chance and go toe to toe with them like a REAL man...

I would be a lot more willing to accept TASER company's version of events if several things didn't happen. One, they deny anybody has ever died due to a taser, or even been hurt by a taser. They blame anxiety and underlying medical conditions for every death, ever. If they didn't have their heads up their ass more people would listen.

TASER International's products protect life, providing advanced Electronic Control Devices (ECDs) for use in the law enforcement, medical, military, corrections, professional security, and personal protection markets. TASER devices use proprietary technology to incapacitate dangerous, combative, or high-risk subjects who pose a risk to law enforcement officers, innocent citizens, or themselves in a manner that is generally recognized as a safer alternative to other uses of force. TASER technology saves lives every day, and the use of TASER devices dramatically reduces injury rates for police officers and suspects.

Emphasis mine. I don't see them denying anyone could die from the use of a TASER. Link, please?

That's right. Last time I checked, police with AK-74 and M-16 don't walk around the street, even in America. Maybe instead of pussying around you should explain why you guys need it. Perhaps you will further miss the point and say that some police do have M-16's available in their squad cars.

No, they don't. During the February 1997 LAPD shootout, police resorted to running to the nearest gun store to even compete with those suspects. See, cops don't carry SWAT teams in their trunks, either. But hey, these fuckin' pussy cops should have stood arms akimbo in the middle of the street and ORDERED these suspects to lay down their fully automatic weaponry, right?

Why can't you watch the video and condemn your fellow cops? Is that too hard to do? They shot tasers at the guy convulsing on the ground. My point is what is reasonable to a bystander and what is reasonable to a cop have a higher standard. Cops want tasers, cops got them, but if cops misuse them they better be prepared to eat the consequences. It might be fine for a rent-a-cop or a citizen to freak out and fire too many taser, but cops cannot and if they do even if it's "reasonable" then they don't get off.

The TASER was still in him. When he continued to resisted, they just hit the trigger again. This is SOP when someone continues to fail to respond to officer commands. Were the cops too trigger happy in the first place? Sure looks like it from the vantage point of the video. But then, I'm not a cop. Are you?

If this scares you maybe you can rethink tasers for cops.

Yes, let's bring back choke holds, billy clubs, and weighted long flashlights (which were recently banned in Los Angeles.)

Come on man. When were you born? I thought older guys like you had all the civil disobedience built into you. All he did was run around swearing in a foreign language, block a door and destroy a computer. Mike's made "scenes," maybe not as bad as physically destroying property but he's done them before.

And Mike or anyone else should not be surprised in the slightest if irrational actions in public like that will make cops magically appear. Are you fucking stupid? "All he did" was act like an irrational fucktard, looking for attention. Out of frustration? Sure, possibly. He doesn't get a free pass to act that way in public and NOT expect to be confronted.

Sometimes it's entirely necessary for civil disobedience to get your point across.

Hey, feel free, asshole. Just don't be surprised when cops show up to deal with your ass.

It's the same point liberals (I assume you)

Last month or so I was a Republitard; now I'm a raving Liberal...

...use to defend trashing up of conservative bull-talk when they're not given a chance to speak.

Same situation applies, as evidenced by the "Don't tase me, bro" asshole.

So when guy gets stuck for 10 hours in airport with no chance to speak and isn't allowed to leave, his only recourse is cause a scene.

Where was he detained and not allowed to leave? ink, please? I didn't see anyone detaining him, nor did I see him locked up in a room unable to leave.

[brianeyci]

You're trying to move the goalpost Lord Poe. You're suggesting (or suggested) nobody ever has to do anything to disturb the peace to attract the attention of the cops, because it's stupid. I point out that's not always true in extreme cases.

In this case, he wanted attention. Maybe that's the reason why he calmed down, because he was finally getting what he wanted, not because he had some insidious plan to destroy shit and be an asshole then stop when someone came who could beat his ass. You seem to suggest that he got what was coming to him.

"This tragic incident appears to follow the pattern of many in-custody deaths or deaths following a confrontation with police. Historically, medical science and forensic analysis has shown that these deaths are attributable to other factors and not the low-energy electrical discharge of the TASER(r). Specifically in Canada, while previous incidents were widely reported in the media as 'TASER deaths,' the role of the TASER device has been cleared in every case to date -- including the widely publicized Bagnell in-custody death in Vancouver where the TASER device was cleared by an inquest jury."

"Cardiac arrest caused by electrical current is immediate. The video of the incident at the Vancouver airport indicates that the subject was continuing to fight well after the TASER application. This continuing struggle could not be possible if the subject died as a result of the TASER device electrical current causing cardiac arrest. His continuing struggle is proof that the TASER device was not the cause of his death. Further, the video clearly shows symptoms of excited delirium, a potentially fatal condition marked by symptoms of exhaustion and mania such as heavy breathing, profuse sweating, confusion, disorientation and violence toward inanimate objects."

"We are taken aback by the number of media outlets that have irresponsibly published conclusive headlines blaming the TASER device and / or the law enforcement officers involved as the cause of death before completion of the investigation. These sensationalistic media reports completely ignore the earmark symptoms of excited delirium shown in the video. TASER International is transmitting over 60 legal demand letters requiring correction of these false and misleading headlines and will take other actions as appropriate. These unsubstantiated, false headlines mislead the public and could adversely influence public policy in ways which could place the lives of both law enforcement and the public at greater risk," concluded Tom Smith, Founder and Chairman of the Board of TASER International, Inc.

1. Taser has been "cleared in every case to date," in other words not responsible for any deaths, ever.

2. The man died because of "mania" and "anxiety" rather than because he was shot by a taser too many times.

3. Bad mouthing the "media" for distorting the facts.

4. Baldfaced lie about him continuing to resist after he was tasered. He was on the fucking ground, convulsing!

Just how much horse shit do you have to swallow before you say, what the fuck?

And why the fuck do you have to knock a guy unconscious? Put him in handcuffs and physically restrain him. Police tactics seem to be, keep attacking the guy until he physically stops moving. Do you ever think that someone shot by a taser could not be thinking clearly? Do you think that someone could be involuntarily moving because of the muscle contractions? Noooooo you have to render a person unconscious so he doesn't move at all.

I am still undecided whether I support police taser use. The only thing I respect here are Sith and Death saying they need them to do their jobs. I do not respect some false dilemma of tasers or choke holds. If scientific evidence comes to light that a significant part of the clogged artery, physically unfit population would be killed by a taser, then I would support ripping it from their arsenal. Not because it kills. Glocks kill. But because it bills itself as a non-lethal device but when shooting someone with an "underlying medical condition" it kills. Last time I checked heart disease was still the number one killer, and if the majority of your citizens have this "underlying medical condition" then maybe it's not so unlethal.

[aerius]

I am still undecided whether I support police taser use. The only thing I respect here are Sith and Death saying they need them to do their jobs. I do not respect some false dilemma of tasers or choke holds.

Brian, think this through a bit, what are the alternatives to Tasers, in other words, what are the other non-lethal options available to law enforcement for subduing and/or restraining a resisting suspect?

The options are bare hands, pepper spray, batons, flashlights which can serve as fistloads or batons, and handcuffs. Any one of these options can kill you just as dead as a Taser.

[Kamakazie Sith]

You missed the point. Maybe you should point out the benefit of a taser, because last time I checked police did without them before TASER International was incorporated.

Poe already posted it for you, but I swear we've had this exact same conversation, and I posted it there as well. Maybe I'm mistaken, but either way now we both know for sure that you've received this information.

I would be a lot more willing to accept TASER company's version of events if several things didn't happen. One, they deny anybody has ever died due to a taser, or even been hurt by a taser. They blame anxiety and underlying medical conditions for every death, ever. If they didn't have their heads up their ass more people would listen.

Yes, TASER International conducted their own investigation based off the findings of State Medical Examiners. You'll forgive me if I don't question the State Medical Examiner, and you'll forgive me if I don't find TASERS as dangerous as you do because I've been tasered twice with no effect lasting beyond the five second exposure time. The most important reason I don't find TASERS as dangerous as you do is I know a little something about them, and I'll share an interesting fact with you.

We hear on the news all the time "MAN DIES AFTER BEING SHOCKED WITH 50,000 VOLTS OF ELECTRICITY FROM POLICE TASER" , but did you know that a TASER only introduces about 2.1 milliamps (0.0021 amps) into the human body? Compare that to your standard US household light socket which is about 15amps IIRC. BTW it takes about .5 amps to be fatal, and about .1 amps to cause an irregular heartbeat.

You've been sucked up into the media frenzy over tasers.

That's right. Last time I checked, police with AK-74 and M-16 don't walk around the street, even in America. Maybe instead of pussying around you should explain why you guys need it. Perhaps you will further miss the point and say that some police do have M-16's available in their squad cars.

I'm still missing your point. I don't see how you can compare a lethal assault weapon to a non-lethal weapon and say "See they don't carry these on the streets so they shouldn't carry this on the streets"

Why can't you watch the video and condemn your fellow cops? Is that too hard to do?

Because we couldn't hear much of anything, and our visibility isn't great?

They shot tasers at the guy convulsing on the ground. My point is what is reasonable to a bystander and what is reasonable to a cop have a higher standard. Cops want tasers, cops got them, but if cops misuse them they better be prepared to eat the consequences. It might be fine for a rent-a-cop or a citizen to freak out and fire too many taser, but cops cannot and if they do even if it's "reasonable" then they don't get off.

No, they shot him while he was standing.

"Even if it's reasonable". Brian, that's the dumbest thing I've heard from you yet. That's what all the rules of force in the entire country are based off on including deadly force. It must be reasonable. If it's reasonable then it's justified. You can take a persons eye out with your finger if it's reasonable. Why the fuck couldn't you taser someone if it was reasonable? What the hell is wrong with you?

If this scares you maybe you can rethink tasers for cops.

Did I miss something? What was suppose to scare me into rethinking tasers for police?

Come on man. When were you born? I thought older guys like you had all the civil disobedience built into you. All he did was run around swearing in a foreign language, block a door and destroy a computer. Mike's made "scenes," maybe not as bad as physically destroying property but he's done them before.

Let me just say that they probably should have established some communication with the person, but what if that didn't work what would have been reasonable to you?

Sometimes it's entirely necessary for civil disobedience to get your point across. It's the same point liberals (I assume you) use to defend trashing up of conservative bull-talk when they're not given a chance to speak. So when guy gets stuck for 10 hours in airport with no chance to speak and isn't allowed to leave, his only recourse is cause a scene.

Never is it necessary to destroy property to get your point across, and if you think so you will be placed under arrest.

[Kamakazie Sith]

1. Taser has been "cleared in every case to date," in other words not responsible for any deaths, ever.

Right, and what's your problem with this? The fact is that it is the STRESS that killed these people. The stress was aggravated by the taser, but it was not the taser itself that killed these people.

2. The man died because of "mania" and "anxiety" rather than because he was shot by a taser too many times.

Yes. Do you have any evidence to suggest that a taser could effect the heart?

3. Bad mouthing the "media" for distorting the facts.

Yes, because the media is a shining example of honesty and never has their own agenda.

4. Baldfaced lie about him continuing to resist after he was tasered. He was on the fucking ground, convulsing!

Wow. Can we see that video because in the one we saw it's very difficult to tell when he's being tasered besides the first time when he fell down.

Just how much horse shit do you have to swallow before you say, what the fuck?

And why the fuck do you have to knock a guy unconscious? Put him in handcuffs and physically restrain him. Police tactics seem to be, keep attacking the guy until he physically stops moving. Do you ever think that someone shot by a taser could not be thinking clearly? Do you think that someone could be involuntarily moving because of the muscle contractions? Noooooo you have to render a person unconscious so he doesn't move at all.

You're assuming that they shot him again because they saw his muscle contractions as more moving? Where's your evidence that he wasn't resisting after the tasering.

I am still undecided whether I support police taser use. The only thing I respect here are Sith and Death saying they need them to do their jobs. I do not respect some false dilemma of tasers or choke holds. If scientific evidence comes to light that a significant part of the clogged artery, physically unfit population would be killed by a taser, then I would support ripping it from their arsenal. Not because it kills. Glocks kill. But because it bills itself as a non-lethal device but when shooting someone with an "underlying medical condition" it kills. Last time I checked heart disease was still the number one killer, and if the majority of your citizens have this "underlying medical condition" then maybe it's not so unlethal.

Again, the taser doesn't have the amps to effect the heart in anyway. Do you have anything besides your own opinion?

[brianeyci]

They shot him while he was on the ground Sith: you can hear a little pop. There's also a transcript on the Internet somewhere of someone who amplified the sound, and you can hear some bystander going they shot him again while he was on the ground.

There's a reason why I put "reasonable" in quotes. Do you know what a quote does? Apparently not. Don't worry, I'll use it later in my post. It means I do not agree with your definition of reasonable, which is anybody who is a suspect. Cops should have a higher standard of reasonable than a regular person.

As for wanking to the amperage compared to the voltage, what you seem to not get is you can't isolate a single variable like that and say, under a specific number there is no death. Tasers exacerbated an underlying medical condition and caused a person's death, you know, just like medical examiners say. That doesn't make them non-lethal, but gets them off the hook for lawsuits. Unlike you I don't wank to the law.

By the way the whole methodology of the most physically fit, prepared members of the police force taking a taser to "prove" that it's safe strikes me as really stupid. I can get doing it so cops don't use it so often and realize how painful it is, but I don't know why people bother to mention this "test" at all, as if it was proof of anything.

Any one of these options can kill you just as dead as a Taser.

Maybe nothing. But if tasers make cops too trigger happy, wouldn't it be a good idea to get rid of them? I'm not sure if they do yet and I would support a review of their use. Some people here don't seem to even want that at all, as if the status quo was okay.

[Lord Poe]

You're trying to move the goalpost Lord Poe.

And you're snipping out and ignoring all your other bullshit charges I've answered without conceding. What "goalpost" have I moved?

You're suggesting (or suggested) nobody ever has to do anything to disturb the peace to attract the attention of the cops, because it's stupid. I point out that's not always true in extreme cases.

How fucking hard is it for you to understand that if you act irrationally in public, the police are going to be called? You have every right to go ahead and making a nuisance out of yourself, for whatever reason your mind justifies for such conduct. Just don't cry foul when the police arrive.

In this case, he wanted attention. Maybe that's the reason why he calmed down, because he was finally getting what he wanted, not because he had some insidious plan to destroy shit and be an asshole then stop when someone came who could beat his ass. You seem to suggest that he got what was coming to him.

Funny, he got plenty of attention before the cops showed up, and that didn't seem to appease him. If you watch the video, a woman tries to talk to him rationally, but does he stop and try to communicate with her in any civilized way? No, he continues breaking shit and acting like an asshole.

1. Taser has been "cleared in every case to date," in other words not responsible for any deaths, ever.

That's a statement of fact, idiot. Where are they claioming something that wasn't true, or backed up by evidence?

2. The man died because of "mania" and "anxiety" rather than because he was shot by a taser too many times.

And, so? Do you recall the video you snipped in my last reply, where suspects who continually disobey commands by police are shot by TASER repeatedly, and don't die?

3. Bad mouthing the "media" for distorting the facts.

What "fact" was distorted exactly? Are you going to stop handwaving soon, and actually prove one of your accusations?

4. Baldfaced lie about him continuing to resist after he was tasered. He was on the fucking ground, convulsing!

You don't continue to convulse after the officer's finger stops touching the trigger. You CAN however, resume resisting after the officer's finger stops touching the trigger, which it looks like this guy was doing.

And why the fuck do you have to knock a guy unconscious? Put him in handcuffs and physically restrain him. Police tactics seem to be, keep attacking the guy until he physically stops moving. Do you ever think that someone shot by a taser could not be thinking clearly? Do you think that someone could be involuntarily moving because of the muscle contractions? Noooooo you have to render a person unconscious so he doesn't move at all.

Every video I've seen involving a TASER has not shown what you're suggesting. Can you provide a link to your claim?

And again, you with the bullshit macho posturing. Hey, maybe you'll approve of this instead:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kKa4daVbuEE

I am still undecided whether I support police taser use. The only thing I respect here are Sith and Death saying they need them to do their jobs.

Right, while implying they're pussies for feeling the need to have them rather than relying on their fists.

I do not respect some false dilemma of tasers or choke holds. If scientific evidence comes to light that a significant part of the clogged artery, physically unfit population would be killed by a taser, then I would support ripping it from their arsenal. Not because it kills. Glocks kill. But because it bills itself as a non-lethal device but when shooting someone with an "underlying medical condition" it kills. Last time I checked heart disease was still the number one killer, and if the majority of your citizens have this "underlying medical condition" then maybe it's not so unlethal.

As pointed out before, pepper spray can kill if you have a bad allergic reaction. Are cops supposed to take your medical history as you resist arrest?

[aerius]

Clearly, we need to give back blackjacks and saps to police officers so they can effectively whack suspects upside the head and cuff'em while they're nicely unconscious.

[brianeyci]

1. Poe, you asked me for proof that TASER claimed that nobody has ever died because of a taser. I provide it, so what the fuck do you want? Now you want to dispute whether or not tasers do kill people in the first place, while simultaneously arguing that even if they did kill, it wouldn't matter. What the fuck do you want? I happen to think that your point, never resist arrest, makes sense, but your other point, never cause a scene so the cops come, doesn't make any sense at fucking all.

2. I never made a claim that tasers always kill. So I don't see what kind of point you're trying to make when you post videos of guys not dying to tasers.

3. The enumerations in the post were not referring to YOU, but to the TASER International bullshit press release. Which YOU asked for, so I gave it to you. You shouldn't be asking me what facts were distorted by the media, but what TASER is saying the media is lying about.

4. Cops specifically said they did NOT use pepper spray in this incident because there was too many people around (it later turned out that was a bullshit story). So contrary to what you say, cops can take risk factors into account. They may not go as far as take medical history, but they can look at a fatass and say, probably a bad idea to use taser on him while on a young youth maybe good idea. What's wrong with that?

5. Maybe I did insinuate that they're pussies in my first post, and there was a little of that to start with but I quickly retracted that. Now I just want to review and see if their actions were the best possible. What do YOU have against that?

[brianeyci]

Clearly, we need to give back blackjacks and saps to police officers so they can effectively whack suspects upside the head and cuff'em while they're nicely unconscious.

Hm, you and Lord Poe do have a point about the other ways worse. I was thinking you could cuff them instead but now that you put it that way you can't really cuff a guy resisting unless you disable him.

Fine, Poe, Sith I concede that the other ways are worse and police need tasers to do their job.

[Skelron]

[Funny, he got plenty of attention before the cops showed up, and that didn't seem to appease him. If you watch the video, a woman tries to talk to him rationally, but does he stop and try to communicate with her in any civilized way? No, he continues breaking shit and acting like an asshole.

Was she speaking his language? Because as I recall after 10 hours he still hadn't seen anyone who spoke his freaking language. Thats the point, a woman speaking to him in English after 10 hours is not going to help because as, was hopefully established 9 Hours ago, the guy dosn't speak English.

[TithonusSyndrome]

And in the great Canadian tradition, we will have an investigation.

By The Canadian Press

VANCOUVER - The head of the government body overseeing the RCMP is launching an investigation into a Taser incident at the Vancouver airport that ended in a man's death.

Paul Kennedy, chairman of the Commission for Public Complaints Against the RCMP, says he believes there are reasonable grounds to investigate the conduct of police the night that Robert Dziekanski died.

In the complaint filed today, Kennedy says he doesn't intend to prejudice the ongoing RCMP investigation into the incident but public concern about the use of force that night warrants a closer look.

The complaint will also look at whether the RCMP officers assigned to the incident are following appropriate policy on investigating one of their own.

The B.C. Civil Liberites Association has also filed a formal complaint with the commission over the incident.

The Polish immigrant died after police shot him with the Taser following a confrontation at the airport in October.

[Darth Wong]

How fucking hard is it for you to understand that if you act irrationally in public, the police are going to be called?

Maybe he wanted the police to show up, because he was hoping they might get a translator instead of sticking him in a "secure room" and ignoring him for 10 hours. He probably didn't count on them interpreting "standing still with your hands by your sides" as "resisting arrest".

[Lord Poe]

Was she speaking his language? Because as I recall after 10 hours he still hadn't seen anyone who spoke his freaking language. Thats the point, a woman speaking to him in English after 10 hours is not going to help because as, was hopefully established 9 Hours ago, the guy dosn't speak English.

That still doesn't give him license to act like a loon. And I can't see how he was being detained. He could have easily walked out of those doors he was putting chairs in front of anytime he wanted to.

This is not simply a language barrier incident. If I went to France to meet my mother at the airport, and didn't find her after 4 hours, (or whenever customs let me run free in the airport) I'd call her damned house. Failing that, I'd go to her house via cab. I wouldn't stay there and tear up the airport lobby. How about you?

How fucking hard is it for you to understand that if you act irrationally in public, the police are going to be called?

Maybe he wanted the police to show up, because he was hoping they might get a translator instead of sticking him in a "secure room" and ignoring him for 10 hours. He probably didn't count on them interpreting "standing still with your hands by your sides" as "resisting arrest".

Agreed about the cops, but that's the last thing I'd do to call for "help". Would you do that? Do you think this is rational behavior in Poland?