A Question About The Force

[Lord Pounder]

As mentioned the Lightsaber is an important part in the training of a Jedi. A lightsaber can cause a great amount of damage due to being able to cut through almost anything with ease. There is no defined edge or blunt side, the entire blade is edge. You ignite a Saber and don't have almost perfect focus you will damage yourself as much as whatever you are attacking.

IIRC Palpatine weilded a lightsaber just to fuck with them. Other Sith like Anakin and Dooku still used them because they where aprentices and still clung to their original Jedi training.

[NecronLord]

IIRC Palpatine weilded a lightsaber just to fuck with them. Other Sith like Anakin and Dooku still used them because they where aprentices and still clung to their original Jedi training.

Doesn't really make much sense. Even wankatine still used one. While they don't seem as important to the Emperor or Yoda, they still have uses for them.

[Chris Parr]

Can you imagine Spider-man swinging between skycrapers and making head shots at 500 m with his ungodly reflexes ?Or the Juggernaut using a chain gun to cut down those pesky fliers and speedsters he could not grab before ?

You know what most superheroes would be even stronger with a weapon not just Jedi. The Jedi merelyhappen to be smart enough to use a weapon extremely well suited for their particular powers.

I think Spider-Man used a web shooter at one time, before his webspinning became a natural part of his powers, so yeah, I could picture him doing that.

I don't believe Juggernaut would bother with those pesky fliers or speeders. Why would he? They're gnats. They can't stop him or hurt him, so if they're not flying around his head like pesky insects, he has no reason to bother with them.

Anyway, I was wondering whether a Force Sensitive might be a match for one of those Z Fighters, from Dragon Ball Z? They seem to use the same power source, although in DBZ they call it Energy, and in Star Wars its called The Force, but it's still the same thin, basicly, power generated by life.

Now, I can only think of two characters on DBZ who used a weapon—a sword by the way—Gohan and Trunks. And once they were able to tap their full potential, they gave up on their weapons, and relied on their powers instead.

[Lord Pounder]

Can you imagine Spider-man swinging between skycrapers and making head shots at 500 m with his ungodly reflexes ?Or the Juggernaut using a chain gun to cut down those pesky fliers and speedsters he could not grab before ?

You know what most superheroes would be even stronger with a weapon not just Jedi. The Jedi merelyhappen to be smart enough to use a weapon extremely well suited for their particular powers.

I think Spider-Man used a web shooter at one time, before his webspinning became a natural part of his powers, so yeah, I could picture him doing that.

I don't believe Juggernaut would bother with those pesky fliers or speeders. Why would he? They're gnats. They can't stop him or hurt him, so if they're not flying around his head like pesky insects, he has no reason to bother with them.

Anyway, I was wondering whether a Force Sensitive might be a match for one of those Z Fighters, from Dragon Ball Z? They seem to use the same power source, although in DBZ they call it Energy, and in Star Wars its called The Force, but it's still the same thin, basicly, power generated by life.

Now, I can only think of two characters on DBZ who used a weapon—a sword by the way—Gohan and Trunks. And once they were able to tap their full potential, they gave up on their weapons, and relied on their powers instead.

Please show evidence that The Force and DBZ Energy are one and the same thing.

[Havok]

Can you imagine Spider-man swinging between skycrapers and making head shots at 500 m with his ungodly reflexes ?Or the Juggernaut using a chain gun to cut down those pesky fliers and speedsters he could not grab before ?

You know what most superheroes would be even stronger with a weapon not just Jedi. The Jedi merelyhappen to be smart enough to use a weapon extremely well suited for their particular powers.

I think Spider-Man used a web shooter at one time, before his webspinning became a natural part of his powers, so yeah, I could picture him doing that.

I don't believe Juggernaut would bother with those pesky fliers or speeders. Why would he? They're gnats. They can't stop him or hurt him, so if they're not flying around his head like pesky insects, he has no reason to bother with them.

Anyway, I was wondering whether a Force Sensitive might be a match for one of those Z Fighters, from Dragon Ball Z? They seem to use the same power source, although in DBZ they call it Energy, and in Star Wars its called The Force, but it's still the same thin, basicly, power generated by life.

Now, I can only think of two characters on DBZ who used a weapon—a sword by the way—Gohan and Trunks. And once they were able to tap their full potential, they gave up on their weapons, and relied on their powers instead.

Please show evidence that The Force and DBZ Energy are one and the same thing.

Oh geez. Does it really matter? He is just saying that they appear to work the same way and have the same descriptions in their own universes. Life creates, flows through, use for good or evil, blah blah blah. Just because he used "same" instead of "similar" do we have to make a federal case of it?

[Chris Parr]

"The Force is an energy field generated by all living things. It surrounds us, penetrates us, and binds the Galaxy together."

Obi Wan Kenobi, A New Hope.

Now the Energy used by the Z Fighters in DBZ is more properly known as Chi, which, roughly translated, means "Life Energy".

See? Different names for the same thing.

[Havok]

"The Force is an energy field generated by all living things. It surrounds us, penetrates us, and binds the Galaxy together."

Obi Wan Kenobi, A New Hope.

Now the Energy used by the Z Fighters in DBZ is more properly known as Chi, which, roughly translated, means "Life Energy".

See? Different names for the same thing.

Well now you are just being a twit and what I posted above is moot.

What you just said is not evidence or proof, just your opinion, so please, as Lord Pounder said....

Please show evidence that The Force and DBZ Energy are one and the same thing.

[OmegaGuy]

The only Force users I'm aware of who didn't need a lightsaber to stop blasterfire were Vader and Horn .

IIRC Dolph (Kueller) also could do the "stop a blaster bolt with his palm" trick

[Surlethe]

"The Force is an energy field generated by all living things. It surrounds us, penetrates us, and binds the Galaxy together."

Obi Wan Kenobi, A New Hope.

Now the Energy used by the Z Fighters in DBZ is more properly known as Chi, which, roughly translated, means "Life Energy".

See? Different names for the same thing.

Not really. In fact, not at all. Force-generated phenomena are almost entirely different from Qi in DragonBall Z, unless there are people in Star Wars who shoot "energy blasts" from their hands, or people in DBZ who use TK and precognition.

And then there's your "logic". By it, a famous person is the same thing as a humongous ball of hydrogen undergoing spontaneous and continuous thermonuclear fusion.

[Chris Parr]

"The Force is an energy field generated by all living things. It surrounds us, penetrates us, and binds the Galaxy together."

Obi Wan Kenobi, A New Hope.

Now the Energy used by the Z Fighters in DBZ is more properly known as Chi, which, roughly translated, means "Life Energy".

See? Different names for the same thing.

Well now you are just being a twit and what I posted above is moot.

What you just said is not evidence or proof, just your opinion, so please, as Lord Pounder said....

Please show evidence that The Force and DBZ Energy are one and the same thing.

I think you're working under the assumption that The Force is unique to that certain Galaxy far far away. However, in The New Jedi Order series, we learn that the Yuuzhan Vong, before they were cut off from the Force, were able to tap into and use this power. Now, if we assume from this that the Force is universal, and not just restricted to the one Galaxy, then logicly, anything which is similar enough could be said to be the same thing with a different name.

[Lord Pounder]

Once again, fuckass, show me how The Force is the same as the wankium in DBZ. Surlethe was good enough to show the differences i.e. a total disimarlity in displayed powers. If you played close attention you'd see I'm actually operating on no assumption, I am actually asking you to back up your claim that The Force and what ever they tap into in DBZ are actually one and the same. Please show some similarities or fuck off back to waching kiddies cartoons. Twat.

[Chris Parr]

"The Force is an energy field generated by all living things. It surrounds us, penetrates us, and binds the Galaxy together."

Obi Wan Kenobi, A New Hope.

Now the Energy used by the Z Fighters in DBZ is more properly known as Chi, which, roughly translated, means "Life Energy".

See? Different names for the same thing.

Not really. In fact, not at all. Force-generated phenomena are almost entirely different from Qi in DragonBall Z, unless there are people in Star Wars who shoot "energy blasts" from their hands, or people in DBZ who use TK and precognition.

And then there's your "logic". By it, a famous person is the same thing as a humongous ball of hydrogen undergoing spontaneous and continuous thermonuclear fusion.

Yeah, well, the Emporer used Sith lightning, and the DBZ characters use TK quite a lot. Haven't seen anyone except Baba who could predict the future. Doesn't mean they couldn't do it though.

And as for my "logic", I think you need to pay attention to what I say. The Force, as seen in Star Wars, and Qi, as seen in Dragon Ball Z, are Synonyms. That is, they are two different words which mean the same thing. I never said anything about two different things with the same name.

[Gullible Jones]

(Disclaimer: I know next to nothing about DBZ.)

Think about it for a minute. These are elements of completely different series. They may be similar concepts - in fact, I would be surprised if Lucas wasn't influenced by traditional Chinese beliefs about "qi" - but that doesn't make them synonimous.

See, Dungeons & Dragons has a pervasive magical force that lets wizards throw great big fucking fireballs at each other... Just like in Dragonball! Oh, they must be the same! (Not.)

Edit: what the hell am I doing arguing about the semantics of Force vs. Qi vs. Magic anyway? They're all imaginary concepts, think whatever you want about them.

[Chris Parr]

Once again, fuckass, show me how The Force is the same as the wankium in DBZ. Surlethe was good enough to show the differences i.e. a total disimarlity in displayed powers. If you played close attention you'd see I'm actually operating on no assumption, I am actually asking you to back up your claim that The Force and what ever they tap into in DBZ are actually one and the same. Please show some similarities or fuck off back to waching kiddies cartoons. Twat.

The manifestations are irrelevant. It's the power they're tapping I'm talking about. And the Force and Qi are both energies created by life and can be used for good or evil and can be used to tap into a wide variety of powers. Just because one group uses powers that the other group doesn't is no reason to think that they're not using the same power source. Just as a baseball player and a figure skater use the same power source (calories) to do different things, so too do the Z Fighters and Jedi and Sith and other Force Sensitives use the same source (Qi/The Force) to do different things.

[Havok]

Edit: what the hell am I doing arguing about the semantics of Force vs. Qi vs. Magic anyway? They're all imaginary concepts, think whatever you want about them.

Yes. That would be stupid, especially on a Star Wars Vs Star Trek inspired website/forum.

[Havok]

Once again, fuckass, show me how The Force is the same as the wankium in DBZ. Surlethe was good enough to show the differences i.e. a total disimarlity in displayed powers. If you played close attention you'd see I'm actually operating on no assumption, I am actually asking you to back up your claim that The Force and what ever they tap into in DBZ are actually one and the same. Please show some similarities or fuck off back to waching kiddies cartoons. Twat.

The manifestations are irrelevant. It's the power they're tapping I'm talking about. And the Force and Qi are both energies created by life and can be used for good or evil and can be used to tap into a wide variety of powers. Just because one group uses powers that the other group doesn't is no reason to think that they're not using the same power source. Just as a baseball player and a figure skater use the same power source (calories) to do different things, so too do the Z Fighters and Jedi and Sith and other Force Sensitives use the same source (Qi/The Force) to do different things.

That's a great analogy, but you still haven't proven anything. On top of that you claim that the two now exist in the same reality. Please prove your claim that the two universes are in fact the same if they are tapping into the same energy field.

[Surlethe]

Yeah, well, the Emporer used Sith lightning, and the DBZ characters use TK quite a lot. Haven't seen anyone except Baba who could predict the future. Doesn't mean they couldn't do it though.

When was the last time you saw any DBZ characters shoot lightning from their fingertips? When was the last time anyone from DBZ regularly used precognition to predict the future? When was the last time a Jedi or Sith shot honest-to-God glowing balls from his hands?

And if you're going to say that DBZ characters use TK quite a lot, I can just as easily say that only once have I seen a DBZ character use TK; it's established nothing like the sort of correlation that should exist if Qi and the Force are the same thing. It's your job to come up with a list of incidents and show that indeed a pattern exists.

And as for my "logic", I think you need to pay attention to what I say. The Force, as seen in Star Wars, and Qi, as seen in Dragon Ball Z, are Synonyms. That is, they are two different words which mean the same thing. I never said anything about two different things with the same name.

Fallacy of circular reasoning. By claiming that the two words are synonyms, you are assuming the very proposition you wish to establish: that the Force and Qi are the same thing. Your initial argument, before you backpeddled to this question-begging backup, was that because "Qi" can in its vague definition as "life energy" be applied to the Force, the Force and DBZ Qi must be the same thing. By that logic, famous people are indeed giant balls of gas because the word "star", in its definition as "famous people", can be applied to famous people.

[lord Martiya]

For what I saw, the characters from Dragonball Z use their own energy in every attack except the allmighty Genkidama, and the Force, according to what Qui-Gon said in TPM, is created by all living creatures. So only one character of Dragonball Z can use the Force, I think.

[Ritterin Sophia]

Yeah, well, the Emporer used Sith lightning,

What's Sith Lightning, I know of no such thing as Sith Lightning, only Force Lightning, which anyone can use barring someone with a prosthetic hands, unless you're one of those morons who think only Sith can do it?

and the DBZ characters use TK quite a lot.

It's not exactly telekinesis, it's more moving the Qi to their feet, the only person whom I've ever seen to use TK was Frieza, it's possible it may be a trait of his species, but neither King Cold or Cooler exhibited these abilities.

Haven't seen anyone except Baba who could predict the future. Doesn't mean they couldn't do it though.

Likewise it doesn't mean they can, but since you're making the positive assertion, you need to prove it.

And as for my "logic", I think you need to pay attention to what I say. The Force, as seen in Star Wars, and Qi, as seen in Dragon Ball Z, are Synonyms. That is, they are two different words which mean the same thing. I never said anything about two different things with the same name.

No they aren't, whilst they're both based on life energy, Qi only requires physical conditioning and can cause you to injure yourself if you step beyond your own boundaries, the Force exacts a toll both mentally and physically as it primarily acts upon willpower to channel it and uses your body as a conduit, there are examples of force users, such as Dorsk 81 (Who died) and King Ommin (Crippled himself), by channeling more than they could handle.

Similair concepts, but they are in no way synonyms, unless you use the most basic definitions rather than the technical ones, which is what a moron would do

[Havok]

Hey... Wasn't there a concession here?

[Chris Parr]

All right, fine, I'll drop it.

Anyway, all I wanted to know was whether any of you think that the Z Fighters in DBZ would be a match for the Jedi?

[Surlethe]

All right, fine, I'll drop it.

Cool.

Anyway, all I wanted to know was whether any of you think that the Z Fighters in DBZ would be a match for the Jedi?

I don't know if that's been done here before (but then, I don't browse down in Fantasy and OSF much), so you might try searching the board history for similar versus threads. If nothing comes up, then consider starting a new thread in Other Sci-Fi or Fantasy about the topic.

[Chris Parr]

ok

[PainRack]

Also, Yoda showed the capability to block, reflect, and absorb the energy from Force lightning without a lightsaber. It's not the same kind of energy, but unless Force lightning is less intense than blaster bolts, it suggests that he may have also been able to block blaster bolts without a lightsaber if he desperately needed to.

Why? ROTJ novelisation states that Force Lightning was generated with the force, and if so, could be deflected via the Force. This suggests a mystical component to the deflection.

[Havok]

Also, Yoda showed the capability to block, reflect, and absorb the energy from Force lightning without a lightsaber. It's not the same kind of energy, but unless Force lightning is less intense than blaster bolts, it suggests that he may have also been able to block blaster bolts without a lightsaber if he desperately needed to.

Why? ROTJ novelisation states that Force Lightning was generated with the force, and if so, could be deflected via the Force. This suggests a mystical component to the deflection.

When did the Force get mystical again?