IRGC boats almost fired upon by USN

[Jadeite]

Pentagon Says Ships Harassed by Iran
By PAULINE JELINEK,
Posted: 2008-01-07 10:18:41
Filed Under: World News
WASHINGTON (Jan. 7) - In what is being called a serious provocation, Iranian Revolutionary Guard boats harassed and provoked three U.S. Navy ships in the strategic Strait of Hormuz, officials said Monday.

U.S. forces were on the verge of firing on the Iranian boats in the early Sunday incident, when the boats ended the incident and turned and moved away, said a Pentagon official.

"It is the most serious provocation of this sort that we've seen yet," said the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to speak on the record.

The incident occurred at about 5 a.m. local time Sunday as a U.S. Navy cruiser, destroyer and frigate were transiting the strait on their way into the Persian Gulf.

"Five small boats were acting in a very aggressive way, charging the ships, dropping boxes in the water in front of the ships and causing our ships to take evasive maneuvers," the Pentagon official said.

"There were no injuries but there very well could have been," he said, adding that the Iranian boats turned away "literally at the very moment that U.S. forced were preparing to open fire" in self defense.

He said he didn't have the precise transcript of communications that passed between the two forces, but the Iranians radioed something to the effect that "we're coming at you and you'll explode in a couple minutes."

Historical tensions between the two nations have increased in recent years over Washington's charge that Tehran has been developing nuclear weapons and supplying and training Iraqi insurgents using roadside bombs - the No. 1 killer of U.S. troops in Iraq.

In another incident off it's coast, Iranian Revolutionary Guard sailors last March captured 15 British sailors and held them for nearly two weeks.

The 15 sailors from HMS Cornwall, including one woman, were captured on March 23. Iran claims the crew, operating in a small patrol craft, had intruded into Iranian waters - a claim denied by Britain.

I wonder if Iran is eager to see a repeat of Operation Praying Mantis? The last time they tangled with the United States Navy didn't go very well for them.

[Jadeite]

Ghetto edit: Link.

[FSTargetDrone]

He said he didn't have the precise transcript of communications that passed between the two forces, but the Iranians radioed something to the effect that "we're coming at you and you'll explode in a couple minutes."

That sounds a bit like a threat, no? "Explode" is pretty serious-sounding, to say the least.

In another incident off it's coast, Iranian Revolutionary Guard sailors last March captured 15 British sailors and held them for nearly two weeks.

Bah! What is it with not understanding that it's spelled "its"?!

[Sidewinder]

He said he didn't have the precise transcript of communications that passed between the two forces, but the Iranians radioed something to the effect that "we're coming at you and you'll explode in a couple minutes."

I know the Iranians know the US Army, Air Force, and Marine Corps is overstretched in Iraq and Afghanistan, but the US Navy? What, are they begging for a Tomahawk or two to transform an Iranian military installation into a parking lot?

[Siege]

I find it hard to believe someone would actually radio "you'll explode in a couple minutes" to a USN vessel whilst racing at it in a small boat. You might as well radio "please machinegun us". Maybe I'm just underestimating the sheer nuttery of the Revolutionary Guard?

[Darth Wong]

I find it hard to believe someone would actually radio "you'll explode in a couple minutes" to a USN vessel whilst racing at it in a small boat. You might as well radio "please machinegun us". Maybe I'm just underestimating the sheer nuttery of the Revolutionary Guard?

They're trying to provoke the US into firing on them, for public relations purposes. If they get shot at, they lose a worthless resource and have an excuse to play the victim. If they don't, there are no real consequences at all. Either way, there's a potential upside and a limited downside.

[Stuart]

They're trying to provoke the US into firing on them, for public relations purposes. If they get shot at, they lose a worthless resource and have an excuse to play the victim. If they don't, there are no real consequences at all. Either way, there's a potential upside and a limited downside.

Also, there's a major power-struggle going on inside Iran and a serious confrontation with the USA is just what some elements of that power struggle need to put their opponents away. I'd guess that was the primary driver of this incident.

The other is, drop dummy packages in front of the ships often enough and they might get ignored when somebody drops a real one.

[FSTargetDrone]

I find it hard to believe someone would actually radio "you'll explode in a couple minutes" to a USN vessel whilst racing at it in a small boat. You might as well radio "please machinegun us". Maybe I'm just underestimating the sheer nuttery of the Revolutionary Guard?

The Navy is understandably not going to take such a threat lightly, considering what a small boat did a few years ago to the Cole.

[Jadeite]

Also, there's a major power-struggle going on inside Iran and a serious confrontation with the USA is just what some elements of that power struggle need to put their opponents away. I'd guess that was the primary driver of this incident.

The other is, drop dummy packages in front of the ships often enough and they might get ignored when somebody drops a real one.

Could you tell us more about this power struggle? I'm guessing its between the hard-liners and reformists? Who's on which side and controls what would be helpful to know.

[Admiral Valdemar]

Why now?

[J]

Why now?

Because oil prices are getting too low, like duh!

[Mange]

An Iranian Foreign Ministry spokesman dismissed the incident as a case of the Iranian vessels not "recognizing" the American ships and that it was "something normal": Yahoo! News.

What the hell were the Iranian crews thinking? What would have happened if the U.S. vessels had opened fire?

[Raesene]

What the hell were the Iranian crews thinking? What would have happened if the U.S. vessels had opened fire?

Martyrs and an excuse for lots of other terrorists to strike ?

A poster in an Austrian newspaper forum wondred how the USA would react to Iranian naval vessels cruising off Nebraska...

The best response was "wondering why the USA has the bad reputation regarding geography".

[Ubiquitous]

What would have happened if the U.S. vessels had opened fire?

Lot's of flag burning around the Islamic world directly at the 'evil' Americans machine gunning heroic Revolutionary Guards in International waters.

[Isolder74]

Well to be fair there is a long wide river near Nebraska.

[Lord of the Abyss]

What the hell were the Iranian crews thinking? What would have happened if the U.S. vessels had opened fire?

I expect that they were thinking that we could be provoked into an international incident. Internally, they could have used that to portray us as enemies that Iranians need to stand united against; externally, they could have used it to weaken us politically even further, portray us as trigger happy thugs. And probably have been believed, after what we've done to our reputation.

[Stuart]

Could you tell us more about this power struggle? I'm guessing its between the hard-liners and reformists? Who's on which side and controls what would be helpful to know.

It's a lot more complex than that; there are about six or seven factions pulling in different directions. The so-called "hard-liners" are split between those who want to unify Islam against the rest of the world, those who want to ensure the purity of "their" form of Islam against the rest (and there's two or three factions right there) and several other less important branches. The so-called "reformers" are split as well, between those who want to revert to a somwhat democratic form of government, those who want a kinder, gentler version of the existing theocratic government and others. They're all furiously conspiring against each other. The ruling authorities there don't want to give up the perks and privileges power brings with it (they're as corrupt as hell) so the present situation is entirely to their taste.

The only thing holding Iran together is outside pressure. That's why the Iranian Government goes to such trouble to make sure everybody hates it. They need the rest of the world squeezing them to stop the country exploding into a real civil war.

[Kane Starkiller]

The only thing holding Iran together is outside pressure. That's why the Iranian Government goes to such trouble to make sure everybody hates it. They need the rest of the world squeezing them to stop the country exploding into a real civil war.

So Bush calling Iran part of "axis of evil" and all these threats to attack it are actually evidence that US supports current regime? Since the pressure from US is keeping it from collapsing into civil war?

[Fingolfin_Noldor]

The only thing holding Iran together is outside pressure. That's why the Iranian Government goes to such trouble to make sure everybody hates it. They need the rest of the world squeezing them to stop the country exploding into a real civil war.

So Bush calling Iran part of "axis of evil" and all these threats to attack it are actually evidence that US supports current regime? Since the pressure from US is keeping it from collapsing into civil war?

I don't think that is the original intended effect. Rather, the current US administration think squeezing it will actually cause Iran to collapse, and not the reverse effect.

[Wanderer]

I find it hard to believe someone would actually radio "you'll explode in a couple minutes" to a USN vessel whilst racing at it in a small boat. You might as well radio "please machinegun us". Maybe I'm just underestimating the sheer nuttery of the Revolutionary Guard?

They're trying to provoke the US into firing on them, for public relations purposes. If they get shot at, they lose a worthless resource and have an excuse to play the victim. If they don't, there are no real consequences at all. Either way, there's a potential upside and a limited downside.

Actually to me this sounds like some IRGC speedboats which regularly patrol the area for drug smugglers got surprised by the appearance of USN vessels and decided to have fun at the USN expense. Note they backed off when it appeared the USN was going to fire. If Tehran wanted a confrontation they would have maintained course.

Bear in mind the Iranian Military operates with wide degree of independence, it has to in order to avoid decapitation strikes, so you'll have some idiots like these bozos who think that just bolting a six cell rocket launcher and 20mm gun to their boat can enable them to get cute with a USN ship.

[Lonestar]

Actually to me this sounds like some IRGC speedboats which regularly patrol the area for drug smugglers got surprised by the appearance of USN vessels and decided to have fun at the USN expense. Note they backed off when it appeared the USN was going to fire. If Tehran wanted a confrontation they would have maintained course.

Bear in mind the Iranian Military operates with wide degree of independence, it has to in order to avoid decapitation strikes, so you'll have some idiots like these bozos who think that just bolting a six cell rocket launcher and 20mm gun to their boat can enable them to get cute with a USN ship.

The IRGC isn't really the Iranian military, think of them as Waffen-SS knockoffs. And they probably weren't surprised(The USN rarely makes an effort to conceal it's movements through the SoH), just decided to test the ROE as far as it would go.

As for weapons, I think the bigger concern was them dumping stuff in the way of the boats as they ran off.

[Stuart]

So Bush calling Iran part of "axis of evil" and all these threats to attack it are actually evidence that US supports current regime? Since the pressure from US is keeping it from collapsing into civil war?

Of course not. What this indicates is that the Administration hasn't really got a clue what is going on inside Iran and is making its decisions based on a very simplistic interpretation of what is going on in there. The Iranian leadership is playing them in order to generate the tension they need to survive. (North Korea is doing much the same thing by the way).

The problem from the Iranian point of view is that obtaining internal security by manufacturing pressure from the outside world is rather like drug addiction - a constantly increasing dose of provocation is neede dto generate the required amount of pressure. Eventually, the situation reaches the point (North Korea has just about got there) when the required level of tension can only be generated by actually starting a war.

[Kane Starkiller]

Aside from different religious groups how serious are ethnic divisions between Balochi, Arabs, Kurds and Azeris in Iran?

[Sidewinder]

The problem from the Iranian point of view is that obtaining internal security by manufacturing pressure from the outside world is rather like drug addiction - a constantly increasing dose of provocation is neede dto generate the required amount of pressure. Eventually, the situation reaches the point (North Korea has just about got there) when the required level of tension can only be generated by actually starting a war.

That can't be smart. Kim Jong-Il surely realizes that if he's seen as the aggressor, he can't count on China and Russia's support, unlike the first time around... doesn't he? After the Iraqi military got ass-raped in OIF, Kim surely realizes the North Korean military doesn't stand a chance against the US and South Korea's, unless the Norks unite behind Islamofascist ideals or something to encourage guerilla warfare against an occupying force... doesn't he?

And even if the Iranians can count on the US Army and Marine Corps NOT invading and occupying their country after they start a war, they surely realize the US Navy and Air Force can still cause severe damage to their infrastructure, making the war more trouble than it's worth... don't they?

Of course, considering the way the Japanese military dictatorship acted during WW2, perhaps I'm being too optimistic.

[Lord of the Abyss]

He said he didn't have the precise transcript of communications that passed between the two forces, but the Iranians radioed something to the effect that "we're coming at you and you'll explode in a couple minutes."

That sounds a bit like a threat, no? "Explode" is pretty serious-sounding, to say the least.

I saw this link posted elsewhere : Navy Times

‘Filipino Monkey’ may be behind radio threats, ship drivers say

By Andrew Scutro and David Brown
Posted : Friday Jan 11, 2008 17:24:25 EST

The threatening radio transmission heard at the end of a video showing harassing maneuvers by Iranian patrol boats in the Strait of Hormuz may have come from a locally famous heckler known among ship drivers as the “Filipino Monkey.”

Since the Jan. 6 incident was announced to the public a day later, the U.S. Navy has said it’s unclear where the voice came from. In the videotape released by the Pentagon on Jan. 8, the screen goes black at the very end and the voice can be heard, distancing it from the scenes on the water.

“We don’t know for sure where they came from,” said Cmdr. Lydia Robertson, spokeswoman for 5th Fleet in Bahrain. “It could have been a shore station.”

While the threat — “I am coming to you. You will explode in a few minutes” — was picked up during the incident, further jacking up the tension, there’s no proof yet of its origin. And several Navy officials have said it’s difficult to figure out who’s talking.

See the Pentagon’s version of the video


A link to the Iranian version (click the camera icon)


“Based on my experience operating in that part of the world, where there is a lot of maritime activity, trying to discern [who is speaking on the radio channel] is very hard to do,” Chief of Naval Operations Adm. Gary Roughead told Navy Times during a brief telephone interview today.

Indeed, the voice in the audio sounds different from the one belonging to an Iranian officer shown speaking to the cruiser Port Royal over a radio from a small open boat in the video released by Iranian authorities. He is shown in a radio exchange at one point asking the U.S. warship to change from the common bridge-to-bridge channel 16 to another channel, perhaps to speak to the Navy without being interrupted.

Further, there’s none of the background noise in the audio released by the U.S. that would have been picked up by a radio handset in an open boat.

So with Navy officials unsure and the Iranians accusing the U.S. of fabrications, whose voice was it? In recent years, American ships operating in the Middle East have had to contend with a mysterious but profane voice known by the ethnically insulting handle of “Filipino Monkey,” likely more than one person, who listens in on ship-to-ship radio traffic and then jumps on the net shouting insults and jabbering vile epithets.

Navy women — a helicopter pilot hailing a tanker, for example — who are overheard on the radio are said to suffer particularly degrading treatment.

Several Navy ship drivers interviewed by Navy Times are raising the possibility that the Monkey, or an imitator, was indeed featured in that video.

Rick Hoffman, a retired captain who commanded the cruiser Hue City and spent many of his 17 years at sea in the Gulf was subject to the renegade radio talker repeatedly, often without pause during the so-called “Tanker Wars” of the late 1980s.

“For 25 years there’s been this mythical guy out there who, hour after hour, shouts obscenities and threats,” he said. “He could be tied up pierside somewhere or he could be on the bridge of a merchant ship.”

And the Monkey has stamina.

“He used to go all night long. The guy is crazy,” he said. “But who knows how many Filipino Monkeys there are? Could it have been a spurious transmission? Absolutely.”

Furthermore, Hoffman said radio signals have a way of traveling long distances in that area. “Under certain weather conditions I could hear Bahrain from the Strait of Hormuz.”

Cmdr. Jeff Davis, a Navy spokesman at the Pentagon, could not say if the voice belonged to the heckler.

“It’s an international circuit and we’ve said all along there were other ships and shore stations in the area,” he said.

When asked if U.S. officials considered whether the threats came from someone besides the Iranians when releasing the video and audio, Roughead said: “The reason there is audio superimposed over the video is it gives you a better idea of what is happening.”

Similarly, Davis said the audio was part of the “totality” of the situation and helped show the “aggressive behavior.”

Another former cruiser skipper said he thought the Monkey might be behind the audio threats when he first heard them earlier this week.

“It wouldn’t have surprised me at all,” he said. “There’s all kinds of chatter on Channel 16. Anybody with a receiver and transmitter can hear something’s going on. It was entirely plausible and consistent with the radio environment to interject themselves and make a threatening comment and think they’re being funny.”

This former skipper also noted how quiet and clean the radio “threat” was, especially when radio calls from small boats in the chop are noisy and cluttered.

“It’s a tough environment, you’re bouncing around, moving fast, lots of wind, noise. It’s not a serene environment,” he said. “That sounded like somebody on the beach or a large ship going by.”

He said he and others believe that the Filipino Monkey is comprised of several people, and whoever gets on Channel 16 to heckle instantly gets the monicker.

“It was just a gut feeling, something the merchants did. Guys would get bored, one guy hears it, comes back a year later and does it for himself,” he said. “I never thought it was one, rather it was part of the woodwork.”

The former skipper noted that he warned his crew about hecklers when preparing to transit Hormuz. “I tell them they’ll hear things on there that will be insulting,” he said. “You tell your people that you’ll hear things that are strange, insulting, aggravating, but you need to maintain a professional posture.”

A civilian mariner with experience in that region said the Filipino Monkey phenomenon is worldwide, and has been going on for years.

“They come on and say ‘Filipino Monkey’ in a strange voice. They might say it two or three times. You’re standing watch on bridge and you’re monitoring Channel 16 and all of a sudden it comes over the radio. It can happen anytime. It’s been a joke out there for years.”

While it happens all over the world, it’s more likely to occur around the Strait of Hormuz because there is so much shipping traffic, he said.