It turns out that one of humanity's oldest professions may be even older than we thought: In a recent study of macaque monkeys in Indonesia, researchers found that male primates "paid" for sexual access to females — and that the going rate for such access dwindled as the number of available females went up.
According to the paper, "Payment for Sex in a Macaque Mating Market," published in the December issue of Animal Behavior, males in a group of about 50 long-tailed macaques in Kalimantan Tengah, Indonesia, traded grooming services for sex with females; researchers, who studied the monkeys for some 20 months, found that males offered their payment up-front, as a kind of pre-sex ritual. It worked. After the females were groomed by male partners, female sexual activity more than doubled, from an average of 1.5 times an hour to 3.5 times. The study also showed that the number of minutes that males spent grooming hinged on the number of females available at the time: The better a male's odds of getting lucky, the less nit-picking time the females received. Though primates have been observed trading grooming for food sharing or infant care, this is the first time this kind of exchange has been observed between male and female primates in a sexual context, says lead researcher Michael Gumert of Singapore's Nanyang Technological University, demonstrating that the amount of time a male macaque "will invest in [its] partner" depends largely on how many options it has around.
Alright folks, pace yourselves. Its gonna be a long thread, and there's plenty of jokes to go around.
Don't try and be a hero.
Stuart: The only problem is, I'm losing track of which universe I'm in.
You kinda look like Jesus. With a lightsaber.- Peregrin Toker
So, other animals are starting to figure out a way to spread their genes despite a lack of other clear indicators of genetic superiority? Way to fight natural selection, little monkey dudes!
Note: I'm semi-retired from the board, so if you need something, please be patient.
It turns out that one of humanity's oldest professions may be even older than we thought: In a recent study of macaque monkeys in Indonesia, researchers found that male primates "paid" for sexual access to females — and that the going rate for such access dwindled as the number of available females went up.
According to the paper, "Payment for Sex in a Macaque Mating Market," published in the December issue of Animal Behavior, males in a group of about 50 long-tailed macaques in Kalimantan Tengah, Indonesia, traded grooming services for sex with females; researchers, who studied the monkeys for some 20 months, found that males offered their payment up-front, as a kind of pre-sex ritual. It worked. After the females were groomed by male partners, female sexual activity more than doubled, from an average of 1.5 times an hour to 3.5 times. The study also showed that the number of minutes that males spent grooming hinged on the number of females available at the time: The better a male's odds of getting lucky, the less nit-picking time the females received. Though primates have been observed trading grooming for food sharing or infant care, this is the first time this kind of exchange has been observed between male and female primates in a sexual context, says lead researcher Michael Gumert of Singapore's Nanyang Technological University, demonstrating that the amount of time a male macaque "will invest in [its] partner" depends largely on how many options it has around.
Lagmonster wrote:So, other animals are starting to figure out a way to spread their genes despite a lack of other clear indicators of genetic superiority? Way to fight natural selection, little monkey dudes!
I'd think that this would select for a) higher intelligence, or b) greater social skills in the population...that's not fighting it, just redirecting it a bit.
Lagmonster wrote:So, other animals are starting to figure out a way to spread their genes despite a lack of other clear indicators of genetic superiority? Way to fight natural selection, little monkey dudes!
I'd think that this would select for a) higher intelligence, or b) greater social skills in the population...that's not fighting it, just redirecting it a bit.
Higher intelligence probably not. Probably has more to do with a combination of ability to gather food and spend time grooming (An honest signal of his ability to obtain resources), and his willingness to invest time in her and potentially her offspring. A follow up study would be to take a look at the more successful males and see what their interactions with offspring are.
GALE Force Biological Agent/
BOTM/Great Dolphin Conspiracy/ Entomology and Evolutionary Biology Subdirector:SD.net Dept. of Biological Sciences
There is Grandeur in the View of Life; it fills me with a Deep Wonder, and Intense Cynicism.
Isn't it possible this also has to do with the effect of having someone of the opposite gender putting their hands all over you for a good amount of time? I know it works in humans to make the sexual drive higher, maybe it's part of the monkey mating ritual too.
Then again I shouldn't really be putting up "suggestions" to people far more qualified than I... it was just a thought.
"Yeah, funny how that works - you giving hungry people food they vote for you. You give homeless people shelter they vote for you. You give the unemployed a job they vote for you.
Maybe if the conservative ideology put a roof overhead, food on the table, and employed the downtrodden the poor folk would be all for it, too". - Broomstick
CaptainChewbacca wrote:I don't know if I'd want to have sex with a woman after spending an hour picking lice and ticks off of her.
So no foreplay?
"Show me an angel and I will paint you one." - Gustav Courbet
"Quetzalcoatl, plumed serpent of the Aztecs... you are a pussy." - Stephen Colbert
"Really, I'm jealous of how much smarter than me he is. I'm not an expert on anything and he's an expert on things he knows nothing about." - Me, concerning a bullshitter
Zablorg wrote:Hmm. Sex for something as trivial as grooming.
Why can't life ever be this simple?
Umm... I've had a number of intimate situations that were started off by me giving someone else a massage, or me brushing her hair. Yes, it can be that simple. In fact, as far as impromptu sex goes, it is often that simple.
Gaian Paradigm: Because not all fantasy has to be childish crap. Ephemeral Pie: Because not all role-playing has to be shallow. My art: Because not all DA users are talentless emo twits. "Phant, quit abusing the He-Wench before he turns you into a caged bitch at a Ren Fair and lets the tourists toss half munched turkey legs at your backside." -Mr. Coffee
Zablorg wrote:Hmm. Sex for something as trivial as grooming.
Why can't life ever be this simple?
It can be. I'm happily married, so I get sex for something as trivial as "the Sun is going down". So do millions of other couples. It's not a big deal.
"It's not evil for God to do it. Or for someone to do it at God's command."- Jonathan Boyd on baby-killing
"you guys are fascinated with the use of those "rules of logic" to the extent that you don't really want to discussus anything."- GC
"I do not believe Russian Roulette is a stupid act" - Embracer of Darkness
"Viagra commercials appear to save lives" - tharkûn on US health care.
Zablorg wrote:Hmm. Sex for something as trivial as grooming.
Why can't life ever be this simple?
It can be. I'm happily married, so I get sex for something as trivial as "the Sun is going down". So do millions of other couples. It's not a big deal.
I was more refering to prostitution, where one would have to pay cash instead of grooming the mistresses hair. I'm sure lots of monkeys have sex for free.
You'd be amazed how many doors to intimate situations are opened just by having a basic knowledge of massage techniques. Which isn't really surprising, the whole point of a massage is to make the recipient feel good, relaxed and less restricted by tension/inhibition. It combines the benefits of drinking with none of the drawbacks.
Gaian Paradigm: Because not all fantasy has to be childish crap. Ephemeral Pie: Because not all role-playing has to be shallow. My art: Because not all DA users are talentless emo twits. "Phant, quit abusing the He-Wench before he turns you into a caged bitch at a Ren Fair and lets the tourists toss half munched turkey legs at your backside." -Mr. Coffee
I kind've feel like this study is stretching the definition of prostitution. I mean, what these monkeys are doing is basically just paying attention to the female and treating her well - exactly what human males do when we take girls out on dates. If we have sex afterwards, is it prostitution? I don't think so.
"If one needed proof that a guitar was more than wood and string, that a song was more than notes and words, and that a man could be more than a name and a few faded pictures, then Robert Johnson’s recordings were all one could ask for."
