Torchwood S2x01: Kiss Kiss, Bang Bang [Spoilers]

[Big Orange]

Gah! I'm missing a "to" and a "r".

[Manus Celer Dei]

That was leagues better than the last series. Actually looking forward for the rest of the series now...

[Stark]

It was still based on a cast of cripplingly stupid, astonishingly selfish and utterly useless morons. I loved the part were they were all annoyed he left after they MURDERED him. WHY DON'T YOU TRUST US LOL.

Constantly emphasising how irredeemably shit your primary cast is is not a good idea. Jack + Spike = good, everything else = just as bad as last year.

[Ryushikaze]

The trailer looks atrocious. "It's the end of the world. Let's all have sex!"

That's verbatim, by the way.

At least everyone else in the clip looked suitably disgusted with his suggestion.

[Hillary]

Horrible, simply horrible.

How did Gwen get to be in charge and why did she suddenly turn into a love-lorn teenager around Jack? I don't remember that from series 1 (although I did miss the last few episodes).

Why didn't they just shoot Spike and cut his arm off - he was going to die in the explosion in any case, why let Gwen die with him? Surely that was a better solution than some "confusing DNA" trick that they ripped off from the last series of Doctor Who.

Even the Jack-Spike stuff struggled to keep its head above water.

I really wish to fuck that they'd actually make their minds up over what this show is supposed to be. Gritty drama with aliens? Eastenders in Cardiff? Captain Scarlet spoof?

Martha has truly found her level...

Did like the blowfish in the sportscar though.

[Stark]

Come on, they had plenty of chances to kill Spike but settled for posing like retards before he consistently owned them all. Torchwood has succeeded at one thing, and that's make their entire primary cast consistently appear to be totally useless. They actually needed Jack to show up to just shoot the fishguy! I mean, stand around all night until he falls asleep was a good plan??? And then they try to use 'action' scenes to showcase their 'professionalism' and 'skills', and it's more highschool dialogue about cocks.

I have only recently been able to talk about the scene where they totally destroy Jack's character credibility. I'm sure you all know the one I mean. When I watched it I think my brain just stopped working. The theory that Jack has serious mental issues and has deliberately surrounded himself with targets for his codependency issues gained over nine thousand points.

PS Hillary, in the last ep they shoot Jack in the face. They totally murder him for their own childish, cowardly reasons. It really puts all Gwen's 'zomg u leff us :'(' whining in perspective. I was waiting for the 'try not shooting people in the face' line, but it never came.

[Hillary]

I just checked the thread about last season's finale. There's a rather marvellous quote there from you.

"Frankly, I'm going to laugh my ass off at the second season when they just forget all about the team-destroying events of this season. These people don't just 'not get on' - they HATE and FEAR each other, and have MURDERED and ASSAULTED each other. Nah, not important, more CGI lameness please! Oh, say cock again too that's awesome! "

I've just looked at the plot line from End of Days on Wiki. OMG, WTF?

I'm utterly speechless.

[Stark]

'Sapphire beam of pure semen defeats the devil'. Quality stuff.

Oh and I loved the 'Owen busts the mojo on the useless IT bint' scene. I mean, in the finale they got on so well, and he had so many nice things to say about her emotional stability and professional competence. It's certainly not like she got steamrolled like everyone else in the Owen And Gwen Murder Jack And Destroy The World Because They're Disgusting Children show. I'm glad to see they're getting on so well now. Could there be love in the air?

[NecronLord]

PS Hillary, in the last ep they shoot Jack in the face. They totally murder him for their own childish, cowardly reasons. It really puts all Gwen's 'zomg u leff us :'(' whining in perspective. I was waiting for the 'try not shooting people in the face' line, but it never came.

Presumably the year of being shot every day by the Master has left him so emotionally damaged he thinks they're nice.

[Admiral Valdemar]

I think Jack's just stringing them along until the day when WHAM! He does them all in in the most gruesome and horrible way.

He must hate them so much, that explains why he's fascinated by them and their total inability to do fuck all unless he's there.

[Big Orange]

I'd say the first episode of the second season of Torchwood was slightly better than most of the content in the first season - I really liked Marsters guest character, most the episode was enjoyable, but the core characters are almost as useless as last year, even though they're thankfully not intrinsically to blame for the problem last week. They were dumb in so easily being taken in (then taken out) by Captain John, but they did manage to pull themselves together and tracked Captain John down, so I guess they're not so inept this time round (Owen is the most competent Torchwood Three operative, but I know he is not likeble amongst most viewers). And another major DW faction, the Time Agency, has also folded as well?!

I'm still looking forward to the rest of the season mind.

[Stark]

Maybe people don't like Owen because he's a selfish, amoral murderer who has assaulted every member of the 'team' either physically or emotionally.

Just maybe. He belongs in prison.

[His Divine Shadow]

Maybe people don't like Owen because he's a selfish, amoral murderer who has assaulted every member of the 'team' either physically or emotionally.

Just maybe. He belongs in prison.

I just don't like his hair.

[speaker-to-trolls]

Maybe people don't like Owen because he's a selfish, amoral murderer who has assaulted every member of the 'team' either physically or emotionally.

Just maybe. He belongs in prison.

I just don't like his hair.

I don't like him because he's not only a prick but a horribly ugly prick and all the women in the team still seem to fancy him.

I thought the episode would have been Better Than Average had it been in the last season, but that's not good enough for starting a new series. Oh, and because no one else has mentioned it, Gwens line that was on the trailer ('you can beat, shoot, threaten or even poison us and we keep coming back...' eurgh, fingers are now unclean) was even worse in the show than it was on the trailer.

[Lord Woodlouse]

Pretty much everything Stark says about it is true. They're irritatingly incompetent, they're emotional retards and the TW organisation just seems so laughably scooby-doo like for something that's supposed to be government sponsored. All the same, I'm past caring. It's not the hard-hitting adult show I was expecting (and that they've billed it as), but I still like it. I want to find out about how Martha is taken by TW, I want to know what Gwen's long suffering idiot boyfriend thinks of her job, I want to see what Spike does next... for all I'm sure it makes me exceptionally uncool, and allows globs of mud to be thrown at me for my poor taste, I find this show compulsive viewing (and prepare more globs of mud, because I find it more compulsive viewing than the infinitely more polished Primeval). I'm just taking it for what it is now, train wreck television.

Part of me thinks they know that that's what it is now. There's elements where it's so silly it must obviously be on purpose. My main hope now is that they realise that, and run with it. I don't think the show can realistically re-invent itself into hard hitting adult drama from here.

[Dartzap]

It has the perfect mix of car crash tv: slapstick comedy, gay innuendo and other such things. Don't be worried, Woodlouse, I shall share that mudpie!

By the by, what are the ratings like for Primeval?

[Stark]

I just can't get past how the primary cast are basically evil children. It disgusts me, it doesn't entertain me. People who can muster any actual emotional involvement with such hopeless caricatures should do charity work with drug addicts instead. Maybe people who like it have their lives actually full of such deranged, psychotic baby-humans and thus it's normal for them? Maybe a cast full of hypocrites and bullies reflects modern Britain? I just don't know.

The parts of the episode that were only Jack and Spike were good, but that's largely because Spike was saying 'wow those guys are horrible little gremlin people'.

And S-T-T, everyone likes Owen. He's a murdering, insane bully with delusions of grandeur. What's not to like? The show is so full of healthy relationships, after all.

Wow, maybe that's it. It's emo retard television. It's my-Dad-hates-me entertainment.

[Broomstick]

I just can't get past how the primary cast are basically evil children. It disgusts me, it doesn't entertain me. People who can muster any actual emotional involvement with such hopeless caricatures should do charity work with drug addicts instead.

Speaking as someone who worked at a rehab clinic for 4 years with actual drug addicts... I have to say you're being insulting to the junkies and crackheads, most of which were less damaged and more functional than Torchwood 3. Then again, I was getting paid to be at the clinic, I wasn't doing it for charity so maybe I haven't the viewpoint you're referring to.

Anyhow - my husband kept getting squicked over the gay kissing. It was distracting to have a grown man throw up his hands, squeal "EWWWWWWWWWWWW!" and run around and then out of the room. Only to come back three minutes later wanting a run down on what he had missed once the smooching was over. I pointed out that being straight was no excuse. I am straight and I didn't run out of the room, nor did I get so squicked out by women kissing. Ah, those Issues that one is unaware of... Very annoying. Between that and the accents I did miss some dialog, but fortunately it's not the sort of show where hearing everything is essential.

Apparently the cat is out of the bag about Jack's immortality. #1, he talked about it in front of everyone and #2, no one seemed surprised. Of course, with Torchwood 3 it could just be they're stupid they have comprehended what he said yet. I can fantasize amusing (to me) scenes on par with a Tarantino bloodfest where the various Torchies get pissed at him and shoot him out of irritation or throw him off a roof, basically indulge those evil fantasies we all have because, what the hell, he'll wake up a few hours later good as new. Of course, Jack should get irritated as hell about such inconvenience but he isn't exactly normal.

Jack, in fact, was a little pathetic looking for a date. I'm a little surprise Ianto said yes. Then again, this is Torchwood where people do weird shit for no explicable reason and never pass up a chance for a fucked up human relationship.

Best bit of dialogue, with John lusting after the locals:

Torchie: "But that's a POODLE"
John: "But it's NICE"

Yeah, well, Jack has them fooled I guess, being mostly uptight and sticking largely to bipeds (mostly). I guess John's next rehab is Dog Rehab. Or something. The "How was rehab" line and subsequent bit was probably the second best bit of dialog in the show.

The show is definitely best when it indulges the urge to be camp. They try to be edgy but they aren't. They need to push SOMETHING a little harder, the show still isn't sure what it wants to be. And those "during the break" bits? What the fuck is that? Look, either the show is good or it's not - stop beating me over the head with why YOU think I should like this show.

[Stark]

That actually makes me feel better, re junkies.

Although the hilarious 'big reveal' of Jack's immortality after it was blindingly obvious from episode one was the writing failure that defined season one. They could have had it at least a bit unsure, with each member seeing something that suggested it: but instead first ep, ps I'm dead but now I'm okay.

BRILLIANTLY HANDLED.

[andrewgpaul]

And those "during the break" bits? What the fuck is that? Look, either the show is good or it's not - stop beating me over the head with why YOU think I should like this show.

Huh? Must be a BBC America thing; no breaks here. What are they about?

[Broomstick]

It's like a minute long "behind the scenes" bit in between ads discussing something about the show, the speakers being the actors or, this week, a the producer, talking about how they did this or the reasoning behind that or how wonderfully someone did something. Gagworthy. I mentioned it in a prior Torchwood thread. It really breaks the mood.

[Lord Woodlouse]

It's like a minute long "behind the scenes" bit in between ads discussing something about the show, the speakers being the actors or, this week, a the producer, talking about how they did this or the reasoning behind that or how wonderfully someone did something. Gagworthy. I mentioned it in a prior Torchwood thread. It really breaks the mood.

Sounds like a cut down version of Torchwood Decoded (which is a version of Doctor Who Confidential) a behind the scenes program. They're usually interesting for DW, but it would be annoying to have between "ad breaks". Of course our DW and TW lacks any ad breaks.

[Dartzap]

Yeah, they started putting Torchwood Declassified on after the repeat now. I'm not entirely sure why...

[Flakin]

It's like a minute long "behind the scenes" bit in between ads discussing something about the show, the speakers being the actors or, this week, a the producer, talking about how they did this or the reasoning behind that or how wonderfully someone did something. Gagworthy. I mentioned it in a prior Torchwood thread. It really breaks the mood.

Yeah, it's a BBC America thing. It is small fragments of the Torchwood Declassified that they stick into the commercial breaks.

I agree with it breaking the mood and pace of the show, but as it's originally for a BBC UK audience, it's not really designed to be shown with breaks at all. The 45 minute running time is the only concession to that, so commercial stations like BBC-A can fill the hour with their infomercials.

[Soontir C'boath]

Apparently the cat is out of the bag about Jack's immortality. #1, he talked about it in front of everyone and #2, no one seemed surprised.

Well, Gwen had known about it since the first episode and must've told the team while Jack was gone.