Honour sought for war bear

Rye · Post by **Rye** » 2008-01-25 09:02am

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/scotland/sou ... 208505.stm

A campaign has been launched to build a permanent memorial to a bear which spent much of its life in Scotland - after fighting in World War II.

The bear - named Voytek - was adopted in the Middle East by Polish troops in 1943, becoming much more than a mascot.

The large animal even helped their armed forces to carry ammunition at the Battle of Monte Cassino.

Voytek - known as the Soldier Bear - later lived near Hutton in the Borders and ended his days at Edinburgh Zoo.

He was found wandering in the hills of Iran by Polish soldiers in 1943.

They adopted him and as he grew he was trained to carry heavy mortar rounds.

When Polish forces were deployed to Europe the only way to take the bear with them was to "enlist" him.

So he was given a name, rank and number and took part in the Italian campaign.

He saw action at Monte Cassino before being billeted - along with about 3,000 other Polish troops - at the army camp in the Scottish Borders.

The soldiers who were stationed with him say that he was easy to get along with.

"He was just like a dog - nobody was scared of him," said Polish veteran Augustyn Karolewski, who still lives near the site of the camp.

"He liked a cigarette, he liked a bottle of beer - he drank a bottle of beer like any man."

When the troops were demobilised, Voytek spent his last days at Edinburgh Zoo.

Mr Karolewski went back to see him on a couple of occasions and found he still responded to the Polish language.

"I went to Edinburgh Zoo once or twice when Voytek was there," he said.

"And as soon as I mentioned his name he would sit on his backside and shake his head wanting a cigarette.

"It wasn't easy to throw a cigarette to him - all the attempts I made until he eventually got one."

Voytek was a major attraction at the zoo until his death in 1963.

Eyemouth High School teacher Garry Paulin is now writing a new book, telling the bear's remarkable story.

'Totally amazing'

Local campaigner Aileen Orr would like to see a memorial created at Holyrood to the bear she says was part of both the community and the area's history.

She first heard about Voytek as a child from her grandfather, who served with the King's Own Scottish Borderers.

"I thought he had made it up to be quite honest but it was only when I got married and came here that I knew in fact he was here, Voytek was here," she said.

"When I heard from the community that so few people knew about him I began to actually research the facts.

"It is just amazing, the story is totally amazing."

I don't know what to say, only that I hope he gets it.

Shroom Man 777 · Post by **Shroom Man 777** » 2008-01-25 09:18am

I hope they make a movie out of this. An Iranian war-bear ripping the arms off Nazi scum would be a binillion times awesomer than cutie dog-shit and Garfield crap. Especially if that war-bear is an alcoholic and a chronic smoker.

CmdrWilkens · Post by **CmdrWilkens** » 2008-01-25 09:30am

Shroom Man 777 wrote:I hope they make a movie out of this. An Iranian war-bear ripping the arms off Nazi scum would be a binillion times awesomer than cutie dog-shit and Garfield crap. Especially if that war-bear is an alcoholic and a chronic smoker.

Honestly it sounds better than redoing Rambo again plus you could get Colbert worked up about it being proof of the coming doom for some free publicity.

Sidewinder · Post by **Sidewinder** » 2008-01-25 09:53am

It's like a cartoon come to life!

Post by **K. A. Pital** » 2008-01-25 01:12pm

Badass. We need to start training bear troops. Though I think large reserves of Bear Troops are just hidden somewhere.

Post by **Kuja** » 2008-01-25 01:39pm

Obligatory:

With that out of the way, I have to agree that this sounds like it would make an awesome movie.

Havok · Post by **Havok** » 2008-01-25 03:05pm

Aw man I got all teary eyed reading about Voytek.

I hope he gets all the honor he deserves.

Ritterin Sophia · Post by **Ritterin Sophia** » 2008-01-25 04:52pm

Stas Bush wrote:Badass. We need to start training bear troops. Though I think large reserves of Bear Troops are just hidden somewhere.

So the question is, Kodiak Corps Vs Kanchatka Corps, who will win. I'm betting the patriotic bears of Kodiak Island can take your Commie Ursids any day!

Kodiak · Post by **Kodiak** » 2008-01-25 06:26pm

General Schatten wrote:
Stas Bush wrote:Badass. We need to start training bear troops. Though I think large reserves of Bear Troops are just hidden somewhere.
So the question is, Kodiak Corps Vs Kanchatka Corps, who will win. I'm betting the patriotic bears of Kodiak Island can take your Commie Ursids any day!

My vote is obviously for Kodiak

Phantasee · Post by **Phantasee** » 2008-01-25 08:37pm

So another memorial to be added to the list...

I always wondered if there were more stories like this. WWII was a big war, after all.

For one thing, I never knew there were Polish troops in Iran. Can anyone explain that?

Zablorg · Post by **Zablorg** » 2008-01-25 08:42pm

They gave him cigarettes. I'm not sure if that's funny or cruel.

Rye · Post by **Rye** » 2008-01-25 08:43pm

Zablorg wrote:They gave him cigarettes. I'm not sure if that's funny or cruel.

It was World War 2. They were more stupid when it came to cigarettes back then.

GrandMasterTerwynn · Post by **GrandMasterTerwynn** » 2008-01-25 09:22pm

Phantasee wrote:So another memorial to be added to the list...

I always wondered if there were more stories like this. WWII was a big war, after all.

For one thing, I never knew there were Polish troops in Iran. Can anyone explain that?

A great article about the bear.

An article on Polish history

The Poles were in Iran under the auspices of the Soviet Union.

After the German attack on the Soviet Union (June 1941) and following a Polish-Soviet agreement, General Wladyslaw Anders formed a Polish Army in the USSR. In the spring and summer of 1942, with Stalin's grudging permission, that army was evacuated to Iran. During the liberation of Italy, Anders' army won fame for storming the Monte Casino Monastery (May 1944).

Andrew J. · Post by **Andrew J.** » 2008-01-26 09:49am

General Schatten wrote:
Stas Bush wrote:Badass. We need to start training bear troops. Though I think large reserves of Bear Troops are just hidden somewhere.
So the question is, Kodiak Corps Vs Kanchatka Corps, who will win. I'm betting the patriotic bears of Kodiak Island can take your Commie Ursids any day!

And how would either fare against Canada's Polar Brigade?

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » 2008-01-26 09:51am

Andrew J. wrote:
And how would either fare against Canada's Polar Brigade?

Our Polar Brigade wouldn't get off the ground, the bears would be busy eating their riders.

Ritterin Sophia · Post by **Ritterin Sophia** » 2008-01-26 03:45pm

Andrew J. wrote:
General Schatten wrote:
Stas Bush wrote:Badass. We need to start training bear troops. Though I think large reserves of Bear Troops are just hidden somewhere.
So the question is, Kodiak Corps Vs Kanchatka Corps, who will win. I'm betting the patriotic bears of Kodiak Island can take your Commie Ursids any day!
And how would either fare against Canada's Polar Brigade?

This is the battle of the Giant Brown Bears. We'll get your Canuckistani Polar bears after we find out who wins in this contest.

Gil Hamilton · Post by **Gil Hamilton** » 2008-01-26 03:51pm

Zablorg wrote:They gave him cigarettes. I'm not sure if that's funny or cruel.

Of course they gave him beer and smokes. He was one of the boys, after all, bear or not.

Phantasee · Post by **Phantasee** » 2008-01-26 03:54pm

Gil Hamilton wrote:
Zablorg wrote:They gave him cigarettes. I'm not sure if that's funny or cruel.
Of course they gave him beer and smokes. He was one of the boys, after all, bear or not.

Do you suppose that he got some of the action from the ladies, too? Or did he stick to being a wingbear?

Julhelm · Post by **Julhelm** » 2008-01-26 04:22pm

I have a book about this bear by W.A. Lasocki & Geoffrey Morgan.

The Duchess of Zeon · Post by **The Duchess of Zeon** » 2008-01-26 05:01pm

Zuul wrote:
Zablorg wrote:They gave him cigarettes. I'm not sure if that's funny or cruel.
It was World War 2. They were more stupid when it came to cigarettes back then.

Beyond that. I was told stories by older relatives in my family of how there was this really cheap brand of cigarettes available which all the guys hated so much that none were purchased in the Cantines, in favour of higher quality stuff like Lucky Strikes or Abdullahs. So to get rid of the stocks of them, they made it mandatory that you had to leave the cantine with a whole carton of the things (for free) whenever you made a purchase. There was this one guy in the unit who liked them, though, so he'd just come after closing and get a bunch of cartons out of the garbage where most of the men immediately tossed them!

PeZook · Post by **PeZook** » 2008-01-28 03:20am

Gil Hamilton wrote: Of course they gave him beer and smokes. He was one of the boys, after all, bear or not.

Besides, I think he ate them, not smoked them.

As for Polish troops in Iran, gen. Vlad Anders (heh) formed the first Polish units in the USSR after being released from prison. However,the Polish corps was chronically underequipped and underfed, and Anders secured permission to evacuate them partially into Iran. Overall, about 100 thousand troops made it there,and later participated in fighting in North Africa and Italy. Most of them never saw Poland again.

It's a big thing for Poles, the epistome of the "Wandering soldier" mythos that WWII created.

Phantasee · Post by **Phantasee** » 2008-01-28 11:48am

PeZook wrote:As for Polish troops in Iran, gen. Vlad Anders (heh) formed the first Polish units in the USSR after being released from prison. However,the Polish corps was chronically underequipped and underfed, and Anders secured permission to evacuate them partially into Iran. Overall, about 100 thousand troops made it there,and later participated in fighting in North Africa and Italy. Most of them never saw Poland again.

It's a big thing for Poles, the epistome of the "Wandering soldier" mythos that WWII created.

Did most of them not see Poland again because they died in the fighting? Or because they couldn't go home after? The history of that part of the world is like a big dark hole to me, I've never really seen a lot about it.

Netko · Post by **Netko** » 2008-01-28 12:11pm

I'm not certain (I know this is what happened to the Western organized Free Polish, but not whether it applies to this Anders guy), but I believe because the post-war communist puppet government wanted no troublemakers with delusions of grandeur and democracy. Especially not high-profile nationalistic Poles that would attempt to rally support for an independent Poland that isn't a Soviet satellite.

PeZook · Post by **PeZook** » 2008-01-29 02:42am

Phantasee wrote: Did most of them not see Poland again because they died in the fighting? Or because they couldn't go home after? The history of that part of the world is like a big dark hole to me, I've never really seen a lot about it.

Pretty much what Netko said ; The post-war communist government was really paranoid about "antirevolutionary elements" coming back, and Polish soldiers who fought alongside western armies were "contaminated", so to speak. Plus, a lot of their officers were educated and raised before the war, in the II Polish Republic, and were naturally undesirable in the new order of things. So they stayed in Britain, France, US and Canada, and died there. Fortunately, later on when Polish government was no longer Stalinist, they were allowed to visit sometimes.

Some soldiers actually did go home ; and out of those, some were even left alone. However, no higher officer ever decided to go back,and for quite some time it wasn't even acknowledged that Poles fought in the western front, or that a non-communist partisan movement existed in occupied Poland. It started to change after Stalin died, but it's still practically impossible to get an unbiased book about WWII published between 1945 and 1983