Just saw Jumper

[K. A. Pital]

The stealing isn't what I had the problem with, more the murder.

Okay, please explain to me how those two folks who were transported into a combat zone in Chechnya [was it really? implications below] weren't killed by the act? That's a warzone where the life expectancy of civilians runs to zero; the Jumpers just went out, leaving those guys in the warzone (if not dead already, I'm still not sure about the tank episode).

[as a side note, the movie takes place in either 1994 or 1999 chronologically]

How was the bus driver at least not badly injured along with the bus? It was still driving when he took it!

So it seems that Griffin at least isn't that concerned about side casualties and collateral deaths.

And it's not murder - he didn't deliberately aim to kill them, right, if they died that's more like deadly neglience or manslaughter.

[Tanasinn]

So what if the jumpers do not care about the fate of the teleported - considering Griffin is waging a real war against Paladins, it seems pretty simple that he can accept casualties?

There's a pretty serious difference between "accepting" casualties and causing them out of total indifference.

And the car chase in Tokyo probably didnt hurt anyone, since any major accident was avoid via teleportation.

Sure, the "heroes" avoid being in any accident, but we do see multiple cars spin out trying to avoid the maniac before he teleports. I find it a stretch to believe that, especially in a city as busy as Tokyo, there would be no injuries (at the very least).

As for the stealing, I've got to say I have a problem with that, too. I have a hard time taking people who live like parasites as anything but parasites. No wonder they've got vigilante religious lunatics after them, if all they do is steal and hop around crowded city streets for kicks.

[K. A. Pital]

No wonder they've got vigilante religious lunatics after them, if all they do is steal and hop around crowded city streets for kicks.

Actually Roland says something to that effect as one of the reasons he hates them; and then he says that all of them are the same and can't change their lifestyles, whereupon Anakin takes him on and proves that he "can be good" by saving the girl. Or so I understood.

[Ford Prefect]

They're hardly antiheroes, especially since Griffin seemed to be kind of crazy because of all he'd been through (probably being hunted by Paladins since childhood) and David was downright heroic.

When it comes down to it Griffin is certain that life isn't fair. As he tries to tell David, his parents were killed when he was five, and its implied that he was there at the time. The simple fact of the matter that Griffin just doesn't care about other people; it's supposed to be ambiguous, after all, when he causes those people to die. The Paladins are the bad guys, in the sense that they're comitting what is essentially genocide for primarily religious reasons ... however, the movie gives us cause to wonder whether or not the Jumpers really deserve to get off without any consequences, because they, like actual people, do bad things themselves. Griffin is an extreme, because he's fighting his own personal war, but I can see where Roland's coming from. In that regard, we see their motivation going from 'only God should have this power' to 'only God has the responsibility to use this power'.

What do you know, moral ambiguity. That's a nice touch.

[Adrian Laguna]

How was the bus driver at least not badly injured along with the bus? It was still driving when he took it!

I think the fact that he got dumped in the middle of the Sahara to be more relevant to his survival.

The Paladins are the bad guys, in the sense that they're comitting what is essentially genocide for primarily religious reasons.

I think the Paladins are doing the right thing for the wrong reasons. It's all nice and all to cheer the mutants, psychics, and jumpers in fiction, but when I think about them existing in real life, I can't help but believe they should all be exterminated as quickly and efficiently as possible.

[Molyneux]

I think the Paladins are doing the right thing for the wrong reasons. It's all nice and all to cheer the mutants, psychics, and jumpers in fiction, but when I think about them existing in real life, I can't help but believe they should all be exterminated as quickly and efficiently as possible.

...well, how nice of you.
Why on earth would you believe that? What could make you think that slaughtering hundreds or thousands of innocent children and teenagers could be at all a defensible route?

[Ford Prefect]

The Paladins are the bad guys, in the sense that they're comitting what is essentially genocide for primarily religious reasons.

I think the Paladins are doing the right thing for the wrong reasons. It's all nice and all to cheer the mutants, psychics, and jumpers in fiction, but when I think about them existing in real life, I can't help but believe they should all be exterminated as quickly and efficiently as possible.

The Paladins are doing the wrong thing. While Roland may be somewhat justified in his belief that Jumpers tend to be irresponsible, we can not take their pogroms of Jumper-extermination as being the right thing to do. Ignoring for a moment their methods result in just as many civillian killings, if not more, you really have to ask yourself if the potential to go bad is really good enough reason to wipe them out entirely.

[18-Till-I-Die]

Molyneux:

Well, lets be honest, in the real world people like the Jumpers would probably cut out their own fiefdoms and there would be very little mankind could do, provided they ever organize. What jail can hold these people? What kind of handcuffs do you put on them? They could, pretty much, do anything they wish anytime they wish with, at best, few consequences...at worst they'd be untouchable.

Same with, for example, Mutants. Only more so, since Mutants have a vast array of abilities. I'm just saying, if there were real people like Hiro, Clair or Sylar from Heroes running around...we'd be fucked as a species. I imagine we'd have the same look on our faces that the Dodo birds did when they met an impossibly advanced, superior race dead-set on their extermination.

In fact, i'd say that Laguna's idea is fairly stupid (i don't mean that as an insult), but not for the reasons you're saying. I agree with him, actually, but i think it'd be stupid to piss the superhumans off by being so open about their extermination...a more covert, Slayer-like secret society (kind of like the Paladins, in fact) would be preferable. Plausable denial and all that.

[Battlehymn Republic]

Yeah. Once again, Paladins are just the Jumper version of Slayers, Hunters, Blade Runners, and whatever. Certainly the people behind them are fanatic, callous sumbitches, and their policies are certainly not to be supported, but their rationale does have some sense to them, though it's hidden under all of the religious gobbledy-gook. I am a bit disappointed that they decided to make Paladins apparently Catholic inquisitors/militant knights. Vatican-bashing went out with the failed Golden Compass movie. Just make them vanilla Highlander-Watcher-type hunters, and focus on the fighting.

[Gullible Jones]

I think the Paladins are doing the right thing for the wrong reasons. It's all nice and all to cheer the mutants, psychics, and jumpers in fiction, but when I think about them existing in real life, I can't help but believe they should all be exterminated as quickly and efficiently as possible.

Funnily enough, Adrian, some might say the same thing about people like you.

[SylasGaunt]

Samuel L. Paladin stabbed that one Jumper that they had caught in the jungle. Also, while we never see it, it's heavily implied that Griffin has just returned from killing a Paladin by dropping him into the ocean at one point.

The point is that it's self defense not murder. The Paladins have stated that their purpose is to hunt down and exterminate every jumper on the planet. Fighting the people trying to genocide you doesn't count in my book.

(if not dead already, I'm still not sure about the tank episode).

The guy in the truck got out at least. We see Griffin look back at the truck and he goes' where'd you go?'. He could have been talking about

How was the bus driver at least not badly injured along with the bus? It was still driving when he took it!

Nobody seems to be crawling out of the bus so I'm guess Griffin might have removed the driver (I couldn't see anyone inside but then I didn't get a ton of time to look either).


How was the bus driver at least not badly injured along with the bus? It was still driving when he took it!

[Ford Prefect]

The driver is still inside the bus (he's still driving) when Griffin jumps it, though I didn't actually spot any passengers.

[PREDATOR490]

Overall, I would say it dosent matter if there was a driver in it or not. The point is the guy jumped there expecting to pick up something to hurl and he picked a road which indicates he wanted to hurl a moving vehicle.
Since most moving vehicles tend to have people driving them then he obviously has no concern for the lives of the people he could kill in his actions.

Basically, the pair of them were selfish pricks against religious nutters and they both are in the wrong. I wouldnt mind knowing how the hell Jumpers have managed to remain 'hidden' given the talent they have for being less than modest with their abilities. I find it hard to believe a bank wont have security footage or a magical car jumping from spot to spot wont be got on a dozen traffic cameras.

[Vympel]

I wouldnt mind knowing how the hell Jumpers have managed to remain 'hidden' given the talent they have for being less than modest with their abilities. I find it hard to believe a bank wont have security footage

Security footage of what? Just dress in dark clothes and keep the lights off, like in the movie. Who knows how the hell you got in there. No rational person is going to leap to "he teleported in!"

or a magical car jumping from spot to spot wont be got on a dozen traffic cameras.

I don't see any reason to believe Griffin does that regularly for laughs. Did you see his hideout?

[Beowulf]

In any case, what would the traffic cameras see? A stolen car with a pair of gaijin inside. Good luck getting any leads with that. Or having all the people witnessing it not be labeled as having a mass hallucination.