WH40K questions.

Lord Revan · Post by **Lord Revan** » 2008-02-26 05:27am

btw question about the Falled (the Dark Angels ones that is), in current time are they CSMs who use the pre-heresy Dark Angels colors or are they something between chaos and loyalists?

on the related question has there been any know CSM chapter or legion (excluding the Alpha Legion) who essentially had been "cursed" so that no matter what they did they would end up in the chaos forces.

loomer · Post by **loomer** » 2008-02-26 06:07am

The Fallen are something unusual, in that some are basically CSMs, some are true loyalists, and most are just Fallen, not one or the other.

Lancer · Post by **Lancer** » 2008-02-26 11:05am

The Fallen aren't true loyalists, any of those would have been purged by Luthor's command before El'Johnsons return to Caliban. You may have the occasional repentant (though there isn't any listed in the fluff), but by and large the Fallen are sneaky bastards who follwed Luthor when he turned to chaos, and could give the Alpha legion a run for their money.

Of course, there are some individuals who may or may not be of the Fallen.

What I'd like to see is more information on the Space Wolves during the Crusade era. It's unlikely, as the Wolves don't have as tragic legacy like the Blood Angels or Thousand Sons (and now the Alpha Legion), nor do they possess some shameful secret like the Dark Angels; they're a well-documented, WISIWYG chapter.

loomer · Post by **loomer** » 2008-02-27 05:25am

The Space Wolves do have their tragic (and at the same time, fucking metal) legacy, though. The Wulfen, and the 13th Company.

Darth Tanner · Post by **Darth Tanner** » 2008-02-27 08:20am

The heresy is in building themselves a self aware robot.

Are the robots constructed by the STC in First and Only self aware? Would Gaunt have destroyed it if it hadn't of been corrupted by chaos?

Not wanting to start a new thread...

How do chaos ships navigate the warp? Do they use the Astronomican or do they have some other means of navigating? Do they keep their gellar fields up to keep out their own masters/slaves or do the things in the warp leave them alone?

Do chaos fleets have an easier time of navigating the warp seeing as the warp itself would be more friendly to them or are they in the same boat as the Imperium?

Also another cheeky question to add in, do any of the books cover the Thousand Sons in any depth? I'd imagine they are mentioned heavily in the Horus books but are any of them specifically about the Thousand Sons chapter?

loomer · Post by **loomer** » 2008-02-27 08:24am

The Chaos marines move through the Warp far more easily than basically anyone else, and have no need for the Astronomicon.

Post by **NecronLord** » 2008-02-27 09:44am

Darth Tanner wrote:Are the robots constructed by the STC in First and Only self aware? Would Gaunt have destroyed it if it hadn't of been corrupted by chaos?

Yes. The Iron Men reputedly rebelled, which implies intelligence. At the least, thier controlling intelligences (Stone Men, or whatever they were) were.

Depends on how pragmatic he was. Combat robots are a viable weapon - the Eldar used them back in the day, as did humanity. On the other hand, he might have been fanatical enough to do it anyway. If they weren't corrupted, such a thing doubtless woudn't have been his call - he's just a grunt. They'd likely bring some Archmagos Ultima or Magos Prime in to determine whether or not they're heresy.

The Emperor didn't approve of such things, though, for whatever reason. Perhaps they're liable to chaos, perhaps he just didn't trust robots.

How do chaos ships navigate the warp? Do they use the Astronomican or do they have some other means of navigating? Do they keep their gellar fields up to keep out their own masters/slaves or do the things in the warp leave them alone?

Demon! I want to go here! Drive the ship!

Do chaos fleets have an easier time of navigating the warp seeing as the warp itself would be more friendly to them or are they in the same boat as the Imperium?

About even, I'd think. Logically, chaos would be better, but there's little evidence of this making a difference in practive.

Also another cheeky question to add in, do any of the books cover the Thousand Sons in any depth? I'd imagine they are mentioned heavily in the Horus books but are any of them specifically about the Thousand Sons chapter?

Not that I'm aware of. Yet.

The Grim Squeaker · Post by **The Grim Squeaker** » 2008-02-27 09:52am

Necronl wrote: The Emperor didn't approve of such things, though, for whatever reason. Perhaps they're liable to chaos, perhaps he just didn't trust robots.

According to the "Visions of the Heresy", it's due to the Robot rebellions of the past. (Although there could easily be other reasons).

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » 2008-02-27 10:01am

Darth Tanner wrote:
Also another cheeky question to add in, do any of the books cover the Thousand Sons in any depth? I'd imagine they are mentioned heavily in the Horus books but are any of them specifically about the Thousand Sons chapter?

Nothing on them in the HH series, yet. The Space Wolf series involves them quite a bit.

Darth Tanner · Post by **Darth Tanner** » 2008-02-27 10:09am

Nothing on them in the HH series, yet. The Space Wolf series involves them quite a bit.

Ah good, I've got their omnibus on order.

Demon! I want to go here! Drive the ship

How serious is your answer here? Would a chaos warship (the non demon possessed variety) have a demon/warp essence to control it instead of the myriad computer control systems and crew of an imperial ship? Or does the demon simply take the place of the astronimicon and navigators guild member.

Aaron · Post by **Aaron** » 2008-02-27 10:14am

Darth Tanner wrote:
How serious is your answer here? Would a chaos warship (the non demon possessed variety) have a demon/warp essence to control it instead of the myriad computer control systems and crew of an imperial ship? Or does the demon simply take the place of the astronimicon and navigators guild member.

Dark Adeptus has ships being crewed by enslaved Daemons as if they were human crew as well as a ship that is crewed by one massive Daemon.

Falkenhayn · Post by **Falkenhayn** » 2008-02-27 07:53pm

Darth Tanner wrote:
How serious is your answer here? Would a chaos warship (the non demon possessed variety) have a demon/warp essence to control it instead of the myriad computer control systems and crew of an imperial ship? Or does the demon simply take the place of the astronimicon and navigators guild member.

In the Execution Hour/Shadow Point duology, a traitor Imperial Captain was mutated by Chaos and physically fused with his ship's systems. He is aided in warp navigation by sorcerers and bound demonic navigators. With such favor, he can ask the demons in the warp what the fastest way to travel is. He can use the powers of whatever demonic patrons, bound entities, or a Chaos God to speed his passage or compel help from the Warp.

Their are specific demon-ships, crewed entirely by bound demons or a greater demon, as stated by previously. A navigator is just a human psyker attuned to the Warp. Demons are created in the warp, inhabit it, and draw on its power for their existence. They have typically resided in the Warp for millions of years, if not billions, and know its vagrancies far better than any human psyker ever can.

Chaos is also very high on technological assimilation and techno-arcane fusion. For example, raiders of the Infidel Class contain targetting and fire control technology of alien manufacture. Likewise, the Eisenhorn trilogy mentions numerous alien races and artifacts that utlize pacts with demons to enhance already advanced technology. It is quite possible that chaos captains modify their ships with whatever technology or sorcery or combination thereof to increase performance.