"The Language of Autism" and "Being an Unpers

[Warsie]

add-on:

"

We consider as 'Autie-Friendly' those businesses who:

- Cater for special diets common to many people on the autistic spectrum and a source of current social limitation.

- Have an establishment that welcomes people on the Autistic Spectrum and their families to enjoy their hospitality, goods or services.

- Have goods, services or establishments that cater to the social, communication, sensory or information processing differences of people on the spectrum without demeaning these people by treating them as 'conditions' (ie we won't be listing businesses primarily purporting 'cures' for autism).

- Those who are equal opportunities employers who consider people on the Autistic Spectrum as employable within their own businesses in whatever way, large or small.

- Those with a business or employable skill or service who identify strongly with the Autism Spectrum community and overtly demonstrate a respect for its members."

and some other stuff listed at

http://www.auties.org/faq/

[FSTargetDrone]

Her actions may have profound meaning to her, but how can the everyday, "normal" person be expected to comprehend them? It looks like chaos.

If she is speaking a language no one else can understand, she may as well be speaking gibberish.

Other autists can understand what she said and they can communicate that way.

But autistic people do not make up the majority of society. And how can we be sure that other autistic people do understand her?

[FSTargetDrone]

Just saw your new posts...

I don't think anyone here is advocating treating autistic people any better or worse than "normal" people, it's just that trying to accommodate any number of different kinds of autistic people's methods of communication in society in general seems daunting to say the least.

[Warsie]

But autistic people do not make up the majority of society.

neither do native americans, or people who speak AAVE ("Ebonics")

And how can we be sure that other autistic people do understand her?

http://www.jamesmw.com/sixrules.htm

[[R_H]]

[quote="[R_H]"And then of course "About Asperger's in general, I'd like to comment that I never really identified as having it until I started to learn some basic social signaling and realized just how bad my problems had been.". Uhuh, he's got Aspergers alright.

Doesn't the last post kind've support him?

Also haha I got the Transhumanism avatar you had
[/quote]

Please elaborate on how the last post supports him? That these "cultures" exist because they in no way affect the vast majority?

[Warsie]

Just saw your new posts...

I don't think anyone here is advocating treating autistic people any better or worse than "normal" people,

k

it's just that trying to accommodate any number of different kinds of autistic people's methods of communication in society in general seems daunting to say the least.

Hence why they try to deal with the problem ("workaround or solution") being vocalization devices, or simply typing all their work (problem for me; shitty writing). And that is where the people who are like that simply form their own communities and help each other.

[Warsie]

Please elaborate on how the last post supports him? That these "cultures" exist because they in no way affect the vast majority?

"I never really identified as having it". That sounds like more than a self-diagnosis. It seems to mean something else. Though I may be "looking into that too deeply". Besides, 'self-diagnosed' people are welcomed equally into their communities.

[[R_H]]

Please elaborate on how the last post supports him? That these "cultures" exist because they in no way affect the vast majority?

"I never really identified as having it". That sounds like more than a self-diagnosis. It seems to mean something else. Though I may be "looking into that too deeply". Besides, 'self-diagnosed' people are welcomed equally into their communities.

Oh, so you think self-diagnosis is acceptable by those that aren't qualified to do so?

[Mr Bean]

Autistic people are not different but the same, in that line of logic Warsie lies the separate but equal.

You might not like the idea that Autism is a disorder, not a condition, it is not equivalent to being tall or Germanic, it's not a matter of eye color or amount of body hair. It's a disorder, it impairs your ability to function in a normal human society.

You might not like the idea an attribute benefits to the disorder claiming it's a net-positive. It's not, science has yet to demonstrate that autism itself provides any benefits. They have however noted that Autism increase the probability of mental retardation to a great extent, in fact Autistic individuals are hugely more likely to be mentally challenged than the average population.

It is a disorder, at best it is a condition, a firmly negative condition. In time science may develop a treatment to offset the symptoms or even a cure to remove it from existence. If not at some point our knowledge of genes will have advance sufficiently to remove it from the population at large.


As for your purpose for Autistic rights, that leads pretty much like a area already covered in our laws. Disabled rights.

[Vehrec]

However the comparison to gay pride I think is a bad one. There is no "pride" in being Autistic, no more than their can be "pride" in being blind. It's simply a condition, a negative one as far as society and science are concern and one that can hopefully be corrected when science and genetic research have advanced far enough.

You ever heard of that Deaf Culture shit that actually has the balls to compare giving hearing aids to deaf children to the efforts to develop a "cure" for black people to rid them of their "affliction"? Well, some fucking idiots are already starting up an Autistic culture that says it's wrong to give autistic people therapy that help them assimilate with the "non-Auties" culture.

I hear you man. There is this guy I have to deal in a bookclub with who loves to make long rants about how "NTs" are the evil, forcing him to conform to their unfair "NT" world. He also esposes that the world would be 'much more scientific' if it was totally populated by Autistics. All I want him to do is shut up about how awesome autistic people are and stop lableing people!

What is this crap about special diets? The only special diets I knkow of Autism spectrum persons being on is the 'mac and chesee' diet where they refuse to eat anything but one or two meals or demand something like catchup with everything.

The fact that there is workplace discrimination against autistics is sad, but understandable. Autisctics can be distracting for other employees, or hard to work with. Some stuttuer, have long pauses in their speach, or are otherwise difficult to communicate with. The long and short of the matter is that human interactions-normal and otherwise- are a huge part of any job. If you can't deal with other people, it does hurt your chances of getting employed, and I don't see that as descrimination, I see it as good business sense.

[Warsie]

Oh, so you think self-diagnosis is acceptable by those that aren't qualified to do so?

I never stated what I said was 'acceptable'. I said many in the community was accepting of them as comrades.

You might not like the idea that Autism is a disorder, not a condition, it is not equivalent to being tall or Germanic, it's not a matter of eye color or amount of body hair. It's a disorder, it impairs your ability to function in a normal human society.

remember what they said about homosexuality? It hampers your ability to function in a "normal human society" (whatever that is). And what is a "normal human society", who determines that?

anyway. "All autism involves a certain level of disability, difference, and sometimes giftedness. "
http://www.jamesmw.com/cataclysm1.htm

You might not like the idea an attribute benefits to the disorder claiming it's a net-positive. It's not, science has yet to demonstrate that autism itself provides any benefits. They have however noted that Autism increase the probability of mental retardation to a great extent, in fact Autistic individuals are hugely more likely to be mentally challenged than the average population.

And I remember similar things said dealing with Eugenics, correct? Scientists said similar things about 'inferior genes' and claimed that it was linked to non-caucasian races. As a matter of fact, the 'nordic' idea came from Eugenics theories and research-perpetuated by scientists. So we can't necessarily say science is everything; they can be just as biased as others.

It is a disorder, at best it is a condition, a firmly negative condition.

And what gives you the right to determine what is a 'negative' condition or not?

In time science may develop a treatment to offset the symptoms or even a cure to remove it from existence. If not at some point our knowledge of genes will have advance sufficiently to remove it from the population at large.

you then take away many of the people who look at things from alternative perspectives rather than the "common sense" crap we hear all the time.

As for your purpose for Autistic rights, that leads pretty much like a area already covered in our laws. Disabled rights.

That still does not necessarily deal with social stigmas.

[Cairber]

I know DAN! doctors will put autistic kids on extremely restrictive diets as a part of the "cure" for autism. I know it is gluten and casein free, but I really haven't looked to much into what they claim this will do.

[[R_H]]

Oh, so you think self-diagnosis is acceptable by those that aren't qualified to do so?

I never stated what I said was 'acceptable'. I said many in the community was accepting of them as comrades.

Do you see the same problem that I see with that? IMO, accepting those who self-diagnosis trivialises autistic individuals and the community.

[SirNitram]

Oh, so you think self-diagnosis is acceptable by those that aren't qualified to do so?

I never stated what I said was 'acceptable'. I said many in the community was accepting of them as comrades.

Then they are belittling their own travails and deserve to be mocked. You start letting in any idiot who can fake mild Aspies and you have lowered the bar until we are just the ones who 'act out'.

You might not like the idea that Autism is a disorder, not a condition, it is not equivalent to being tall or Germanic, it's not a matter of eye color or amount of body hair. It's a disorder, it impairs your ability to function in a normal human society.

remember what they said about homosexuality? It hampers your ability to function in a "normal human society" (whatever that is). And what is a "normal human society", who determines that?

Except, of course, that our inability to function in a normal human society is a real, actual thing, not prejudice. We cannot function properly in social situations, we have crippling other problems, and we must deal with this every single day.

The normal is the average, you stupid, stupid, inbred, fuck. Averages are numerical; even half-rate Aspie HFA's can work out the godsdamned average. If you're too stupid to work it out, I think you're not actually Aut; we have natural skill at math and analysis. If you're too proud, you are the enemy of everyone with this who fights to be held as normal.

anyway. "All autism involves a certain level of disability, difference, and sometimes giftedness. "
http://www.jamesmw.com/cataclysm1.htm

Note the conditional on the giftedness before you ever claim this isn't a crippling disability.

You might not like the idea an attribute benefits to the disorder claiming it's a net-positive. It's not, science has yet to demonstrate that autism itself provides any benefits. They have however noted that Autism increase the probability of mental retardation to a great extent, in fact Autistic individuals are hugely more likely to be mentally challenged than the average population.

And I remember similar things said dealing with Eugenics, correct? Scientists said similar things about 'inferior genes' and claimed that it was linked to non-caucasian races. As a matter of fact, the 'nordic' idea came from Eugenics theories and research-perpetuated by scientists. So we can't necessarily say science is everything; they can be just as biased as others.

Ah, you use racism as a fig leaf? Except we are bad copies. We lose function that is vital to any social/pack species like humanity. You deal with it. As best you can, every day. You accept it is a disability and you fight back.

It is a disorder, at best it is a condition, a firmly negative condition.

And what gives you the right to determine what is a 'negative' condition or not?

A lifetime of being and working with others who are on the Spectrum, inbred fucker. Living on my own despite it. Holding down work, getting married, supporting a wife, despite it. And knowing the full costs every damn day.

In time science may develop a treatment to offset the symptoms or even a cure to remove it from existence. If not at some point our knowledge of genes will have advance sufficiently to remove it from the population at large.

you then take away many of the people who look at things from alternative perspectives rather than the "common sense" crap we hear all the time.

Good. You aren't actually on the Spectrum, are you? You're one of those over-diagnosed non-cases. No one whose ever gone out into the world and tried to live without Mommy and Daddy holding your hands, without precisely constructed special workplaces, and without enough medication to stun a Bull Elephant.

As for your purpose for Autistic rights, that leads pretty much like a area already covered in our laws. Disabled rights.

That still does not necessarily deal with social stigmas.

You know how people like me deal with social stigmas? We disavow cretins like you who whine. We fight and we fit in as best we can and we explain to people the reality: That we are broken but still function. We do not hide behind the fig leaves of comparing believing our disability to, shock, be a disability, behind the fig leaves of homophobia and racism.

Get out of my sight before you whine again.

[SirNitram]

I know DAN! doctors will put autistic kids on extremely restrictive diets as a part of the "cure" for autism. I know it is gluten and casein free, but I really haven't looked to much into what they claim this will do.

I at least adapted myself to a restricted diet. I believe it's normal. I cannot speak for everyone.

[Mr Bean]

remember what they said about homosexuality? It hampers your ability to function in a "normal human society" (whatever that is). And what is a "normal human society", who determines that?

Bullshit
Homosexuality is not a "condition" it's a preference(Personal or genetic) for sexual partner's, unless you say wear a cape with a big "H" on the back and carry a rainbow flag around, Homosexuality is not obvious status. Unless you greet everyone with Hello I am a Homosexual how are you?

And I remember similar things said dealing with Eugenics, correct? Scientists said similar things about 'inferior genes' and claimed that it was linked to non-caucasian races. As a matter of fact, the 'nordic' idea came from Eugenics theories and research-perpetuated by scientists. So we can't necessarily say science is everything; they can be just as biased as others.

Oh wait! Eugenics was based off bullshit, therefor all science is bullshit! It's so clearer that you explained it that way.

Or you shove that bullshit back up arse. Eugenics has nothing to do with this. It was bullshit back then, it's still bullshit now.

And what gives you the right to determine what is a 'negative' condition or not?

I have no fucking right, neither do you. However the Medical and Scientific community has every right, and they after reviewing the evidence, after running hundreds of peer reviewed studies, after examining thousands of papers published in peer-reviewed journals, they have determined that Autism is a Neurological Disorder.

you then take away many of the people who look at things from alternative perspectives rather than the "common sense" crap we hear all the time.

Again you have a serious issue accepting you have a disorder, it's not common sense, it's not an simple cultural traidition. It is hordes of doctors and scientists running tests and determine that Autism is a purely negative condition, best removed from the human population.

That still does not necessarily deal with social stigmas.

Then you need social change, not laws. Unless you want Autism linked into hate crime laws your asking for special privileges

[Zablorg]

However the comparison to gay pride I think is a bad one. There is no "pride" in being Autistic, no more than their can be "pride" in being blind. It's simply a condition, a negative one as far as society and science are concern and one that can hopefully be corrected when science and genetic research have advanced far enough.

I think they'll hold a negative light when you try to 'cure' them of who they are. And the whole 'negative' condition is society's bias towards those who think differently.

Well, some fucking idiots are already starting up an Autistic culture that says it's wrong to give autistic people therapy that help them assimilate with the "non-Auties" culture.

You have a problem with people standing up for their rights? You wouldn't like it if you were forced 'therapy' to fit in with the mainstream because you acted or thought differently, would you?

Fuck you. A very large majority need the therapy in order to get anywhere in society.

Her actions may have profound meaning to her, but how can the everyday, "normal" person be expected to comprehend them? It looks like chaos.

If she is speaking a language no one else can understand, she may as well be speaking gibberish.

Other autists can understand what she said and they can communicate that way.

I beg to differ. But since I doubt you have anything to back this up...

That the experience isn't exactly fun for the autistic people themselfs,

many of them are autistic themselves.

Yes. Many autistics are autistics themselves. You win a cookie.

and that employers don't give a shit whether you're "special" or not, so long as you get the job done. Which they won't be able in most cases unless they recieve social intergration through their development.

Form their owm companies and business? Self-determination?

I dare you to find me exactly how many autistics grow up to be successful without help in their developement, asshole.

Seriously, there aren't many perks to being autistic, save perhaps a hightened perception of things and often an abnormal level of interest in a particual field. And while those qualities may provide certain talents they may otherwise not have, and the end of the day no-one really gives a shit whether you can recite the periodic table backwards.

mathematics? sciences? Don't many fields have a intense specialization?

'Cept, ya know, there's the problem with a) no-one understanding what they are trying to communicate, and b) a great deal of skills won't be marketable.

a group that actively objects to autistics intergation into society?

Society shunns them, makes fun of them, etc. Why should they surrender to a entity that hates them?

Why should Mr. Employerpants have to deal with his employee pissing on his desk? Once more, they need this integration into functional society, you dick.

Those kids aren't going to last 2 days in the real world if their ideals were pushed forward, especially in these times when a good paying job is more needed then ever.

They can form their own communities? IIRC some of them are doing that.

Yes, because forming a community is going to really really help them, isn't it.

I realize that most of the examples I gave refer to low-functioning autistics, but that's more the people I think need the help more.[/i]

[Rogue 9]

I have been diagnosed with Asperger's syndrome. You know how I fucking deal with it? I take that famous attention span and ability to specialize in a subject and apply it to human communication, learning through study what so-called neurotypicals naturally absorb in early childhood. I do not deal with it by fucking whining about it and demanding special treatment. Your behavior is disgraceful, Warsie.

Doubly so because not all autistics are capable of learning to deal with normal society. It is undeniably a disorder, a negative condition that severely impairs the victims' ability to operate on a day-to-day basis; that it has some positive traits (specialist learning capacity and memory only sometimes among them) does not change that one whit. Hemming and hawing about it is useless, stupid, and ultimately counterproductive.

[Warsie]

Ah, you use racism as a fig leaf? Except we are bad copies. We lose function that is vital to any social/pack species like humanity. You deal with it. As best you can, every day. You accept it is a disability and you fight back.

And did I deny that? No.

A lifetime of being and working with others who are on the Spectrum, inbred fucker. Living on my own despite it. Holding down work, getting married, supporting a wife, despite it. And knowing the full costs every damn day.

I'm autistic myself, you dickhead so you should shut the fuck up about claiming to speak for everyone.

Good. You aren't actually on the Spectrum, are you? You're one of those over-diagnosed non-cases. No one whose ever gone out into the world and tried to live without Mommy and Daddy holding your hands, without precisely constructed special workplaces, and without enough medication to stun a Bull Elephant.

1. I never said where I was autistic or not, assclown.
2. Awww...gotta make shit up like a bitch ehh? since you brought it up, actually I've been diagnosed by a psychologist you fucker.

You know how people like me deal with social stigmas? We disavow cretins like you who whine.

Translation: You act like a bitch. And you are being a bitch. And you speak for everyone, which you fucking don't.

We fight and we fit in as best we can and we explain to people the reality: That we are broken but still function. We do not hide behind the fig leaves of comparing believing our disability to, shock, be a disability, behind the fig leaves of homophobia and racism.

"We are broken but still function". And you bitch about me 'whining'? I didn't start this shit.

Except, of course, that our inability to function in a normal human society is a real, actual thing, not prejudice. We cannot function properly in social situations, we have crippling other problems, and we must deal with this every single day.

A different way of socializing, as I mentioned in my links.

[qquote]Get out of my sight before you whine again.[/quote]

Fuck you too.

A very large majority need the therapy in order to get anywhere in society.

Have you forgotten my shit listed above? Treating people like shit?

I beg to differ. But since I doubt you have anything to back this up...

remember this link?
http://www.jamesmw.com/sixrules.htm

Bullshit
Homosexuality is not a "condition" it's a preference(Personal or genetic) for sexual partner's, unless you say wear a cape with a big "H" on the back and carry a rainbow flag around, Homosexuality is not obvious status. Unless you greet everyone with Hello I am a Homosexual how are you?

There are noticed differences in how some homosexuals act, look, dress, etc.They may be stereotypical but I have seen them to be true (in some cases)

However the Medical and Scientific community has every right, and they after reviewing the evidence, after running hundreds of peer reviewed studies, after examining thousands of papers published in peer-reviewed journals, they have determined that Autism is a Neurological Disorder.

It's only considered a fucking disorder because they have no problem

Again you have a serious issue accepting you have a disorder, it's not common sense, it's not an simple cultural traidition. It is hordes of doctors and scientists running tests and determine that Autism is a purely negative condition, best removed from the human population.

Source?

I dare you to find me exactly how many autistics grow up to be successful without help in their developement, asshole.

Why do I gave to, Goatseman?

'Cept, ya know, there's the problem with a) no-one understanding what they are trying to communicate, and b) a great deal of skills won't be marketable.

vocalizations? typing?

Why should Mr. Employerpants have to deal with his employee pissing on his desk? Once more, they need this integration into functional society, you dick.

and considering there's a SHITLOAD of 'functional societies' you phail.

I do not deal with it by fucking whining about it and demanding special treatment. Your behavior is disgraceful, Warsie.

I simply asked for them to be treated as humans. And oh wow..."MY behavior is disgraceful". wow....considering 2-3 people tried to jump me....

Doubly so because not all autistics are capable of learning to deal with normal society.

did not deny that. And

Hemming and hawing about it is useless, stupid, and ultimately counterproductive.
_________________

they're attacking me.

[SirNitram]

Ah, you use racism as a fig leaf? Except we are bad copies. We lose function that is vital to any social/pack species like humanity. You deal with it. As best you can, every day. You accept it is a disability and you fight back.

And did I deny that? No.

Actually, every time you try to dismiss the disorder nature as racism or homophobia and irrational in the same ways, yea, you do deny it. You're a lying twerp.

A lifetime of being and working with others who are on the Spectrum, inbred fucker. Living on my own despite it. Holding down work, getting married, supporting a wife, despite it. And knowing the full costs every damn day.

I'm autistic myself, you dickhead so you should shut the fuck up about claiming to speak for everyone.

No you're not. You're a self-diagnosed Aspie. You even try and get self righteous with me, punk, and I will only mock you harder.

Good. You aren't actually on the Spectrum, are you? You're one of those over-diagnosed non-cases. No one whose ever gone out into the world and tried to live without Mommy and Daddy holding your hands, without precisely constructed special workplaces, and without enough medication to stun a Bull Elephant.

1. I never said where I was autistic or not, assclown.

Liiiiiiiiiiiar.

I'm autistic myself, you dickhead

Keep your lies straight within the same post.

2. Awww...gotta make shit up like a bitch ehh? since you brought it up, actually I've been diagnosed by a psychologist you fucker.

I doubt it. You been out of your parents house? You lived on your own yet?

You know how people like me deal with social stigmas? We disavow cretins like you who whine.

Translation: You act like a bitch. And you are being a bitch. And you speak for everyone, which you fucking don't.

Awwww, the cretinous little self-diag thinks he'll hurt my feelings by calling me a bitch.

You're a fraud or a fucking insult to the rest of us.

We fight and we fit in as best we can and we explain to people the reality: That we are broken but still function. We do not hide behind the fig leaves of comparing believing our disability to, shock, be a disability, behind the fig leaves of homophobia and racism.

"We are broken but still function". And you bitch about me 'whining'? I didn't start this shit.

Yea. You did. You spouted off this crap about 'WE NEED TO BE TREATED LIKE HUMANS!'. We are, you worthless whiner. You want to be pampered. You posted a checklist for how you want catered too!

We consider as 'Autie-Friendly' those businesses who:

- Cater for special diets common to many people on the autistic spectrum and a source of current social limitation.

- Have an establishment that welcomes people on the Autistic Spectrum and their families to enjoy their hospitality, goods or services.

- Have goods, services or establishments that cater to the social, communication, sensory or information processing differences of people on the spectrum without demeaning these people by treating them as 'conditions' (ie we won't be listing businesses primarily purporting 'cures' for autism).

- Those who are equal opportunities employers who consider people on the Autistic Spectrum as employable within their own businesses in whatever way, large or small.

- Those with a business or employable skill or service who identify strongly with the Autism Spectrum community and overtly demonstrate a respect for its members."

Lying little whiner, caught again and again.

Except, of course, that our inability to function in a normal human society is a real, actual thing, not prejudice. We cannot function properly in social situations, we have crippling other problems, and we must deal with this every single day.

A different way of socializing, as I mentioned in my links.

I don't give a fuck about your self-indulgent crap in your links. I go by science and logic and analysis. We don't socialize the way humanity as a whole does. You adapt or you die. Lesson of 99% of the species that ever lived, because they all died.

[qquote]Get out of my sight before you whine again.

Fuck you too.[/quote]

Funny how you don't answer any of it. How you don't explain how you're not treated as a 'human'. Why you should be catered to. What you've actually accomplished to have some standing to backtalk me.

That's probably because you have no answers. Like every other worthless, spineless fraud.

Hemming and hawing about it is useless, stupid, and ultimately counterproductive.
_________________

they're attacking me.

Top left of the page, idiot boy. 'Get your fill of sci-fi, science, and mockery of stupid people.' From the Posting Rules you are required to read on the way in:

On this forum, it is considered perfectly acceptable to flame people simply for being dishonest or stupid, no matter how polite they are. I am aware that on most forums, stupidity or dishonesty alone are not considered grounds for flaming. However, those forums' rules do not apply here.

You want to be treated human? Here, you're treated human. Like everyone else. You get attacked when you say stupid crap.

[Napoleon the Clown]

Warsie, can you show any evidence that autism is a net gain for affected individuals? If not, what's so great about it? Non-autistics can focus perfectly well, without the drawback of being severely stunted in social interaction. Do you know what kind of species humans are? We're a social species. We're a species that makes packs, like wolves. Humans aren't like tigers. We cannot survive on our very own in the wild without the aid of technology. Difficulties on the level that most autistics have to deal with would be potentially fatal without a society to support them. There may be benefits to having autism.

Of course, there may also be benefits to schizophrenia. That means we should just alter society to work around the strengths of that one percent, right? We shouldn't try to find ways to eliminate schizophrenia, that's genocide. Schizophrenics are people, too. They may not be able to function in society without medication and therapy, but damn can they make brilliant artists. Society should revolve around people who are different.

Or how about bipolar? That seems to show a correlation with creativity, especially during hypomanic phases. And, while hypo, us bipolars can get so much done. Sure, the suicide rate is higher than Major Depressive Disorder, but there appears to be a connection between this potentially crippling "neuro atypicality" and creative genius. Because it appears to have a few things that are boons for certain careers and activities, we shouldn't try to get rid of that. That'd be genocide! (Note: That's sarcasm. As was the paragraph on schizophrenia. It was using the same damn "logic" on two conditions that often lead to premature death as you use on autism.)


Look, I'm bipolar. I do feel that it has helped to shape "who I am." It has had an impact on my personality. If Q were to offer to snap his fingers and make it so nobody else ever had to suffer with it in exchange for my life? I'd sacrifice myself. It has good parts to it, but it has so much more that makes life exceedingly more difficult. Depression isn't fun. Full blown mania is fucking terrifying. Mixed states are hell. It is not worth it. The hypomania can be an absolute blast. Boundless energy, only needing half as much sleep, being more efficient at your job... That's great. But the difficulties outweigh the minuscule benefits.

Face it, autism may have some small benefits, but without society compensating for the weaknesses that come with it, you're overall less able to function to any meaningful degree.

[RIPP_n_WIPE]

Are people with autism trapped in their own world? Or are the rest of us just trapped in ours?

They are trapped in their own world. The whole purpose of language is to communicate with others, so you need to be able to do it in such a manner that others will find it intelligible. If someone has a perfectly workable language that only makes sense to him, that is not just "different" than normal communication skills; it is dysfunctional.

And yet here we piss away millions every year making programs for the gaelic comunity...all of whom can speak english and who number around the 10,000 mark, which is roughly one towns worth in the entire country...all because apparently having more and different languages is a good thing. Actually, it's been argued seriously on this board by some folk that we should work to "save" languages that are dying out rather than trying to work towards common communication.

There's a slight difference though in having a language that only YOU understand. There's no cultural heritage behind having your own language that only YOU get. Languages that are dying out are links to cultural heritages. For some people having a language die is part of their group culture dying out.

[DaveJB]

Just to make things clear, Warsie, is your argument "It's not our fault we've got autism, therefore it's up to society to adjust and accommodate for us?" Because my personal attitude has always been "It's not society's fault that I've got autism (Asperger's, specifically), therefore I should try and adjust and fit in as best I can."

And guess what? I get along well enough in the world. Admittedly my social skills are far from perfect, but if people think you're making the effort, I think you'll find they're willing to make the same effort towards you.

[Mr Bean]

Just to repeat a point Warsie has at this point has claimed not to be Autistic, while claiming to be Autistic in the same post and even better, has gotten offended at being told he was claiming to Autistic, and ALSO getting angry and being told he's not Autistic.

That's not even to go into the fact he buys into stereotypes about Gays and has some serious misconceptions about the Scientific method.

Warsie we await your response with anticipation.

[Warsie]

snip.

Since you don't believe me, I can't make you believe me. But you ARE wrong, and I do NOT lie. so don't accuse me of that. As the flaming has ended or slowed down, I will withdraw. You win. And you misinterpreted all my shit.

Oh, where have I said I was autistic before you mentioned whether I was?

Oh well, screw it. I'm withdrawing from this battle.