Jim Raynor wrote:I guaran-fucking-tee that George Lucas didn't hear a peep about the ridiculous alternate-universe fanfic that Traviss was writing into this book. I usually don't come down that hard on him for continuity, because he's old, wants to live his life, and has movies to take care of. I blame it on the people he delegates to. But at some point, it just gets ridiculous. I would at least make sure that my creation wasn't violated on some basic level, like not having the Jedi (the true core of the saga, not the fucking Mandos) being portrayed as a bunch of idiotic and useless elitist assholes.
"Oh, if only our Little Father the Tsar knew of our plight, then we poor peasants wouldn't suffer like we do! He would set the Duke right!"
The poor peasants of Tsarist Russia were not helped; certain Tsars and officials attempted to relieve their situation, but most did not, and even those who tried failed, due both to incompetence and lack of commitment.
George "Evil" Lucas does not care the slightest what LFL mark with the Star Wars brand, as long as it brings in money.
"But there's no story past Episode VI, there's just no story. It's a certain story about Anakin Skywalker and once Anakin Skywalker dies, that's kind of the end of the story. There is no story about Luke Skywalker, I mean apart from the books."
You're being a little hard on Lucas. Hasn't he gone on record as saying that the EU isn't "his" universe? And he has demonstrated that while he'll use elements of the EU that suit him, he will never be tied down to it.
He can't be expected to tightly control a franchise he was never that interested in to begin with.
The real blame I feel lies with the people at LFL who are in charge of quality control and continuity. That they show such apathy as pure shit is passed under their noses is unforgivable.
Hm, was that not exactly what I just said? He simply does not care about it?
"But there's no story past Episode VI, there's just no story. It's a certain story about Anakin Skywalker and once Anakin Skywalker dies, that's kind of the end of the story. There is no story about Luke Skywalker, I mean apart from the books."
This part of another review shows once more that Traviss is not only lazy, but apparently to stupid to even read the Star Wars website or any work by their fellow authors.
The Remnant - Sadly, it seems that the author's grasp of the status and workings of the Remnant is dubious at best and nonexistant at worst. There are numerous self-contradictions in the book, referring to the Remnant as small and later having multiple Grand Moffs and a rather large number of Moffs. The mention of a "first female Moff" with Moff Crowal having existed as far back as the NJO was an annoyance, even if meant to be taken as a joke. Adding to that, the only returning Moff was Sarreti, who's retired.
The man was supposed to be young in the NJO, how is he retired now? Quille was a missed link to the past, he could have been Moff Quillan, but sadly either a different route was chosen or the name was incorrect. There's also the weekly Moff meetings and Pellaeon being the Head of State which are a headache to work out with his being GADF Supreme Commander. The concept that they don't carry out meetings through the holonet when we've seen them attending that way before seemed poorly researched as well.
Seriously, WTF? At least KJA got the ages of characters right and didn't shit all over other peoples work. I think this is way past the point of incompetence and has already reached the level of malicious intent.
EDIT: How the fuck does someone manage to get the names/ages/genders of characters wrong? And how the fuck does a Star Wars writer manage to confuse Grand Moff with sector moff? And how the fuck does one forget facts that were established in the same series of books?
Whoever says "education does not matter" can try ignorance
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A decision must be made in the life of every nation at the very moment when the grasp of the enemy is at its throat. Then, it seems that the only way to survive is to use the means of the enemy, to rest survival upon what is expedient, to look the other way. Well, the answer to that is 'survival as what'? A country isn't a rock. It's not an extension of one's self. It's what it stands for. It's what it stands for when standing for something is the most difficult! - Chief Judge Haywood
------------ My LPs
Thanas wrote:EDIT: How the fuck does someone manage to get the names/ages/genders of characters wrong? And how the fuck does a Star Wars writer manage to confuse Grand Moff with sector moff? And how the fuck does one forget facts that were established in the same series of books?
Because all she really does care is her own created work. If you look at the whole of her writing, she's always done that. With everything since her crusade she's ignored primary SW lore, so her shitting on EU lore shouldn't come as much a surprise as inevitability.
MM /CF/WG/BOTM/JL/Original Warsie/ACPATHNTDWATGODW FOREVER!!
Sometimes we can choose the path we follow. Sometimes our choices are made for us. And sometimes we have no choice at all
^Call me crazy, but this has gotten to a point Trek book "lore" has never reached. For all their craziness, side characters like Alexander did not suddenly mutate into girls, nor did the structure of the Romulan Empire suddenly shift upside down.
This has reached the level of ST:Nemesis. Yikes.
Whoever says "education does not matter" can try ignorance
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A decision must be made in the life of every nation at the very moment when the grasp of the enemy is at its throat. Then, it seems that the only way to survive is to use the means of the enemy, to rest survival upon what is expedient, to look the other way. Well, the answer to that is 'survival as what'? A country isn't a rock. It's not an extension of one's self. It's what it stands for. It's what it stands for when standing for something is the most difficult! - Chief Judge Haywood
------------ My LPs
Thanas wrote:^Call me crazy, but this has gotten to a point Trek book "lore" has never reached. For all their craziness, side characters like Alexander did not suddenly mutate into girls, nor did the structure of the Romulan Empire suddenly shift upside down.
This has reached the level of ST:Nemesis. Yikes.
Pretty much.
I am awaiting for Mando's to become a galactic power that wipe out the Sith, Empire, and NR and establish a glorious new order for a thousand thousand years(because she know has to shit on future continuity for her Mando love).
In the end, it's sad that nothing short of poor sales will stop this bitch, and she's showing up KJA in ways he didn't even do to fucking Dune. That personally amazes me.
MM /CF/WG/BOTM/JL/Original Warsie/ACPATHNTDWATGODW FOREVER!!
Sometimes we can choose the path we follow. Sometimes our choices are made for us. And sometimes we have no choice at all
Darth Hoth wrote:Hm, was that not exactly what I just said? He simply does not care about it?
Yes but with the implication that he's in it for the money.
I doubt he cares about that either. I'm saying that he doesn't care because it has little to do with his creation.
Darth Hoth wrote:Hm, was that not exactly what I just said? He simply does not care about it?
Yes but with the implication that he's in it for the money.
I doubt he cares about that either. I'm saying that he doesn't care because it has little to do with his creation.
I strongly doubt he minds the royalties...
"But there's no story past Episode VI, there's just no story. It's a certain story about Anakin Skywalker and once Anakin Skywalker dies, that's kind of the end of the story. There is no story about Luke Skywalker, I mean apart from the books."
Ghost Rider wrote:I am awaiting for Mando's to become a galactic power that wipe out the Sith, Empire, and NR and establish a glorious new order for a thousand thousand years(because she know has to shit on future continuity for her Mando love).
I wouldn't put it above her to ruin the only decent thing that has come out of the post-endor EU for the past year. Probably because they have got *gasp* jedis and *gasp* non-force users that would eat Mandalores for breakfast.
In the end, it's sad that nothing short of poor sales will stop this bitch, and she's showing up KJA in ways he didn't even do to fucking Dune. That personally amazes me.
Well, I have not bought a single EU book after swarm war (with the exception of Allegiance). However, going by the trek precedent, I believe it will take several years for people to wake up and notice their franchise has turned into pure and utter crap.
Whoever says "education does not matter" can try ignorance
------------
A decision must be made in the life of every nation at the very moment when the grasp of the enemy is at its throat. Then, it seems that the only way to survive is to use the means of the enemy, to rest survival upon what is expedient, to look the other way. Well, the answer to that is 'survival as what'? A country isn't a rock. It's not an extension of one's self. It's what it stands for. It's what it stands for when standing for something is the most difficult! - Chief Judge Haywood
------------ My LPs
Darth Hoth wrote:I strongly doubt he minds the royalties...
Who would? I just doubt it's the main factor behind his apathy.
Thanas wrote:
Ghost Rider wrote:I am awaiting for Mando's to become a galactic power that wipe out the Sith, Empire, and NR and establish a glorious new order for a thousand thousand years(because she know has to shit on future continuity for her Mando love).
I wouldn't put it above her to ruin the only decent thing that has come out of the post-endor EU for the past year. Probably because they have got *gasp* jedis and *gasp* non-force users that would eat Mandalores for breakfast.
I think it likely she'll do something even stupider and have the Mandalorians poised to conquer the entire galaxy and utterly destroy the Jedi/Sith/GA/Empire forever but decide they don't want to because of SUPERIOR MANDALORIAN HONOR or something.
Therefore, the Jedi et al from that point onward will exist at the Mandalorian's sufferance.
Ghost Rider wrote:I am awaiting for Mando's to become a galactic power that wipe out the Sith, Empire, and NR and establish a glorious new order for a thousand thousand years(because she know has to shit on future continuity for her Mando love).
I wouldn't put it above her to ruin the only decent thing that has come out of the post-endor EU for the past year. Probably because they have got *gasp* jedis and *gasp* non-force users that would eat Mandalores for breakfast.
Wait until they show that Jaina's love child by Boba Fett is really the person they cloned Cade Skywalker from.
Thanas wrote:
Ghost Rider wrote:In the end, it's sad that nothing short of poor sales will stop this bitch, and she's showing up KJA in ways he didn't even do to fucking Dune. That personally amazes me.
Well, I have not bought a single EU book after swarm war (with the exception of Allegiance). However, going by the trek precedent, I believe it will take several years for people to wake up and notice their franchise has turned into pure and utter crap.
Oh more then that. Even with Trek it took pretty much a decade of pure drivel before even stalwarts woke up. The rabid fanbase is what allows people like Traviss not only to write, but suceed.
KJA just missed the window with SW, it seems.
MM /CF/WG/BOTM/JL/Original Warsie/ACPATHNTDWATGODW FOREVER!!
Sometimes we can choose the path we follow. Sometimes our choices are made for us. And sometimes we have no choice at all
I have a hard time understanding how someone who could write such a good story in Hard Contact can degenerate into this vomit inducing pile of shit. Traviss' work has gone beyond horrible and has collapsed into a black hole comprised entirely of suck. It's drawing the rest of the franchise down into its festering bowels and corrupting everything with the name Star Wars attached to it.
I can't even look at any EU product without being reminded of the shit Traviss pulls. I stopped reading the post-Endor EU after Vector Prime, I'm glad I did and yet a part of me wants to read everything since just to see something I loved turn to total and complete shit. I just don't get how any thinking person can possible like her drivel.
Xess wrote:I have a hard time understanding how someone who could write such a good story in Hard Contact can degenerate into this vomit inducing pile of shit.
I can't really comment since I haven't read this novel, but I agree. My impression when Hard Contact was released was that she was a promising author and I looked forward to see more of her stories. Then came the "3 million clones" debacle and Triple Zero and things quickly spiraled downwards.
Btw, have anyone read the reviews over at SW.com or has Moosie banned everyone who dislikes it?
Mange wrote:
I can't really comment since I haven't read this novel, but I agree. My impression when Hard Contact was released was that she was a promising author and I looked forward to see more of her stories. Then came the "3 million clones" debacle and Triple Zero and things quickly spiraled downwards.
Does anyone think that the "3 million clones" debacle might have influenced KT's writing style?
I think she's attached herself so strongly to her concept of the Mandalorians that nothing else matters.
They're perfect and wonderful and manly in every way and the entire Star Wars galaxy knows it, especially those stupid Jedi.
She's like a fangirl writing slash fiction, difference being she's earning money for this tripe.
That's why I consider KT to be the worst kind of hack, somebody who showed talent but throws it all away because she's an egotistical, obsessive fool.
Lord_Xerxes wrote:Jesus Christ, impenetrable armor is so damn lame. How exactly is the entire suit impenetrable anyway? Wouldn't it have to be flexible in certain key points or entirely hinder the wearer?
That also begs the question: If the suit is impervious to lightsabers, then why didn't Jango simply put up his arms to block Windu's attack in AOTC? And why didn't he rely more on it during the fight with Obi-Wan on Kamino?
It's possible that when she wrote Hard Contact, she had advice and editors who were more stringent and probably exerted more influence on her, and the things that plague her work now had to be minimized. Its also quite possible her confrontations with the fans over the Clone Army size did influence her writing (since we know she used her authorial position to beat up on her opposition, something that Curtis ironically gets accused of and criticized for frequently.) A definite result of the Clone Army debates was that a goodly number of KT's detractors were forced off the SW.com and TFN boards either out of disgust or by dishonesty of certain members in charrge (such as a certain Dark Moose.)
We can look at other "hack" authors like KJA or Terry Goodkind who, despite writing total shit, can still profit once they get a fanbase - people who mindlessly support the author or will just buy anything. Something like that appears to have occured with Traviss as well - she's "established" herself and she no longer has the kinds of restraints other authors do because she's appeared to be VERY popular. Considering that people will BUY her books even if they know its shit (the REvelations rewviews on TFN as I noted, ,made this abundantly clear) will only add to this - after all, if people are buying her work they must like it.
Add to this that its quite likely that her fandom, however large or small it is, is bound to have significant representation at TFN and SW.com (Amidst a horde of more mindless or apathetic readers) and that a vast majority of her critics have been suppressed or driven off, that will merely add to her perception of "success" (no doubt fueled by the fact some of her supporters are in positions of authority as well.)
Lastly, you can point to her depth of contact with the fandom as being a possible problem point - she's not only easily influencable by idiots (like Dark Moose, or perhaps someone like McEwok) but she can also utilize her author status to engender support/worship for her work - alot of people will "kiss up" to someone they perceive as famous. (not unlike when Curtis has made infrequent appearances here, I might add. Though not nearly as kiss-assy in those cases.)
By the way, did anyone else notice when reading the TFN forums that some of her critics were vehement in insisting that they "WEREN'T" bashing KT? One of them (at least) even flat-out said that they didn't want to be banned or anything.
That at least tells me that while they may have relaxed their attempts to suppress all criticism of Traviss, alot of the membership of those boards are still aware (and wary) of drawing that down on themselves.
i guess to some of them though that such tactics are appropriate - Mandalorian even, I suppose.
Lord_Xerxes wrote:Jesus Christ, impenetrable armor is so damn lame. How exactly is the entire suit impenetrable anyway? Wouldn't it have to be flexible in certain key points or entirely hinder the wearer?
That also begs the question: If the suit is impervious to lightsabers, then why didn't Jango simply put up his arms to block Windu's attack in AOTC? And why didn't he rely more on it during the fight with Obi-Wan on Kamino?
Well, to be fair, with the Jango-Windu fight, he had just been run over by a huge animal and was probably suffering from internal injuries. He may have been so dazed and in so much pain that he didn't know what to do, indeed he had just been trampled by what amounts to an interstellar rhino, he probably had the grandmammy of all concussions.
It doesn't really matter in the Jango/Windu fight becasue a fair bit of his armour was exposed cloth/jumpsuit - not that BEskar crap, and thus not immune to a lightsaber. (That seems to be forgotten about the uber-wank mando armor.. its not nearly as full-covering as stormtrooper armour is.)
Amusingly, I've noticed that Traviss decided to ignore the fact that cetain sources (the DK visual dictionaries mainly) credit Jango and Boba's armour as having some sort of internal enegy shielding reinforcing the armour. I don't suppose it would be possible THAT could be why Mandalorian armor is lightsaber resistant...
I really wonder what it was that got Traviss hooked on Mandalorians in the first place.
As I've complained about before, the "legend" of the Mandalorians was nonexistent. The Fandalorian idiots were basically wanking off to fanfiction about one bit character in the OT who wasn't even that great.
I doubt Traviss was a big-time SW fan before she got a job writing for LFL. She hasn't read much of the other SW books, and by her own admission doesn't like to read. Her grasp of continuity is spotty at best. Her hatred for the Jedi and twisted view of the primary canon shows that she doesn't like core parts of the SW saga.
Going back to the nonexistent Mandalorian point, they were never all that fleshed out until Traviss herself started writing them. Traviss is basically the creator of Mandalorian "canon." She's wanking off to her own made up bullshit.
So what made Traviss, a middle-aged woman who didn't read SW and didn't understand SW, latch on to Boba Fett as some kind of awesome, godly character, who is not only a better fighter than everyone else, but smarter, wiser, more honorable, and of superior moral values? I would understand it if she were a younger writer who grew up in the 90s liking SW and conditioned to like Mandalorians (whatever the fuck they were supposed to be before, they were cool by association to Boba). But she's not.
"They're not triangular, but they are more or less blade-shaped"- Thrawn McEwok on the shape of Bakura destroyers
"Lovely. It's known as impugning character regarding statement of professional qualifications' in the legal world"- Karen Traviss, crying libel because I said that no soldier she interviewed would claim that he can take on billion-to-one odds
"I've already laid out rules for this thread that we're not going to make these evidential demands"- Dark Moose on supporting your claims
Alexian Cale wrote:Anyone taking bets on the amount of casualties that the Mandalorians will take, trying to bring down the Remnant's SSD?
Methinks that if Traviss has any say over Denning, none.
I'm thinking minimal to none, as well. I, too, am becoming particularly tired of Mandalorian "fanwank" (is that the proper term?) to the point that if I ever become an author, it will be so as to write a story publicly condemning the Mandalorians by having them get stranded on Endor and letting the Ewoks kick the shit out of them for three-hundred-and-six pages. Did anyone like how a random Mandalore had the all powerful Sith Lord at his mercy and let him go?
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