SGA 4*18 "The Last Man" (Spoilers)

[TimothyC]

Well I like how they were able to bring Todd and Ronin together.

[Brother-Captain Gaius]

They definitely saved the best for last. A lot of things I liked about this episode, and though Carter in command of a 304 was always on my wishlist, I thought it would've been better if she'd performed some similar feat of apocalyptic destruction via messing around with some planetary superweapon or a metric shitton of naquadah or somesuch.

[CaptJodan]

That was an appropriate season finale for this season. A meh finale for a meh season. I don't really find giant reset button episodes to be great finales. Though I was glad they mentioned why the gate safety systems didn't stop the solar flare connection, as that was going to be a point I was going to make. Phoenix must have been a real piece of crap, added to the fact that they waited a damn long time to open fire (with no doubt more apologetics for why that one button they have to push wasn't pushed).

Mark 12 Naquada generators huh? Earth, with all the tech specs they have, still haven't gotten Asgard style Neutrino whatsits reactors working? Or maybe Mark 12s are superior in some way.

The only real importance of this episode was the final 5 minutes, and it wasn't all that spellbinding. For season finales, I'd rate it lower than most.

[LadyTevar]

For exposition and storytelling, I give it a 4/5

For overall season finale? 2/5.

[Lord MJ]

I'm guessing that they retconned that Ancient Time Machine out of existence. Would've accomplished the same thing as Rodney's plan

[CaptainChewbacca]

I'm guessing that they retconned that Ancient Time Machine out of existence. Would've accomplished the same thing as Rodney's plan

It was either destroyed or not recovered or something. I liked the story, but the 'cliffhangar' felt tacked-on.

[JME2]

I liked the story, but the 'cliffhangar' felt tacked-on.

Seconded; a meh ending to Season 4.

2.5/5

[Shinn Langley Soryu]

Well, at least Samantha, Ronon, and Todd went down fighting. Also, congratulations to Lorne on making general.

[neoolong]

It was either destroyed or not recovered or something. I liked the story, but the 'cliffhangar' felt tacked-on.

That's cause the whole thing happened in the last three minutes of the episode.

Though honestly, I would have thought someone would have suggested not doing anything until Teyla gets there in order to ensure that they have the best chance of getting her back. Still, I guess they had to try since it's only known that Teyla is dead at least a couple of months in the future.

[Cecelia5578]

I'm so glad that it wasn't a standard time travel story, as if that cliche hasn't been done to death, but rather bringing up an earlier SG-1 episode for precedent.

[LadyTevar]

Nitram did like how they used the solar flare idea for why it happened and how to get back. SG is one of the few SciFi series with writers who remember past episodes and mine them for ideas.

[neoolong]

Interestingly enough, this is the third time that they've done the usage of solar flares to cause time travel. They did it in 2010 to send a message about not visiting the Aschen.

[PREDATOR490]

The way Sam was portrayed as dying was retarded. Are they so stupid they go into a combat situation with no guns ready ?
If they are ready then why the hell werent they shooting the beams BEFORE they got 'disabled' ?

This episode really annoyed me on all counts through bad writing and extremely obvious writer's fiat. IOA decide to nuke the Asurans because they were building ships that 'could' be used against Earth yet they wont do jack shit to attack Michael when he is using a virus that can be used against human populations including Earth. Sure, the Wraith dont have the drive systems to reach Earth NOW but your sitting in a galaxy that has Ancient remains all over the place. Wouldnt it be prudent to continue exploring to nullify those remains before Michael or the Wraith get them ?
Additionally, why do the IOA decide they can defend themselves against Michael when they just had one of their X304s creamed by 3 Hive ships or a Wraith cruiser can bitch slap the Daedulus and get away ?

Wouldnt it be prudent to take action against Michael before he becomes a dominant power and has access to the resources to build more ships. The same thing SG-1 was so good in pointing out would make things worse by having a unified Goa'uld ?

I notice Atlantis was empty when Shepard arrived and Mckay hinted something was going on in the Milky Way related to the Pegasus galaxy yet they never said why. So many things in that episode just seemed contrived and 'convenient'. No mention of Dr Weir, no mention of the fact Sheppard is going into the same stasis chamber as the Scottish guy or mention of what happened to him. Did they cure him, was the cure on the disk ?
Why not go back before Teyla was taken if the situation was that grave ?

[CaptainChewbacca]

Why not go back before Teyla was taken if the situation was that grave ?

As for the last, I'm guessing 'doubling up' in a timeline causes problems, or it was less likely for them to find a solar flare to send Sheppard that far back.

[PREDATOR490]

Why not go back before Teyla was taken if the situation was that grave ?

As for the last, I'm guessing 'doubling up' in a timeline causes problems, or it was less likely for them to find a solar flare to send Sheppard that far back.

IF this is time travel... which I doubt then it wouldnt double up by my understanding.

Normal Timeline = A>B>C>D....

If someone goes back and tells A not to go to B then C and D are less likely to happen. If that is the case then future version should instantly vanish because the future that lead to them being there never occured... right ?

Although by that reasoning then technically the future version shouldnt have been able to 'interfere' except to create a loop thus it just plays over and over. On that topic, how can Sheppard be given a crystal from the future that should already exist in the 'past' Atlantis. The crystal will either be a duplicate or hasnt been placed yet to be used which means... it should cease to exist the moment Sheppard arrived... right ?

On the upside, I take it this episode is confirmation that Woolsey is coming next season but I am less than impressed given the IOA background he has or the way they portray him. I dont think even Picardo is going to be able to work something decent out of the role without considerable changes from the writing to make him less of a IOA pen pusher.

[NecronLord]

That was an appropriate season finale for this season. A meh finale for a meh season. I don't really find giant reset button episodes to be great finales. Though I was glad they mentioned why the gate safety systems didn't stop the solar flare connection, as that was going to be a point I was going to make. Phoenix must have been a real piece of crap, added to the fact that they waited a damn long time to open fire (with no doubt more apologetics for why that one button they have to push wasn't pushed).

It's worth noting that it appeared to have a copy of the Asgard Core; indicating that all the asgard tech may be on all the 304s now.

Mark 12 Naquada generators huh? Earth, with all the tech specs they have, still haven't gotten Asgard style Neutrino whatsits reactors working? Or maybe Mark 12s are superior in some way.

Neutrino Ion Generators were an appreciable proportion of the (massive) Asgard Beliskner class. You couldn't necesserily install them in the city, just because of size. It's also possible that their fuel doesn't keep that well.

I'm guessing that they retconned that Ancient Time Machine out of existence. Would've accomplished the same thing as Rodney's plan

Either that, or two 48,000 year trips is beyond it's fuel limits; or McKay just couldn't get it.

The way Sam was portrayed as dying was retarded. Are they so stupid they go into a combat situation with no guns ready ?

Because asgard-tech shields and weapons are not operable in hyperspace. See Small Victories and New Order. Waiting at the destination of a ship and shiving it before it can power its weapons is a long established tactic for quickly overcoming a vessel, from the Asgard (New Order) against the Replicators, to the Tau'ri against the Asurans (All My Sins Remember'd).

If they are ready then why the hell werent they shooting the beams BEFORE they got 'disabled' ?

You say 'disabled' like it's unbelievable (such as the Star Trek Nemesis inability to scuttle the ship) when in fact, it's really quite believable. The wraithbrids shot the guns off.

This episode really annoyed me on all counts through bad writing and extremely obvious writer's fiat. IOA decide to nuke the Asurans because they were building ships that 'could' be used against Earth yet they wont do jack shit to attack Michael when he is using a virus that can be used against human populations including Earth.
[/quote]They had the hubris to think that the Asurans were a sitting target. Mikey's lot aren't, by default. Wraith appear to be mostly nomadic; you can't just go to their homeworld and drop a bomb on them.

Sure, the Wraith dont have the drive systems to reach Earth NOW but your sitting in a galaxy that has Ancient remains all over the place. Wouldnt it be prudent to continue exploring to nullify those remains before Michael or the Wraith get them ?

How're they going to do that then?

Additionally, why do the IOA decide they can defend themselves against Michael when they just had one of their X304s creamed by 3 Hive ships or a Wraith cruiser can bitch slap the Daedulus and get away ?

They got the drop on the Phoenix. It's in no way garunteed that they could do the same to other 304s. And 'creamed' implies something other than a phyrric victory. Casualties; one human, tens of thousands of wraithbrids. I know who I'd preffer to have fought for in that battle.

Wouldnt it be prudent to take action against Michael before he becomes a dominant power and has access to the resources to build more ships. The same thing SG-1 was so good in pointing out would make things worse by having a unified Goa'uld ?

With what? He's a dude who lives in a tent and occasionally some bombed out ruins. This hardly compares to the great cities of the industrialised Delmak.

I notice Atlantis was empty when Shepard arrived and Mckay hinted something was going on in the Milky Way related to the Pegasus galaxy yet they never said why.

Evil Weir, I'd guess.

So many things in that episode just seemed contrived and 'convenient'. No mention of Dr Weir, no mention of the fact Sheppard is going into the same stasis chamber as the Scottish guy

Or maybe the city has more than one. Which we actually know it does; there's the one that Janus put Elizabeth in, and the one that Beckett is in.

Why not go back before Teyla was taken if the situation was that grave ?

While you can dick with causality to a degree (Moebius) that would probably have greater risk of him not being believed, or something going wrong, or both Sheppards being inconvinienced by having to fight for their stuff... And so on.

If someone goes back and tells A not to go to B then C and D are less likely to happen. If that is the case then future version should instantly vanish because the future that lead to them being there never occured... right ?

No. You can get multiple people hanging around happily by this mechanism. See Moebius in SG1. The original SG1 went back in time, and defied Ra too early, resulting in a change that prevented them from existing. However, when the second SG1 travelled back in time, they found the original Daniel Jackson still extant, despite his having erased his own past.

Although by that reasoning then technically the future version shouldnt have been able to 'interfere' except to create a loop thus it just plays over and over. On that topic, how can Sheppard be given a crystal from the future that should already exist in the 'past' Atlantis. The crystal will either be a duplicate or hasnt been placed yet to be used which means... it should cease to exist the moment Sheppard arrived... right ?

It's a duplicate, assuming that they've not just made a new one with an asgard replicator or something.

[CaptJodan]

It's worth noting that it appeared to have a copy of the Asgard Core; indicating that all the asgard tech may be on all the 304s now.

Actually, it is worth mentioning to me. That was during a massive storm down here in Florida, and the TV went out during the entire intro to the Phoenix, so my knowledge on that ship is admittedly limited.

Because asgard-tech shields and weapons are not operable in hyperspace. See Small Victories and New Order. Waiting at the destination of a ship and shiving it before it can power its weapons is a long established tactic for quickly overcoming a vessel, from the Asgard (New Order) against the Replicators, to the Tau'ri against the Asurans (All My Sins Remember'd).

Yet ironically, the 304s, and every other attacking ship, was able to raise their shields in time without taking damage. It didn't take but a couple seconds at most for shield flares on the 304s to be seen in "All My Sins Remembere'd" from ships firing back. Sam knew she was going into a combat zone, so shields should be her first priority.

The bottom line is, the report that the weapons were offline came in considerably later than the first opening shots.

I don't have the episode, but from my limited memory, this was 5-10 seconds of her not even trying to return fire. And we all know that stating the fucking obvious is more important than getting your crew to work the problem.

[NecronLord]

To be honest, I can easily believe that ships waiting would still have an advantage - charging their capacitors, powering down volitile hyperdrives, etc. etc.

[CaptJodan]

Wow, I really fucked up the tags there.

I guess my biggest objection was that that particular scene screamed writer's fiat like PREDATOR said. Asgard shields have been wildly inconsistent, and that inconsistency played out here. Some episodes have shields getting low and consoles explode, while others like "All My Sins", they're talking about not being able to take much more, and there hasn't been a single exploding console or spark. This episode had the ship's systems breaking faster than we've ever seen before, in addition to Carter's slow response to the situation, and yes, even the Trek standard of someone being blown back from their console.

By that point, you know they're going to kill off pretty much everyone else, save Rodney. They needed him to be "The Last Man" from his own time. And that particular scene just gave me the impression they'd break whatever "rules" they may have to do it.

[PREDATOR490]

The X304's were shown capable of taking on ORI mothership firepower and I find it highly unlikely Wraith firepower is as concentrated as a single burst of those beams.
We have seen the Daedulus engage multiple hives with success yet this 'new' ship cant do the same. Either that ship was shoddily constructed compared to the others or the Wraith have beefed up their firepower by the time that situation occured.

This is the same kind of situation that has been leveled against Voyager. The writers had an image of what they wanted and did it without consideration of the methods or consistancy they took to get there. The end result, 3 Hive ships fire off a poor barrage against the ship that is no where near the kind of beating the Daedulus recieved when it got caught out by two hive ships.
This entire situation was basically done to kill 'heroically' Sam but instead looks like contrived incompetant stupidity on her part. Ronan ended up with the best death in this episode and I find that morbidly tragic considering it was done in a way beyond simple 'macho' with Todd being there and was consistant with the personnality. Sam's demise is completely inconsistant with her character and thus looks awful.

[NecronLord]

The X304's were shown capable of taking on ORI mothership firepower

For a couple of shots.

and I find it highly unlikely Wraith firepower is as concentrated as a single burst of those beams.

Why? For all we know, they've upgraded their power generation sustantially. Wraith hive ships are bigger than even Ori vessels.

The end result, 3 Hive ships fire off a poor barrage against the ship that is no where near the kind of beating the Daedulus recieved when it got caught out by two hive ships.

Number of pulses doesn't actually mean anything; we've seen that energy weapons can fire at different charges before. Remember, the most formidable things in space, O'Neills and Ori motherships, fire single, large, pulses.

Sam's demise is completely inconsistant with her character and thus looks awful.

I had no problem with it - people can look a bit dismayed or distressed when they're about to die.

[Rommie2006]

The Asgard shields on the Phoenix, I agree were anomalously weak.

We know from SG-1 Season Finale that Asgard shields can withstand at least half a dozen shots from Ori beam weapons. We know from Ark of Truth that it can withstand more than half a dozen shots.

And now we see the Phoenix collapse after several shots from Wraith weapons? WTF!?!

[NecronLord]

Both of those examples were a 304 with a ZPM tied into its systems. Presumably this ship didn't have such a thing.

[Anarchist Bunny]

Also to be fair the ship was rushed into action with Atlantis' resources and not Earth's.