Tactical Stupidity in Science Fictions

[Patrick Degan]

If you recall, the first "sensor ghost" was a Romulan Warbird, which Picard swung the Enterprise toward to prepare to combat.

In the second instance, however, Picard stupidly dismissed the second threat. Remember the dialogue:

"Mr. Burke, did you input that new sensor code?"

"Yes sir."

Picard smiles and settles back into his command chair. "Mr. Worf, it appears I didn't give you enough credit... Continue with the simulation—" BOOM BOOM BANG CRASH.

And in any case, noting mitigates the fact that, for the purposes of a combat exercise, Picard and his engineers disabled the ship's defences and primary offensive arsenal, leaving the Enterprise extraordinarly vulnerable. The Federation Flagship would have been reduced to radioactive scrapmetal had Daimon Braktor decided to press his attack all the way.

[Master of Ossus]

Signs: Alien race invading Earth LUDICROUSLY refuses to use its "technology" because the Terrans would inevitably use their nuclear weapons if they did, destroying the planet and everyone on it. Instead, the aliens fought only hand-to-hand, and used their seemingly totally ineffective "poison" on the Earthlings.

Sorry, but if an alien race was invading Earth and posed a significant risk to the planet, whether or not they were using their technology would be a moot point. If I was the President, I would use nuclear weapons whether or not they were fighting CQC. A planet overrun by aliens only fighting without ranged weapons would be just as bad as a planet overrun by aliens using such weapons.

Also, why the hell did they go hand-to-hand when WATER could cause somewhat serious injuries to them? If human blood splashed on them, they would be seriously burned by that. There is no reason either for the aliens to have used their completely idiotic tactics OR for the humans not to use their nuclear capability. BOTH sides in the conflict were moronic.

[phongn]

Signs: Alien race invading Earth LUDICROUSLY refuses to use its "technology" because the Terrans would inevitably use their nuclear weapons if they did, destroying the planet and everyone on it. Instead, the aliens fought only hand-to-hand, and used their seemingly totally ineffective "poison" on the Earthlings.

But it wasn't an invasion, and that was what the book said - not neccessarily what actually was happening.

Sorry, but if an alien race was invading Earth and posed a significant risk to the planet, whether or not they were using their technology would be a moot point. If I was the President, I would use nuclear weapons whether or not they were fighting CQC. A planet overrun by aliens only fighting without ranged weapons would be just as bad as a planet overrun by aliens using such weapons.

By that point, yes, but remember, just because the book in the movie said something, it doesn't mean its true for that movie's universe.

Also, why the hell did they go hand-to-hand when WATER could cause somewhat serious injuries to them? If human blood splashed on them, they would be seriously burned by that. There is no reason either for the aliens to have used their completely idiotic tactics OR for the humans not to use their nuclear capability. BOTH sides in the conflict were moronic.

The Alien incursion appeared to be a probing action or raid rather than a straight-up invasion. Putting on some sort of environnmental suit might have denied them their chameleon-like abilities when they wanted stealth to harvest various humans.

IIR goggles might work against them - presumably they radiate heat and would be detectable that way.

[Master of Ossus]

You still have not addressed the point. Why would the Aliens have fought hand to hand with their outrageously crappy aerosal poison and their claws? Why didn't the humans use their nuclear weapons? Don't get me wrong, it was a great horror film, but it made no sense when you thought about it. And why would the aliens bother to use stealth if, with their technology, the Terrans could not have posed any threat to them. It was almost as if they wanted to die.

BTW, I absolutely hate the idea that "every enemy has a weakness." It simply should not be true for a race that advanced. Oh, there would be some problems with their society, but there is no way that humanity today should have any chance against an enemy like that. And there is absolutely no way they should have been able to defeat a race of aliens in a matter of hours.

[The Yosemite Bear]

The Martians not sending a probe to find out if Earth bacteria were harmful to them

For not lootiong all the Penecillian Supplies during the 1950's invasion.

[Peregrin Toker]

Warhammer 40K: The Imperium equipping Space Marine Assault Squads with boltpistols and swords instead of equipping them with regular, SMG-sized boltguns with bayonets. (Actually, the only people in the 40K universe who seem to utilize bayonets properly are the Necrons and the Kroot)

[phongn]

You still have not addressed the point. Why would the Aliens have fought hand to hand with their outrageously crappy aerosal poison and their claws?

Perhaps they wanted to stay hidden, and any ranged weapons would not have allowed them to stay undetected?

Why didn't the humans use their nuclear weapons?

How are you going to target them? Set them for airburst at 5000ft AGL and hope for the best?

Don't get me wrong, it was a great horror film, but it made no sense when you thought about it. And why would the aliens bother to use stealth if, with their technology, the Terrans could not have posed any threat to them.

Who knows? Maybe they wanted to stay undetected on the ground for their raid.

[Nephilim]

I'll tell ya something I don't understand, why doesn't the EA use lasers for interceptors? instead of slow moving energy bolts? especially with a range of only a few hundred km

This is covered in B5Wars in the weapon descriptions.

"Because Lasers are coherent light, they strike a target effectively instantaneously, meaning they can’t be blocked by most kinds of defense fire. On the other hand, they are incapable of themselves firing defensively. This is both an advantage and a disadvantage."

[Master of Ossus]

Perhaps they wanted to stay hidden, and any ranged weapons would not have allowed them to stay undetected?

WANTED TO STAY HIDDEN WHILE THEY WERE INVADING A PLANET? LOL! And they did not even do a very good job of staying hidden without ranged weapons. And, BTW, why would ranged weapons the aliens should have used given away their position any worse than projectile weapons we have, and BTW, why would the aliens have cared if we knew where they were? They should have been invincible. And why would they have been more hidden with their hand-to-hand combat (which consisted of picking someone up and standing there looking threatening while other humans stared at them), than with ranged weapons?

How are you going to target them? Set them for airburst at 5000ft AGL and hope for the best?

All landings took place within 1 mile of crop circles. If CNN knew that, Military intelligence should have, also. And why would the alien use of technology have made nuclear weapons more targetable (not a word)?

Don't get me wrong, it was a great horror film, but it made no sense when you thought about it. And why would the aliens bother to use stealth if, with their technology, the Terrans could not have posed any threat to them.

Who knows? Maybe they wanted to stay undetected on the ground for their raid.

They didn't do a very good job of that. They knocked out communications on Earth for a period of time, were broadcast all over every major station, and their crop circles COMPLETELY revealed their presence (albeit with some skeptics, but who would be a skeptic after such an invasion?).

[Majin Gojira]

The Aliens in Signs were only interested in gathering Humans (I think it was for food, did you see their teeth!). It was not an invasion, it was more of a harvest.

Second point - ok, more of an opinion. I had the distinct impression that the aliens we saw were not the ones in charge - they were genetically engeneired solders (Dead Givaway: the poison gas-launching toobs on their wrists).

On Atomic weapons- let me just say, I'm glad your finger isn't on the button Master of Ossus. Yes, they appeared within 1 mile of crop circles - they also were over MAJOR POPULATION CENTERS. If the raid had continued for another day, then maybe they would have used the bomb.

Enough disecting of Signs, now for real military blunders.

Every Godzilla film from "Ghidorah The Three Headed Monster" to "Godzilla 1985", and from "Godzilla vs. King Ghidorah" to "Godzilla, Mothra, King Ghidorah: Giant Monster All Out Attack"

The films mentioned (and the ones in between them in the series) show the military having NO PLAN what-so-ever in dealing with the monsters aside from hammering them with weapons they ALREADY KNOW TO BE INEFFECTIVE.

Sure, it's not really an important issue for the story(Insert laughter here), but it is a great blunder in Sci-fi.

Ah, before I forget, one more: In "Gamera: Gaurdian of the Universe", when Gamera appears durring an operation to capture some small Gyaos-birds, the Japanese Military is rendered ABSOLUTELY HELPLESS because they need an order from the government to do anything.

I giggled tremendously when I saw that scene.

[Straha]

Ah, before I forget, one more: In "Gamera: Gaurdian of the Universe", when Gamera appears durring an operation to capture some small Gyaos-birds, the Japanese Military is rendered ABSOLUTELY HELPLESS because they need an order from the government to do anything.

I giggled tremendously when I saw that scene.

Isn't that a lampoon of Japan's constitution which says the "armed defence(sp?) force" can't even leave the country without a vote in parliment saying it can, and then it can only do what is outlined in the order. Now there is a blunder.

[Master of Ossus]

The Aliens in Signs were only interested in gathering Humans (I think it was for food, did you see their teeth!). It was not an invasion, it was more of a harvest.

So? Why would they gather humans up at great risk for themselves. Are you seriously saying that the aliens came lightyears out of their way (from the movie it seemed like it would have taken them a long time) just to snack on a few humans? Remember that their metabolisms were very fast, and they were gathering no food for several days while they "probed" the Earth to detect its weaknesses and assess its strength. It was clearly not for food. Which brings us to the question of why the aliens would harest people if they were so easily injured by people. It would have been much easier for them to have begun kidnapping people from invisible craft, abducting them like some people say aliens do today. And why would they use DEADLY poison if they were trying to harvest us?

Second point - ok, more of an opinion. I had the distinct impression that the aliens we saw were not the ones in charge - they were genetically engeneired solders (Dead Givaway: the poison gas-launching toobs on their wrists).

So.... They aren't in charge. So what? They still take resources to grow, don't they? Those are some genetically engineered soldiers. One of them lost to a guy with a baseball bat, and another one couldn't break down a wooden door. And the "poison gas" was weak as hell. It didn't even affect anyone else in the room, in spite of the fact that the Uncle guy was there for several seconds fighitng the alien, and perhaps even longer.

On Atomic weapons- let me just say, I'm glad your finger isn't on the button Master of Ossus. Yes, they appeared within 1 mile of crop circles - they also were over MAJOR POPULATION CENTERS. If the raid had continued for another day, then maybe they would have used the bomb.

If everyone on Earth was going to die anyway, who would care if we killed them sooner in an attempt to save some of them? If you are attacked with overwhelming force, you have to respond with overwhelming force. I would use Nuclear weapons in their situation in a second, beginning with the aliens in rural areas. If it was clear that humanity was going to lose, anyway, then I would begin nuking their ships and landings in urban areas, in the hopes that some humans would survive the nuclear strike. If you are going to lose, and you have a chance to lose but not as badly, you must take it. As it was, the humans did not need nuclear weapons to kill the aliens. All they needed was a garden hose or a baseball bat (or a board, with a nail through it), but I was trying to show that there was no possible reason for the aliens to fight hand-to-hand. In fact, it is ridiculously stupid for them to do so. For an interplanetary (and, perhaps, intergalactic) race they are stupid as hell.

[Majin Gojira]

Oh, God, it just hit me....Shamalan was doing a classic Hitchok! (I bet i spelled that wrong, and right now I don't care!)

The Aliens were a Mcguffin! No wonder we can't make heads or tails of them! Their not that important!

Side note: I live in PA, EVERYONE in the area this was placed in...i'm blanking on it right now, would at least have a shotgun. WHERE WAS MEL'S SHOTGUN!?!

[The Yosemite Bear]

Cydonia Base for not hitting X-Com with everything theve got.

[Master of Ossus]

Oh, God, it just hit me....Shamalan was doing a classic Hitchok! (I bet i spelled that wrong, and right now I don't care!)

The Aliens were a Mcguffin! No wonder we can't make heads or tails of them! Their not that important!

Side note: I live in PA, EVERYONE in the area this was placed in...i'm blanking on it right now, would at least have a shotgun. WHERE WAS MEL'S SHOTGUN!?!

He was a Catholic, who objected to swearing. You're right though, the fact that none of them ever got weapons except for the knife (by accident), and the baseball bat kind of bothered me. To be honest, while I was watching the movie, I assumed that the movie would end with them in the basement and the radio off (ala the Birds, the REAL ending). I was minorly disappointed with the very end, although the eventual appearance of the alien was well done.

[Vapthorne]

Here's one.

ST:5, Captian Kirk, and SF for this matter, for allowing a ship not even half finished to enter into a critical hostage situation when there were many perfectly built starships ready to go.

[Skelron]

Warhammer 40K: The Imperium equipping Space Marine Assault Squads with boltpistols and swords instead of equipping them with regular, SMG-sized boltguns with bayonets. (Actually, the only people in the 40K universe who seem to utilize bayonets properly are the Necrons and the Kroot)

hmm, no I disagree given what the 'Swords' they carry actually are, I'm taking the sword. (Chain or Power Sword>bayonet) bayonet's are out dated in the 40K universe, it may sound strange to say this, but they simply don't cut it when compared to say a Marine wielding a Powersword, or an Eldar Howling Banshee.

[Patrick Degan]

Here's one.

ST:5, Captian Kirk, and SF for this matter, for allowing a ship not even half finished to enter into a critical hostage situation when there were many perfectly built starships ready to go.

That one is more properly laid at Starfleet's door rather than Capt. Kirk's. They ordered the Enterprise into action, despite her condition.

There is historical precedent for this, however. The British Admiralty, desperate to field every warship they could to hunt down and destroy the Bismarck, sent out the HMS Prince Of Wales with a large contingent of civilian workers still labouring away on the gun turrets to get them operational for battle even as the ship headed out into the North Atlantic.

[Peregrin Toker]

hmm, no I disagree given what the 'Swords' they carry actually are, I'm taking the sword. (Chain or Power Sword>bayonet) bayonet's are out dated in the 40K universe, it may sound strange to say this, but they simply don't cut it when compared to say a Marine wielding a Powersword, or an Eldar Howling Banshee.

The weapons used by Space Marine Assault Squads aren't powerswords, they are chainswords (one-hand chainsaws). Powerswords are so expensive that they are reserved for officers plus Deathwatch Kill Squads, Wolf Guard and other elite troops.

[HemlockGrey]

Isn't that a lampoon of Japan's constitution which says the "armed defence(sp?) force" can't even leave the country without a vote in parliment saying it can, and then it can only do what is outlined in the order. Now there is a blunder.

I don't think it was really a 'blunder' in the traditional sense, because there was a clear reason for it. If I recall, that was written during the Occupation, because no one wanted the military to seize power again like it did in WW2.

Of course, I could be completely wrong.

[RedImperator]

Oh, God, it just hit me....Shamalan was doing a classic Hitchok! (I bet i spelled that wrong, and right now I don't care!)

The Aliens were a Mcguffin! No wonder we can't make heads or tails of them! Their not that important!

Side note: I live in PA, EVERYONE in the area this was placed in...i'm blanking on it right now, would at least have a shotgun. WHERE WAS MEL'S SHOTGUN!?!

They were in Bucks County, deep in farm country. You're right, everybody out there is pretty much armed to the teeth.

[Subnormal]

Bucks County dang thats like 20 miles from where I am now, I don't have a shotgun but I do have a cache of other arms which I won't mention.

On with the topic of this post, tactical stupidity. I just thought up another one the Hailfire droid in AOTC. They have to be the most tacticaly inept vehicle in the universe, they ride on Two giant wheels(easily disablable), they have about 20 missles per side, completely exposed, easy to hit. There is no known way of refilling expended firepower, it has no secondary weapons. It probably is horrible at close ranges. The whole assortment of Seperatist vehicles is filled with tactical stupidity, walking spider legged vehicles(possibly one leg knocked out and the thing is immobile) Now if the Seperatist made a Highbrid of the Hailfire and say the spiderdroid that would make sense, but otherwise the Hailfire is a wheeled POS.

[Peregrin Toker]

The whole assortment of Seperatist vehicles is filled with tactical stupidity, walking spider legged vehicles(possibly one leg knocked out and the thing is immobile)

Don't forget that the whole Clone Wars thing is coreographed by Palpatine and Dooku, so the Republic/Empire will win...

[Sea Skimmer]

Ah, before I forget, one more: In "Gamera: Gaurdian of the Universe", when Gamera appears durring an operation to capture some small Gyaos-birds, the Japanese Military is rendered ABSOLUTELY HELPLESS because they need an order from the government to do anything.

I giggled tremendously when I saw that scene.

Isn't that a lampoon of Japan's constitution which says the "armed defence(sp?) force" can't even leave the country without a vote in parliment saying it can, and then it can only do what is outlined in the order. Now there is a blunder.

The Japanese constitution limits overseas military deployments to no more then 2000 men, with arms only for self-defense no more often then twice per year. And to do this does require a vote of parliament.

Self-defense has been interpreted to mean rifles and LMG's only, though I don’t think any troops have ever been deployed.

[consequences]

going to go extremely old school here. In Children of the Lens, the main evil stronghold(Eddore) is impregnable to the good guys, because the telepathic shields that are mechanically generated to protect the bad guys supreme commander are impervious to any attack the good guys(Arisians) can make, and both races are powerful enough that only psionic attacks can kill them. However, the Arisians had access to technology that would let them completely obliterate the planet Eddore, and thus destroy the generators protecting the Eddorian supreme commander, leaving him vulnerable to direct psychic attack. They completely ignore this possibility, and instead do the whole "combine our strength" bit with every Arisian and Lensman(good guy lesser telepath) contributing.