Federation Crew vs. Firefly "Bushwacked"

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2007-12-27 09:44pm

A federation starship comes across a group of people looting a starship which has been previously attacked by pirates/reavers. the scavangers do have a prisoner whose the only survivor of the ship that was attacked. In short the plot line is Identical to that presented in the Firefly episode "Bushwacked" except that the Federation replaces the Alliance.

Peptuck · Post by **Peptuck** » 2007-12-27 10:52pm

Depends on whether the Federation is operating in another reality and is aware of it. If they're operating in an alternate, alien reality, they would probably accept the stories about the Reavers with a more open mind than Alliance soldiers and sailors who have probably been conditioned and briefed into believing that the Reavers aren't real, simply on the basis that they are in an alternate universe where this sort of thing is possible.

Otherwise, the Federation would probably act a lot like the Alliance, though with more technobabble and probably some moral preaching about not scavenging a vessel like that. They'd have an easier time catching the Reaver crewman than the Alliance did, with a simple sensor sweep and a transport lock.

Ted C · Post by **Ted C** » 2007-12-28 11:05am

Peptuck wrote:Otherwise, the Federation would probably act a lot like the Alliance, though with more technobabble and probably some moral preaching about not scavenging a vessel like that. They'd have an easier time catching the Reaver crewman than the Alliance did, with a simple sensor sweep and a transport lock.

I have my doubts about how easily the Enterprise crew would find the insane guy. He's not wearing a comm-badge, so he can't easily be distinguished from the rest of the ship's crew: he's just one human life-sign among a bunch of other human life-signs. It's not like they haven't had all kinds of trouble with intruders running around unimpeded on the Enterprise.

Of course, if he follows his original behavior, he'll head for the salvaging ship when he escapes from sickbay, and the Enterprise sensors shouldn't have any trouble locating him there, since he'll be about the only one on board.

Shroom Man 777 · Post by **Shroom Man 777** » 2007-12-28 12:10pm

Unless Serenity's shitty engine is leaking a lot of unhealthy doses of radiation. Then the Federation's quadrucorders can't see through the quantums and so an Away Team of expendable Redshirts led by the Captain must go there to investigate.

At least they're not facing a pair of Ferengi.

Gil Hamilton · Post by **Gil Hamilton** » 2007-12-28 01:22pm

Ted C wrote:I have my doubts about how easily the Enterprise crew would find the insane guy. He's not wearing a comm-badge, so he can't easily be distinguished from the rest of the ship's crew: he's just one human life-sign among a bunch of other human life-signs. It's not like they haven't had all kinds of trouble with intruders running around unimpeded on the Enterprise.

Wouldn't that make him pretty easy to locate? Look for human life signs that AREN'T wearing a commbadge and discount people who are in bed or in the shower or places that you'd reasonably take your commbadge off while in. That should sniff out his location pretty quickly, particularly if you have people looking for him who might spot him/be attacked by him/et cetera.

Ted C · Post by **Ted C** » 2007-12-28 02:52pm

Gil Hamilton wrote:
Ted C wrote:I have my doubts about how easily the Enterprise crew would find the insane guy. He's not wearing a comm-badge, so he can't easily be distinguished from the rest of the ship's crew: he's just one human life-sign among a bunch of other human life-signs. It's not like they haven't had all kinds of trouble with intruders running around unimpeded on the Enterprise.
Wouldn't that make him pretty easy to locate? Look for human life signs that AREN'T wearing a commbadge and discount people who are in bed or in the shower or places that you'd reasonably take your commbadge off while in. That should sniff out his location pretty quickly, particularly if you have people looking for him who might spot him/be attacked by him/et cetera.

If the Federation ship involved is something like the E-D, then no, because that ship is full of civilians who won't be wearing comm-badges all the time.

Remember "The Game"? Wesley evaded capture for quite a while by dumping his comm-badge and moving through the jeffries tubes. I think this guy would be able to do much the same thing for a while. Once they were actively on his trail, they'd be able to track him down, but he might get off the ship before they did (enough other intruders have done it).

Gil Hamilton · Post by **Gil Hamilton** » 2007-12-28 05:28pm

Ted C wrote:If the Federation ship involved is something like the E-D, then no, because that ship is full of civilians who won't be wearing comm-badges all the time.

Remember "The Game"? Wesley evaded capture for quite a while by dumping his comm-badge and moving through the jeffries tubes. I think this guy would be able to do much the same thing for a while. Once they were actively on his trail, they'd be able to track him down, but he might get off the ship before they did (enough other intruders have done it).

I thought even the civilians on the Enterprise had commbadges of some stripe. Even so, picking which one of them is a Reaver couldn't be that hard. I realize the Federation aren't geniuses and so doing things like "Look for the person without a commbadge whose running around with an elevated heart rate and, you know, mauling people" probably isn't the best bet, but they could still ask civilians to stay in their quarters or where ever they happen to be and do a lock down. Then anything that is still running around and which doesn't have a commbadge is probably your Reaver.

Besides, how would the Reaver get around? Say there were on the Enterprise. The Enterprise is ENORMOUS and while it seems like everyone can get around it by crawling through the ductwork, I don't think a crazed out of his mind person with no clue to the lay out of the ship is going to be able to get off it. Chances are he's going to run into someone before too long or be unable to operate a turbolift due to not being able to input commands and they'll truck him back to sickbay and this time stick him in a forcefield till they figure out what to do with him.

Crazedwraith · Post by **Crazedwraith** » 2007-12-28 06:47pm

How exactly is the Reaver going to get out of sickbay? They could quarantine him behind forcefields, not knowing whats wrong with him. And even if they won't Fed starships don't use good ol' fashioned scalpels they'd use some laser shit. One of the reason's for the reaver's escape in the canon Bushwacked was that he grabbed a scalpel and cut quite a few throats. In these scenario he's limited to fists. The enterprise lot are much more likely to survive and get a security team on him a lot quicker then the feds, who had to find the bodies first.

Sarevok · Post by **Sarevok** » 2007-12-29 01:48am

The Federation seem well equipped to fight the Reavers. They have stun phasers, force fields, good sensors and transporters all of which would come handy.

If the Feds act competently this incident won't even take 10 mins of an star trek episode. The Reaver guy in question was doomed even when the Alliance was involved. It's not like he was zombie spreading infection rapidly.

whipped4073 · Post by **whipped4073** » 2008-04-09 05:26pm

Oh, it'll last longer than 10 minutes, just because Picard & Riker will start sermonizing to the Firefly crew about ethics (or the perceived lack thereof among Serenity's crew)... which will get Mal het up due to reminding him of the high-handed attitude of the Alliance. Of course, Jayne & Worf will get into a staring contest to see who has more testosterone/larger balls, & Geordi will want to show off Main Engineering to Kaylee (although I'm not sure if she'll be as impressed with the technology as with how clean & shiny everything is).

Thag · Post by **Thag** » 2008-04-09 06:24pm

How big a Federation ship are we talking about? As pointed out already, a Galaxy has lots of places to hide and lots of bodies to hide behind. Something more cramped like a Defiant or a Saber will run out of room real fast for a reaver.

PREDATOR490 · Post by **PREDATOR490** » 2008-04-09 06:28pm

From what I gather this scenario has 2 specific ways it can go for a substitution of the Federation.

A) Federation ship 'magically' arrives in this other reality and encounters said situation. In this case, the Federation ship has no jurisdiction to lecture the crew of the Firefly. They wont even know who the Alliance is let alone the laws being broken so at best Hal is likely to tell them to mind their own business if they get preachy. Firefly isnt going to take on a Federation ship so he will either tell them to leave or he will leave himself.

The most I can see a Federation ship doing is taking this survivor into custody. More than likely at least one of the crew members will play the 'sympathy / medical duty" angle to try and help this guy. If Hal tells them what Reavers do, I would expect even a Federation security officer to post appropriate safeguards against anything happening. I suspect he might end up in sickbay behind a forcefield or sedated.

If Hal DOSENT tell them about Reavers or they choose not to believe him then this guy will probably kill the medical team but I dont see him lasting very long on a Federation ship other than the larger ships like the Galaxy. Even in this case, they just tell everyone to return to safe zones while scanning for lifesigns that arent in regular areas. Once they find him it will just be a case of killing / stunning him.

Afterwards, they will do more exploration, contact the Alliance and hand the guy over. Probably going to relay Hal's actions as well if they parted on bad terms so Hal gets shafted by the Alliance when they start looking for them again. Not as if that wouldnt happen anyway since they have two wanted people aboard but this time the Alliance would probably get detailed Federation logs on the ship and crew so the Alliance can actively hunt them.

B) Federation becomes the Alliance in this scenario

In that case, Hal hates the Federation's guts and they will consider him the equivelent of a Maquis pirate. He promptly gets arrest, Reaver gets taken into custody and it is essentially the same situation as in A.

FaxModem1 · Post by **FaxModem1** » 2008-04-09 09:11pm

Who is Hal? I remember a Mal, but not a Hal.

loomer · Post by **loomer** » 2008-04-09 09:44pm

I remember a Hal from Malcom in the Middle. and now I'm stuck picturing him as captain of Serenity, complete with fretting over iced tea.

Fanfic time.

Peptuck · Post by **Peptuck** » 2008-04-09 11:58pm

This makes me wonder what might happen if the Enterprise's crew determines what happened to River, and whether or not Simon explains what the Academy did to her. I get the image of Picard deciding to offer sanctuary to both of the Tam siblings if he knew what she was put through, and Simon accepting it, as the Enterprise is certianly better armed and staffed and able to really protect River from the Alliance.

Post by **The Yosemite Bear** » 2008-04-10 01:12am

Worse, the HAL talk has gotten me thinking of how the frak did the sociopathic computer get involved with this....

BTW which would be worse for a Federation ship?
HAL 9000
SHODAN
GlaDOS

Zixinus · Post by **Zixinus** » 2008-04-10 10:39am

BTW which would be worse for a Federation ship?
HAL 9000
SHODAN
GlaDOS

Shodan. Hal is malfunctioning while GlaDOS is just insane. Shodan on the other hand is quite sane and deliberate in his sociopathic actions.

PREDATOR490 · Post by **PREDATOR490** » 2008-04-10 12:54pm

If your taking the movie into account then supposedly River has somesort of 'reader' ability which would probably attract the attention of Troi.
This is assuming the Federation ship IS actually the Enterprise which the OP didnt specify. There is as much possibility as it being a Janeway, Sisko or Equinox captain.

Janeway - Reaver guy is going to end up killing half the crew and confined to a room as a punishment if they muster the intellect to catch him. I dont think River is going to fair well on Voyager given it's track record assuming she is even granted the chance to stay.

Sisko - I could see Sisko letting Mal ( Got it right this time ) fly off readily enough and the Defiant is going to be hard for this Reaver guy to hide in.
Good chance River will be allowed the chance to stay and the Defiant is definetly a safer bet if they run into Alliance bounty hunters. Sisko isnt as likely to risk his ship flying into every goddamn hazard under the guise of getting home like Janeway.

Equinox Captain - I suppose in this case it depends on the extent of the Federation ship's situation. If they are sufficiently hard pressed I can see them flying by without much concern or copying Mal's strategy for pirating / looting whatever they can to get home. River gets ignored or potentially cashed in for Alliance support.

Zixinus · Post by **Zixinus** » 2008-04-10 02:32pm

What about Picard?

PREDATOR490 · Post by **PREDATOR490** » 2008-04-10 06:57pm

I would expect Picard to quickly realise he has no right to punish Mal or otherwise interfere in his business outside of Federation territory. He may attempt to lecture him but even then I find this unlikely if Picard considers this a breach of the Prime Directive / Starfleet regulations saying he cant get involved. I suppose Mal would be more likely to hand the Reaver guy over to a ship like the Enterprise D/E with it's much larger ability to care for such a person.

For once Troi may actually be of use in trying to help the guy reform but at the very least I would hope she can tell the crew he needs to be watched. If she does, this guy ends up behind a forcefield, sedated or some security personnel with phasers.
Being sedated or behind a forcefield effectively renders the guy harmless but given the track record of goldshirts I wouldnt be surprised if he caused some carnage. Should be a simple case of clearing the ship crew to their rooms etc. then scan for the lifesign that isnt obeying. Obviously this would be harder on the E-D over the E-E.

Troi can help River with her own problems supposedly and the E-D is definetly going to be more comfortable for the pair than Mal's ship. After that, Enterprise goes on it's merry way trying to find a way home while River and Reaver get treatment. Simon will most likely request sanctuary and I dont see why Picard wouldnt grant it but the Reaver guy is likely to be handed over to the Alliance wether he reforms or not.

If at some point River gets hunted down again by the Operative then I imagine the Enterprise is going to follow in the same tracks Mal did. I can easily see the Enterprise getting trashed in the attempt though due to the lack of friends to broadcast the truth like Mal did or even the ability to GET to that planet. I dont think the Reaver fleet is going to easily miss a big shiny ship like the Enterprise flying through their territory and Picard isnt likely to pull the same stunt Mal did to overcome the fleet the Operative assembled. Even if they do learn the truth, Picard still has to worry about the Prime Directive and in this case he would be interfering directly in the political affairs of a soverign power.

Enigma · Post by **Enigma** » 2008-04-10 08:26pm

What about Kirk?

Vertigo1 · Post by **Vertigo1** » 2008-04-10 09:17pm

Ted C wrote:
Gil Hamilton wrote:
Ted C wrote:I have my doubts about how easily the Enterprise crew would find the insane guy. He's not wearing a comm-badge, so he can't easily be distinguished from the rest of the ship's crew: he's just one human life-sign among a bunch of other human life-signs. It's not like they haven't had all kinds of trouble with intruders running around unimpeded on the Enterprise.
Wouldn't that make him pretty easy to locate? Look for human life signs that AREN'T wearing a commbadge and discount people who are in bed or in the shower or places that you'd reasonably take your commbadge off while in. That should sniff out his location pretty quickly, particularly if you have people looking for him who might spot him/be attacked by him/et cetera.
If the Federation ship involved is something like the E-D, then no, because that ship is full of civilians who won't be wearing comm-badges all the time.

Remember "The Game"? Wesley evaded capture for quite a while by dumping his comm-badge and moving through the jeffries tubes. I think this guy would be able to do much the same thing for a while. Once they were actively on his trail, they'd be able to track him down, but he might get off the ship before they did (enough other intruders have done it).

Theres an even simpler solution to this. Confine the civilians to whatever area they are in, and start throwing up forcefields. Then just sweep the ship a section at a time, ignoring any lifesigns where they KNOW there are civilians. If they pick something up, they can either beam it into the brig, or flood the area with gas and send in security.

As for the jeffries tubes, iirc those aren't like the normal doors. You can just approach them and they just magically open. You have to enter some sort of passcode to make them open.

Peptuck · Post by **Peptuck** » 2008-04-11 12:52am

If at some point River gets hunted down again by the Operative then I imagine the Enterprise is going to follow in the same tracks Mal did. I can easily see the Enterprise getting trashed in the attempt though due to the lack of friends to broadcast the truth like Mal did or even the ability to GET to that planet. I dont think the Reaver fleet is going to easily miss a big shiny ship like the Enterprise flying through their territory and Picard isnt likely to pull the same stunt Mal did to overcome the fleet the Operative assembled. Even if they do learn the truth, Picard still has to worry about the Prime Directive and in this case he would be interfering directly in the political affairs of a soverign power.

Dude, the Enterprise has warp drive, and this is a setting without FTL capability. The Enterprise could just go around the Reavers and outrun the Alliance.

PREDATOR490 · Post by **PREDATOR490** » 2008-04-11 07:34am

Going 'round' wont really help them if the Reavers are around the entire planet. Mal didnt consider going round at all and a Federation ship wont be able to employ the same kind of strategy to fly by.

Even if they can outrun the Alliance or Reavers, they will have to stop for supplies eventually, get to the planet and to contact a relevant party who can broadcast the recording. All of which renders the FTL ability mute.
The more I think about it though, Picard will not do anything with that recording because it violates the Prime Directive. Interfering in the affairs of internal disputes is something the Federation supposedly do not do and doing so is going to attract attention from more than just the cloak and dagger tactics of the Operative against Mal.

As for Kirk.
Kirk starts ravaging the local female population. I suspect the Companion lady will be the most likely target on Serenity. Probably going to help River and spread the truth about the Reavers.

Ted C · Post by **Ted C** » 2008-04-11 08:33am

Gil Hamilton wrote:I thought even the civilians on the Enterprise had commbadges of some stripe.

The civvies in this image don't seem to be wearing comm badges...

+http://tng.trekcore.co*/gallery/albums/s5/5x21/theperfectmate146.jpg

Gil Hamilton wrote:Even so, picking which one of them is a Reaver couldn't be that hard. I realize the Federation aren't geniuses and so doing things like "Look for the person without a commbadge whose running around with an elevated heart rate and, you know, mauling people" probably isn't the best bet, but they could still ask civilians to stay in their quarters or where ever they happen to be and do a lock down. Then anything that is still running around and which doesn't have a commbadge is probably your Reaver.

I didn't say the couldn't find him, just that it wouldn't be a no-brainer that they could handle in a few seconds.

Gil Hamilton wrote:Besides, how would the Reaver get around? Say there were on the Enterprise. The Enterprise is ENORMOUS and while it seems like everyone can get around it by crawling through the ductwork, I don't think a crazed out of his mind person with no clue to the lay out of the ship is going to be able to get off it.

Ask a question out loud to the computer and it will freely offer directions. Case in point, Ralph Offenhouse in "The Neutral Zone". He absently asked out loud "I wonder where the captain would be", and the computer promptly informed him that the captain was on the bridge, then it sent him there via turbolift.

Besides, I suspect our Reaver would just want a place to hide so he could ambush people. Getting back to Serenity would be nice, but that would require operating a transporter, and he's got no clue. So it's not really a question of whether he can get off the ship; it's a question of how many casualties he can cause before he's tracked down.