Armageddon???? (Part Fifty Up)

[The Duchess of Zeon]

These demons have no idea what's coming to them if they hit Detroit and Sheffield.

I wonder when we'll meet Abigor again.

Probably as soon as Detroit and Sheffield get hit, because the humans are bound to ask him what the fuck that was. Could be pretty tense, as they might believe that Abigor witheld this information deliberately, and Abigor would have to explain that it hadn't been done for thousands of years and the possibility simply didn't occur to him.

However, Abigor should be able to tell them that the attack was probably launched by the last person who ever pulled off such a stunt: Belial. He'll even be able to tell them where Belial is located, which will be bad news for Belial.

Since we can hook demons up to the DIMON equipment, we can just get Abigor to punch through a portal to Belial's castle and then basically roll a nuclear bomb on a timer on a cart through it. All they'll see is a big shiny steel tube fall into the middle of his throne-room, and then five seconds later as they run over to stare at it, they'd be vapourized.

[Vejut]

What it puts me in mind of is actually the old idea of the orbital "flying crowbars". Toss something down a long way, watch it cause a lot of damage on the ground. If they could open a portal fairly high up, or simply somehow make use of the downhill slope in energy from Hell to Earth, you might be able to get a decent amount of kinetic energy out into a metal rod. Against this however, is the fact that people coming out of the hell mouth and kitty's portals don't go flying against the wall, though maybe that's why they have to use naga and special shrines, to open a different kind of portal.

[Darth Wong]

Guys, I did some background reading (I don't know why I didn't do that before), and I think that if Stuart follows the source material, this attack could be more spectacular than we thought:

Genesis 19 NIV:

17 As soon as they had brought them out, one of them said, "Flee for your lives! Don't look back, and don't stop anywhere in the plain! Flee to the mountains or you will be swept away!"

18 But Lot said to them, "No, my lords, please!
19 Your servant has found favor in your eyes, and you have shown great kindness to me in sparing my life. But I can't flee to the mountains; this disaster will overtake me, and I'll die.
20 Look, here is a town near enough to run to, and it is small. Let me flee to it—it is very small, isn't it? Then my life will be spared."

21 He said to him, "Very well, I will grant this request too; I will not overthrow the town you speak of.
22 But flee there quickly, because I cannot do anything until you reach it."

23 By the time Lot reached Zoar, the sun had risen over the land.
24 Then the LORD rained down burning sulfur on Sodom and Gomorrah—from the LORD out of the heavens.
25 Thus he overthrew those cities and the entire plain, including all those living in the cities—and also the vegetation in the land.
26 But Lot's wife looked back, and she became a pillar of salt.

27 Early the next morning Abraham got up and returned to the place where he had stood before the LORD.
28 He looked down toward Sodom and Gomorrah, toward all the land of the plain, and he saw dense smoke rising from the land, like smoke from a furnace.

29 So when God destroyed the cities of the plain, he remembered Abraham, and he brought Lot out of the catastrophe that overthrew the cities where Lot had lived.

If the text of the NIV Bible is correct, the destruction of Sodom and Gomorah was accomplished with a rain of burning sulphur, and there was dense smoke billowing from the plain on the following morning. It looks like he actually destroyed everything in the entire plain, including all of the farms and crops outside the cities themselves, although we don't know how large that plain actually was.

Having said that, it couldn't have been a lake of lava, because that would still be glowing the next morning, and you'd think Lot would notice if the whole plain had been turned into a glowing lake of lava.

[The Vortex Empire]

Regardless, it will just cause a huge retaliation by the humans. Nuclear seems likely.

[Eulogy]

If the text of the NIV Bible is correct, the destruction of Sodom and Gomorah was accomplished with a rain of burning sulphur, and there was dense smoke billowing from the plain on the following morning. It looks like he actually destroyed everything in the entire plain, including all of the farms and crops outside the cities themselves, although we don't know how large that plain actually was.

Having said that, it couldn't have been a lake of lava, because that would still be glowing the next morning, and you'd think Lot would notice if the whole plain had been turned into a glowing lake of lava.

It's not lava, but such an attack would still burn a lot of property and lives, especially if the smoke is particularly persistent. Of course, depending on how big Sodom and Gomorrah is, Belial's attack could be anything from annihilation of a large part of Detroit to a wet fart (leaning towards the latter, given the energy requirements and possible problems from the naga).

[The Duchess of Zeon]

It's entirely unlikely that Sodom and Gamorrah had populations larger than around 3,000 each, the typical size of "cities"--really, small fortified towns--in that era in that region. And they were very dense, for defensive purposes, with the houses built up right next to each other, like in PPNA Jericho or Catal Huyuk. Settlement changed little over thousands of years, after all. That said, destroying the plain as well, and wiping out both cities at once, implies a larger area of effect, but not a tremendous one.

[Adrian Laguna]

Resurrected humans seem to work rather like zombies; to kill them for good you have to seriously maim the brain tissue.

Funny you should say that. I was about to suggest that to avoid having to use the "dead-dead" to refer to someone how has died after resurrecting in Hell, those in Hell be referred to as "undead". With the word "dead" being used for denizens of hell who've died.

Incidentally, it occurs to me that Ian Flemming was right, you do only live twice.

[Stuart Mackey]

It's entirely unlikely that Sodom and Gamorrah had populations larger than around 3,000 each, the typical size of "cities"--really, small fortified towns--in that era in that region. And they were very dense, for defensive purposes, with the houses built up right next to each other, like in PPNA Jericho or Catal Huyuk. Settlement changed little over thousands of years, after all. That said, destroying the plain as well, and wiping out both cities at once, implies a larger area of effect, but not a tremendous one.

Moreover how strong was the wind that day, from what diection and how much vegitation was there around and how dry was it? I think we should also be looking at the effects of forest/scrub fires and how they start. As for the ignition device/s, perhaps some kind of primitive incendiery weapon?

[Darth Wong]

It would help if we knew how large this plain was.

[ray245]

Regardless, it will just cause a huge retaliation by the humans. Nuclear seems likely.

I hate losing more friendlies due to the nuke...

[Darth Wong]

Regardless, it will just cause a huge retaliation by the humans. Nuclear seems likely.

I hate losing more friendlies due to the nuke...

If it's a targeted strike at the palace, the workers in the mines will probably be OK, unless they're directly beneath the palace. Of course, anyone in the palace itself would be completely obliterated.

[Jawawithagun]

True. They should start beaming some of our epic war movies straight into the minds of demons in Hell, then, especially if they're high-ranking dukes. But I don't think that's feasible yet; so far we're only torturing one demon that way.

I vote for Soviet propaganda movies. They convey properly that absolutely nothing can stop us. Underlaid with spiffy music.

So now I'm waiting for the Baldricks to be introduced to salvoes of Katyushas blanketing the sky and their unnerving wail.
Though the modern ones don't sound like that anymore or do they?

[JBG]

It's entirely unlikely that Sodom and Gamorrah had populations larger than around 3,000 each, the typical size of "cities"--really, small fortified towns--in that era in that region. And they were very dense, for defensive purposes, with the houses built up right next to each other, like in PPNA Jericho or Catal Huyuk. Settlement changed little over thousands of years, after all. That said, destroying the plain as well, and wiping out both cities at once, implies a larger area of effect, but not a tremendous one.

Belial is still thinking in terms of settlements as Her Grace has described. He compensates for recent human performance and attitude by positing more such settlements and a long term plan, more humans and the few massive etc armouries that the humans maintain and build up to fight hell.

The "larger area of effect" could do massive damage, all the same, to vast urban conurbations, or slums etc. That won't, per se, reduce the humans' war making potential. The recent production surge etc should see lots of goodies flooding into the system and the targets are getting more numerous all the time. There are bottlenecks for sure but unless blessed with the utter best of fortunes Belial would not be able to target them, let alone discern their significance. He's done pretty well though - as Stuart said, demons are smart.

[The Duchess of Zeon]

It's entirely unlikely that Sodom and Gamorrah had populations larger than around 3,000 each, the typical size of "cities"--really, small fortified towns--in that era in that region. And they were very dense, for defensive purposes, with the houses built up right next to each other, like in PPNA Jericho or Catal Huyuk. Settlement changed little over thousands of years, after all. That said, destroying the plain as well, and wiping out both cities at once, implies a larger area of effect, but not a tremendous one.

Belial is still thinking in terms of settlements as Her Grace has described. He compensates for recent human performance and attitude by positing more such settlements and a long term plan, more humans and the few massive etc armouries that the humans maintain and build up to fight hell.

The "larger area of effect" could do massive damage, all the same, to vast urban conurbations, or slums etc. That won't, per se, reduce the humans' war making potential. The recent production surge etc should see lots of goodies flooding into the system and the targets are getting more numerous all the time. There are bottlenecks for sure but unless blessed with the utter best of fortunes Belial would not be able to target them, let alone discern their significance. He's done pretty well though - as Stuart said, demons are smart.

There's also the question of how effective a rain of burning sulphur on causing fires in a modern city will be. It could probably do severe damage to the suburbs, but unless a firestorm starts, it should be fairly easily contained in built up brick, steel, and glass urban or industrial areas.

[Sidewinder]

If the destruction of Sodom and Gomorrah was caused by the demons raining burning sulfur from a portal in midair, I think we should consider the danger that people in the cities will asphyxiate due to the mass of pollutants in the air.

[Starglider]

I hope you got part 6 ok Stuart, I PMed it on Yuku since SDN was down, but Yuku doesn't seem to have a 'check if your messages were actually received' feature the way phpBB2 does.

[kdahm(the same one)]

True. They should start beaming some of our epic war movies straight into the minds of demons in Hell, then, especially if they're high-ranking dukes. But I don't think that's feasible yet; so far we're only torturing one demon that way.

I vote for Soviet propaganda movies. They convey properly that absolutely nothing can stop us. Underlaid with spiffy music.

So now I'm waiting for the Baldricks to be introduced to salvoes of Katyushas blanketing the sky and their unnerving wail.
Though the modern ones don't sound like that anymore or do they?

It's a pity we're still trying to hide our full capability from the demons.

Otherwise, take all of the film from the various May Day parades in Moscow, Beijing, and from the Norks over the year to Hollywood, seamlessly splice them together, add an voiceover or blue screen announcer, and release it. For more fun, loop some sections. What would Satan do if he thought Earth had 9^5 or 9^6 iron chariots?

[Darth Wong]

It's a pity we're still trying to hide our full capability from the demons.

Otherwise, take all of the film from the various May Day parades in Moscow, Beijing, and from the Norks over the year to Hollywood, seamlessly splice them together, add an voiceover or blue screen announcer, and release it. For more fun, loop some sections. What would Satan do if he thought Earth had 9^5 or 9^6 iron chariots?

What possible point would there be in sending him a propaganda film?

[Edward Yee]

I also can't see the point, unless we know demon psychology and culture enough to know how to properly get the message across that we want, unfiltered.

[fusion]

It's a pity we're still trying to hide our full capability from the demons.

Otherwise, take all of the film from the various May Day parades in Moscow, Beijing, and from the Norks over the year to Hollywood, seamlessly splice them together, add an voiceover or blue screen announcer, and release it. For more fun, loop some sections. What would Satan do if he thought Earth had 9^5 or 9^6 iron chariots?

What possible point would there be in sending him a propaganda film?

That would be useful if we can broadcast it to every demon in hell through the mind-link thingy... Probably many demons will see that there is no point and thus it will be easier for us to fight?

I am just trying to make a reasonable statement from it

Otherwise good chapter...

[Starglider]

That would be useful if we can broadcast it to every demon in hell through the mind-link thingy... Probably many demons will see that there is no point and thus it will be easier for us to fight?

You don't think the demons have adequately demonstrated that nothing good ever comes from gloating?

[DarthShady]

Would the demons be able to understand a voice on a recording, since they seem to speak our languages thanks to using some telepathic magic?

I think they should be able to understand. I mean if they learned the language before, they won't suddenly unlearn it.

Great chapter, this story keeps getting better.

[fusion]

That would be useful if we can broadcast it to every demon in hell through the mind-link thingy... Probably many demons will see that there is no point and thus it will be easier for us to fight?

You don't think the demons have adequately demonstrated that nothing good ever comes from gloating?

No they have not...

You already know how I post, from a sightly skewered view point...

I mean my plan works if you look at it from a certain point of view...

[Starglider]

I mean my plan works if you look at it from a certain point of view...

Operation Sealion works if you look at it from a certain point of view... specifically, one involving copious helpings of mind-altering substances.

[PainRack]

Can we analyze how large the potential AOE is? Reading from various christian sites, they suggest that Gnorrhea located southwest of the Dead Sea with Sodom being east.

Could anyone find more detailed information from archaelogy about these suspected sites?